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Belief

Posted by shadowhive , 27 September 2013 · 465 views

(I apologise for any potential typos in advance, my keyboard seems not to like me and I never notice until it's too late)

One of the things I look for in the posts here is trying to understand the mentality of belief. The main things being why people would believe in a god (specifically one that does horible things) and why people seem to value their guns (Americans especially).I think understanding the mentality of both of those things is important especially when they ignore the damage done by their belief or even excuse it.

Everyone does believe something though and most of those things don't really have an impact or really lead to anything negative. So I'm (randomly) gonna list some of mine.

The afterlife. This is the only one I've ever mentioned here before (at length anyway). While I've never associated with any religion (and nor has my family in any real way) I've always felt there was some form of afterlife. I do believe in the soul, that there is an essence of a person that carries on beyond death. I don't think any religion has a monopoly on the afterlife (to me that comes off as insane and is a big reason why I disregard religion entirely). I'm not sure on what specifics there are of the afterlife, but the main thngs are the standard 'reunited with loved ones' and also that it's what you make of it. There's an episode of Ameican Dad which features personal heavens, where the main characters each had their own idea of heaven and I think that describes what I think it is petty well. (Mine would include a mix of doritos, pepsi, galaxy chocolate, awesome sci-fi stuff, video games and scantily clad Welshmen.)

Slightly related is ghosts. I believe that they could be actual sprits as well as the.. 'recordings' of things played out over and over. The former is mostly related to two experiences. The first was when I was younger. I was heading up the road (I can't remember why) and I saw this kid running along in front of me. I thought nothing of it because, hey there's nothing strange about seeng a kid right? Well it turned a corner to go down a drive. Agan, nothing strange there. But by the time I got there (and I was only a few paces behind) the kid was gone. The drive was blocked by a gate, which was locked, and there was nowhere the kid could've gone. To this day I think that kid was a ghost. The ghost of who, I dunno. I never did see their face clearly, but yeah. The second many experience is more a feeling than anything. I used to live in a flat, before my grandprents died. In the last weeks there I started feeling uneasy. I don't know why, but it wasn't just me. The dog would start barking at nothing and my friend had the same sort of feeling too (although she heard voices too). I dunno why it suddenly started then since nothing like it happened before but... I dunno.

Away from the supernatural to life here. I do think that certan cryptids exist. Ater all there are parts of the world we've yet to fully explore so who's to say what's out there. Species are still being found that are previously unknown so, yeah, here could be other to.

And then there's life elsewhere, out there. Do I think there's life in the universe? Absolutely. The universe is simply too big or us to be the only one. Personally, I think there's life elsewhere in the solar system, not necessarily on Mars but on Europa. It does, after all, have a massive liquid ocean so the possibility for life is extremely high. I don't expect it to be intelligent life but even fish would be some life, life that's not our own.

Do I think aliens have visited us? I don't know. It's possble they coould be observing, but I'm less sure about making contact. Any race that would watch us for any length of time would see we historically do not play well with others. As a species we have had a dsgusting habit of destroying those which are different than us. Any race watching would be wise to take that into account and only make contact when we are mature enough as a species and a world (which we are sorely not).

Like I said in my other post though I do believe we have to come together as a species to advance. That means being a bit more unified, in terms of universal human rights and dealing with their abuses. In not letting religion having governments in their pockets.In being able to co-operate on more proects like the ISS. We are, sadly, a long way from achieving that properly, but hopefully that'll change and we can actually become a more unifed world and species rather than a myiad of dsparate counties.

I am almost certain I've missed something out that I meant to include when i started this, but ah well. I think I've covered the main ones.




First of all I want to say I love your Grell Avatar, Black Butler has to be my second favorite anime. Now back to what I came to say relating to the blog :P Relating to the value on guns. The best way I can relate my feelings on this is the scene in War of the Worlds (The new one) Where  Tom Cruise (I believe it was him) risks his life for his pistol even though he knows it is next to useless against the invasion. The reason I believe he did it was for the only reason I have a firearm (I still to this day have never used it outside a firing range, great stress reliever) is for the false sense of security that one gets from having a weapon in a terrible situation. Granted I do realize my reasoning is flawed, but I don't honestly plan to stop anytime soon.

