Buzz Aldrin comments on UFO following Apollo

[SwampgasBalloonBoy]

Of course many other people have.

But weren't we talking about astronauts on space flights?

Isn't that a much shorter list -- maybe even, an empty one?

Are there not even one astronaut believing in UFOs? I don't know about empty, though

[psyche101]

Nothing like the horses mouth huh?

Of course the conspiracy minded won't buy it however that's hardly indicative of an actual conspiracy.

Indeed I am really very surprised to see this subject pop up again to be honest. There was that big long thread on the debris last year, and when Zoser tried to call it a genuine "Astronaut Disclosure" I informed him of the same.

To be quite frank, I am unsure how this one could get so hyped up. It has not inly been ousted by Buzz, it has been discussed extensively, and the real story is quite well known, that being that the TV show did what TV shows do best. They took a story and changed it to get more bottoms in seats. Why the UFO buff's keep putting so much faith in an entertainment medium I cannot fathom, but it does show that UFO buff's most certainly do not bother to look any further than the woo woo sites that make such outlandish claims without any proof.

I guess the only answer we are faced with is that the UFO buffs do not want to know, they only want to hear what they want to hear. This case is proof of that much I am sure. Be funny if Buzz gave the shows producers a little justice Bart Sibrel fashion LOL.

[psyche101]

If he said he hasn't seen it, then we'll have to take his words for it. But it doesn't change the facts that others have. It's not like "Since Buzz hasn't seen UFOs, Its must not exist!"

There is no "it" that is the thing here, there never was an "it". The entire story is a fabrication at Buzz's expense and Buzz let the cat out of the bag. Buzz is good like that.

Ed Mitchell says UFO's exist, but the papers tend to omit he also says he has not seen any, he has just heard about them. Sadly, some of the people he "heard" about them from are known frauds, like Bob Lazar, Stephen Greer and Glenn Dennis. Even the UFO buffs give those men a wide berth.

I think that leaves you with Cooper. That s a very complex tale.

[psyche101]

Since SLA panels were also reported on other flights, and were photographed through telescopes from Earth accompanying the CSMs, why wouldn't the crews sometimes have seen them on the outbound leg [never on the return leg, of course, for obvious reasons]?

Indeed, but I know what LS's cryptic comment refers to, that being the Mylar panel Collins describes (when the CSM-LM went Boom) during the flight. It seems to be a much better candidate optically, time and distance wise, unless I am mistaken. Lost Shaman actually told me about the observations by James Young from Table Top Mountain, asa such he is very aware of them, the panels are a good culprit, but might have been a bit far out to resolve at all. The Mylar is likely to have been closer, and within viewing distance.

I have to agree with Lost Shaman here, I think Astronaut Collins made the right call on that one.

Edited January 14, 2013 by psyche101

[Hazzard]

Are there not even one astronaut believing in UFOs? I don't know about empty, though

No one here is arguing the existence of UFOs,... We all know they exist.

What some of these UFO are is the million dollar question.

[wimfloppp]

Most likely space junk

[JimOberg]

Are there not even one astronaut believing in UFOs? I don't know about empty, though

Astronauts saying the saw a 'UFO' on a space flight.

There are a few intriguing descriptions of visual phenomena, from astronauts and cosmonauts, that do deserve interest.

So maybe if we stretch the meaning of the word, in the sense that not everything that's been seen has been fully understood -- well, OK.

[quillius]

Astronauts saying the saw a 'UFO' on a space flight.

There are a few intriguing descriptions of visual phenomena, from astronauts and cosmonauts, that do deserve interest.

So maybe if we stretch the meaning of the word, in the sense that not everything that's been seen has been fully understood -- well, OK.

so when an astronaut specifically says UFO they are not talking about unusual visual phenomena.

do you agree with this sentence Jim? if not how do we differntiate between the 'stretch' to visual phenomena versus UFO (in the sense of the word prior to the stretch) ??

[lost_shaman]

Since SLA panels were also reported on other flights, and were photographed through telescopes from Earth accompanying the CSMs, why wouldn't the crews sometimes have seen them on the outbound leg [never on the return leg, of course, for obvious reasons]?

