Occultism

[Kazahel]

But that has been my whole point the whole time. You choose to beleive these definitions because you think shapeshifting is cool.

Yes of course shapeshifting is cool but I believe the definitions I found because it fits with what I have experienced. I first shapeshifted in lucid dreams because I just looked at it as a thing to try to do(I guess I thought it would be a cool trick though yes). Its also very addictive and now I just seem to find myself shifted sometimes. Usually its when I run in dreams because I spent years running in lucid dreams with my hands to make me shift into a wolf. For fun because its a really good experience to shapeshift. So everytime I would go lucid straight away I would run and then try to shift into a wolf again, and then after a few years I just seemed to find myself running like that in normal dreams because deep down I knew I could run like that to go faster. So what would happen is I would go lucid because I would be aware I was running with my hands. So its a trigger into going lucid for me. So I choose to believe the definitions because they are fitting to what I've spent many years doing.

So, it has nothing to do with definitions, since you choose to ignore the ones I have shown you showing that shapeshifting is a physical thing, and choose to believe the definitions that you want.

But its not only a physical thing. So it has everything to do with the definitions. Which I didnt ignore, only showed how others have expanded on them.

[667-Neighbor of the Beast]

Yes of course shapeshifting is cool but I believe the definitions I found because it fits with what I have experienced. I first shapeshifted in lucid dreams because I just looked at it as a thing to try to do(I guess I thought it would be a cool trick though yes). Its also very addictive and now I just seem to find myself shifted sometimes. Usually its when I run in dreams because I spent years running in lucid dreams with my hands to make me shift into a wolf. For fun because its a really good experience to shapeshift. So everytime I would go lucid straight away I would run and then try to shift into a wolf again, and then after a few years I just seemed to find myself running like that in normal dreams because deep down I knew I could run like that to go faster. So what would happen is I would go lucid because I would be aware I was running with my hands. So its a trigger into going lucid for me. So I choose to believe the definitions because they are fitting to what I've spent many years doing.

But its not only a physical thing. So it has everything to do with the definitions. Which I didnt ignore, only showed how others have expanded on them.

But, you just do not seem to realize, that all of this, everything you have described, is strictly in your head, and only figments of your imagination. It is not something you did, just something you dreamed. It is strictly imaginary. To believe that you can claim that you did something you only imaginged you did it ridiculous.

Try going to a shrink and convincing them that you are a shapeshifter because you dreamed it was so and see what kind of reaction you get there.

Like I said, this is what you choose to believe, not because of what is real, but because of what you want to be real.

You claim that I am ignoring definitions, yet you seem to be doing the same thing. You just seem to be picking which definitions you like.

And you still have not addressed why your claims of being a shapeshifter are true, yet say my claims of being the pope, and Mulders claims of criminality are not, even though they all happened in dreams.

A

Edited December 28, 2009 by 667-Neighbor of the Beast

[Kazahel]

You/we are just doing circles. You choose to ignore the more detailed definitions while I understand both. I dont usually see the definitions of shapeshifting as saying its ONLY a physical thing anyway.

[+HerNibs]

You/we are just doing circles. You choose to ignore the more detailed definitions while I understand both. I dont usually see the definitions of shapeshifting as saying its ONLY a physical thing anyway.

Shapeshifting = changing shape

The term definition is being altered to fit whatever anyone wants.

YOU experienced changing shape in a dream.

It isn't that anyone is ignoring the definitions you are putting forth its that we are sticking with accepted/general definition and proponents of this story are altering what the definitions are.

Nibs

[Pauly Dangerously]

You/we are just doing circles. You choose to ignore the more detailed definitions while I understand both. I dont usually see the definitions of shapeshifting as saying its ONLY a physical thing anyway.

Lol. So, you regularly see "shapeshifting" not only defined, but defined frequently enough in a way other than one changing physically, to have you convinced that it should be accepted as fact and accepted here as a very real happening that deserves it's own place in excepted vernacular?

[Kazahel]

Shapeshifting = changing shape

YOU experienced changing shape in a dream.

Yes thats right.

Lol. So, you regularly see "shapeshifting" not only defined, but defined frequently enough in a way other than one changing physically, to have you convinced that it should be accepted as fact and accepted here as a very real happening that deserves it's own place in excepted vernacular?

I guess I just thought everyone knew that shapeshifting was an astral/dreaming thing and that anything else is.. seemingly impossible.

[+HerNibs]

Yes thats right.

I guess I just thought everyone knew that shapeshifting was an astral/dreaming thing and that anything else is.. seemingly impossible.

No. Many people claim to be able to actually morph into another creature. None have provided evidence.

And the human body doesn't work that way.

Nibs

[Kazahel]

No. Many people claim to be able to actually morph into another creature. None have provided evidence.

And the human body doesn't work that way.

Nibs

I know which is why it was always meant to be an astral/dreaming thing.

[+HerNibs]

I know which is why it was always meant to be an astral/dreaming thing.

Which is what keeps it from being a real (as in testable and observable) and makes it fantasy or dreams.

