Tantalising Testimony

[synchronomy]

Vancouver Island - 1981

Best Flying Saucer Photo Ever?

Nice case zoser.

I like the ones without wild claims, books being written, or even news media reporting.

I going to poke around for more info but I have a feeling that what you have presented is the bulk of what's available.

It would have been better if they had also witnessed the object's motion, instead of only noticing it later in the picture.

Sure looks like the classic flying saucer.

...and it's not bugs or some secret military aircraft that I know of.

It looks small, but who's to say ET's wouldn't use small drones at times...heck we do that already.

[zoser]

Nice case zoser.

I like the ones without wild claims, books being written, or even news media reporting.

I going to poke around for more info but I have a feeling that what you have presented is the bulk of what's available.

It would have been better if they had also witnessed the object's motion, instead of only noticing it later in the picture.

Sure looks like the classic flying saucer.

...and it's not bugs or some secret military aircraft that I know of.

It looks small, but who's to say ET's wouldn't use small drones at times...heck we do that already.

I like them too. Seemingly innocent people who have other motives than UFO hunting that just happen to be in the right place at the right time.

Wait until tomorrow; I have a cracking case lined up that is sure to cause some intense controversy.

Just finishing off a bit of research on it. Off to bed now. Make sure you are here at around 5pm GMT tomorrow.

Z

[Matt Vinyl]

Well done for wading through the thread! Your more than welcome. It would be great to hear more about your father's experiences.

Thanks Zoser, appreciated! I will endeavour to get around to creating a dedicated thread to it shortly.

[psyche101]

Excellent post.

You've given me a lot to think about and no doubt I'll be chewing on it all day.

Thank you for the kind words, I consider you thorough in your pursuit, so I very much appreciate your comment.

Perhaps my use of the word "agenda" isn't the best choice. No doubt it has been influenced by my career working with government, police, military, and private sector firms in the same or similar capacity, that being summarizing the spending of public funds to ensure it "fits" or to "justify use" within the laws and by-laws authorizing their use as such. Which it did. It was a frequent term I heard from higher-ups..."Make sure it fits the agenda"

Ahh, so we would be talking multiple agendas? That would make sense to me. Make sure it fits the current agenda. That could be project specific, or even in some cases, a personal view in order to have an efficient system.

There were times due to unforeseen circumstances, emergencies, errors, or downright stupidity or improper decisions that big bucks were committed to, which in hindsight could have and/or should have been spent in more effective and efficient ways.

If you perceive I am writing that with a bit of polish, glitter, and smokescreening...you are correct. Lets leave it at that. In most cases I was bound, and still am, to ND agreements.

I don't mean to imply that I had access to information pertaining to "UFO" type subjects...lol...not at all. It's just that the reports to the public and the entire chain of information and events leading to the final report are subject to FOI legislation...so the final reporting and facts must remain unaltered. I often had "secret" clearance. I always laugh when whistle blowers say that. They imply often that it gave them access to any file where they worked, and it doesn't work that way at all. Everything I experienced had to be accessed on a "need to know" basis. Often requiring jumping through hoops to back it up.

I have seen that many projects are indeed a waste of funds. But I suppose in some cases we have to waste funds to find out we are wasting our time. But I honestly always thought the CIA should have been shut down after MKULTRA. LSD, Electroshock therapy, even outright poisoning, the CIA appears to be nothing more than barbaric thugs, which would explain how funding is maintained. I have been shocked by some of what I have read, and consider the CIA at the same level of Japanese Soldiers who would torture POW's with Bamboo. The PsyOps experiments are just plain stupid I feel. Men who stare at Goats. I have no idea who would even be stupid enough to sign away funding, let alone achieve it on such pipe dreams. Might as well fund an expedition to find the Hollow Earth entrance, or seek out Alices Wonderland. I normally have a healthy respect for authority, but I have little tolerance for wastage, corporate silliness and continued failure. They certainly have some connections high up. If it was a group that worked for my company, their results by now would have well and truly shut the division down.

IMHO.

I laugh too at the "secret clearance" tag. I am just a garden variety sparky and I have had to sign NDA's for Government projects that I have worked on. No UFO's in my line of work LOL.

My little sister was in a respectable position in the RAAF, she was employed as CISCOM. And being a sensitive communications position, I suspect she overheard some very secretive discussions, she even raised the flag on Australia Day and had lunch with the PM at the time, who was a good PM, not like what we currently have. I have asked her about the subject of ET, and she finds the suggestion more mirthful than anything. She says she knows that is a more of a PITA than a concern. In fact she had quite a giggle at the suggestion.