As for the afterlife. I have rather mixed feelings on the afterlife simply because I have way too many theories. I do however believe in some form of our soul hangs onto life when we pass if we still hang onto life so forcefully. Sort of like our soul ripping (Best way I can describe how I see it in my mind) I am one of those that partially believes in an entity escorting us to where our soul shall spend its days. I don't however believe that our soul stays in one place for all eternity. To me that just doesn't make sense. I don't believe that we only lived to die and have our souls be kept in one place like a broom closet. Where we our souls go and what they do I am not sure. Thats part of the mystery of afterlife. The little fun in it if I may say so.

Ghosts I believe in hands down because it is so plausible to me. I myself do not have a "Ghost experience" like other people, but I feel that if in your true essence or you have something that you feel you truely need to live for but can live no longer you cling to life all you can and the life you lived your soul is ripped. Meaning that part of your soul that clings to Life ever so much stays here. To do what? I haven't the slightest. Does the other part of your soul go on normally? I doubt it, but again I don't know.

Now cryptids (to an extent) I believe in 100% I mean the Platypus used to be(still is? Not sure if once they are discovered if they are called cryptids anymore) you also have the Giant Squid, There are just many things that are plausible and probably do exist is some form or fashion.

I do believe in life else where, I do believe we are watched, and I basically believe the same thing you do.

I figured that since you shared some of your beliefs I would share some of mine. I laughed a little when I saw your personal heaven, in a good way of course. :)
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RedDusk, on 27 September 2013 - 01:02 PM, said:

First of all I want to say I love your Grell Avatar, Black Butler has to be my second favorite anime. Now back to what I came to say relating to the blog :P Relating to the value on guns. The best way I can relate my feelings on this is the scene in War of the Worlds (The new one) Where  Tom Cruise (I believe it was him) risks his life for his pistol even though he knows it is next to useless against the invasion. The reason I believe he did it was for the only reason I have a firearm (I still to this day have never used it outside a firing range, great stress reliever) is for the false sense of security that one gets from having a weapon in a terrible situation. Granted I do realize my reasoning is flawed, but I don't honestly plan to stop anytime soon.

As for the afterlife. I have rather mixed feelings on the afterlife simply because I have way too many theories. I do however believe in some form of our soul hangs onto life when we pass if we still hang onto life so forcefully. Sort of like our soul ripping (Best way I can describe how I see it in my mind) I am one of those that partially believes in an entity escorting us to where our soul shall spend its days. I don't however believe that our soul stays in one place for all eternity. To me that just doesn't make sense. I don't believe that we only lived to die and have our souls be kept in one place like a broom closet. Where we our souls go and what they do I am not sure. Thats part of the mystery of afterlife. The little fun in it if I may say so.

Ghosts I believe in hands down because it is so plausible to me. I myself do not have a "Ghost experience" like other people, but I feel that if in your true essence or you have something that you feel you truely need to live for but can live no longer you cling to life all you can and the life you lived your soul is ripped. Meaning that part of your soul that clings to Life ever so much stays here. To do what? I haven't the slightest. Does the other part of your soul go on normally? I doubt it, but again I don't know.

Now cryptids (to an extent) I believe in 100% I mean the Platypus used to be(still is? Not sure if once they are discovered if they are called cryptids anymore) you also have the Giant Squid, There are just many things that are plausible and probably do exist is some form or fashion.

I do believe in life else where, I do believe we are watched, and I basically believe the same thing you do.

I figured that since you shared some of your beliefs I would share some of mine. I laughed a little when I saw your personal heaven, in a good way of course. :)

Thanks! Black Butler is awesome and I really love Grell (obviously). It's one of my faourite animes too (though I need to watch more).

I think that's really odd. I've never seen a gun up close, which less handled one and I honestly wouldn't feel safer with one in the house. So the gun mentality of the US has always seemed rather strange. It's like... you guys need a gun to feel safe and I just find that utterly strange ecause it's not as if you live somewhere where there's dangerous animals and it's not as if you guys live in a war zone or anywhere that really warrants it. So I don't really get why you need that security to begin with.

