iPhone app can manipulate your dreams

[_Only]

It would be interesting if it wasn't actually a test to see if dreams could be manipulated, but just a big effort to see what people currently have floating around in their unconscious mind, on a large scale, with the obligation for all of the users to submit their dreams to the database.

[JGirl]

The self-described "psychologist, author and magician"

the term 'sheeple' comes to mind here

Edited April 11, 2012 by JGirl

[Karlis]

"... we know very little about how to influence dreams. ... " Prof Wiseman said.

I'm rather surprised by this comment -- especially from a person who is an expert in this field. I'm making this post brief, without going into any specifics.

One simple example: A radio set at a low volume next to a sleeping person, broadcasting a conversation, will influence dreams of the sleeper.

Comments anyone?

Karlis

[JayMark]

I'm rather surprised by this comment -- especially from a person who is an expert in this field. I'm making this post brief, without going into any specifics.

One simple example: A radio set at a low volume next to a sleeping person, broadcasting a conversation, will influence dreams of the sleeper.

Comments anyone?

Karlis

But you do not necessarly know how it will influence the dream. Just that it will (or might).

I've had my radio alarm go off while I was sleeping, loud enough so I would hear it in my dreams but not loud enough to wake me immediately. It never influenced my dreams in the same way.

I think his comment was more about the whole mechanism behind dreaming which is bound to consciousness. As far as science goes, we do not know how consciousness is generated and do not know exactly why we dream and how they work according to our consciosuness/subconsciousness.

My thoughts.

Peace.

[_Only]

I'm rather surprised by this comment -- especially from a person who is an expert in this field. I'm making this post brief, without going into any specifics.

One simple example: A radio set at a low volume next to a sleeping person, broadcasting a conversation, will influence dreams of the sleeper.

Comments anyone?

Karlis

Of course that does influence dreams in the way that bits of it get incorporated into your dream. But more of a question is if it is actually influencing the dream, or just becoming incorporated. Could guess that it is modifying it, or guess that it is simply fitting in as the dream would already be, in a unique way. They don't really have any way of knowing.

Edited April 11, 2012 by _Only

[human_eraser]

There is no such thing as mind control... if you are beaten constantly say as a POW then you willingly do what the other wants in fear of more pain. :duh: You have free will... nothing can change that.

Edited April 12, 2012 by human_eraser

[Paracelse]

There is no such thing as mind control... if you are beaten constantly say as a POW then you willingly do what the other wants in fear of more pain. :duh: You have free will... nothing can change that.

I would say this is incorrect, mind control is zverywhere. A very mild form on mind control would be teleshopping channels and advertising. I live with an elderly Mom and you wouldn't know how much stuff I put by on shelves when I take her shopping. And I'm not talking about stuff she needs but stuff she normally wouldn't use. Also when I cath it in time I send back stuff she buy onb shpping networks. Imagine something moer enhanced, you could have mandchurian canditates

[_Only]

Yeah, neuro-linguistic programming can be an effective tool.

[bLu3 de 3n3rgy]

As can hypnosis and messing around with people in alt/suggestible states. But then people question the validity of that because of the issues with 'false memories'. Or suggestions leading people to believe something, fill in the gaps of something that isn't true.

Stage hypnosis for example, my sister had it done and said it was extremely strange to go a long with something but not be able to put her finger on what was wrong about it or know why the sceniro was 'false'. So under that kind of suggestion it felt more 'right' to just accept what was going on as being true because everything was made to make sense. Even though the sceniro was ridiculous and set up for entertaining others.

The sub conscious mind records everything from the observer perspective that every type stimuli and input is something really being experienced. That goes for dream and astral projection experiences too.

[orangepeaceful79]

Any any rate, whether this App is thinly disguised mind control or not - I've concluded that its a piece of crap that doesn't run on my iPad, or at least not that I can tell, so I'm deleting it. Pragmatism wins over paranoia most any day at least for me.

[sarah_444]

Any any rate, whether this App is thinly disguised mind control or not - I've concluded that its a piece of crap that doesn't run on my iPad, or at least not that I can tell, so I'm deleting it. Pragmatism wins over paranoia most any day at least for me.

Agreed - it didn't work at all for me either.

[_Only]

Maybe just another case of P.T. Barnum style marketing for another empty product.

Edited April 12, 2012 by _Only

[human_eraser]

I'm still sceptic about mind control. To have control over someone you have to eliminate the consciousness in it. So in effect, what you are controlling is just a "vessel" so to speak. We as self conscious beings have the ultimate control over ourselves. The only thing that we do not have control over are involuntary body functions, which help us maintain homeostasis which keeps us alive.

[_Only]

I'm still sceptic about mind control. To have control over someone you have to eliminate the consciousness in it. So in effect, what you are controlling is just a "vessel" so to speak. We as self conscious beings have the ultimate control over ourselves. The only thing that we do not have control over are involuntary body functions, which help us maintain homeostasis which keeps us alive.

This is a good example of what can happen.