Nibs

[Kazahel]

Which is what keeps it from being a real (as in testable and observable) and makes it fantasy or dreams.

Nibs

Yes but in the end not all dreams are just dreams it seems. Thats why there are threads on how people dream the future and have shared dreams and things like that. So even though it may just be a dream they are linked to real time events sometimes(or it seems that way sometimes anyway). Which is where the astral part comes in. So they are dreams but sometimes they seem much more.

[+HerNibs]

Yes but in the end not all dreams are just dreams it seems. Thats why there are threads on how people dream the future and have shared dreams and things like that. So even though it may just be a dream they are linked to real time events sometimes(or it seems that way sometimes anyway). Which is where the astral part comes in. So they are dreams but sometimes they seem much more.

There is no evidence of dreams being anything but functions of our subconcious. Only stories.

Nibs

[Kazahel]

There is no evidence of dreams being anything but functions of our subconcious. Only stories.

Nibs

I know that is popular belief.

[+HerNibs]

I know that is popular belief.

Ummm...no, it is what it is. No evidence. Just stories.

Nibs

[Kazahel]

Anyway shapeshifting is pretty easy you should try it sometime. Just run really fast and place your hands down to keep running while your lucid dreaming, then you can use that to trigger you later in normal dreams into going lucid if you do it enough(if you make it a habit). It's a good technique I came up with and its fun and feels very real.

Edited December 28, 2009 by Kazahel

[667-Neighbor of the Beast]

Anyway shapeshifting is pretty easy you should try it sometime. Just run really fast and place your hands down to keep running while your lucid dreaming, then you can use that to trigger you later in normal dreams into going lucid if you do it enough(if you make it a habit). It's a good technique I came up with and its fun and feels very real.

What makes you think we have not done such things in our dreams?? I have done many incredible things in dreams. The difference between you and and the rest of us is, that the rest of us know it is just our imagination, which makes it much less amazing. And by the way, you did not come up with the technique. People have been doing this long before you were born.

[667-Neighbor of the Beast]

Yes but in the end not all dreams are just dreams it seems.

Yes, they are, unless you can prove otherwise. Since you seem so stuck on proper definitions:

"Dreams: a series of thoughts, images, or emotions occurring during sleep"

They don't seem to be anything else other than something that goes on in your head.

[Kazahel]

Yes, they are, unless you can prove otherwise. Since you seem so stuck on proper definitions:

"Dreams: a series of thoughts, images, or emotions occurring during sleep"

They don't seem to be anything else other than something that goes on in your head.

But then define Astral and then maybe astral dreaming.

And I can guess you havent shapeshifted in dreams before because if you had I think you would just call it that. It's the only word that suits.

And by the way, you did not come up with the technique. People have been doing this long before you were born.

Actually I did come up with that technique. Not that people shapeshift in dreams... I agree with you on that because as you said they have been doing this before I was born. So I know thats old but what is new(my technique)is that if you make yourself shift in dreams so often(by placing your hands down to run)as soon as you go lucid in the dream, then after awhile it becomes such a habit that when you go to run in normal dreams you find yourself placing your hands down to run. So you can trigger going lucid in a dream because you are used to being lucid when your running on all fours. So when you do it by just habit it makes you lucid dream. Which is a more advanced technique imo if you want to trigger lucidity in dreams.

So I stumbled on my technique because I just found myself going lucid because I was running like that naturally after awhile. And I ran like that because I made it a habit everytime I lucid dreamed for many years.

I posted it ages ago on Dreamviews

Edited December 29, 2009 by Kazahel

[667-Neighbor of the Beast]

And I can guess you havent shapeshifted in dreams before because if you had I think you would just call it that. It's the only word that suits.

No, the only word that suits it is dreaming, period. What makes you think I have not done something like this in my dreams. Hell, most people probably have. The only difference is that the rest of us know it is just a dream, and nothing more. You seem to want to make this in to something special, to make it sounds like you have special "powers" or abilities, and just don't like it when everyone besides yourself can see that they are just dreams. It is all in your head. You are not special for having done this. It is not a spiritual event. It is not a life changing experience. It is just a dream man. I know it, everybody here knows it, except you for. What does that tell you?? That everyone here is wrong, and that you are some super special human privileged to something that the rest of us are not, and no one has discovered this in the history of humanity except yourself, or the more likely scenario is that everyone realizes the truth, except for yourself, and you just do not want to accept it, because you want to feel special by claiming that you have special abilities.

For cripes sake, they are just dreams!! Figments of your imagination!! Everyone knows that, and trying to convince everyone that they are anything more is just making you sound even more ridiculous.

[Kazahel]

No, the only word that suits it is dreaming, period. What makes you think I have not done something like this in my dreams. Hell, most people probably have. The only difference is that the rest of us know it is just a dream, and nothing more. You seem to want to make this in to something special, to make it sounds like you have special "powers" or abilities, and just don't like it when everyone besides yourself can see that they are just dreams. It is all in your head. You are not special for having done this.

