People don’t like Obamacare

[questionmark]

Two things are true about Obamacare. First, the law has been broadly unpopular for the last several years. Second, the idea of defunding it — as some conservative Republicans are pushing — is even less popular.

The new August tracking poll from the Kaiser Family Foundation, which is the resource for public opinion on the law, makes that case definitively.

Let’s start with overall approval of the law. Forty-two percent of those tested have an unfavorable view of it while 37 percent view it favorably, numbers that have been consistent since late 2011. Even the party breakdowns inside the main question are remarkably steady; roughly six in 10 Democrats, one in three independents and 15 percent (or so) of Republicans approve of Obamacare.

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[Kowalski]

Well, according to this http://www.dontfundobamacare.com/ the petition signatures are at 781,507 signatures, so obviously quite a few people want it defunded.....

[questionmark]

Well, according to this http://www.dontfundobamacare.com/ the petition signatures are at 781,507 signatures, so obviously quite a few people want it defunded.....

that still is below 0.5% of the voting population.

I don't know how many times I have to repeat it: a small number of activists changes nothing. Those who matter at the end of the day are those likely to go to vote. And those generally are not the small number of activists. You will find them in the morning sitting in the local coffee shop hangout complaining about their medical bill.

[Yamato]

that still is below 0.5% of the voting population.

I don't know how many times I have to repeat it: a small number of activists changes nothing. Those who matter at the end of the day are those likely to go to vote. And those generally are not the small number of activists. You will find them in the morning sitting in the local coffee shop hangout complaining about their medical bill.

If the number was 40 times higher, you could say that it's still below 20% of the voting population. The point is that people shouldn't be forced by the federal government to buy a product or service they don't want. 16 million Americans may not want to buy the next government-mandated charade, and that much larger but relatively small number isn't an excuse for them to have to buy it.

[questionmark]

If the number was 40 times higher, you could say that it's still below 20% of the voting population. The point is that people shouldn't be forced by the federal government to buy a product or service they don't want. 16 million Americans may not want to buy the next government-mandated charade, and that much larger but relatively small number isn't an excuse for them to have to buy it.

Have you stopped to pay SS lately? Or is it different when they "push down your throat' a retirement pay and free medical when you are old?

How about car insurance?

[Four Winds]

I don't see how anyone would like a program that forces you to buy health insurance and fines you if you don't.

[questionmark]

I don't see how anyone would like a program that forces you to buy health insurance and fines you if you don't.

So why are you not rebelling against Social Security? There you are buying insurance against poverty once unable to work.

[Yamato]

Have you stopped to pay SS lately? Or is it different when they "push down your throat' a retirement pay and free medical when you are old?

How about car insurance?

So maybe big government and big insurance in bed together is a good thing and we should get even more, more more of it? Maybe the US government should determine what kind of car insurance I need and how much I should pay for it? I'm sure some bureaucrat with a pencil knows all about me and the market can't handle that either. Car insurance will be $375/month in no time once the government starts dolling it out. Nobody will be able to afford it unless it's the government plan. How many times do we have to learn the lesson the hard way before we learn it once?

[questionmark]

So maybe big government and big insurance in bed together is a good thing and we should get even more, more more of it? Maybe the US government should determine what kind of car insurance I need and how much I should pay for it? I'm sure some bureaucrat with a pencil knows all about me and the market can't handle that either. Car insurance will be $375/month in no time once the government starts dolling it out. Nobody will be able to afford it unless it's the government plan. How many times do we have to learn the lesson the hard way before we learn it once?

If it were not for the insistence of your political allies there would have been a public option, which is the only way this will really work at the end of the day. Was screwed up in Congress, we will have to live with it. And yes, I rather pay $375 a month than living sleeping under a bridge just because I got cancer.

Edited August 28, 2013 by questionmark

[Kowalski]

Edited August 28, 2013 by Kowalski

[Yamato]

If it were not for the insistence of your political allies there would have been a public option, which is the only way this will really work at the end of the day. Was screwed up in Congress, we will have to live with it. And yes, I rather pay $375 a month than living sleeping under a bridge just because I got cancer.

Walking to work because you don't have car insurance, you mean. Regarding cancer, I'd rather grow an acre of cannabis in my back yard and eat/juice a plant a day and save myself with the best medicine available but that's too difficult for the dumbkabobs in government to figure out too. They'd rather put my cancer-ravaged body that never hurt anyone in a cage for daring to help myself.