Yeah that does make sense. I really don't get the christian idea of the afterlife, where the soul is remoed and they become servents of god. That basically sounds like forced slaery which is an odd thing to believe in. Yeah I dont think you'd have to stay wherever you go, you'd have a choice. But yeah it is one big mystery really.

I think some ghosts would be souls coming back to visit. I mean if you can go where you want you'd want to visit places that mattered to you. I do think too that some get... stuck, unable to move one for some reason. they doo say that traumatic events can leave like an... imprint. So it may not be the actual soul but that, which gets played over and over like some late night rerun.

Absolutely! I mean I just saw pictures of a squid they recently discoered called the big fin squid and it's just so huge and freaky looking and weve only just seen it so.. who knows what else is down in the depths? And I recall a documentary on the search for the Yeti and they found some fur... whch didn't math any known animal. So yeah, there's still thngs out there.

:)

Thanks, it's nice to read them. Heheh and yeah I may have ended up dazing over said heaen (and then mentally adding things like unlimited pizza and a unicorn) :P
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White Crane Feather
Sep 27 2013 03:49 PM
We have a very large inner city gang problem that spills over to suburban areas, many people are indeed avid hunters, and we take our constitutional rights very seriously. Originally the second amendments was put there because in the past because tyrannical powers would first disarm a public before feeding off of it. The historical presidence goes back to even ancient civilizations ( one of the reasons many martial arts weapons are farm implements).

It's only a very recent development that people rely on their governments to protect them. In neary every case the governments are merely have the power to clean up and go get the bad guy. It's impossible to protect Somone during an incident.

Americans have an inherant distrust of their government and its ability to provide for their safety, and lets not forget that it was founded on an apocalyptic cult.  Fear runs rampant in our culture for good reason, therefore we purchase guns to arm our households . Would it be a better place if the culture never existed in the first place... Mabye. But the fact of the matter is that there are so many guns it makes no sense to disarm law abiding citizens while criminals obviously are not going to follow the rules. We are not the type of people to be passive in the face of a threat.  Ironically even the mention of fun controls sends sales booming in the us. Obama has done more for gun sakes and directly contributed to there being more guns on the street than any us president before him. Haveing a degree in economics it's interesting to watch from a market perspective.
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White Crane Feather, on 27 September 2013 - 03:49 PM, said:

We have a very large inner city gang problem that spills over to suburban areas, many people are indeed avid hunters, and we take our constitutional rights very seriously. Originally the second amendments was put there because in the past because tyrannical powers would first disarm a public before feeding off of it. The historical presidence goes back to even ancient civilizations ( one of the reasons many martial arts weapons are farm implements).

It's only a very recent development that people rely on their governments to protect them. In neary every case the governments are merely have the power to clean up and go get the bad guy. It's impossible to protect Somone during an incident.

Americans have an inherant distrust of their government and its ability to provide for their safety, and lets not forget that it was founded on an apocalyptic cult.  Fear runs rampant in our culture for good reason, therefore we purchase guns to arm our households . Would it be a better place if the culture never existed in the first place... Mabye. But the fact of the matter is that there are so many guns it makes no sense to disarm law abiding citizens while criminals obviously are not going to follow the rules. We are not the type of people to be passive in the face of a threat.  Ironically even the mention of fun controls sends sales booming in the us. Obama has done more for gun sakes and directly contributed to there being more guns on the street than any us president before him. Haveing a degree in economics it's interesting to watch from a market perspective.

Ultimately the gun laws have ended up creatng ther own problems. With guns so freely availale, criminals and gangs can easily get hold of guns. Guns are listed to 'protect' people rom those problems, but I the laws had been tighter in the irst place those issues would not be widespread.

And honestly, Americans seem so paranoid of their own government it's a wonder how they're a functional socety. It just seems absurd to me that Americans ac so terrified of their own government.

Our country has gun control laws and I am not scared of the government. (I'll admit their inept and incompetant a times, but scared of them? No, certainly not enough to want to bear arms.) If the American people are that scared of their government why on earth do they stay?

That's what scares me about you people. The mere thought of gun control gets 'law abiding citizens' to arm themselves more. How many guns do 'law abiding' citzens actually need? It just sounds utterly absurd and, quite frankly, scary.

