35 replies to this topic

[the L]

From wiki:

Terence Kemp McKenna (November 16, 1946 – April 3, 2000) was an American philosopher…

Terence McKenna advocated the exploration of altered states of mind via the ingestion of naturally occurring psychedelic substances. For example, and in particular, as facilitated by the ingestion of high doses of psychedelic mushrooms, and DMT, which he believed was the apotheosis of the psychedelic experience.
He was open to the idea of psychedelics as being "trans-dimensional travel"; literally, enabling an individual to encounter what could be ancestors, or spirits of earth. He remained opposed to most forms of organized religion or guru-based forms of spiritual awakening.
Either philosophically or religiously, he expressed admiration for  Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, Gnostic Christianity, Alchemy.
In his book Food of the Gods, McKenna proposed that the transformation from humans' early ancestors Homo erectus to the species Homo sapiens mainly had to do with the addition of the mushroom Psilocybe cubensis in its diet - an event which according to his theory took place in about 100,000 BC. Mushroom can dissolve boundaries, can be used as sex stimulans.
Wherever and whenever the ego function began to form, it was akin to a cancerous tumor or a blockage in the energy of the psyche.
—Terence McKenna, Food of the Gods
The mushroom, according to McKenna, had also given humans their first truly religious experiences Another factor that McKenna talked about was the mushroom's potency to promote linguistic thinking. This would have promoted vocalisation, which in turn would have acted in cleansing the brain,which would further mutate the brain. All these factors according to McKenna were the most important factors that promoted evolution towards the Homo sapiens species. After this transformation took place, the species would have begun moving out of Africa to populate the rest of the planet [21] Later on, this theory by McKenna was given the name "The 'Stoned Ape' Theory of Human Evolution".


So what do you think about McKenna idea about Stoned ape theory?

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 July 2012 - 10:39 PM, said:

From wiki:

Terence Kemp McKenna (November 16, 1946 – April 3, 2000) was an American philosopher…

Terence McKenna advocated the exploration of altered states of mind via the ingestion of naturally occurring psychedelic substances. For example, and in particular, as facilitated by the ingestion of high doses of psychedelic mushrooms, and DMT, which he believed was the apotheosis of the psychedelic experience.
He was open to the idea of psychedelics as being "trans-dimensional travel"; literally, enabling an individual to encounter what could be ancestors, or spirits of earth. He remained opposed to most forms of organized religion or guru-based forms of spiritual awakening.
Either philosophically or religiously, he expressed admiration for  Pierre Teilhard de Chardin, Gnostic Christianity, Alchemy.
In his book Food of the Gods, McKenna proposed that the transformation from humans' early ancestors Homo erectus to the species Homo sapiens mainly had to do with the addition of the mushroom Psilocybe cubensis in its diet - an event which according to his theory took place in about 100,000 BC. Mushroom can dissolve boundaries, can be used as sex stimulans.
Wherever and whenever the ego function began to form, it was akin to a cancerous tumor or a blockage in the energy of the psyche.
—Terence McKenna, Food of the Gods
The mushroom, according to McKenna, had also given humans their first truly religious experiences Another factor that McKenna talked about was the mushroom's potency to promote linguistic thinking. This would have promoted vocalisation, which in turn would have acted in cleansing the brain,which would further mutate the brain. All these factors according to McKenna were the most important factors that promoted evolution towards the Homo sapiens species. After this transformation took place, the species would have begun moving out of Africa to populate the rest of the planet [21] Later on, this theory by McKenna was given the name "The 'Stoned Ape' Theory of Human Evolution".


So what do you think about McKenna idea about Stoned ape theory?

He was too stoned to know what he was talking about, since Homo sapiens have been around for at least twice as long at his claimed "100,000 BC" and we didn't descend from Homo erectus prior to that but from Homo heidelbergensis.

His theory sounds more like a back-handed attempt to promote the use of psychotropic drugs since according to him "we done it before".

cormac

[The Puzzler]

cormac mac airt, on 28 July 2012 - 10:53 PM, said:

He was too stoned to know what he was talking about, since Homo sapiens have been around for at least twice as long at his claimed "100,000 BC" and we didn't descend from Homo erectus prior to that but from Homo heidelbergensis.

His theory sounds more like a back-handed attempt to promote the use of psychotropic drugs since according to him "we done it before".

cormac

There is still disagreement on the subject of the classification, ancestry, and progeny of H. erectus, with two major alternative classifications: erectus may be another name for Homo ergaster, and therefore the direct ancestor of later hominids such as Homo heidelbergensis, Homo neanderthalensis, and Homo sapiens; or it may be an Asian species distinct from African ergaster
http://en.wikipedia....ki/Homo_erectus

I don't think he meant that erectus came right before sapien but that the road from erectus to sapien, from the point we were erectus.

