The History of Schizophrenia

[Theater of Dreams]

C'mon that's not entirely fair.

You're doing theories a disservice...

How so? Even theories require some degree of evidence if one wants it to be taken seriously. And Scowl's right. Notforgotten's been unable to state anything other than what he's been trying to sell the whole time; an unsupported theory.

[notforgotten]

How so? Even theories require some degree of evidence if one wants it to be taken seriously. And Scowl's right. Notforgotten's been unable to state anything other than what he's been trying to sell the whole time; an unsupported theory.

The psychiatrist can not support their theory. The lie can squirm in the shadow of darkness for all of eternity.

[Setton]

How so? Even theories require some degree of evidence if one wants it to be taken seriously. And Scowl's right. Notforgotten's been unable to state anything other than what he's been trying to sell the whole time; an unsupported theory.

That was kind of the point I was making. Except that notforgotten is not offering an unsupported theory. By definition, a theory has supporting evidence.

1. Theories require evidence

2. scowl described notforgottens ravings ideas as a theory

3. This is doing theories a disservice.

The psychiatrist can not support their theory. The lie can squirm in the shadow of darkness for all of eternity.

That's why they don't claim to know the cause. If they had a theory of it, it would be accepted as 'truth' since there are no opposing theories.

[Theater of Dreams]

That was kind of the point I was making. Except that notforgotten is not offering an unsupported theory. By definition, a theory has supporting evidence.

1. Theories require evidence

2. scowl described notforgottens ravings ideas as a theory

3. This is doing theories a disservice.

That's why they don't claim to know the cause. If they had a theory of it, it would be accepted as 'truth' since there are no opposing theories.

That could've been worded better, you're right.

[Theater of Dreams]

The psychiatrist can not support their theory. The lie can squirm in the shadow of darkness for all of eternity.

So cancer and migraines? Those are lies too?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Schizophrenia#Causes

Here. Read up. With an open mind, you'll find these psychiatrists you're incriminating are doing more for schizophrenics than faith is.

[notforgotten]

https://en.wikipedia...ophrenia#Causes

Here. Read up. With an open mind, you'll find these psychiatrists you're incriminating are doing more for schizophrenics than faith is.

So what precisely are they doing more?... prescribing medication that causes other illnesses like diabetes! They say that there is no cure and that it is a life long disease. It is not medication that is allowing people to go back to work, but the remission to the sin that is causing the schizophrenia in the first place. Complete obedience to God could get rid of the schizophrenia all together. And Jesus will deliver their souls from this evil, our enemies, the devils for all of eternity. Can psychiatry do that?...no!!!

Psalms 23 The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want. He maketh me to lie down in green pastures; he leadeth me beside still waters. He restoreth my soul; he leadeth me in the paths of righteousness for his name's sake. Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil; for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff comfort me. Thou prepares a table before me in the presence of my enemies; Thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over. Surely goodness and mercy shall follow me all the days of my life; and I will dwell in the house of the Lord for ever.

Edited May 4, 2013 by notforgotten

[notforgotten]

1 Peter 5:8-11 Be sober and vigilant. Your opponent the devil is prowling around like a roaring lion looking for [someone] to devour. Resist him, steadfast in faith, knowing that your fellow believers throughout the world undergo the same sufferings. The God of all grace who called you to his eternal glory through Christ [Jesus} will himself restore, confirm, strengthen, and establish you after you have suffered a little. To him be dominion forever. Amen.

[scowl]

So what precisely are they doing more?... prescribing medication that causes other illnesses like diabetes!

Which is a small risk compared to living a completely non-functional life.

They say that there is no cure and that it is a life long disease.

No. They don't say it is necessarily a life-long disease. As I've said at least three times now there exists "acute schizophrenia" which can appear and disappear. Many acute schizophrenics simply stop having schizophrenic episodes at some point in their lives.

You clearly haven't spent any time studying this disease. If you're really interested in helping these people I would highly recommend that you read some books on the subject. There are several books full of case studies. Once you read them you'll understand why your theory is completely wrong.

It is not medication that is allowing people to go back to work, but the remission to the sin that is causing the schizophrenia in the first place.

No, it is the medication. I've seen schizophrenics who were completely disassociated from reality become nearly lucid after being medicated for a couple of hours, therefore it has to be the medication that is causing this effect. By your theory the medication made the evil spirits "go away" so medication must be a good thing.

Complete obedience to God could get rid of the schizophrenia all together. And Jesus will deliver their souls from this evil, our enemies, the devils for all of eternity. Can psychiatry do that?...no!!!

Can Jesus do that? No, it cannot. That is why you have no examples, no evidence, no clinical studies, and absolute nothing to back up your medieval fantasy world of demonic possession.