I suppose my experience wrt this work has led me to highly doubt the testimonies of many Disclosure Project witnesses and other "whistleblower" folks such as Bob Lazer. He is a classic example and in future generations if you look up bovine feces in the dictionary his picture will be there.

I could not agree more. Amazing that people still give him the time of day, the discovery of element 115 in my opinion showed him to be the horses behind that he is.

Maybe when I use the term "agenda", it would be more appropriate say "prime directive".

Indeed, I see what you mean now, and than you for taking the time to extrapolate. I agree that the prime directive is defence, and any instance that may threaten such would bring defence forces to the party.

In referring to "sovereignty"...maybe "our territories and airspace"

But it has never been threatened. People claim to see UFO's on a very regular basis, and any claims of harm such as Cash Landrum or the famous Thomas Mantel case do not seem to be direct interference, and the damage is always assumed.

I don't really like the term "conspiracy" because by very definition it implies illegal activity.

Agreed. And a lack of IQ ponts.

As far as a "global" initiative to cover-up the ETH or just UFO's, its just perceived as such because all the militaries and governments of various countries have the same/similar "prime directive".

I do not believe their is any cooperation between governments worldwide in this regard, just that they all have objective to attain the same goals.

I surely agree that the facade is merely an illusion. It's the objective to obtain the same goals that puts them at odds. I would cite the Cold War as an example, and the US and Russia were insistent that each other knew of any major development as a fear tactic. Information was deliberately leaked to create tension and the illusion of superiority. If one country had an Alliance with ET, they would want others to know that they have a powerful ally, not hide them from the public because "we can't handle the truth." Whilst that line works well in A Few Good Men, with regards to the public, it's so cheesy that the only place it should reside is in a movie. It just does not work in real life.

Cheers mate, thanks for the conversation.

[psyche101]

It looks small, but who's to say ET's wouldn't use small drones at times...heck we do that already.

If it is a genuine craft, I would say it would more likely be a drone due to the clear dome on top. It actually looks rather like a CCTV housing. But overall, it looks like a frisbee with a clear dome stuck on top of it. Sort of like this one.

or this one

Which thrown in the air looks similar to me......

??????????????

[synchronomy]

If it is a genuine craft, I would say it would more likely be a drone due to the clear dome on top. It actually looks rather like a CCTV housing. But overall, it looks like a frisbee with a clear dome stuck on top of it.

Again, you have prompted me to think.

I went back and reread zoser's original submission and noted this:

"These analyses suggest that the disc was a three dimensional object located at a distance of at least 30 feet from the camera; the object's surface albedo was diffuse and of lower luminance than a sunlit cloud."

If the object were only 30 feet from the camera, the perceived size of it in the original picture wouldn't be far off from that of a frizbee. Of course that's just my perception, I'm not applying any science here. In any case it's small.

So if it is ET, then it would have to be some type of drone, unless the "occupants" are the size of...well, damn small anyway.

If the photographer didn't see that object when it was there, then it becomes apparent that they may not be able to say there was no one throwing frizbees at the time.

I don't see that much can be done with this case other than take it at face value.

Nothing points to a deliberate hoax and it's unidentifiable.

So, to me, it's a UFO.

Could be lots of things.

[Space Commander Travis]

Again, you have prompted me to think.

I went back and reread zoser's original submission and noted this:

"These analyses suggest that the disc was a three dimensional object located at a distance of at least 30 feet from the camera; the object's surface albedo was diffuse and of lower luminance than a sunlit cloud."

If the object were only 30 feet from the camera, the perceived size of it in the original picture wouldn't be far off from that of a frizbee. Of course that's just my perception, I'm not applying any science here. In any case it's small.

So if it is ET, then it would have to be some type of drone, unless the "occupants" are the size of...well, damn small anyway.

If the photographer didn't see that object when it was there, then it becomes apparent that they may not be able to say there was no one throwing frizbees at the time.

I don't see that much can be done with this case other than take it at face value.

Nothing points to a deliberate hoax and it's unidentifiable.

So, to me, it's a UFO.

Could be lots of things.

I don't really think that if there were ET Craft exploring our airspace, they'd be very likely to be manned, or staffed or whatever. It'd make much more sense for them to be drones.

[psyche101]

Again, you have prompted me to think.

And again, thank you, I take that remark as a compliment.