I am more scared of gong to America and being shot by a 'law aiding citizen' than I am by a criminal to be honest.
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White Crane Feather
Sep 27 2013 06:51 PM
Statistically it's not responsible gun owners that are the problem, but yes. we have serious problems. There is a strong sentiment here that a government should fear its people, in many ways it does provide a check against the government. In reality though  guns are no match for drones, cruise missiles, or apache helicopters, so this defense from the government is an illusion.

Still. I used to  live down the street from a bad neighbor hood and my house was broken into twice. I bought my wife a shotgun because I work in the evenings. Statistically she is more likely to shoot me with it in an accident, but I felt much better knowing she had something to protect herself with.

The sad fact is that guns are not going anywhere it would spark a rebellion here if Somone tried to force the issue. So one has to decide weather to be left empty handed or armed and trained.

I prefer to the latter. As my children grow older and times change I'm not going to leave my boys empty handed and untrained in a country filled with drug violence, gangs, psychopaths, potential for severe economic unrest, and a wealth of other luming threats.

And yes I have tried to talk my wife into moveing to Australia, or even Canada. She won't do it.
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White Crane Feather, on 27 September 2013 - 06:51 PM, said:

Statistically it's not responsible gun owners that are the problem, but yes. we have serious problems. There is a strong sentiment here that a government should fear its people, in many ways it does provide a check against the government. In reality though  guns are no match for drones, cruise missiles, or apache helicopters, so this defense from the government is an illusion.

Still. I used to  live down the street from a bad neighbor hood and my house was broken into twice. I bought my wife a shotgun because I work in the evenings. Statistically she is more likely to shoot me with it in an accident, but I felt much better knowing she had something to protect herself with.

The sad fact is that guns are not going anywhere it would spark a rebellion here if Somone tried to force the issue. So one has to decide weather to be left empty handed or armed and trained.

I prefer to the latter. As my children grow older and times change I'm not going to leave my boys empty handed and untrained in a country filled with drug violence, gangs, psychopaths, potential for severe economic unrest, and a wealth of other luming threats.

And yes I have tried to talk my wife into moveing to Australia, or even Canada. She won't do it.

I agree its not responsible gun owners that are the problem. But when you have a system where ANYONE can get a gun, then that is a part of the problem isn't it? That's true. If the governmen wanted to take oer it could and easily, because it has better tech than simple guns. Guns can't stop a cruise missile or chemical or biological weapons. Guns are useless against the armor of a tank, or a well equiped soldier. The excuse that theyre a defense against the government is a pitiful one. It's like acting like a plastic bag is an effective space helmet, it just isn't.

The statistic that a loved one is more likely to shoot you than an intruder is a disturbing one... yet you went and did it anyway. And you're not alone in that, which is even more disturbing.

Honestly, that logic just sounds crazy. That people would be terrified enough to kill if someone took their guns shows how deep the issue is. So you want people trained? Having the general public trained to kill sounds like a very bad idea. It just sounds like it'll make people more of a danger not less.

You could say that about anywhere. I don't want my future kids trained for those threats, not unless they choose to go into the military or law enforcement. Members of the public should not HAVE to be trained to deal with those things. We have people to do those jobs for us (but let me guess, Americans are too paranoid about those people too right?).

It's funny, if all of those threats you mention had any serious possiility of happening to you realistically, you'd be out there like a shot. Not for yourself, but for your kids. That you don't, well it says a lot.

It seems America is happy to be paranoid and as such, will only spiral down into further paranoia because any attempt to deal with it will be considered a threat. It's sad really, to see a country like that deal with a problem by making it worse and worse.
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shadowhive, on 27 September 2013 - 02:29 PM, said:

Thanks! Black Butler is awesome and I really love Grell (obviously). It's one of my faourite animes too (though I need to watch more).

I think that's really odd. I've never seen a gun up close, which less handled one and I honestly wouldn't feel safer with one in the house. So the gun mentality of the US has always seemed rather strange. It's like... you guys need a gun to feel safe and I just find that utterly strange ecause it's not as if you live somewhere where there's dangerous animals and it's not as if you guys live in a war zone or anywhere that really warrants it. So I don't really get why you need that security to begin with.

