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Tantalising Testimony


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Don't get excited by this one, though, since it's supposedly one of ours that crashed in 1963, in Area 51, but it does give a nice aerial view of a crash clean up.

TheMacGuffin,These crashed UFO's are what the Holy Bible refers to as "Fallen Angels" Do not be decieved asto the true nature of these Aliens.
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<p>TheMacGuffin,These crashed UFO's are what the Holy Bible refers to as "Fallen Angels" Do not be decieved asto the true nature of these Aliens.

I got the distinct impression that the military had no great affection for them, and that we shot at them and sometimes they shot at us. The pictures I saw showed dead bodies in a crashed craft of some kind. I never believed they were angels or devils, nothing like that, but they had real physical bodies and were flying around in machines--very advanced machines, but machines nonetheless.

They can be hurt and they can be killed. They can break their little necks and they die when they're hit with bullets. For these reasons, I do not regard them as supernatural entities at all, but physical things from some other place or time. I was not told where they were from, but I can assure you that in the pictures they showed us they were quite dead.

I don't think that angels and demons could be killed like that.

Edited by TheMacGuffin
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A best evidence thread. Yes I suppose so, but where eye witness testimony serves as the main weight of evidence. Also if you look at a trace of the cases I have posted, they are in some ways grouped together. The three children's school cases, the pilot cases, and so on. The more recent cases tend to be Australian (oops I've given away today's case). Will post soon.

Also if you notice I'm doing one per day to keep a degree of regularity to it; and this serves to update me on the major cases. Three years isn't long to be studying Ufology.

one final thing and that is that it's a bit different to a BE thread; I'm not posting random sightings. These are major classic cases not just video evidence. An individual, or mass sighting, followed if possible by an abduction, or close encounter with humanoids. The wholes case.

I hope that clarifies the intention.

The more recent cases have been Australian, I just hope you do not judge the entire country based upon a couple of ditzy blondes and some school kids. I find these few cases out of character for the average Aussie personally.

Regularity is certainly there, perhaps you should slow down a tad. I have mentioned about 3 cases that we have discussed that you forgot we spoke of altogether.

I would also add the the BE thread was about physical evidence, this one is about stories and personal interpretations, so probably quite some difference there too.

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Don't get excited by this one, though, since it's supposedly one of ours that crashed in 1963, in Area 51, but it does give a nice aerial view of a crash clean up.

area-51-cover-up-plane-crash-aerial-distant-view-tents_35800_600x450.jpg

Thanks for that pic, it is an excellent one, interesting the the debris is so well scattered. This is more what I would expect of something that destructed during decent, not on impact.

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The more recent cases have been Australian, I just hope you do not judge the entire country based upon a couple of ditzy blondes and some school kids. I find these few cases out of character for the average Aussie personally.

I Can't imagine that Australia is any different to any other country when it comes to it's UFO visitations and the people's reaction to the phenomena. There are some pretty excellent cases there; the Gosford case, and the Kelly Cahill case for example are both highly significant and well documented. Let's not forget the haunting Fredrick Valentich case.

I would be interested to know how the media treats the issue out there? The UK media lost interest some time in the 90's but is seems to be picking up again slightly now with the disclosure announcements.

Regularity is certainly there, perhaps you should slow down a tad. I have mentioned about 3 cases that we have discussed that you forgot we spoke of altogether.

I have a case that MacG mentioned a while ago, that he will be interested in. Maybe I'll hold them off until tomorrow?

I would also add the the BE thread was about physical evidence, this one is about stories and personal interpretations, so probably quite some difference there too.

Yes I realise that difference. Hearing all of the witness testimony can allow comparisons to be made, and I have to admit not all cases leave trace evidence. The Kelly Cahill case did, but Grace Askew's for example did not.

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From the Paul Bennewitz film, Kirtland Air Force Base and Sandia National Labs, taken in 1980. Very few people ever saw these, and needless to say they were not easy to get. I was never able to see the complete film myself, and as far as I know only some excerpts of the original have ever been publicized, at least in recent years.