I went back and reread zoser's original submission and noted this:

"These analyses suggest that the disc was a three dimensional object located at a distance of at least 30 feet from the camera; the object's surface albedo was diffuse and of lower luminance than a sunlit cloud."

If the object were only 30 feet from the camera, the perceived size of it in the original picture wouldn't be far off from that of a frizbee. Of course that's just my perception, I'm not applying any science here. In any case it's small.

I agree totally, but this is what is wrong with UFOlogy today. The question should be "what is it" Not "This is an alien craft, how do we prove it". Unfortunately, that does seem to be a common theme in this particular thread.

So if it is ET, then it would have to be some type of drone, unless the "occupants" are the size of...well, damn small anyway.

If the photographer didn't see that object when it was there, then it becomes apparent that they may not be able to say there was no one throwing frizbees at the time.

I don't see that much can be done with this case other than take it at face value.

Nothing points to a deliberate hoax and it's unidentifiable.

So, to me, it's a UFO.

Could be lots of things.

Indeed, but how does ET make the picture? Again, UFOLogy puts forth that UFO=ET. That is when tin foil hats become appropriate. This is going back to the God syndrome the way I see it. I do not know what it is, it must be the almighty.

Do you know what Volcano In Vancouver had activity in 1981? I cannot seem to place the activity.

[psyche101]

I don't really think that if there were ET Craft exploring our airspace, they'd be very likely to be manned, or staffed or whatever. It'd make much more sense for them to be drones.

When regarding first contact that would certainly be more sensible, and overcome issues like quarantine, but going a step further, and using this logic, wouldn't communications as a prelim be even better still? Even with non inhabited planets, scans and analyses would be more important than visiting I would think. I would expect to more likely see some sort of relay in gravity wells if either of these were the case for reporting. Considering the distances involved, it seems pretty logical? No need to wait centuries for return data. And you can just keep going deeper, something like the Voyager probes, until you just run out of power or heavy maintenance is required.

Edited November 29, 2012 by psyche101

[Space Commander Travis]

When regarding first contact that would certainly be more sensible, and overcome issues like quarantine, but going a step further, and using this logic, wouldn't communications as a prelim be even better still? Even with non inhabited planets, scans and analyses would be more important than visiting I would think. I would expect to more likely see some sort of relay in gravity wells if either of these were the case for reporting. Considering the distances involved, it seems pretty logical? No need to wait centuries for return data. And you can just keep going deeper, something like the Voyager probes, until you just run out of power or heavy maintenance is required.

Ah, there's the thing; my thesis is that they (supposing that there is a They) aren't, or at least, during, say, the 1950s, when UFOs first, as we know, came to prominence, weren't, trying to make Contact, because at the time they weren't sure if there was life here or not. They were doing effectively what we're doing on places like Mars, sending out probes to planets that they thought might look interesting to explore and see if they copuld find anything interesting. Since then, they might have been gradually carrying on a process of data gathering, with a view to perhaps establishing contact at some point on a discreet level if they think it might be advantageous. Indeed, there'd be a relay or a mother craft somewhere a discreet distance away, far enough not to alarm anybody so that they could carry on their researches without being bothered by or bothering anybody,.

[S2F]

Do you know what Volcano In Vancouver had activity in 1981? I cannot seem to place the activity.

Mt Garibaldi had some landslides in 1981. It's near Vancouver BC

There was an eruption of Mt St Helens in 1980 but it was near Vancouver WA. (I actually remember that one quite well, not too far from where I lived)

Seems like a random question unless I'm missing something....which isn't unusual.

Edited November 29, 2012 by Slave2Fate

[quillius]

Analyses of the original negative included micro-densitometry, computer enhancements, and other measurements intent upon showing a support thread, atmospheric disturbance, or other evidences of a hoax.

so an analysis intent on showing either evidence of a hoax or atmospheric disturbance produced the below....

These analyses suggest that the disc was a three dimensional object located at a distance of at least 30 feet from the camera

who needs triangulation when you can establish a distance (i.e. 30ft) using a still picture with no line of reference....???

obviously would be nice to see this analysis and the calculations used to arrive at 30ft

[zoser]

I don't really think that if there were ET Craft exploring our airspace, they'd be very likely to be manned, or staffed or whatever. It'd make much more sense for them to be drones.

Then you will appreciate the next case; stand by.

[zoser]

When regarding first contact that would certainly be more sensible, and overcome issues like quarantine, but going a step further, and using this logic, wouldn't communications as a prelim be even better still? Even with non inhabited planets, scans and analyses would be more important than visiting I would think. I would expect to more likely see some sort of relay in gravity wells if either of these were the case for reporting. Considering the distances involved, it seems pretty logical? No need to wait centuries for return data. And you can just keep going deeper, something like the Voyager probes, until you just run out of power or heavy maintenance is required.