Actually 'lucid dreaming' would be more closer. Not just plain old dreaming. And lucid dreaming is not something we all naturally do. It's something we all can do if you learn it and then once you learn it you can shapeshift. Then as my special Shapeshifting Running technique says.. after awhile of doing this it triggers you into going lucid. Which is very cool, ask any lucid dreamer, and its generally not something that people do very often, let alone shapeshift during them!

It is not a spiritual event. It is not a life changing experience. It is just a dream man. I know it, everybody here knows it, except you for. What does that tell you?? That everyone here is wrong, and that you are some ..

Who are you to tell me what is a spiritual event or life changing experience in my life? And these are lucid dreams and astral dreams and experiences. So they are not "just dreams man".. they are fully lucid ones for starters. For you to now say stuff like "super special human privileged to something that the rest of us are not" just means you havent been listening or even have a clue about lucid dreaming. Let alone shapeshifting.

For cripes sake, they are just dreams!! Figments of your imagination!! Everyone knows that, and trying to convince everyone that they are anything more is just making you sound even more ridiculous.

What do you think I tried to convince people my shapeshifting dreams were? I only tried to convince.. I guess if you want to use that word... that shapeshifting was always meant to be a dreaming/astral thing.

Edited December 29, 2009 by Kazahel

[667-Neighbor of the Beast]

Actually 'lucid dreaming' would be more closer. Not just plain old dreaming. And lucid dreaming is not something we all naturally do. It's something we all can do if you learn it and then once you learn it you can shapeshift. Then as my special Shapeshifting Running technique says.. after awhile of doing this it triggers you into going lucid. Which is very cool, ask any lucid dreamer, and its generally not something that people do very often, let alone shapeshift during them!

Who are you to tell me what is a spiritual event or life changing experience in my life? And these are lucid dreams and astral dreams and experiences. So they are not "just dreams man".. they are fully lucid ones for starters. For you to now say stuff like "super special human privileged to something that the rest of us are not" just means you havent been listening or even have a clue about lucid dreaming. Let alone shapeshifting.

What do you think I tried to convince people my shapeshifting dreams were? I only tried to convince.. I guess if you want to use that word... that shapeshifting was always meant to be a dreaming/astral thing.

But the problem is, that you are trying to make dreams into something more than what they really are. I don't care what you call it, dreaming is dreaming, and dreams are nothing more than figments of your imagination. So, basically, you are trying to convince everyone that your dreams are special, when everyone here knows they are not. You are not special, you do not have some special ability, no matter what you label it. They are just dreams, and nothing more. Just figments of your imagination that you are trying to turn into something more.

I have been listening to everything you have said, but me, and obviously the others here too, KNOW that dreams are just dreams, no matter what you call them.

[Kazahel]

But the problem is, that you are trying to make dreams into something more than what they really are. I don't care what you call it, dreaming is dreaming, and dreams are nothing more than figments of your imagination.

You keep saying this but I always said shapeshifting is a dreaming thing.. so I dont understand how you can say I am trying to make dreams into something more. ? And lucid dreaming is a different kind of dreaming and one that most people dont experience very often. But with time and practise and some good techniques.. people can learn to experience them more if they like and can actually experience the joys of shapeshifting.

[667-Neighbor of the Beast]

You keep saying this but I always said shapeshifting is a dreaming thing.. so I dont understand how you can say I am trying to make dreams into something more. ? And lucid dreaming is a different kind of dreaming and one that most people dont experience very often. But with time and practise and some good techniques.. people can learn to experience them more if they like and can actually experience the joys of shapeshifting.

This IS what I am talking about. Lucid dreaming is still dreaming. It all happens inside or your head. I don't care if you call it lucid dreaming, it is still just your imagination. So, claiming that you are a shapeshifter, because you imagined so, does not make you a shapeshifter. You imagined it!!!!! It was in your imagination!! To claim that you are something that you imagined is ridiculous, childish, and borders on insane!! What do you not get about that???

[Kazahel]

Dude chill. Thats how you shapeshift. Anyway maybe you should try out my special shapeshifting running technique because its good for that.. its very relaxing.. and is quite an experience.

[667-Neighbor of the Beast]

Dude chill. Thats how you shapeshift. Anyway maybe you should try out my special shapeshifting running technique because its good for that.. its very relaxing.. and is quite an experience.

First of all, I think you are the one who needs to chill. Second, quit trying to convince everyone that you are so special. You are not. You did not invent some special shapeshifting technique, you did not shapeshift, you do are not priveliged. You had a dream. We all have them. You are no different.

[Kazahel]

You did not invent some special shapeshifting technique, you did not shapeshift, you do are not priveliged. You had a dream. We all have them. You are no different.

Yes I came up with that technique and its a good one if anyone wants to use it. Its my 'Special Shapeshifting Running Technique'(because its special to me) and it was just a bonus how it worked out that it triggers lucidity. So if anyone here is into lucid dreaming and shapeshifting, it could help you out.