[Four Winds]

So why are you not rebelling against Social Security? There you are buying insurance against poverty once unable to work.

I don't like social securty either. I would rather make my own retirement choices with that money. Unfortunately it has become such a part of the system it would be hard to transition, but I wish we would. A person should at least be able to opt out of SS. Have a choice if they want to trust the government to provide for them when they retire or trust themselves.

The last thing I want to see is another government mandated program telling me to buy something or face penalties.

[Kowalski]

I don't like social securty either. I would rather make my own retirement choices with that money. Unfortunately it has become such a part of the system it would be hard to transition, but I wish we would. A person should at least be able to opt out of SS. Have a choice if they want to trust the government to provide for them when they retire or trust themselves.

What makes me mad, is not only do you have no choice but to pay into it, it's not gonna be there, when you need it. Social Security is going to run dry by 2033, if not sooner...

Link: http://wallstcheatsheet.com/stocks/unsurprisingly-medicare-and-social-security-will-run-dry-soon.html/?a=viewall

The longer expected lifespan of Medicare’s trust fund means that benefits will not have to be reduced as quickly as previously thought. However, in their annual

report, the trustees who oversee Social Security said that reserves for the fund that pays disability benefits would be exhausted by 2016, and all Social Security reserves, including the fund that pays retirement benefits, would run out by 2033.

Another link: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57587128/trustees-medicare-fund-will-run-out-in-2026/

[Four Winds]

What makes me mad, is not only do you have no choice but to pay into it, it's not gonna be there, when you need it. Social Security is going to run dry by 2033, if not sooner...

Yeah, that makes me mad as well. Being forced to pay into a system that will likely not be there in it's current form when I retire is just wrong.

[Jeremiah65]

Social security and car insurance are sad comparisons to this disaster.

If the prez was all that concerned about the healthcare of others, he would have done something different....guaranteed payment of hospital and/or emergency room bills ....or just going ahead and pushing for socialized medicine as Canada or UK have....no, there is no "care" about your "healthcare"...Oops....there is no profit for big Pharma or the mega corporations this way...can't have that.

All this does is prop up and industry and in turn back up Wall Street....you know that all insurance companies are backed by securities on Wall Street don't you?....this is Crony Capitalism....we have " to buy" something and that assures profits for many not even in the picture.....a scam.

I don't get why folks cannot see past the hype and realize what this is...it is guaranteed income to a specific industry and it's affiliates.....if you do not see this....oh well....."there are none so blind as those that will not see"

Edited August 29, 2013 by Jeremiah65

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

Yeah, that makes me mad as well. Being forced to pay into a system that will likely not be there in it's current form when I retire is just wrong.

that's what shocks me - Australia has an SS scheme, both employees and employers pay into it and the government skims off and uses the profits.

How the hell do you not get out what you pay in?

[Harte]

The point is that people shouldn't be forced by the federal government to buy a product or service they don't want. 16 million Americans may not want to buy the next government-mandated charade, and that much larger but relatively small number isn't an excuse for them to have to buy it.

I agree with you there.

But the idea of defunding Obamacare is as naive as naive gets.

This will shut down the government - temporarily of course.

So, how do they start back up? A continuing resolution. What does a continuing resolution do? It funds all of government (including any Obamacare funding) at current levels.

Only an idiot would think that defunding this program will end it.

Only legislation can end it - not cutting off funds.

That is, of course, unless the Republicans don't care if they return to minority status in both houses and continue to be vacant from the White House. This I doubt.

The current call for defunding Obamacare is clearly a political ploy made by those whose constituencies can't think past the next day or two.

Harte

[ninjadude]

If the prez was all that concerned about the healthcare of others, he would have done something different

YEARS ago now when this passed by a majority of Congress, this was the REPUBLICAN ideas. Medicare for all, Single Payer was not supported by Republicans.

[Harte]

The idea of forcing people to buy insurance did originate with Conservatives. Their plan included the option to put down a bond in lieu of purchasing a policy. The bond would be enough to cover any health payments you needed.

Please direct me to this option in Obamacare.

Harte

[questionmark]

The idea of forcing people to buy insurance did originate with Conservatives. Their plan included the option to put down a bond in lieu of purchasing a policy. The bond would be enough to cover any health payments you needed.

Please direct me to this option in Obamacare.

Harte

Please read the parts the (self stylized) conservatives did not want to pass in Obamacare. The fact of the matter is that hardly any of the bill was left untouched by the time it went up and down through both houses. The bill originally was a carbon copy of the Republican's proposal and enacted in at least one Republican held state whose Guv at the time was a Republican who lost the elections after announcing that he would roll back Obamacare within 90 days of taking office.