The date is when this change occurred, obviously after the time of erectus, but the effects and evolution in our brains may not have started showing until 100,000 years ago, even though erectus was the first to begin the process of change, through the use of drugs.

Edited by The Puzzler, 29 July 2012 - 06:35 AM.

[Arbitran]

It's an intriguing thought...

I've always said that the Bible was written when the Israelites discovered manna... which was likely hallucinogenic, whatever it was. That, and just about all of their food was probably infested with things like ergot which would cause them to enter psychedelic states.

Edited by Arbitran, 29 July 2012 - 06:41 AM.

[The Puzzler]

Arbitran, on 29 July 2012 - 06:39 AM, said:

It's an intriguing thought...

I've always said that the Bible was written when the Israelites discovered manna... which was likely hallucinogenic, whatever it was. That, and just about all of their food was probably infested with things like ergot which would cause them to enter psychedelic states.

I recently discovered that manna may have actually been the hemp seed, the only seed that can sustain one uncooked for many years, Google it, very interesting, and Canaan may actually be named from the word Canna-bis. The more you think about it the more logical it all seems imo.

[Arbitran]

The Puzzler, on 29 July 2012 - 06:46 AM, said:

I recently discovered that manna may have actually been the hemp seed, the only seed that can sustain one uncooked for many years, Google it, very interesting, and Canaan may actually be named from the word Canna-bis. The more you think about it the more logical it all seems imo.

Indeed.

[cormac mac airt]

Quote

I don't think he meant that erectus came right before sapien but that the road from erectus to sapien, from the point we were erectus.

That's not what was said from the quote so it's not really open to reinterpretation. What was said was rather specific, to whit:

Quote

McKenna proposed that the transformation from humans' early ancestors Homo erectus to the species Homo sapiens mainly had to do with the addition of the mushroom Psilocybe cubensis in its diet - an event which according to his theory took place in about 100,000 BC.

Meaning that Homo sapiens direct ancestor, according to McKenna, was Homo erectus. Which is incorrect as both Homo sapiens and Homo neanderthalensis descended from Homo heidelbergensis at some point between 500,000 and 800,000 years BP. Once again, Wiki is NOT your friend.

Quote

The date is when this change occurred, obviously after the time of erectus, but the effects and evolution in our brains may not have started showing until 100,000 years ago, even though erectus was the first to begin the process of change, through the use of drugs.

Except that that doesn't really work either as "anatomically modern humans", meaning physically/structurally the same, are in evidence from c.200,000 BP. There's nothing from either the Omo Kibish or Herto remains to suggest that they were significantly different from what we have now. Which again makes McKenna's 100,000 BP date meaningless.

cormac

[Habitat]

The Puzzler, on 29 July 2012 - 06:46 AM, said:

I recently discovered that manna may have actually been the hemp seed, the only seed that can sustain one uncooked for many years, Google it, very interesting, and Canaan may actually be named from the word Canna-bis. The more you think about it the more logical it all seems imo.

Can you substantiate that ? You mean as a sole food source ?

[The Puzzler]

Habitat, on 29 July 2012 - 06:59 AM, said:

Can you substantiate that ? You mean as a sole food source ?

Yes, as a sole food source.
I can only substantiate it from apparent facts put forth in this website and some other similar ones so far, as I have not made the time to venture into each point made.

-----------------------

Cannabis will be critical to convert waste into food when humans venture into space for long-term journeys.

It is the only single source of all essential oils and protein required for complete human nutrition. It is also the only complete protein source that is safe when raw.

By comparison, protein from beans and grains can kill if not cooked sufficiently. Beans and grains contain no essential oil. Plants that produce essential oils produce inadequate protein, like olive and flax.

Cannabis nutrition and medicinal facts have been known since the beginning of time.

• Cannabis Used to Make Earliest Clothing
  
• Worlds Oldest Marijuana Bust

Cannabis seed is the only food substance that can provide complete human nutrition from a single source.

Buddha consumed cannabis seed as his only source of nutrition while seeking enlightenment.

A tradition in Mahayana Buddhism relates that during the Buddha’s six steps of ascetism, he lived by consuming one cannabis seed a day.

What is white like coriander seed and provides complete human nutrition?

Cannabis seed are the same size, shape and color as coriander seed mentioned in Exodus. Cannabis is the only plant satisfies the following requirements.

• Native to Asia (including Israel)
  
• Complete human nutrition (USDA)
  
• Fast growing season - 120 days
  
• About 1 pound of seed per plant
  
• The name is derived from Canaan
  
• Fixes nitrogen (grows in poor soil)
  
• Contain no toxins (unlike legumes)
  
• Seed is drug-free

http://crackheadawar...nna-from-heaven

Edited by The Puzzler, 29 July 2012 - 07:39 AM.