Nice to see you back on the thread again psyche

[zoser]

Zdany, Poland 2006.

I really have no idea yet what to make of this fascinating case.

Two men are returning from a wedding party. Both ask for their anonymity to be preserved, so we shall only use their first names – Maciej (Matthew), 65, is driving, and Zbyszek, 60, sits in the passenger seat. The atmosphere in the car is merry, the passenger is actually still very tipsy. And – an important factor in the whole story – he has a still camera, quite good at that: an Olympus. He was using the camera to photograph dancing couples but on this day it will turn out that having it enabled him to take one of the best UFO photographs in the world. They drive towards a town called Terespol, or – to be more precise – towards a smaller town called Międzyrzec Podlaski.

Read more:

http://www.ufoeviden...nt/Photo411.htm

Note the photographs are copyrighted so I will not post those specific shots here. The pictures do look high resolution.

Here are the photo's on a youtube clip:

Here is one of the photographers giving testimony on a youtube clip. Don't get excited unless you speak Polish; maybe our Eastern European members could translate for us?

Edited November 29, 2012 by zoser

[zoser]

[S2F]

Looks like a couple of these fastened together.

[zoser]

Looks like a couple of these fastened together.

Well Done. Very imaginative.

Please read the case then report back.

Edited November 29, 2012 by zoser

[Space Commander Travis]

I notice that they do try to forestall that suggestion. "Matthew, who is driving the car, is convinced that some kids are making fun of drivers by… throwing a huge bowl."

Looks very much like one of Sweetpumper's metallic balls.

So to speak.

* Although a Cynic might suggest that it's perhaps not that surprising that the car suddenly breaks down, since it is a Polonez ......

[S2F]

Well Done. Very imaginative.

Please read the case then report back.

Nah.

You can see from the reflection in the object that it is not far from the camera or the ground. If it's a UFO then it's probably less than a foot wide.

[zoser]

I recommend people read the whole case before making a judgement:

he starts taking pictures, but he suddenly notices something strange slowly moving over the fields. The object is big, about two metres in diameter, and it reminds two bowls welded together at the edges! It is metallic – sunlight is reflected from its surface. No engine can be heard, there is no fumes or smoke, but… a very strong wind starts blowing in gusts! It is also of importance, as there was no wind so strong on that day. Zbyszek starts making pictures of the unidentified object. At one point the UFO starts a swift ascent and instantly flies away.

If someone threw a bowl, how long would it stay up in the air? Seconds maybe? It was up in the air for 8 mins. How come the tilt is consistent?

Please can people read the whole case and refrain from making cynical crass judgements? Just for once?

[booNyzarC]

Looks like a couple of these fastened together.

I agree, and based on the images it appears to me as though it is hanging from the branch above. They've given us two photos from different perspectives and distances, and the size of the 'object' seems to adjust accordingly between the two photos if it is about the size of two bowls fastened together just as you have stated.

[Space Commander Travis]

So is the fact that they said "they thought it was some kids having a Prank by throwing a metal bowl" merely a cunning Ploy or Ruse to distract attention from the fact that that's in fact what it actually was?

[zoser]

So is the fact that they said "they thought it was some kids having a Prank by throwing a metal bowl" merely a cunning Ploy or Ruse to distract attention from the fact that that's in fact what it actually was?

Nowhere does it say in the testimony that he saw anyone throw anything. That was his gut feeling and it would probably have been mine. Take a look at the observer on the youtube clip. He and his partner are ordinary folk.

What would you expect him to think? What about his testimony? It cannot be disregarded.

If you feel that he said he actually saw kids throw something then please show me.

they slow down, but suddenly, less than a hundred yards away, they see… something big, metallic and shiny flying across the road! Matthew, who is driving the car, is convinced that some kids are making fun of drivers by… throwing a huge bowl. A moment later the car’s engine stops. There is, however, another detail that must not escape our attention. Another car is running behind with Russian registration plates, a passenger minibus. And its engine stops at exactly the same moment! Both drivers step out of their cars, open the hood and try to start their engines. Zbyszek, the passenger, also steps out of the car.

I'm sorry but the main witness has not said that.

Edited November 29, 2012 by zoser

[booNyzarC]

What about his testimony? It cannot be disregarded.

You are far too trusting zoser.