After all, schizophrenia is most common in Christian cultures so Jesus isn't helping them. The disease is relatively rare in non-Christian countries excluding Russia and the countries of the former Soviet Union. Japan has one of the lowest rates of schizophrenia per capita in the developed countries according to the WHO yet Christians are only 1% of the population. Even odder, Thailand has a much higher rate than Japan (nearly as high as U.S. per capita) and their population is only 0.7% Christian. See, schizophrenia has no statistical connection to Christianity.

So screaming your theory over and over is a silly waste of time when simply statistical data completely disproves it.

Psalms 23 The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not...

Did you just cure someone's schizophrenia? I didn't think so.

[scowl]

So cancer and migraines? Those are lies too?

https://en.wikipedia...ophrenia#Causes

Yet for some reason "notforgotten" doesn't believe diabetes is a lie.

Edited May 4, 2013 by scowl

[notforgotten]

Yet for some reason "notforgotten" doesn't believe diabetes is a lie.

My focus is on schizophrenia. Your generalizations are irrelevant.

[notforgotten]

Which is a small risk compared to living a completely non-functional life. A completely non functional life is characteristic of a soul in ruins through punishment. This is the state in which the human soul is in without God in the afterlife.

No. They don't say it is necessarily a life-long disease. They do say that their is no cure for the disease. As I've said at least three times now there exists "acute schizophrenia" which can appear and disappear. Many acute schizophrenics simply stop having schizophrenic episodes at some point in their lives. It is most likely that they stopped the sin that was causing the schizophrenia in the first place than anything else.

You clearly haven't spent any time studying this disease. If you're really interested in helping these people I would highly recommend that you read some books on the subject. There are several books full of case studies. Once you read them you'll understand why your theory is completely wrong. I needn't trouble myself with reading a bunch of books full of lies.

No, it is the medication. I've seen schizophrenics who were completely disassociated from reality become nearly lucid after being medicated for a couple of hours, therefore it has to be the medication that is causing this effect. By your theory the medication made the evil spirits "go away" so medication must be a good thing. The medication merely sedated the patient and put them to sleep which is helpful in alleviating the symptoms.

Can Jesus do that? No, it cannot. That is why you have no examples, no evidence, no clinical studies, and absolute nothing to back up your medieval fantasy world of demonic possession. Psychiatry has nothing to prove me wrong.

So screaming your theory over and over is a silly waste of time when simply statistical data completely disproves it. There is nothing in your repertoire of lies that can prove me wrong.

Did you just cure someone's schizophrenia? I didn't think so. Schizophrenia can be cured through the discontinuation of sin and prayer. Prayer may not be a necessary element, but discontinuation of the sin that is causing the schizophrenia is necessary. There is no other way.

The Christian schizophrenic can be delivered from their illness in which the devils partake in and be delivered from the devils and punishment for all of eternity through Christ [Jesus]. Edited May 5, 2013 by notforgotten

[scowl]

My focus is on schizophrenia. Your generalizations are irrelevant.

Your focus is not on schizophrenia. Your focus is on promoting ancient superstitions about mental disease that civilized society rejected decades ago because they were scientifically tested and disproved.

There is not a single controlled case where religion has cured mental disease. You would rather let these poor people rot in your ignorance than allow them to take medications that improve their lives.

Now go ahead and quote some more Bible verses if that makes you feel better...

[notforgotten]

Your focus is not on schizophrenia. Your focus is on promoting ancient superstitions about mental disease that civilized society rejected decades ago because they were scientifically tested and disproved. Nothing has been scientifically tested and disproved. You can show nothing supporting your claim.

There is not a single controlled case where religion has cured mental disease. There are testimonies. You would rather let these poor people rot in your ignorance than allow them to take medications that improve their lives. I'm not against medication, if it helps.

Schizophrenia is a key to the reality of the invisible spirit world. And I will not sway from my knowledge of the truth. Edited May 5, 2013 by notforgotten

[scowl]

A completely non functional life is characteristic of a soul in ruins through punishment. This is the state in which the human soul is in without God in the afterlife.

If that were true, medication would not help. Instead it's a characteristic of schizophrenia, a mental disease which can and is treated by medication.

They do say that their is no cure for the disease.

Yes, half of what you said is correct. The other half was another one of your lies.

It is most likely that they stopped the sin that was causing the schizophrenia in the first place than anything else.

Why don't you hang out with a schizophrenic for a day? Then you could tell us what "sins" these awful people are committing that are making them sleep on the streets and eating out of garbage cans. From your vicious tone I believe you would enjoy seeing sinners suffering like that.

I needn't trouble myself with reading a bunch of books full of lies.

Why should we or anyone else trouble ourselves reading your lies?

The medication merely sedated the patient and put them to sleep which is helpful in alleviating the symptoms.

So you can alleviate the symptoms of schizophrenia with sedatives? That's good news! Tell us more! This sounds like a very promising thing to study!