Well Jim, obviously early on in the flights right after jettison the Panels are much closer for example when they were photographed accompanying the CSMs those photos were taken much earlier in the Flights than when the Apollo 11 crew reported their sighting.

[SwampgasBalloonBoy]

There is no "it" that is the thing here, there never was an "it". The entire story is a fabrication at Buzz's expense and Buzz let the cat out of the bag. Buzz is good like that.

Ed Mitchell says UFO's exist, but the papers tend to omit he also says he has not seen any, he has just heard about them. Sadly, some of the people he "heard" about them from are known frauds, like Bob Lazar, Stephen Greer and Glenn Dennis. Even the UFO buffs give those men a wide berth.

I think that leaves you with Cooper. That s a very complex tale.

Here's Ed Mitchell clearing things up. The stuffs he heard about was confirmed by an admiral at the Pentagon. I don't think Ed is so gullible to believe in this kind of things without good cause.

http://dsc.discovery.com/space/qa/alien-ufo-edgar-mitchell.html

[psyche101]

Here's Ed Mitchell clearing things up. The stuffs he heard about was confirmed by an admiral at the Pentagon. I don't think Ed is so gullible to believe in this kind of things without good cause.

http://dsc.discovery...r-mitchell.html

That is Admiral WIlson. Ed went and saw the Admiral with non other than Stehen Greer, which resulted in Ed completely wiping his involvement with that particular situation - LINK Edgar Mitchell Most Unhappy With Stephen Greer Using His Name as a Disclosure Witness.

Not only that, Admiral Wilson categorically refuses to support Greer and Mitchell in this instance.

LINK - Billy Cox: And, Finally, Admiral Wilson Denies Greer/Mitchell Allegations

Here is Ed clearing things up even more. The Kerrang Radio Interview, where he clears up the misconceptions.

LB: As we were mentioning before the show started, you really stirred up a hornet’s nest, strangely enough, and like you said, you’ve been saying this for years.

EM: I don’t know what really got things stirred up, perhaps it was the Larry King show. I don’t know.

LB: Could be. But basically people are freaking out that you were aware of several UFO visits.

EM: That’s not quite right. You use that in the plural. I was talking about the Roswell incident, the Roswell visitation primarily, but there have been many others that have been reported that I have no personal awareness of but that was the one that I was really talking about.

LB: So the interview has been a little misquoted. But you actually have information about the Roswell incident?

EM: Yes and my information comes from what I call “the old timers,” because I grew up in the Roswell area and when I went to the moon, some of the old timers from that period, some locals, and others military and intelligence people, who were under rather severe oaths to not reveal any of this and kind of wanted to get their conscience clear and off their chests before they passed on, selected me and said, independently – this wasn’t a group effort – independently that maybe I might be a safe person to tell their story to. And all of them confirmed, and what I’m saying is they confirmed the Roswell incident was a real incident and they in some way had some part in it that they wanted to talk about.

Edgar thinks the Roswell Incident is real, and I assure you that he has come to this conclusions via sources such as Bob Lazar (whom he openly advocates) Glenn Dennis, Stephen Greer, whom he has not ousted, and some cattle ranchers from Roswell. He personally knows nothing at all, and simply believes people who have approached him.

There is quite a thread on Edgar here. Quillius and I went into quite some depth regarding his allegations. In the end, we find Edgar knows exactly what he says he does. And that is hearsay and rumour form dubious sources. Not much to hang one's hat on I am afraid.

This is what I was saying. Roll your sleeves up, and one finds that these big calls are bunkum. The problem lies with incompetent reporters, not Dr. Mitchell.

Still, to this day I wonder what on earth inspired him to attempt telepathy experiments whilst on his way to the moon. Seems rather woo woo for a man with a good head on his shoulders.

(Edgar Mitchell) I, nor any crew I was on (I was on three Apollo crews), received any briefing before or after flights on UFO events, saw anything in space suggesting UFOs or structures on the moon, etc. We did it just like we said in official reports. My only claim to knowledge of these events is from the individuals, mostly of yesteryear, who were in government, intelligence, or military; were there, saw what they saw, and now believe it should be made public. But I claim no first hand knowledge, nor have any. Pass it on to the rest of the net, if you will.

