Tax bills for rich families at 30-year high

[Render]

WASHINGTON (AP) — The poor rich.

With Washington gridlocked again over whether to raise their taxes, it turns out wealthy families already are paying some of their biggest federal tax bills in decades even as the rest of the population continues to pay at historically low rates.

http://www.boston.com/business/personal-finance/2013/03/03/tax-bills-for-rich-families-approach-year-high/tPcmllN0iKPUSpp53v8WcI/story.html

[ninjadude]

ohh boo hoo. I do not feel the least bit sorry. They're not paying anything like during the good old days in the 1950's when the marginal tax rate was 90%

[AsteroidX]

I had flapjacks for breakfast. The 1950's are irrelevent today anyways.

Edited March 3, 2013 by AsteroidX

[Prab]

They are earning more than ever, so therefore they pay more.

Whereas most of the people in this country are still working near minimum wage in the service sectors,

There are even lesser jobs than ever with the industrial revolution and automation of industries which means there are more people in the service sector now than ever, which also means that more production by the industries i.e. the rich and less of wages to pay due to automation therefore leading to higher profits than before.

And people are paid very less and the minimum wage has not increased in comparison with the inflation of currency, which means people have to work more to fulfill the same needs that they had before.

These things are not that simple, analysis all over the internet clearly says that till now the corporate are not paying their fair shares, not to mention those purposely made tax escape loopholes for the rich which allows them to pay nearly no tax.

Oh and the lobbying.

[Sakari]

Good, finally.

Although they still do not pay enough, and have too many loopholes and write offs still.

We made a whopping $46,000 last year. Paid out $5,000 in taxes deducted from paychecks.

Did my taxes, and still owe.

Maybe there should be a straight 11% tax across the board.

The rich get richer, the poor stay poor, and the middle class are going poor.

Off topic, but I see gas is also going up as it all ways does for the Spring and Summer wealthy vacationers to go out in their boats and motorhomes and quad's etc....

Yet, people like me ( most ) are struggling right now to afford gas just to go to work and back.

[Gromdor]

I was just reading an article today that said that the average American's net worth hit a 43yr low. It also said that 24.8% of all American's had a negative net worth. Meaning that 1 out of 4 people in the US didn't really own their belongings, rather their bank or lender actually owned it. I wonder if there is a correlation between this and the numbers the OP posted.

[Ashotep]

I think the rich should pay their fare share and its not 12% after all the loopholes and deductions. Then they complain about welfare, SS, medicare and food stamps taking too much of the tax dollar. Real rich of them.

[Bama13]

ohh boo hoo. I do not feel the least bit sorry. They're not paying anything like during the good old days in the 1950's when the marginal tax rate was 90%

Ah, like killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. Why should the government ever get 90 cents of a dollar I earned?

[Capt Amerika]

Would you rather have 12% of 10 million or 28% of 80,000?

Think about the true amount the rich actually pay before you spout off that they aren't paying their fair share.

Its ridiculous that we have so many people demonizing a sector of the population that actually took time to become highly educated and sacrificed time and effort to get to the top.

Sorry if your only aspirations was to drop out of high school, work at Wal-Mart and knock up your girlfriend.

Maybe if everyone had some ambition and drive we wouldn't be taxed so heavily to provide for them.

Food Stamps and welfare are at all time record highs.

There's a figure to be proud of!

But the problem is those dang rich people.....right?

[Capt Amerika]

They are earning more than ever, so therefore they pay more.

Whereas most of the people in this country are still working near minimum wage in the service sectors,

There are even lesser jobs than ever with the industrial revolution and automation of industries which means there are more people in the service sector now than ever, which also means that more production by the industries i.e. the rich and less of wages to pay due to automation therefore leading to higher profits than before.

And people are paid very less and the minimum wage has not increased in comparison with the inflation of currency, which means people have to work more to fulfill the same needs that they had before.

These things are not that simple, analysis all over the internet clearly says that till now the corporate are not paying their fair shares, not to mention those purposely made tax escape loopholes for the rich which allows them to pay nearly no tax.

Oh and the lobbying.

First of all, Food service workers don't work in a skilled profession and therefore don't get anything but minimum wage.

Minimum skills = Minimum wage.

Secondly, Every time you raise the minimum wage you cause inflation, when the wages of the unskilled are forcibly raised, the products are raised to compensate.

The best solution for increasing wages is higher education and trade school.