Yeah that does make sense. I really don't get the christian idea of the afterlife, where the soul is remoed and they become servents of god. That basically sounds like forced slaery which is an odd thing to believe in. Yeah I dont think you'd have to stay wherever you go, you'd have a choice. But yeah it is one big mystery really.

I think some ghosts would be souls coming back to visit. I mean if you can go where you want you'd want to visit places that mattered to you. I do think too that some get... stuck, unable to move one for some reason. they doo say that traumatic events can leave like an... imprint. So it may not be the actual soul but that, which gets played over and over like some late night rerun.

Absolutely! I mean I just saw pictures of a squid they recently discoered called the big fin squid and it's just so huge and freaky looking and weve only just seen it so.. who knows what else is down in the depths? And I recall a documentary on the search for the Yeti and they found some fur... whch didn't math any known animal. So yeah, there's still thngs out there.

:)

Thanks, it's nice to read them. Heheh and yeah I may have ended up dazing over said heaen (and then mentally adding things like unlimited pizza and a unicorn) :P

My gun mentaility is simply I like to hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst. Its also why I carry a first aid kit everywhere I go and have two extras in my vehicle.

I guess the imprint makes sense, but thats all part of the mystery and the fun in trying to unravel said mystery.

I love when people bring up Sea Cryptids simply because there is soooo much possibility for them to exist its not even funny. I do however find it sad that we (Earth as a whole) is more interested in space then what is beneath the waves and oceans. Such a tragedy. I believe if we invest what we do into space programs into deep sea research the results would be remarkable and astounding.
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White Crane Feather
Sep 29 2013 12:50 AM
We should get rid of cars then. To many people die in car accidents ( it's the leading cause of accidental death)  they should be banned because they are risky.

We are a free country. Our government does what we tell it to. If as a group we decide no guns then that will be the law of the land, but if people want to beanie to choose for themselves instead of Somone parenting them, they will vote that way.

Law enforcement absolutely does not protect anyone. They show up after you are dead and hopefully find a way to capture the bad guy, but that's of little use to the people who have already been victimized.

There are no anti gun sentiments in a home invasion. If they are conming through your door to rape and pillage, you will wish you were armed.

Criminals do not get their guns legally, the only thing anti gun legislation accomplishes is taking rights away from people that will follow the law, by definition criminals do not. This effectively disarms the good guys and arms the bad guys.
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White Crane Feather, on 29 September 2013 - 12:50 AM, said:

We should get rid of cars then. To many people die in car accidents ( it's the leading cause of accidental death)  they should be banned because they are risky.

We are a free country. Our government does what we tell it to. If as a group we decide no guns then that will be the law of the land, but if people want to beanie to choose for themselves instead of Somone parenting them, they will vote that way.

Law enforcement absolutely does not protect anyone. They show up after you are dead and hopefully find a way to capture the bad guy, but that's of little use to the people who have already been victimized.

There are no anti gun sentiments in a home invasion. If they are conming through your door to rape and pillage, you will wish you were armed.

Criminals do not get their guns legally, the only thing anti gun legislation accomplishes is taking rights away from people that will follow the law, by definition criminals do not. This effectively disarms the good guys and arms the bad guys.

Getting rid of cars makes less sense ten getting rid of guns. The main purpose of cars is to get people from one place to another. Accidents happen because, well unpredictable things can happen between destinations. What is the main purpose of a gun? To kill (or at the very least wound). So when a gun is used to shoot someone, it's performing it's primary function. (Very much unlike the car.)

The problem with that, of course, is that not every decision is put to a vote amongst the people. The government makes all kinds of decisions without consulting everyone. People vote primarily for who wll represent them in government, but they don't vote for every single issue the government does. (Indeed if hey did the process would become unwieldy to the point where the government is ineffectual.)

Yes, that's how law enforcement functions. It can't stop every crime happening, after all how could it? But it can catch people before they do it again.

Home invasions seem to be far more common in America than anywhere else. I do not feel less safe because I don't have a gun (or any other weapon to hand). I feel safe walking down he street at night (even in towns and cities). I feel safe in my own home. It seems you cannot say the same.