--Edgar Mitchell

LINK

Edited January 15, 2013 by psyche101

[SwampgasBalloonBoy]

That is Admiral WIlson. Ed went and saw the Admiral with non other than Stehen Greer, which resulted in Ed completely wiping his involvement with that particular situation - LINK Edgar Mitchell Most Unhappy With Stephen Greer Using His Name as a Disclosure Witness.

Not only that, Admiral Wilson categorically refuses to support Greer and Mitchell in this instance.

LINK - Billy Cox: And, Finally, Admiral Wilson Denies Greer/Mitchell Allegations

Here is Ed clearing things up even more. The Kerrang Radio Interview, where he clears up the misconceptions.

Edgar thinks the Roswell Incident is real, and I assure you that he has come to this conclusions via sources such as Bob Lazar (whom he openly advocates) Glenn Dennis, Stephen Greer, whom he has not ousted, and some cattle ranchers from Roswell. He personally knows nothing at all, and simply believes people who have approached him.

There is quite a thread on Edgar here. Quillius and I went into quite some depth regarding his allegations. In the end, we find Edgar knows exactly what he says he does. And that is hearsay and rumour form dubious sources. Not much to hang one's hat on I am afraid.

This is what I was saying. Roll your sleeves up, and one finds that these big calls are bunkum. The problem lies with incompetent reporters, not Dr. Mitchell.

Still, to this day I wonder what on earth inspired him to attempt telepathy experiments whilst on his way to the moon. Seems rather woo woo for a man with a good head on his shoulders.

(Edgar Mitchell) I cooperated with Steve Greer some years ago, but he began to overreach his data continuously, necessitating a withdrawal by myself, and, I believe, several others. I have requested to be removed from any web site, announcements, etc., but see that has not taken place.

The above showed that Ed Mitchell is not that delusional to believe in just about anything. So either Ed Mitchell or Wilson was lying. Mitchell have separated himself from Greer, but still believe in what he has been told. Psyche, I think you're implying Ed Mitchell'd got a screw loose.

Since the amazing broad daylight UFO was videotaped by me on June 11, 1995, I have invested over $5,000 to date to present this 'proven' footage to the world--for free. But when another would take (or steal) this copyrighted footage and profit from it without so much as a 'howdy do' to me, it certainly would have put most anyone in a mood of discontent.

Have anyone seen the footage described above by Jason Leigh? provide link if possible.

Edited January 15, 2013 by SwampgasBalloonBoy

[psyche101]

(Edgar Mitchell) I cooperated with Steve Greer some years ago, but he began to overreach his data continuously, necessitating a withdrawal by myself, and, I believe, several others. I have requested to be removed from any web site, announcements, etc., but see that has not taken place.

The above showed that Ed Mitchell is not that delusional to believe in just about anything. So either Ed Mitchell or Wilson was lying. Mitchell have separated himself from Greer, but still believe in what he has been told. Psyche, I think you're implying Ed Mitchell'd got a screw loose.

The key words are necessitating withdrawal. Good God man. He went to the Moon. He knew there were no cities there, but still sided with Greer. Dr. Mitchell is a human, and he comes with all the defects we all have. He was royally sucked in by Greer, he was royally sucked in by Bob Lazar. He is human, and can make a bad call. And yes, I guess I am implying he is somewhat eccentric. Again, I remain perplexed a his ESP experiment on the way to the moon on Apollo 14. I cannot understand how a man of science could possibly find such an effort valuable. It seems like he set himself up for ridicule in that instance. All I can figure is the religious angle. Many of these early pioneers were very much God Fearing men. Todays focus on religion I feel is somewhat different.

He has outwardly stated that he believes Bob Lazars experience is real. As far as I am concerned, that is outright proof that Dr Mitchell has not got the details correct.

Dr Mitchell explicitly states that he was approached. If a bunch of people you grew up with approached you and said they had something to confide in you, I think you would listen. No doubt when one feels important, one will endeavour to assist those who have approached you for help.