Paul%2BBennewitz%2527%2BUFO%2Bfilms.jpg

Quality pictures and well done for finding them and making them available. I won't ask where they came from, but they sure look convincing.

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I reckon the craft she saw was a time machine and its occupants were humans from goodness known how many years, decades or centuries in the future.

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I reckon the craft she saw was a time machine and its occupants were humans from goodness known how many years, decades or centuries in the future.

One theory is as good as another. Any reason for choosing that one among the others?

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I Can't imagine that Australia is any different to any other country when it comes to it's UFO visitations and the people's reaction to the phenomena. There are some pretty excellent cases there; the Gosford case, and the Kelly Cahill case for example are both highly significant and well documented. Let's not forget the haunting Fredrick Valentich case.

I would be interested to know how the media treats the issue out there? The UK media lost interest some time in the 90's but is seems to be picking up again slightly now with the disclosure announcements.

I think you should visit Australia before you make any comparisons on her people. We differ from out American Cousins greatly I would say in that we have different values. And we are of quite some conflicting opinions with our British friends as well. It will not be long before Australia makes that break from the Commonwealth. Americas citizens appear very patriotic and the population count alone has to have an impact. The cases that you have presented are very much fringe element, I personally do not know a single individual that would take either case as seriously as you do. It would be considered credulous to the majority to my personal experience and I have moved about a bit. If you were to ask the average Aussie in the street who Kelly Cahill or Grace Askew is I would bet that if you got one in ten thousand who knew who you were talking about you would be doing very well. And out of them, 90% would think you were just wasting their time. Fredrick Valentich's bones are sitting at the bottom of Bass Strait, not on another planet. Just like Amelia Earheart, these pioneers tend to go missing from time to time. Heck, it took 75 years to find George Mallory's body and we had a good idea where to look! Bass straight would have Valentich's remains spread far and wide. That is if they even still have form after all those years being battered about and picked clean in that wild water.

The media treat the phenomena like a joke, as they always do everywhere. It is a selling point Zoser, I think you place too much faith in the media to report responsibly. That is not their agenda, their agenda is to sell enough papers to put food on the family table and meet the mortgage. One paper in particular who promotes UFO stories here is called the NT News, and it is a rag that makes stuff up just to sell it, they were caught out by ABC's media watch and exposed for running lies and calling them stories.

Please read this link to see how the NT news lied through their teeth to make a story sound like ET, and how they were put on the spot and exposed. - LINK - UFO Armada invades NT News

I have a case that MacG mentioned a while ago, that he will be interested in. Maybe I'll hold them off until tomorrow?

Do you not agree that at least a brief discussion of the cases, between the cases, would be more interesting? It is becoming more of a list than a discussion. This is what the BFRO does to instill faith in the Bigfoot phenomena. They grab every single case no matter how ridiculous so at the end of the day they can say "We have complied X thousand cases!!!! How is that not convincing!!!!!" Well, it is not. A great deal of rubbish is no more convincing than a little bit of rubbish. One of the great quotes I have seen here that must go into my signature is "The plural of anecdote is not data" I just need to track down who said it first to give them the credit.

Yes I realise that difference. Hearing all of the witness testimony can allow comparisons to be made, and I have to admit not all cases leave trace evidence. The Kelly Cahill case did, but Grace Askew's for example did not.

But you turn a blind eye when the comparison turns out to be a mundane explanation and or discount ET. And you give such explanation no credence, when they are very important discoveries. A one sided conversation can only travel so far Zoser.

Kelly Cahill, do you mean the triangle on her tummy? If so, that is not trace evidence whatsoever. Kelly's "aliens" were ghostly, like apparitions, it stinks of sleep paralysis to high heaven if not just dramatisation. How did ghostly aliens leave a physical mark? I do not see what is so compelling about her claim, I really don't. Same with Grace Askew I just do not find her story believable. Hell, do you know where she lives? How does one become the sole witness when Bacchus Marsh is a well settled tourist spot since 1850? Hardly remote and isolated. But I find the return visit the most suspect aspect.