Its sad when you look around and see that a foreigner shows up one day, becomes a citizen and fulfills the American dream within 20 years while natural born Americans balk at all the opportunities that this nation provides.

Laziness and a false sense of entitlement are the diseases that are killing this nation.

Obama and his crew just perpetuate the problem by spoon feeding the masses with welfare and handouts.

Look at Obama and his staff, how many people do you see who only made it through High School? None!

They know where the real problem lies and they have no interest in telling you.

Education is the key to everything. No one in the Homeless shelter is sitting on a Masters degree.

Its not a rich/poor problem. Poor people become rich people all the time and vice versa.

Its a educated/non-educated problem.

[Jeremiah65]

Taxes needs to be more fair and balanced for everyone...rich, poor and middle classed...I don't have a magic wand but some things in the code need to go and some things need to stay.

People need the freedom to do their best, let people be creative and get the GOV out of their way.

The Gov needs to be more responsible with the money they are already collecting before they cry for more. We used to operate just fine on far-far less money,,,inflation is a part of it, but only a part of it. There is a gigantic black hole of traceable spending and most everyone knows this. We used to pave our roads, maintain our bridges, support education and extracurricular activities in schools, tend to the elderly and the sick for much less money. Now we are spending a trillion dollars a year more than we take in and it is still not enough? I'm sorry, but there is something very wrong here and no one seems to be asking the right questions.

Edited March 4, 2013 by Jeremiah65

[Cradle of Fish]

Ah, like killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. Why should the government ever get 90 cents of a dollar I earned?

I don't know if you realise this, but the United States was at the peak of its power during the fifties. The goose kept laying despite high taxes on the rich(implemented by the Republican Eisenhower).

[Bama13]

I don't know if you realise this, but the United States was at the peak of its power during the fifties. The goose kept laying despite high taxes on the rich(implemented by the Republican Eisenhower).

Do you think it was the high tax rate, or the fact that the US was one of the few industrialized nations that wasn't devastated by WWII? IIRC the lowest tax rate was around 20% also. Yet no one is advocating raising taxes on the poor to 20%.

[bmk1245]

[...]

Yet, people like me ( most ) are struggling right now to afford gas just to go to work and back.

Imagine that you would have to pay over $6.5 per gallon...

If we would have prices on gas as low as in USA... Would be awesome...

[aztek]

ohh boo hoo. I do not feel the least bit sorry. They're not paying anything like during the good old days in the 1950's when the marginal tax rate was 90%

that is idiotic.we don't live in 50s anymore.they pay more taxes a week that you will in your entire life,

[supervike]

Maybe there should be a straight 11% tax across the board.

Why isn't there more of a cry for a flat tax? It seems overwhelmingly fair.

[aztek]

Ah, like killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. Why should the government ever get 90 cents of a dollar I earned?

cuz he, from what he says, is very likely to be a frigging freelaoedr on welfare, and doesn't pay a red cent of taxes, he gets paid by us, those that pay taxes, and he aint gonna look for work as long as he gets free money, no wonder he wants everone to pay more so his worthless azz gets paid.

[Sakari]

Would you rather have 12% of 10 million or 28% of 80,000?

Think about the true amount the rich actually pay before you spout off that they aren't paying their fair share.

Its ridiculous that we have so many people demonizing a sector of the population that actually took time to become highly educated and sacrificed time and effort to get to the top.

Sorry if your only aspirations was to drop out of high school, work at Wal-Mart and knock up your girlfriend.

Maybe if everyone had some ambition and drive we wouldn't be taxed so heavily to provide for them.

Food Stamps and welfare are at all time record highs.

There's a figure to be proud of!

But the problem is those dang rich people.....right?

Really?

How about 12% straight across the board.

I do not have the luxury of being able to right off a bunch of B.S. Nor does 95% of the population.

( including cars, boats, etc. ) No, I can not write off my mileage, my dinners, or my cost of the car because I used them for " business ".

I have been with people quite a few times that kept the reciept so they could write off the Dinner or Lunch as a " business meeting "........What kind of bull**** is this?....Maybe if the rich would stop doing this, and the other bull**** write offs, we would not be in this mess.

I know what the " true amount " of some " pay " for sure. One is my father in law, he ran the San Diego Airport, and he was V.P. of a well known Airline. I know what he " wrote off", he told me. So did a few others.

Not many that are millionaires worked there asses off. You are way off base there. Far and few between are the ones that actually grew up in a " middle class" ( such a B.S. phrase ), or poverty. Most were born into wealth, and / or had " jobs " and " careers " handed to them on a silver spoon. It is luck of the draw of where you were as a sperm.