But Dr Mitchell clearly states he has no first hand knowledge, and has done so on more than one occasion. He himself says "I do not know anything". All he has ever said is I heard........... and where he "heard" these things from does not fill one with confidence. I am sorry, but despite Dr Mitchell's accomplishments, I do not see his personal success as a reason to give the time of day to Bob Lazar. The papers are using Dr Mitchell in my opinion, to their own nefarious ends. I find it very sad. I hate to think of Edgar Mitchell being remembered as some UFO crank as opposed to the 6th man to walk on the moon. I think that is disrespectful to Dr Mitchell.

Since the amazing broad daylight UFO was videotaped by me on June 11, 1995, I have invested over $5,000 to date to present this 'proven' footage to the world--for free. But when another would take (or steal) this copyrighted footage and profit from it without so much as a 'howdy do' to me, it certainly would have put most anyone in a mood of discontent.

Have anyone seen the footage described above by Jason Leigh? provide link if possible.

In jail as far as I know. What is left of his site is a Lionel Ritchie tribute page.

The former Cleburne man who pleaded guilty Sept. 3 to federal weapons violations after crashing his truck into the Veterans Affairs Regional Office in March was released from custody Tuesday and will live in a halfway house two blocks from the VA until he is sentenced.

Jason Leigh, 49, who apologized to the people of Waco for his actions earlier this month, was released to the Salvation Army halfway house at 500 S. Fourth St. A bond hearing set for Tuesday to determine his detention status was canceled after federal prosecutors did not oppose his release pending sentencing.

"Basically, all his psychiatric evaluations came back and nobody anticipates he will be a threat to anybody in the future," Leigh's attorney, Rod Goble, said. "He was going on 50 years and had never done anything wrong, and this is the next process, to see how he does under the supervision of the halfway house. But I really do not believe he is a danger to a soul. He is very nice, very likeable, very intelligent and very remorseful."

After he drove through a sliding-glass door at the VA building, Leigh threatened to blow up the building unless $1 million was placed in a Swiss bank account, with former President Jimmy Carter administering the fund, officials have said. He staged a 14-hour standoff with police to rally attention to the plight of homeless veterans and out of frustration over his dealings with the VA, he said.

LINK.

Hrmmzzzz, some issues there.

Edited January 15, 2013 by psyche101

[TheMacGuffin]

This is pretty convoluted verbal pretzeling. MacG says the article says Baker worked on Gemini. I suggest he misread or misunderstood, or just elaborated on the article. with no justification in the actual content. You're saying that even if the article did NOT say Baker worked on Gemini [which you implicitly imply], he might have secretly, snd MacG was just a good guesser.

Live with it.

I did not say that. David Baker said that he worked for NASA from 1965-84, and that he already had a PhD in physics when he began working there, so that makes him quite a bit older than age 17 when he started.

He said this in an interview with Wired.com.

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2011/04/human_spaceflight_david_baker/

David Baker worked with NASA on the Gemini, Apollo and space shuttle programs between 1965 and 1984. He has written more than 80 books on spaceflight technology including his latest, the NASA Space Shuttle Owners’ Workshop Manual.Read the excerpt: Anatomy of the Space Shuttle.

[TheMacGuffin]

Wired.com: You joined NASA back in the Apollo days, right?

Baker: In the mid-1960s, during the Gemini program. It was a very different time to that which exists today. NASA was a very different institution.

Wired.com: What was it like then?

Baker: There was a very different culture. It was a much younger group of guys. When you’re that age, you think you have a God-given right to change the world, and we were being given blank checks to do it. So it was very very different to today.

Wired.com: How would you describe the difference? What is it like today?

Baker: It’s moved across to being a very top-heavy bureaucracy. It started with just a few thousand people, even by the 1950s.

Most of these were scientists and engineers who really wouldn’t give a monkey’s cuss for getting publicity, for lobbying for projects or anything like that. They were just dedicated guys, who loved their work, trying to push every corner of the technical envelope that they could.

I think everybody within NASA really believed they were starting a whole new way of developing a future for Americans, and broadly for humankind as well.