As I said, please do not judge our country based on a coupe of ditzy blondes and some old tales told by schoolchildren.

The only Grace Askew I have time for is this one. And she is not an Aussie.

grace-askew-web.jpg

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One theory is as good as another. Any reason for choosing that one among the others?

So if I say that the colours are consistent with plasma photographed in infra red that would also be quite acceptable to you as a plausible option?

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Quality pictures and well done for finding them and making them available. I won't ask where they came from, but they sure look convincing.

Those were the only ones I could get, but I'm sure there are more somewhere. In spite of all the hocus-pocus by Richard Doty, the Bennewitz films and pictures were real and may even still be classified for all I know. Someone spent a lot of time analyzing them, but I don't know who.

And here's an interesting chart that someone made. I call my UFO sighting an A-2 type.

ufo-types.jpg

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Supposedly there have been people from the UFO investigation running around with charts and pictures like these since at least the 1950s, at least according to some witnesses. I have heard that there is even a collection of models somewhere, but I've never seen one.

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Those were the only ones I could get, but I'm sure there are more somewhere. In spite of all the hocus-pocus by Richard Doty, the Bennewitz films and pictures were real and may even still be classified for all I know. Someone spent a lot of time analyzing them, but I don't know who.

And here's an interesting chart that someone made. I call my UFO sighting an A-2 type.

ufo-types.jpg

80 different types of spacecraft seems an awful lot I have to say.

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80 different types of spacecraft seems an awful lot I have to say.

More than that. What does that tell you? What conclusions would you reach, say compared to what we did? Let's assume for the moment we have proof of these. What would you conclude?

A number of different conclusions are possible here, and there is no "right" answer, only probable or plausible ones, but let's assume that our information is good and accurate.

Edited by TheMacGuffin
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I got the distinct impression that the military had no great affection for them, and that we shot at them and sometimes they shot at us. The pictures I saw showed dead bodies in a crashed craft of some kind. I never believed they were angels or devils, nothing like that, but they had real physical bodies and were flying around in machines--very advanced machines, but machines nonetheless.

They can be hurt and they can be killed. They can break their little necks and they die when they're hit with bullets. For these reasons, I do not regard them as supernatural entities at all, but physical things from some other place or time. I was not told where they were from, but I can assure you that in the pictures they showed us they were quite dead.

I don't think that angels and demons could be killed like that.

TheMacGuffin,

Correct, dismiss the interpreter that joined this message board in April. This interpreter is not a real interpreter.

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More than that. What does that tell you? What conclusions would you reach, say compared to what we did? Let's assume for the moment we have proof of these. What would you conclude?

Proof that every single one is an Alien craft? The only conclusions I could come to closely looking at the crat is that some bear similarity, say A1 to A3, A4 to A6 with A8, B7, I4 & I5 look like they could be upgraded models from the same source of technology, so I would assume the sightings are very well spread over time?

A number of different conclusions are possible here, and there is no "right" answer, only probable or plausible ones, but let's assume that our information is good and accurate.

Honestly, I have no answer, I think if that many craft were visiting us then the question would not exist. We all would know.

Edited by psyche101
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Proof that every single one is an Alien craft? The only conclusions I could come to closely looking at the crat is that some bear similarity, say A1 to A3, A4 to A6 with A8, B7, I4 & I5 look like they could be upgraded models from the same source of technology, so I would assume the sightings are very well spread over time?

That's one possibility. There are certain basic models but a number of variants, maybe because they are being improved over time or they have alterations for different missions. They may have produced large numbers of a certain variant while others are relatively rare. After all, this is done all the time with earthly aircraft.

Some of these may be "retired" or replaced by new types over time, and this chart shows 50-60 years worth of UFO sightings.

Another possibility is that they are not all products of the same civilization and technology, but several different ones--or many different ones--and some are more advanced than others. If that's true, then the type is the tip-off to its place of origin.