Psychiatry has nothing to prove me wrong.

There are decades of research, clinical studies, and thousands of highly educated scientists who have dedicated their lives to helping people with debilitating mental illness and finding ways for these people led functional if not normal lives. There were some of the most compassionate and understanding people I have ever met in my life. Before medicine took on the most difficult of all human diseases, these poor people were locked up like criminals and treated like animals. I bet you wish those days would return.

So who do you have to support your theory? No one.

What evidence do you have to support your theory? None.

Is there any reason to believe anything you say? No.

There is nothing in your repertoire of lies that can prove me wrong.

And there's nothing in your statements that proves you right, therefore you are no better than a charlatan selling snake oil.

[Purple Octopus]

Wow. I just read 25 pages of people bickering with an unmedicated schizophrenic. Give it up, OP is mentally ill. :/

[notforgotten]

Wow. I just read 25 pages of people bickering with an unmedicated schizophrenic. Give it up, OP is mentally ill. :/

Considering your Avatar, you have very little room to talk.

[Purple Octopus]

You're making even less sense as time goes on. Sad. I'll pray for you.

Edited May 5, 2013 by phantasia

[scowl]

Nothing has been scientifically tested and disproved. You can show nothing supporting your claim.

Yes I can, but you'll just say "lies lies lies lies!" because you cannot face the truth that your make-believe world in which evil spirits wander around and torment people is a complete fantasy.

If you want to understand treatment of schizophrenia in the real world, read these links:

http://en.wikipedia....l_antipsychotic

http://en.wikipedia...._antipsychotics

http://en.wikipedia....ki/Neuroleptics

In the reference section of each Wikipedia entry for these drugs, there are links to published clinical studies showing their effectiveness:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorazine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haldol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prolixin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trilafon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mellaril

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navane

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stelazine

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Amisulpride

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clozapine

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Iloperidone

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulpiride

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Ziprasidone

[notforgotten]

If that were true, medication would not help. Instead it's a characteristic of schizophrenia, a mental disease which can and is treated by medication. I do believe that in some cases, there may be a biological factor in the form of a brain disorder causing the schizophrenic to experience the invisible spirit world and to be tormented by the devils. May medication someday help to correct this.

Why don't you hang out with a schizophrenic for a day? Then you could tell us what "sins" these awful people are committing that are making them sleep on the streets and eating out of garbage cans. Drugs have been known to have demonic influence and bring evil spirits into a persons life. I'm not saying that this is always the case. Isn't it true that certain drugs can cause a psychosis like schizophrenia?

So who do you have to support your theory? Look up schizophrenia and spiritual warfare on the internet.

[notforgotten]

Yes I can, but you'll just say "lies lies lies lies!" because you cannot face the truth that your make-believe world in which evil spirits wander around and torment people is a complete fantasy.

If you want to understand treatment of schizophrenia in the real world, read these links:

http://en.wikipedia....l_antipsychotic

http://en.wikipedia...._antipsychotics

http://en.wikipedia....ki/Neuroleptics

In the reference section of each Wikipedia entry for these drugs, there are links to published clinical studies showing their effectiveness:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thorazine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haldol

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prolixin

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trilafon

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mellaril

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Navane

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stelazine

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Amisulpride

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clozapine

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Iloperidone

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sulpiride

http://en.wikipedia....iki/Ziprasidone

None of this disproves that the schizophrenic is being persecuted by the devils. You're wasting your time if you think that you can find anything that will do that. Why? Because the truth can not be disproved!

[pallidin]

None of this disproves that the schizophrenic is being persecuted by the devils. You're wasting your time if you think that you can find anything that will do that. Why? Because the truth can not be disproved!

I don't think so. There is significant evidence that mental illness is a result of biological dysfunction, as opposed to a supernatural influence.

However, I do maintain that supernatural influence is indeed possible in some, rare, cases.

[notforgotten]

I don't think so. There is significant evidence that mental illness is a result of biological dysfunction, as opposed to a supernatural influence.

However, I do maintain that supernatural influence is indeed possible in some, rare, cases.

The "evidence" in which you speak of is merely "implied" and not evidence at all.

[Rlyeh]

None of this disproves that the schizophrenic is being persecuted by the devils. You're wasting your time if you think that you can find anything that will do that. Why? Because the truth can not be disproved!

Notice you haven't provided a shred of evidence? You're right, you can't disprove fiction.

[Theater of Dreams]

Considering your Avatar, you have very little room to talk.

Well, Phantasia's read through 25 pages of your narrow-minded, obsolete ramblings... but I guess her opinion doesn't matter seeing as her profile picture is an accurate depiction of her mental state. Now doctor please, tell me of what my profile picture says of me.

[Frank Merton]

All this sort of thing demonstrates and even proves the harm that certain religions do with their demons and evil spirits and all the rest of that primitive stuff.