[Jeremiah65]

It has already been explained how mandatory participation in a private product is wrong.....it just seems the lawyers have been bought off......

I, thankfully, get my worthless insurance crap through my wife's employer...as a single, self emplyed worker....i could never afford it....and I make a decent living.

This "all is great and all is equal" crap needs to die.....Darwin was not a moron....natural selection needs some room to work....some of you actually should not be here....

We have the left that says there was no creation, there was no higher mind and when confronted with the basis of their thoughts in a social scenario...the recoil like rats from a fire...

The dumb should die....this is darwanism...get your sh!t in a row or stop b!tching like little girls....either social darwinism and selection is real or it is not....there was no welfare to the dinosaurs.....idiots.

Morons should die to cleanse the gene pool...but that is only part time acceptable to the evolutionists.....

clue...folks....what we are is a mix of darwinism and creationism.....and no one will ever figure out where the line is....so just freaking live with it and shut the eff up.....

Edited August 30, 2013 by Jeremiah65

[Yamato]

I agree with you there.

But the idea of defunding Obamacare is as naive as naive gets.

This will shut down the government - temporarily of course.

So, how do they start back up? A continuing resolution. What does a continuing resolution do? It funds all of government (including any Obamacare funding) at current levels.

Only an idiot would think that defunding this program will end it.

Only legislation can end it - not cutting off funds.

That is, of course, unless the Republicans don't care if they return to minority status in both houses and continue to be vacant from the White House. This I doubt.

The current call for defunding Obamacare is clearly a political ploy made by those whose constituencies can't think past the next day or two.

Harte

Republican politics don't determine how I think - about anything. They'll defund Obamacare as fast as they'll lose votes for doing so. The problem with Republicans and Democrats is that they need to do all those stupid little things that win them votes; unnecessary, unconstitutional, and seeing that we were already pulling massive deficits, unaffordable things.

[Jeremiah65]

The dumb should die....this is darwanism...get your sh!t in a row or stop b!tching like little girls....either social darwinism and selection is real or it is not....there was no welfare to the dinosaurs.....idiots.

Morons should die to cleanse the gene pool...but that is only part time acceptable to the evolutionists.....

How funny is some of this left wing back walking.....They believe in Darwansim except when it comes to humanity......

We need the weak and goofy to die off....I get such a hoot when I go into a public restroom and see a continuous feed cloth towel that has a sign that reads 'do not hang from towel by neck"....really? Do you need to tell the worthy parts of society that? I'd say....remove the labels and let the gene pool cleanse itself....I have zero tolerance for stupid. Who wants to continue stupid?....oh I know...those that need votes...."Lets preserve the morons as voting machines...we feed them and shelter them and tell them who to vote for".....this is not totally out of the question....

Freedom is the only answer and freedom is hard...it is not easy. Freedom scares the sh!t out of most folks because they have been conditioned to be terrified of it.....I am not scared of freedom....I love it's principles...I long for it's arrival....it is like a mistress that I want to embrace but I cannot.....there is something in the way.....oh....the democrats....let me die free.....if I cannot live that way.

You and your warping of social darwinism is not going to win the war....maybe the battle....but soon folks will figure out we are protecting and paying for idiots that might be best off on the other side of the dirt....then you lose....

Edited August 30, 2013 by Jeremiah65

[Harte]

Please read the parts the (self stylized) conservatives did not want to pass in Obamacare. The fact of the matter is that hardly any of the bill was left untouched by the time it went up and down through both houses. The bill originally was a carbon copy of the Republican's proposal and enacted in at least one Republican held state whose Guv at the time was a Republican who lost the elections after announcing that he would roll back Obamacare within 90 days of taking office.

Please ponint me to the portion of Obamacare, either in the original or in the bill as passed, that allowed people the option not to buy in by putting up a bond. I'm not arguing for either version, BTW. What I'm saying is relevant when posters claim that the mandate was a Republican idea.

It's not a mandate in the conservative's version. You get to choose.

Harte

Edited August 31, 2013 by Harte

[ninjadude]

Their plan included the option to put down a bond in lieu of purchasing a policy. The bond would be enough to cover any health payments you needed.

Please direct me to this option in Obamacare.

Tell me how that has any real difference than the individual mandate. Because it would have to be one heck of a bond.