Edited by TheMacGuffin
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That's one possibility. There are certain basic models but a number of variants, maybe because they are being improved over time or they have alterations for different missions. They may have produced large numbers of a certain variant while others are relatively rare. After all, this is done all the time with earthly aircraft.

They could be variants, but again, if a species has freighters, commuters, scouts, and fighters all here at earth, it seems incredible that we do not have more info on them from the amateur community.

Some of these may be "retired" or replaced by no types over time, and this chart shows 50-60 years worth of UFO sightings.

Actually, I did notice the Kenneth Arnold model, and the Petit Rechain model, but newer sightings do not seem to offer such detail, so I guess the majority would be from that more golden era for UFO sightings.

Another possibility is that they are not all products of the same civilization and technology, but several different ones--or many different ones--and some are more advanced than others. If that's true, then the type is the tip-off to its place of origin.

If they were many, would that not make it harder to determine? But I think if I look real hard, I could probably bring the 80 of them down to about 8 groups?

Edited by psyche101
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They could be variants, but again, if a species has freighters, commuters, scouts, and fighters all here at earth, it seems incredible that we do not have more info on them from the amateur community.

If they were many, would that not make it harder to determine? But I think if I look real hard, I could probably bring the 80 of them down to about 8 groups?

I think there has been considerable discussion about that over the years, although some UFO types seem to be a lot more common than others. Sometimes new ones seem to show up, depending on which of the big waves we're talking about.

It sure isn't just flying saucers, though, but flying everything--a regular flying circus. The saucers, triangles, cigar shapes and spheres were seen early on, even in the 1940s, but that was when they still knew just a little about what was going on. Then things started to get more complicated compared to the original theory that just one group was involved.

Edited by TheMacGuffin
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TheMacGuffin,

Correct, dismiss the interpreter that joined this message board in April. This interpreter is not a real interpreter.

I have no idea who he was, but UFOs never had any religious significance to me, and the information I got about them had nothing to do with angels, demons or anything supernatural.

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I think you should visit Australia before you make any comparisons on her people. We differ from out American Cousins greatly I would say in that we have different values. And we are of quite some conflicting opinions with our British friends as well. It will not be long before Australia makes that break from the Commonwealth. Americas citizens appear very patriotic and the population count alone has to have an impact. The cases that you have presented are very much fringe element, I personally do not know a single individual that would take either case as seriously as you do. It would be considered credulous to the majority to my personal experience and I have moved about a bit. If you were to ask the average Aussie in the street who Kelly Cahill or Grace Askew is I would bet that if you got one in ten thousand who knew who you were talking about you would be doing very well. And out of them, 90% would think you were just wasting their time. Fredrick Valentich's bones are sitting at the bottom of Bass Strait, not on another planet. Just like Amelia Earheart, these pioneers tend to go missing from time to time. Heck, it took 75 years to find George Mallory's body and we had a good idea where to look! Bass straight would have Valentich's remains spread far and wide. That is if they even still have form after all those years being battered about and picked clean in that wild water.

The media treat the phenomena like a joke, as they always do everywhere. It is a selling point Zoser, I think you place too much faith in the media to report responsibly. That is not their agenda, their agenda is to sell enough papers to put food on the family table and meet the mortgage. One paper in particular who promotes UFO stories here is called the NT News, and it is a rag that makes stuff up just to sell it, they were caught out by ABC's media watch and exposed for running lies and calling them stories.

Please read this link to see how the NT news lied through their teeth to make a story sound like ET, and how they were put on the spot and exposed. - LINK - UFO Armada invades NT News

Do you not agree that at least a brief discussion of the cases, between the cases, would be more interesting? It is becoming more of a list than a discussion. This is what the BFRO does to instill faith in the Bigfoot phenomena. They grab every single case no matter how ridiculous so at the end of the day they can say "We have complied X thousand cases!!!! How is that not convincing!!!!!" Well, it is not. A great deal of rubbish is no more convincing than a little bit of rubbish. One of the great quotes I have seen here that must go into my signature is "The plural of anecdote is not data" I just need to track down who said it first to give them the credit.