Criminals don't follow the law, you are correct there, but they can get guns the same way that the 'good guys' can get guns. They can steal guns from good guys. And some criminals, of course, don't start off as bad guys. This is, of course, he problem. There's been no form of proper gun control in America and now, even if some were put in place, it would make no difference because of how many guns are out there because gun control has been stalled for so long.

Of course, your arguement there focusses on guns being used for and by criminals. That neatly makes the situation nicely black and white. But what about the many situations where that's not the case? How many kids are killed because they find a gun and accidently shot themselves (or others)? How many people (especally teenagers) have snapped, took a gun and shot up somewhere? How many of those 'good guys' have shot someone out of anger, only to regret it later? How many have shot someone assuming they were an intruder only to find it wasn't? Recently people have been shot simply for walking past someone's house.

Guns turn anyone into a potential killer, even 'good guys' and the people that are killed aren't 'big bad criminals' but other good guys too. In fact a gun is more likely (and you admit it yourself) to do just that.
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RedDusk, on 28 September 2013 - 02:08 AM, said:


My gun mentaility is simply I like to hope for the best, but be prepared for the worst. Its also why I carry a first aid kit everywhere I go and have two extras in my vehicle.

I guess the imprint makes sense, but thats all part of the mystery and the fun in trying to unravel said mystery.

I love when people bring up Sea Cryptids simply because there is soooo much possibility for them to exist its not even funny. I do however find it sad that we (Earth as a whole) is more interested in space then what is beneath the waves and oceans. Such a tragedy. I believe if we invest what we do into space programs into deep sea research the results would be remarkable and astounding.

I think preparing for the worst can be a good idea, but sometimes it can go too far. How many people have a gun in there home under that mentality? Compare that to how many have a fire extinguisher or carry a first aid kit like you do? A first aid kit is a much more sensible thing to do than have a gun, as it's application is much more ueful (and more likely to come in handy).

Yes, it does. I think that when you have a ghost that does the same thing over and over, that's what it is. After all if you could cme back from the afterlife why would you do the same thing over and over? (Especially is that thing is traumatic.)

There really is. They say we know more about the surface of the moon than the bottom of the sea, so it's likely there's much more down there we still don't know. Personally I think we should be interested in both. Space is much bigger of course, but underwater exploration would prove useful before a mission to Europa. Who know what we could find beneath the waves if there was a little more focus?
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White Crane Feather
Sep 29 2013 03:25 PM
How many kids die in car accidents, how many people die from misuse or abuse of pharmacuticles. Both more than guns. A gun is a tool like a car. When its misused or abused its dangerous. Cars and pharmacuticles cause far more accidental deaths but you don't hear a call to ban either. The fact of the matter is that a weapon carries more of an emotional attachment and gets more press. Thats it. People die in accidents and abuse all the time that's life. The fact of the matter is that a weapon is a tool that is not anymore dangerous than your car, you just like the convinence your car offers so you are willing to take the risk of driving it and the risk that a kid might run out in front of you someday and die both more likely than a gun accident. You have the choice to take these risks and I'm willing to bet you would fight for them because makeing choices for oneself is what freedom is about.

There is no evidence that guns on average are anymore dangerous than stairs. When you have a large population of people death by stairs adds up. It's only the emotional attachment to weapons that fuels fear. You should worry more about crossing the street. Or mabey banning burgers and unhealthy food which kills far more people than guns.
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White Crane Feather, on 29 September 2013 - 03:25 PM, said:

How many kids die in car accidents, how many people die from misuse or abuse of pharmacuticles. Both more than guns. A gun is a tool like a car. When its misused or abused its dangerous. Cars and pharmacuticles cause far more accidental deaths but you don't hear a call to ban either. The fact of the matter is that a weapon carries more of an emotional attachment and gets more press. Thats it. People die in accidents and abuse all the time that's life. The fact of the matter is that a weapon is a tool that is not anymore dangerous than your car, you just like the convinence your car offers so you are willing to take the risk of driving it and the risk that a kid might run out in front of you someday and die both more likely than a gun accident. You have the choice to take these risks and I'm willing to bet you would fight for them because makeing choices for oneself is what freedom is about.