I worked my ass off my entire adult life, I tried to " work my way up ".....Sorry, lay offs and plant shut downs do not fair well, unless you are a close friend, or relative of the company.

Want proof?.....Oregon Resources....Opened 18 months ago, 130 Million Dollar investment. Shut the doors 4 months ago. 70 people out of work. Guess who has jobs there still, with no production going, and " funds ran out"?......16 people, with a combined salary of over 2.3 million dollars. Staying there to " empty the warehouse, and to " clean up "......When they are done, half of them were called by the ex CEO to go work in Arizona, for a different Company. Why them? Because they were all close " friends ", and I guarantee most of them sucked at what they do, hence ORC shutting down for one. I guarantee there are people more qualified that applied, probablly just out of " higher education ".. Think any of the hourly got these chances?

Sorry, if I were a millionaire, and could afford luxurious trips, dinners, cars, and new my childrens children were set, I would have no problem letting go of a few of my " write offs " and paying back to the Country that gave me the " chance " to be this wealthy. Especially if I new it were helping the population as a whole. But again, I am not a " millionaire ", so maybe I am not as greedy.

When I delivered Pepsi, I met ate least 7 " managers " of convenience stores that had business degrees. They were trying to pay off school loans, and could not find jobs with their " higher education ". Mainly because they did not " know " someone, or have family to hook them up. I made more a year then they did. So bull**** on your " un-skilled " crap. There are many people out there that had high paying jobs, lost them, and can not find replacements. So, to support their families, they are working at " un skilled " jobs.

Do you realize most States unemployment is a lot more then minimum wage? .......

Oregon, unemployment works out to about $12.00 a hour.

Maybe you had parents or relatives that handed you everything, most of us did not, and most of it have lived this personally, and know what is going on.

Edit to add a example :

Myself and the wife tried very hard to get a grant or a Government loan ( the ones everyone hear about ) to open a restaurant. My wife worked with a executive Chef for quite a while.

We could not get one, but guess who can ?

Someone that all ready has a business, if they want to " expand ", as long as they use it with the thoughts of hiring someone, or people.

So, people trying to start a business, oh well.....

People that all ready have one, even if doing very well, come and get it.

Yes, this is fair. This is one of those great programs our Government brags about......

To bad me and the wife were not wealthy, we could have had a business, recieved a grant to expand it, and wrote off all of the interest, and the money for expansion.

Edited March 5, 2013 by Sakari

[ninjadude]

cuz he, from what he says, is very likely to be a frigging freelaoedr on welfare, and doesn't pay a red cent of taxes, he gets paid by us, those that pay taxes, and he aint gonna look for work as long as he gets free money, no wonder he wants everone to pay more so his worthless azz gets paid.

right. about 80k in taxes this year. that's right taxes/ it was a weird year. So don't give me your freeloader red cent paid by us BEEE ESSS.

[Sakari]

Why isn't there more of a cry for a flat tax? It seems overwhelmingly fair.

There have been.......

Realistically, considering all of the " write offs " some people use. A 7% - 9% straight across the board flat tax would be more then enough. And MOST people would be doing better.

A Millionaire paying $90,000.00 is going to " feel " the same as a hard working " lower middle class, ( 95% of the country ) paying $4,050.00. They would still have their $ 910,000.00 to live on for a year, while Joe " middle class " will still have his or her $40,950.00.

If a person had $900,000 in a bank account for a year, they make $45,000.00 in interest. ( that is just a basic savings account ) That is more then most hard working " middle class " people make in a year......Kind of makes me sick.

Edited March 5, 2013 by Sakari

[Gromdor]

The numbers in the article that the OP posted includes income, payroll, corporate, and estate taxes. A poor person doesn't even have to worry about corporate or estate taxes, not having those two. The article also states that the richest 20% pay 71% of the taxes. A quick google search shows that they have 85-93% of all the wealth. I can see someone getting angry at a welfare recipient not paying taxes, but if we take even 99 cents out of every dollar we give them, are we really taking taxes from them?

We have 47% of the population not paying income taxes now and that number keeps rising. And don't think it is just lazy liberals too. Every time there is a tax cut more people join that 47% percent.(earned income tax credit and child tax credit come to mind). We could get rid of those credits and other benefits like the mortgage deduction and elderly tax benefits and force that number lower. The other option is for people to go out and get higher paying jobs and thus pay more into income tax revenue. Realistically, I don't really see either of these happening.