I felt very much motivated by this. I thought the United States had the resources, it had the vision, and it had a plan to hold the line on freedom. It was right in the middle of the Cold War. We thought of the Communists very much as the previous generation had thought of the Nazis.

So there was that great sense that we were being given a huge mission, a huge responsibility. We were essentially Cold War warriors in civilian clothes.

But then during Apollo, a huge number of people came over from the Air Force, and they tied it all up. All these guys who were very undisciplined, scientists and engineers, they like to be left alone to just do their research. All of a sudden NASA was a huge political tool, it was on everybody’s radar, and it was like working in a goldfish bowl. The press came down onto everything.

We lost control, essentially, of the dream. It became just a political football. That was really one of the changes that I think came through in the ’70s with the Apollo program, and it was never going to be the same again. Ever since then, its programs and its successes have been used largely for political purposes.

Edited January 15, 2013 by TheMacGuffin

[TheMacGuffin]

Oberg was wrong. There's nothing wrong with my reading comprehension.

[SwampgasBalloonBoy]

The key words are necessitating withdrawal. Good God man. He went to the Moon. He knew there were no cities there, but still sided with Greer. Dr. Mitchell is a human, and he comes with all the defects we all have. He was royally sucked in by Greer, he was royally sucked in by Bob Lazar. He is human, and can make a bad call. And yes, I guess I am implying he is somewhat eccentric. Again, I remain perplexed a his ESP experiment on the way to the moon on Apollo 14. I cannot understand how a man of science could possibly find such an effort valuable. It seems like he set himself up for ridicule in that instance. All I can figure is the religious angle. Many of these early pioneers were very much God Fearing men. Todays focus on religion I feel is somewhat different.

He has outwardly stated that he believes Bob Lazars experience is real. As far as I am concerned, that is outright proof that Dr Mitchell has not got the details correct.

Dr Mitchell explicitly states that he was approached. If a bunch of people you grew up with approached you and said they had something to confide in you, I think you would listen. No doubt when one feels important, one will endeavour to assist those who have approached you for help.

But Dr Mitchell clearly states he has no first hand knowledge, and has done so on more than one occasion. He himself says "I do not know anything". All he has ever said is I heard........... and where he "heard" these things from does not fill one with confidence. I am sorry, but despite Dr Mitchell's accomplishments, I do not see his personal success as a reason to give the time of day to Bob Lazar. The papers are using Dr Mitchell in my opinion, to their own nefarious ends. I find it very sad. I hate to think of Edgar Mitchell being remembered as some UFO crank as opposed to the 6th man to walk on the moon. I think that is disrespectful to Dr Mitchell.

In jail as far as I know. What is left of his site is a Lionel Ritchie tribute page.

Hrmmzzzz, some issues there.

I think Jason Leigh is out now. That was more than a decade ago. No matter. I just like to see the video. After reading the hype, I just want to see it.

It was supposedly used by Greer in his Disclosure Project presented to Congress. Is the video actually exist? Have anyone seen it? I can't find it online. If anyone have seen the Disclosure Project, do you see the video of a cigar shape ufo in the daylight, over a golf course? that probable it.

[psyche101]

I think Jason Leigh is out now. That was more than a decade ago. No matter. I just like to see the video. After reading the hype, I just want to see it.

It was supposedly used by Greer in his Disclosure Project presented to Congress. Is the video actually exist? Have anyone seen it? I can't find it online. If anyone have seen the Disclosure Project, do you see the video of a cigar shape ufo in the daylight, over a golf course? that probable it.

Jason Leigh has mental issues, and Greer is a known crackpot.

Considering this, what exactly do you expect to find?

[SwampgasBalloonBoy]

Jason Leigh has mental issues, and Greer is a known crackpot.

Considering this, what exactly do you expect to find?

I like to know if it does exist. If it doesn't, then it's irrelevant whether the guy have mental issue or not. I don't condone what he did with the VA, but the VA have frustrated a lot of former soldiers with their incompetence and red tape. But that's beside the point.

If the footage doesn't exist, then there's nothing to debunk. One of the technique is to discredit the person behind the evidence. However, if there are no evidence to analyze, then there's no need to employ such tactic. The best way, imo, is to say, "the evidence never existed!"