There is no evidence that guns on average are anymore dangerous than stairs. When you have a large population of people death by stairs adds up. It's only the emotional attachment to weapons that fuels fear. You should worry more about crossing the street. Or mabey banning burgers and unhealthy food which kills far more people than guns.

This, again, is something I find odd about pro-gun people. When discussing guns you quickly change the subject. People dying from drugs or car accidents are completely different issues. Yes, people die from drug overdoses and yes, people die in car accidents. And yes, those things are tragedies. But that has NO baring on the issue of guns and people being killed by them. Why is it pro-gun people like using the deaths of others by other means as an excuse, as if those deaths make the ones done by shooters more acceptable?

A gun is not a tool. It is a weapon, it's purppose and function is to kill. A kitchen knife, that is a tool. It can kill someone just as easily as a gun can, but it's primary purpose is for food preparation. Any other thing that can kill have an actual use that does not involve killing, from baseball bats to cars and drugs. But guns? Guns are designed with the sole purpose of killing another living thing and that's what makes them dangerous.

You're right, it is the emotional attachment to weapons that fuels fear, but the attachment that fuels it is the one that gun owners have, with their fixation of keeping weapons and the excuses that they have for having them.

This is shown most of all by you. Look at my orginal post. It is nine paragraphs long. I mention guns in the first paragraph VERY briefly (not even a sentence long) and look at the reaction it provoked from you! My main post wasn't even focussed on guns in the slightest and you fixated on it to the exclusion of all of the rest of the post. That, to me, says a lot about what the gun mentality does.
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White Crane Feather
Sep 30 2013 01:35 AM
I'm not reacting, I have enjoyed your passionate arguing in other threads, I debate for entertainment. If it wasn't you I wouldn't give it a second thought.

Nor have I changed the subject. I'm merely pointing out the double standard. You are unwilling to ban burgers or cars because of your preferences but wish to force your tastes on others.  You are completely wrong. A weapon is merely a tool for the intention of the user. So is a Knife. It's soul fiction is not to kill only. It's called a force multiplyer. A knife is a force multiplier and so is a knife or martial arts training. If my intention is to detur the weapon multiplies my force in doing so, if my intention is to kill the weapon does the same. A rock has no intentions, nor does a gun. It's a cold hard piece if metal. Gun issues are not gun problems. It's people that are the problem. Why don't you look at Mexico. It has tremendous gun violence and very strict gun controls. The anti gun lobby had no grounds to stand on other than apeal to emotion.
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White Crane Feather
Sep 30 2013 01:50 AM
By the way I agree with the other issues. That's why it caught my attention.  You are usually very logical and thoughtful when it comes to gay rights or religion, then horribly inaccurate and illogical  when it comes to gun owners and their rights.
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White Crane Feather, on 30 September 2013 - 01:35 AM, said:

I'm not reacting, I have enjoyed your passionate arguing in other threads, I debate for entertainment. If it wasn't you I wouldn't give it a second thought.

Well thanks I guess.

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Nor have I changed the subject. I'm merely pointing out the double standard. You are unwilling to ban burgers or cars because of your preferences but wish to force your tastes on others.  You are completely wrong. A weapon is merely a tool for the intention of the user. So is a Knife. It's soul fiction is not to kill only. It's called a force multiplyer. A knife is a force multiplier and so is a knife or martial arts training. If my intention is to detur the weapon multiplies my force in doing so, if my intention is to kill the weapon does the same. A rock has no intentions, nor does a gun. It's a cold hard piece if metal. Gun issues are not gun problems. It's people that are the problem. Why don't you look at Mexico. It has tremendous gun violence and very strict gun controls. The anti gun lobby had no grounds to stand on other than apeal to emotion.

It's not a double standard. While a knife or car can be used to kill someone, it's not it's primary function (or even a secondary one). Can you say the same thing about a gun? No you can't. If a gun kills someone it's doing it's job. It's a weapon and it's function is to kill. Anyone can kill with a gun too. While killing with a knife or rock requires force (or a car requires ability to at least start a car), all you need to do is point and shoot with a gun. It requires no real skill or ability (as shown by young kids shooting themselves). Hell, I could kill someone with a gun and I've never even handled one, whereas I couldn't do it with a car or knife.