But you turn a blind eye when the comparison turns out to be a mundane explanation and or discount ET. And you give such explanation no credence, when they are very important discoveries. A one sided conversation can only travel so far Zoser.

Kelly Cahill, do you mean the triangle on her tummy? If so, that is not trace evidence whatsoever. Kelly's "aliens" were ghostly, like apparitions, it stinks of sleep paralysis to high heaven if not just dramatisation. How did ghostly aliens leave a physical mark? I do not see what is so compelling about her claim, I really don't. Same with Grace Askew I just do not find her story believable. Hell, do you know where she lives? How does one become the sole witness when Bacchus Marsh is a well settled tourist spot since 1850? Hardly remote and isolated. But I find the return visit the most suspect aspect.

As I said, please do not judge our country based on a coupe of ditzy blondes and some old tales told by schoolchildren.

The only Grace Askew I have time for is this one. And she is not an Aussie.

grace-askew-web.jpg

I regard Australians as the same stock as the mother nation (GB). I have several relations there, some moved out in the 50's and some later. People say that Oz is just GB with sunshine. I would love to go there one day.

On the Kelly Cahill case, craft left tripod indentations on the ground. It was well documented.

Edited by zoser
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Zoser

On the Kelly Cahill case, craft left tripod indentations on the ground. It was well documented.

Zoser, please define for me *exactly* what you mean by 'well documented' with specific regard to this case and the claimed indentations.

And yes, I have a reason for asking. Or feel free to withdraw the comment, if you prefer.. :P

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Zoser

Zoser, please define for me *exactly* what you mean by 'well documented' with specific regard to this case and the claimed indentations.

And yes, I have a reason for asking. Or feel free to withdraw the comment, if you prefer.. :P

It's all on the video clip; but here you are:

They had two different laboratories confirm several unusual anomalies and magnetic problems at the apparent site of the UFO landing. Some interesting changes in soil chemistry were detected- an above average sulphur content, the presence of pyrene (which occurs in coal tar and is also obtained by the destructive hydrogenation of hard coal), and tannic acid- in a crescent shaped indentation. There was a triangular formation of dead grass on the ground, spaced out in the site.

http://rense.com/general39/tm_aug.htm

Edited by zoser
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It will not be long before Australia makes that break from the Commonwealth.

Don't get your hopes up. That's not gonna happen. And why would you want to break away from a great, vibrant organisation like the Commonwealth? Just consider yourself lucky that you aren't in the EU like Britain is. Britain made a big mistake in abandoning its great Commonwealth allies in 1973 to join an organisation with less friendlier states which have less in common with us (and the New Zealanders weren't that happy either, because when Britian joined the EU it ruined New Zealand's economy). We were told by Europhiles that the EU was the future and the the Commonwealth is finished (the graphs below prove them wrong)

The fact of the matter is that the Commonwealth economy grows, year on year, faster than the EU economy and the Commonwealth is about to overtake the EU in terms of share of the world's GDP.

And just look at all the countries that are eager to join the Commonwealth. Even countries that were nothing to do with the British Empire are clambering over themselves to join the Commonwealth.

Australia would do well to stay in the Commonwealth and Britain would do well to leave the sclerotic, stagnant and decaying EU and concentrating more on the vibrant and rapidly-growing Commonwealth.

Look at the graphs below, compiled by World Economics. The first two contrast the growth rates of the EU and the Commonwealth since Britain joined in 1973 (in all cases, the UK is excluded from the figures). Ouch. The third and fourth, though, are the real kickers. They contrast the share of world GDP of the Commonwealth with, respectively, the members of the EEC in 1973 and the current members of the eurozone. The Commonwealth's economy is about to overtake the eurozone's. According to the IMF, the countries within the single currency will grow at an average of 2.7 per cent over the next five years – which strikes me as optimistic – while the Commonwealth surges ahead at 7.3 per cent.

Cwealth-growth.jpg

CommonwealthII.jpg

Read the article here: http://blogs.telegra...een-blown-away/

Anyway, end of rant.

Edited by TheLastLazyGun
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