[topsecretresearch]

Edgar thinks the Roswell Incident is real, and I assure you that he has come to this conclusions via sources such as Bob Lazar (whom he openly advocates) Glenn Dennis, Stephen Greer, whom he has not ousted, and some cattle ranchers from Roswell. He personally knows nothing at all, and simply believes people who have approached him.

Edgar Mitchell grew up in Roswell, New Mexico. I don't think the Ed Mitchell's or Gordon Cooper's as well as other astronauts needed a Steven Greer to convince them of anything. Lol.

[topsecretresearch]

Jason Leigh has mental issues, and Greer is a known crackpot.

Considering this, what exactly do you expect to find?

Look in the mirror. A lot of your armchiar sketicism is either intentionally deceptive or just plain pathetic.

Stop spin doctoring every thread already.

[topsecretresearch]

The key words are necessitating withdrawal. Good God man. He went to the Moon. He knew there were no cities there, but still sided with Greer. Dr. Mitchell is a human, and he comes with all the defects we all have. He was royally sucked in by Greer, he was royally sucked in by Bob Lazar.

psyche101 = Spin Doctoring 101.

Mitchell grew up in Roswell, New Mexico, which some UFO believers maintain was the site of a UFO crash in 1947. He said residents of his hometown "had been hushed and told not to talk about their experience by military authorities." They had been warned of "dire consequences" if they did so.

But, he claimed, they "didn't want to go to the grave with their story. They wanted to tell somebody reliable. And being a local boy and having been to the moon, they considered me reliable enough to whisper in my ear their particular story."

Too often on the internet, and there are A LOT of blogs that use spin doctor tactics, you see arm chair skeptics that think they are that brilliant investigator they see on TV but in reality they just don't have what it takes to be a proper detective, scientist (even though they like to exclaim "science") or the imaginary character named Sherlock Holmes.

Edited January 16, 2013 by topsecretresearch

[topsecretresearch]

Look in the mirror. A lot of your armchiar sketicism is either intentionally deceptive or just plain pathetic.

Stop spin doctoring every thread already.

I shouldn't complain though. What do you expect on forums such as Unexplianed Mysteries or Above Top Secret.

[psyche101]

I like to know if it does exist. If it doesn't, then it's irrelevant whether the guy have mental issue or not. I don't condone what he did with the VA, but the VA have frustrated a lot of former soldiers with their incompetence and red tape. But that's beside the point.

If the footage doesn't exist, then there's nothing to debunk. One of the technique is to discredit the person behind the evidence. However, if there are no evidence to analyze, then there's no need to employ such tactic. The best way, imo, is to say, "the evidence never existed!"

If something does exist, do you expect a known crackpot who pushes moon base nonsense and someone with mental issues has something of value?

If the footage does exist, I expect it to be pretty ordinary. I cannot see any breakthroughs coming from this pair.

Good luck in finding it, I would consider it a waste of time. I think sometimes one can be thorough, and sometimes, one can just waste time. It is worth attempting to separate the two.

[psyche101]

Edgar Mitchell grew up in Roswell, New Mexico. I don't think the Ed Mitchell's or Gordon Cooper's as well as other astronauts needed a Steven Greer to convince them of anything. Lol.

Ed was approached. Cooper had issues with NASA, no great wonder there, but no matter what you say, Edgar has publicly stated that he has no first hand knowledge himself. What is wrong with actually listening to the man himself instead of the Newspaper versions?

Do you really think Ed Mitchell "knows" something himself about the UFO/ET phenomena do you? What about Edgar's own words?

(Edgar Mitchell) I, nor any crew I was on (I was on three Apollo crews), received any briefing before or after flights on UFO events, saw anything in space suggesting UFOs or structures on the moon, etc. We did it just like we said in official reports. My only claim to knowledge of these events is from the individuals, mostly of yesteryear, who were in government, intelligence, or military; were there, saw what they saw, and now believe it should be made public. But I claim no first hand knowledge, nor have any. Pass it on to the rest of the net, if you will.

--Edgar Mitchell

How do you read Ed's own words? What do you think he is saying above?