[Habitat]

The Puzzler, on 29 July 2012 - 07:32 AM, said:

Yes, as a sole food source.
I can only substantiate it from apparent facts put forth in this website and some other similar ones so far, as I have not made the time to venture into each point made.

-----------------------

Cannabis will be critical to convert waste into food when humans venture into space for long-term journeys.

It is the only single source of all essential oils and protein required for complete human nutrition. It is also the only complete protein source that is safe when raw.

By comparison, protein from beans and grains can kill if not cooked sufficiently. Beans and grains contain no essential oil. Plants that produce essential oils produce inadequate protein, like olive and flax.

Cannabis nutrition and medicinal facts have been known since the beginning of time.

• Cannabis Used to Make Earliest Clothing
  
• Worlds Oldest Marijuana Bust

Cannabis seed is the only food substance that can provide complete human nutrition from a single source.

Buddha consumed cannabis seed as his only source of nutrition while seeking enlightenment.

A tradition in Mahayana Buddhism relates that during the Buddha’s six steps of ascetism, he lived by consuming one cannabis seed a day.

What is white like coriander seed and provides complete human nutrition?

Cannabis seed are the same size, shape and color as coriander seed mentioned in Exodus. Cannabis is the only plant satisfies the following requirements.

• Native to Asia (including Israel)
  
• Complete human nutrition (USDA)
  
• Fast growing season - 120 days
  
• About 1 pound of seed per plant
  
• The name is derived from Canaan
  
• Fixes nitrogen (grows in poor soil)
  
• Contain no toxins (unlike legumes)
  
• Seed is drug-free

http://crackheadawar...nna-from-heaven

Thanks for all that. Hemp is an under-utilized resource, all that could change in the future. As for its psychotropic effects, I can't recall knowing anyone who seemed better for using it, and some definitely seemed worse as a result.

[anubis9]

maybe is the origin of the use of the hallucinogen and the religions

[Habitat]

No doubt, substances like cannabis were in use in biblical times, in fact I sometimes wonder if Christ's saying about those who attempt to enter other than by the gate being akin to thieves of the night, refers to those seeking mystical experience through such substances. The thing he would be alluding to is the kingdom of heaven, and drugs as an attempted short-cut, possibly.

[The Puzzler]

anubis9, on 29 July 2012 - 09:12 AM, said:

maybe is the origin of the use of the hallucinogen and the religions

There definitely seems to be some ancient spiritual, shamanic connection.


Although entheogens are taboo and most of them are officially prohibited in Christian and Islamic societies, their ubiquity and prominence in the spiritual traditions of various other cultures is unquestioned. "The spirit, for example, need not be chemical, as is the case with the ivy and the olive: and yet the god was felt to be within them; nor need its possession be considered something detrimental, like drugged, hallucinatory, or delusionary: but possibly instead an invitation to knowledge or whatever good the god's spirit had to offer." (Ruck and Staples)
Most of the well-known modern examples, such as peyote, psilocybe and other psychoactive mushrooms and ololiuhqui, are from the native cultures of the Americas. However, it has also been suggested that entheogens played an important role in ancient Indo-European culture, for example by inclusion in the ritual preparations of the Soma, the "pressed juice" that is the subject of Book 9 of the Rig Veda. Soma was ritually prepared and drunk by priests and initiates and elicited a paean in the Rig Veda that embodies the nature of an entheogen:

Splendid by Law! declaring Law, truth speaking, truthful in thy works, Enouncing faith, King Soma!... O [Soma] Pavāmana (mind clarifying), place me in that deathless, undecaying world wherein the light of heaven is set, and everlasting lustre shines.... Make me immortal in that realm where happiness and transports, where joy and felicities combine...

The Kykeon that preceded initiation into the Eleusinian Mysteries is another entheogen, which was investigated (before the word was coined) by Carl Kerényi, in Eleusis: Archetypal Image of Mother and Daughter. Other entheogens in the Ancient Near East and the Aegean include the poppy, Datura, and the unidentified "lotus" eaten by the Lotus-Eaters in the Odyssey and Narcissus.
According to Ruck, Eyan, and Staples, the familiar shamanic entheogen that the Indo-Europeans brought with them was knowledge of the wild Amanita mushroom. It could not be cultivated; thus it had to be found, which suited it to a nomadic lifestyle. When they reached the world of the Caucasus and the Aegean, the Indo-Europeans encountered wine, the entheogen of Dionysus, who brought it with him from his birthplace in the mythical Nysa, when he returned to claim his Olympian birthright. The Indo-European proto-Greeks "recognized it as the entheogen of Zeus, and their own traditions of shamanism, the Amanita and the 'pressed juice' of Soma — but better, since no longer unpredictable and wild, the way it was found among the Hyperboreans: as befit their own assimilation of agrarian modes of life, the entheogen was now cultivable" (Ruck and Staples). Robert Graves, in his foreword to The Greek Myths, hypothesises that the Ambrosia of various pre-Hellenic tribes were amanita (which, based on the morphological similarity of the words amanita, amrita and ambrosia, is entirely plausible) and perhaps panaeolus mushrooms.
Amanita was divine food, according to Ruck and Staples, not something to be indulged in or sampled lightly, not something to be profaned. It was the food of the gods, their ambrosia, and it mediated between the two realms. It is said that Tantalus's crime was inviting commoners to share his ambrosia.