Gun violence is a problem. The thing I don't get with America is that instead of tackling the problem, they throw more guns at it. That just sounds like the wrong way to go. It's like seeing a fire and instead of putting it out you hrow more fire at it.

And what of other countries? Just because Mexico has strict gun laws and still has a gun problem doesn't mean gun control is ineffectual. There's many others where it works pretty effectively.

I'm going to be coming to America at some point soon, perhaps next year and you know something? I know I will not feel even half as safe there as I will here and why? Because everyone has a gun and that scares me. It terrifies me that everyone there has a weapon that dangerous and seems to be ok with it. I just will not feel safe in your country from the moment I step off the plane until I get back on it.

White Crane Feather, on 30 September 2013 - 01:50 AM, said:

By the way I agree with the other issues. That's why it caught my attention.  You are usually very logical and thoughtful when it comes to gay rights or religion, then horribly inaccurate and illogical  when it comes to gun owners and their rights.

Well I am when it comes to those issues, because I've had personal experience with them.

When it comes to guns, however, like I've said. I've not seen a gun in person, much less held one. So I don't understand the need for one. You may call me illogical but I'm not so afraid of the government I feel the need to arm myself. I'm not so afraid of someone breaking into my home I feel the need to give a gun to someone who is more likely to shoot someone they know than an intruder. That sounds horribly illogical to me. It sounds completely alien and absurd.

I just don't see why someone should have the 'right' to own a dangerous weapon and why it's so important to do so. It just sounds so absurd.

The thing that I find most disturbing is that anyone can get a gun legally. Why isn't there at least manadatory training in gun safety before someone gets their first one? Or a reasonable limit to how many a household can own? But I feel even the suggestion of such measures would send people clamouring to get more guns instead, because the possibility of even the smallest regulation seems to terrify you guys.
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I like it when a ''normal'' person talks on these blogs.

Science can always explain things to a point shadowhive and religion and faith can give us the mental and emotional support to a point, the problems occurs when one is unable to accept the other.
e.g. all known life is basically a handful of materials chemical bought to life due to a few chemical reactions causing some electrical reactions or vice verse. Religion faith belief  whatever you would call it is intrinsic to each of us based on our experiences and things we have been told.
Neither of these can explain what we are as a whole.
Science tells us that we are made of energy regardless of what form that energy takes it can't be destroyed just converted to another form, hence there is no reason not to believe that once the energy we are made up of in this form will not  continue in another.
Faith belief etc... tells us that what we are will continue once our bodily existence has passed.
So both tell us the same thing albeit in very different ways, what science tells us is a transference of energy state, does it not imply that a soul or conscientiousness  which is in printed upon that energy state also transfers. I believe it does, what then happens I don't know but it is plausible that that energy state can once again be born in whole or partially into another material form or another person whilst taking with it the impressions upon the energy of a former conscientious.
So yes some form of rebirth or reincarnation is certainly possible even from a scientific view point, how much the person would know this or even understand it other than feeling of having been here before or even as a man knowing and feeling that he should be a woman......because the first imprint on the energy was female......well i don't know.
Regarding the meeting of loved ones in an afterlife again I see no known reason why that when our bodies die and the energy transforms that it would not seek out energy of the same signature such as previous family members or friends. this can be seen in action in science as it is well known that certain energy signatures attract but also repel.
I hope this information will help in someways guide you to your own beliefs on these matters as in all honesty your own belief is the most important.
Finally on the subject of guns....there is only one reason why people have guns and that is to make themselves more powerful either in looks or in there own minds. If as a person you are in a place where everyone is bigger and stronger than you are a weapon makes you feel more powerful than you are. If your a mother with children in a place that you feel fear, then a weapon makes you feel more powerful than you actually are.
If as a burglar or person wanting to do a crime the weapon again gives you belief that people will view you as being more powerful than you are and on the other side of the same coin the officer with the gun in his hand gives him belief that it gives him power to up hold the law.
To me all guns should be remove and if a support item is required to give a feel of strength or power in an awkward position then it should be something with none terminal out come.
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