You don't have to remove consciousness. Just keep it busy, and sneak something in the back door. I agree that we do ultimately have the choice, but are easily manipulated. Some more than others.

Edited April 12, 2012 by _Only

[AdealJustice]

I'm still sceptic about mind control. To have control over someone you have to eliminate the consciousness in it. So in effect, what you are controlling is just a "vessel" so to speak. We as self conscious beings have the ultimate control over ourselves. The only thing that we do not have control over are involuntary body functions, which help us maintain homeostasis which keeps us alive.

trauma based mind control?

[White Crane Feather]

This is a good example of what can happen.

You don't have to remove consciousness. Just keep it busy, and sneak something in the back door. I agree that we do ultimately have the choice, but are easily manipulated. Some more than others.

It's true... Suggestion is powerful.... I regularly use it in front of parents in safetyproofing classes for children to show them how easily kids can be manipulated. Then, I arm them against it :) :)

[psychoticmike]

oh, mind control is definitely real my friends, if you can reprogram someones beliefs, you can control their mind. You can do that through repetition and enough access to the subconcious. I know its real cause i have reprogrammed some of my own subconcious beliefs and seen the effects. I can even conciously control when and if adrenaline gets released, when it starts i can stop it almost instantly. I can also slow my heart beat down, just by thinking about it, and stop pain in its tracks. How much pain? i don't know yet, i haven't tested it in extreme enough situations to find out.

I have cured things with my mind as well.

This app could be harmless, but thats just it, we don't know. And i guess it doesn't even work.

[highdesert50]

Relaxation training as well as image rehearsal training have been used for years by psychologists to address sleep and nightmares.

[human_eraser]

oh, mind control is definitely real my friends, if you can reprogram someones beliefs, you can control their mind. You can do that through repetition and enough access to the subconcious. I know its real cause i have reprogrammed some of my own subconcious beliefs and seen the effects. I can even conciously control when and if adrenaline gets released, when it starts i can stop it almost instantly. I can also slow my heart beat down, just by thinking about it, and stop pain in its tracks. How much pain? i don't know yet, i haven't tested it in extreme enough situations to find out.

I have cured things with my mind as well.

This app could be harmless, but thats just it, we don't know. And i guess it doesn't even work.

You may be able to slow your heart down, but you can't stop it by thinking about it.

And I didn't choose the guy with the glasses.

[_Only]

You may be able to slow your heart down, but you can't stop it by thinking about it.

Pain? Yes, the idea is to stop thinking about it.

And I didn't choose the guy with the glasses.

I know, not everyone in the world does. We can't be forced so easily, just pushed.

Edited April 15, 2012 by _Only

[human_eraser]

Pain? Yes, the idea is to stop thinking about it.

I know, not everyone in the world does. We can't be forced so easily, just pushed.

That makes sense, that we can be "pushed" to do something, but... we can't be turned into zombies like in the movies. But even if you are pushed, you still can choose...

[lindsea]

I tried with an open mind as I'm very interested in sleep, dreams, etc. I tried placing my phone in different places around me as I slept and.. hmm. Balogna.

The only time it fired (played the clip), my dreams were quite the opposite. The other few times, it said I never went into a deep sleep. My Zeo band claimed otherwise. So did my refreshed, I-had-a-deep-sleep feeling.

[psyche101]

Hrrmmz, Reading this thread, I just downloaded, this, and then I remembered, I never remember my dreams!

Edited May 4, 2012 by psyche101

[_Only]

I tried with an open mind as I'm very interested in sleep, dreams, etc. I tried placing my phone in different places around me as I slept and.. hmm. Balogna.

The only time it fired (played the clip), my dreams were quite the opposite. The other few times, it said I never went into a deep sleep. My Zeo band claimed otherwise. So did my refreshed, I-had-a-deep-sleep feeling.

You should try this site out some time.

Be it effective triggering of brain waves through tones, a placebo effect, or the both combined, they work quite effectively for me. It has multiple tones for dreams, including lucid dreaming. I used the lucid tone, and was surprised when the next morning I realized in my dream that I was dreaming... but that woke me up. :/ Nevertheless, I've used multiple tone "sessions" on there, to some noteworthy results (including the behavior changing one to help me quit smoking; it's been almost 7 days without a cigarette ).

http://iso-tones.com/

edit: And Psyche, you should try listening to one of the dream ones before you go to bed.

Edited May 4, 2012 by _Only

[Mikko-kun]

I think this is the most irresponsible phone application ever. I can already see someone doing a harmful version of this and using to give people twisted dreams or brainwash. By the way, I been living without a phone now, for a month soon, just a wireless internet... it may not be the phone, but my dreams have changed during that time. I didn't have an iphone though.

Seriously, I can't understand why someone would want their dreams manipulated. I have dreamed and remembered at least one dream which I wouldn't want manipulated, and you never know when that dream of yours come to you.

One thing that bothers me even more about this is, that this is an application, not a new phone in itself. Doesn't this mean they've already had the potential to mess with our dreams?