According to The Living Torah, cannabis may have been one of the ingredients of the holy anointing oil mentioned in various sacred Hebrew texts.^[15] The herb of interest is most commonly known as kaneh-bosm (Hebrew: קְנֵה-בֹשֶׂם). This is mentioned several times in the Old Testament as a bartering material, incense, and an ingredient in holy anointing oil used by the high priest of the temple. Although Chris Bennett's research in this area focuses on cannabis, he mentions evidence suggesting use of additional visionary plants such as henbane, as well.^[16]
The Septuagint translates kaneh-bosm as calamus, and this translation has been propagated unchanged to most later translations of the old testament. However, Polish anthropologist Sula Benet published etymological arguments that the Aramaic word for hemp can be read as kannabos and appears to be a cognate to the modern word 'cannabis',^[17] with the root kan meaning reed or hemp and bosm meaning fragrant. Both cannabis and calamus are fragrant, reedlike plants containing psychotropic compounds.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entheogen

[Habitat]

"Beware of strong stimulants, Robin."  (Batman, c.1960's)

[The Puzzler]

cormac mac airt, on 29 July 2012 - 06:58 AM, said:

That's not what was said from the quote so it's not really open to reinterpretation. What was said was rather specific, to whit:



Meaning that Homo sapiens direct ancestor, according to McKenna, was Homo erectus. Which is incorrect as both Homo sapiens and Homo neanderthalensis descended from Homo heidelbergensis at some point between 500,000 and 800,000 years BP. Once again, Wiki is NOT your friend.



Except that that doesn't really work either as "anatomically modern humans", meaning physically/structurally the same, are in evidence from c.200,000 BP. There's nothing from either the Omo Kibish or Herto remains to suggest that they were significantly different from what we have now. Which again makes McKenna's 100,000 BP date meaningless.

cormac

I'd be pretty sure McKenna knew erectus was not around at 100,000BP.

That quote is worded a bit wrong, here's another take on it:

In his book Food of the Gods,^[22] McKenna proposed that the transformation from humans' early ancestors Homo erectus to the species Homo sapiens mainly had to do with the addition of the mushroom Psilocybe cubensis in its diet - an event which according to his theory took place in about 100,000 BC (this is when he believed that the species diverged from the Homo genus)

He believed the homo sapiens had diverged off at around 100,000BC.

The Omo finds and other early anatomically modern humans are a mix of archaic and modern traits, nor do they display signs of behavioural modernity in general until 50,000BP.

Skhul V - showing the archaic features in early 'anatomically modern humans'.


Around 100,000BP he has stated he thinks homo sapien branched off, which might not be so untrue, if we define homo sapiens as having not only anatomical traits but also the earliest signs of behavioural traits distinguishing that human as true homo sapien ie; modern human in both anatomical AND behavioural traits.

It was a theory whereby the stimulation of the brain advanced at that point to create the evolution he thinks occurred.

The first human species to move out of Africa was Homo erectus, the African variety of which, together with Homo heidelbergensis, is considered to be the immediate ancestor of modern humans

TOGETHER with homo heidelbergensis.

Modern humans probably did evolve around 100,000BP rather than the archaic humans before them termed as anatomically modern humans...

As we saw last time:

• Homo erectus
  
• throughout Africa, Asia, and Europe evolved into, or was replaced by, a fairly variable lot of archaic Homo sapiens that began appearing between about 400,000 and 200,000 BP
  
• by 130,000 BP, the western European archaic sapiens had become distinctly Neanderthal
  
  • The archaic sapiens made "Middle Paleolithic" tools, most classically represented by the Mousterian tools of the European Neanderthals
• then, modern Homo sapiens evolved, probably first in Africa around 100,000 BP
  
• the archaic sapiens populations either evolved in the same direction, interbred with, or were replaced by modern Homo sapiens
  
• http://bruceowen.com...ist/3250s06.htm