[aztek]

right. about 80k in taxes this year. that's right taxes/ it was a weird year. So don't give me your freeloader red cent paid by us BEEE ESSS.

lol, why not 280k??? don't believe that for a second

[Capt Amerika]

Really?

How about 12% straight across the board.

I cut out the rant portion to comment on your actual question.

I agree 100% on the flat tax!

I feel its high time that every single American pays income tax, not just 50% of us.

No more tax breaks, no more deductions etc. just a flat percentage for everyone on every dime made regardless of how it was made.

and fyi, I was born absolutely dirt poor to a single mother of two, I was in the cornfields detasseling corn at the age of 12 just to buy school clothes, I know what poor feels like.

I also know that 22 years in the Military taught me that the people who make it in this country are the ones with a skill set that people cant live without. Mechanics, plumbers, electricians etc and I also learned that no one is going to hire a person with a High school diploma over a person with a college degree.

I truly do feel for the people who bust their humps every day for next to nothing, my mom did it for 40 years. But the reality is that higher education is the only way to give yourself a leg up over the next guy.

At some point the tax code needs to be scrapped and rewritten, but have you ever noticed that no one ever actually does anything about it? President Obama? Congress? No one.

They know its written to protect their interests, nothing will ever change.

Just imagine if people actually sent money to DC and didn't get every penny back and then a little extra just because they were considered too poor.

For approx. 40% of the nation, tax time is a time to get a check worth more than they even paid over the whole year. Earned Income Credit, what a joke.

And it is truly sad that a person can make more on unemployment than minimum wage jobs, that tells me that unemployment pay is too high and discourages people from going out accepting work.

I truly hope you get the opportunity to open your restaurant and I hope you have great success with it. Don't give up, no one ever reaches the top by giving up.

[Sakari]

I cut out the rant portion to comment on your actual question.

I agree 100% on the flat tax!

I feel its high time that every single American pays income tax, not just 50% of us.

No more tax breaks, no more deductions etc. just a flat percentage for everyone on every dime made regardless of how it was made.

and fyi, I was born absolutely dirt poor to a single mother of two, I was in the cornfields detasseling corn at the age of 12 just to buy school clothes, I know what poor feels like.

I also know that 22 years in the Military taught me that the people who make it in this country are the ones with a skill set that people cant live without. Mechanics, plumbers, electricians etc and I also learned that no one is going to hire a person with a High school diploma over a person with a college degree.

I truly do feel for the people who bust their humps every day for next to nothing, my mom did it for 40 years. But the reality is that higher education is the only way to give yourself a leg up over the next guy.

At some point the tax code needs to be scrapped and rewritten, but have you ever noticed that no one ever actually does anything about it? President Obama? Congress? No one.

They know its written to protect their interests, nothing will ever change.

Just imagine if people actually sent money to DC and didn't get every penny back and then a little extra just because they were considered too poor.

For approx. 40% of the nation, tax time is a time to get a check worth more than they even paid over the whole year. Earned Income Credit, what a joke.

And it is truly sad that a person can make more on unemployment than minimum wage jobs, that tells me that unemployment pay is too high and discourages people from going out accepting work.

I truly hope you get the opportunity to open your restaurant and I hope you have great success with it. Don't give up, no one ever reaches the top by giving up.

Sorry about the rant, very touchy subject for me.

Flat tax, hell yah !

Most important of all of this.....

Thank You for Sacrificing your time for all of us, and for serving our Country. There is nothing more honorable then a Veteran / Soldier of the USA !

Thank You.....

[Orcseeker]

I also learned that no one is going to hire a person with a High school diploma over a person with a college degree.

Problem with this is that in the last decade a lot has changed, especially in regards to the education system. The cost to do a college degree has increased substantially with many people unable to do it simply because they don't have the money.

What does this do you ask?

Well it ensures the poor people are generally kept poor, works on eroding down the middle class and ensures the rich stay rich.

Now if the rich sacrificed more money through tax (which Warren Buffet, one of the lost successful and richest people in the US agrees with) coupled with good money management can give some disadvantaged people their break. Because at the end of the day, what's an extra billion dollars to a billionaire? Apart from climbing the "rich list", nothing really.

Right now if you want a prestigious position in a very high paying job, you need to be related or born into such a sub society to ensure you get there. Talent just isn't enough these days.