335 replies to this topic

[TheSearcher]

laver, on 10 January 2013 - 09:00 AM, said:

Just an excuse for not looking at the evidence available at the press of a button. Ancient religious texts by the way are evidence but I would concur need to be very carefully considered because like recorded history they are biased in favour of the writer(s) and their agendas. I wish you bon voyage on your quest for the truth if it so be

Yet I'm the one with the closed mind........

[laver]

Peter Cox, on 10 January 2013 - 09:14 AM, said:

And what Acient religious texts are you referering too? Refrence please?

Crop circles - here is evidence. PEOPLE have been CAUGHT making them. Not suspected of it BUT CAUGHT RED HANDED.

Or are we to believe that its all like the movie "Signes"?

I was referring to all ancient texts with the caveat that we should watch out for serious 'spin'

Of course there are man made crop circles but that is a very a long way from saying 'all crop designs are man made' because the evidence is otherwise

'Holywood' but not so Holy when it comes to telling the truth ; but entertains some

[Peter Cox]

Proof is what you lack here Real Proof. Can you direct me to a page or book oir paper or anything that PROVES beyond doubt that some are not made by humans?

And an argument of they to maths detailed cannot be made. As the statment is controdictry, if we dont understand the math behind them how can we say its to complex? So if we understand the math behind them we can design them and in such make them.

Proof as in a UFO video that is proven not to be a hoax, or little green men themselves making them

You see I can PROVE beyond any doubt that humans have made the circles, and you have agreed with me. Now it is your turn....

The truth is there is no PROOF that is beyond questioning to back you up, yet I can produce case after case to back me up. See the diffrence in the way the debate has gone so far?

And again WHAT religious text? the bible? Chapter and verse? Same for the others? if its just acient writings and not religious text, where can I find it and re-view it myself and who did the translation using what method? Real proof please

Edited by Peter Cox, 10 January 2013 - 10:27 AM.

[laver]

Hasina, on 10 January 2013 - 08:14 AM, said:

Should we do the same with all 'holy texts'? Just pick and choose what sounds nice... like the majority of the religions that use these 'holy texts', oh snap!

Oh yes, 'Holy' and other texts. Should we not always be on our guard against authors who are trying to bend our minds to their point of view and agendas?
If we agree with their arguments, fine, we get converted but hopefully this is based on fact not fancy. Of course, in this we have to try to be wise and from ancient times wisdom has been seen as a feminine trait..Sophie.. the Goddess with her 7 pillars of wisdom......

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

I'm curious as to how the churches of revelation play into this - as we know where each and everyone of those churches are (Turkey) and IIRC why they're mentioned in Revelation. How do they connnect to crop circles?

[laver]

Wearer of Hats, on 10 January 2013 - 09:30 AM, said:

surely if you're  using the Bible as a basis, then you should accept the "Mowing Devil" explanation for crop circles?

I don't quite see that argument
The religious establishment seems to often decide that anything that cannot be readily explained, and some that can be explained, must be the work of the 'devil'
unless this phenomena, whatever it may be, is being done by one of their deities in which case it is a 'miracle'!

An ardent teetotaller might argue that changing water into wine was the work of the 'devil' ? ( most of us would not agree) so it is just a matter of perspective
There will no doubt be those who oppose the idea of some crop designs having a foreign or spiritual origin on the basis that this might challenge their particular
religious beliefs and concept of the divine unless of course it transpired that it was their deity making them. In the 'Mowing Devil' case all those years ago when people were much more superstitious the local clergy, not knowing the cause, would cast it as evil and spin some yarn about it being due to an evil farmer who had better come to church and pray for forgiveness. This is because the route to the divine was only through the church and hence the clergy.
In secular Britain today the attitude would be very different with very few, if any, people diving for the church door when a crop circle appears

[DingoLingo]

laver, on 10 January 2013 - 09:59 AM, said:

I was referring to all ancient texts with the caveat that we should watch out for serious 'spin'

Of course there are man made crop circles but that is a very a long way from saying 'all crop designs are man made' because the evidence is otherwise

Still waiting to see the evidence to show that not all crop circles are man made.. so far.. I have not seen any evidence..

[Peter Cox]

laver, on 10 January 2013 - 11:38 AM, said:

I don't quite see that argument
The religious establishment seems to often decide that anything that cannot be readily explained, and some that can be explained, must be the work of the 'devil'
unless this phenomena, whatever it may be, is being done by one of their deities in which case it is a 'miracle'!

An ardent teetotaller might argue that changing water into wine was the work of the 'devil' ? ( most of us would not agree) so it is just a matter of perspective
There will no doubt be those who oppose the idea of some crop designs having a foreign or spiritual origin on the basis that this might challenge their particular
religious beliefs and concept of the divine unless of course it transpired that it was their deity making them. In the 'Mowing Devil' case all those years ago when people were much more superstitious the local clergy, not knowing the cause, would cast it as evil and spin some yarn about it being due to an evil farmer who had better come to church and pray for forgiveness. This is because the route to the divine was only through the church and hence the clergy.
In secular Britain today the attitude would be very different with very few, if any, people diving for the church door when a crop circle appears

Im not sure I agree with this if the bible said "a devil changed water into wine" then we would all agree but you can have perception on a direct implication "Jesus turned water into wine" is what the bible says, its not left open for debate or argument, the simple truth in the writing is that Jesus and nothing else did the act.

Much the same way as a car crash the driver crased the car, regardless of if he was on a phone or not, he crased. I dont see a link between crop circules and religion, again im waiting on specifics of the religious text you refering too.

Crop circles are man made until proven otherwise, this is why people are not running to the church when they appear.

[Sir Wearer of Hats]

and that is different to someone in our ever so enligthened and open minded age saying "aliens did it" how?

laver, on 10 January 2013 - 11:38 AM, said:

I don't quite see that argument
The religious establishment seems to often decide that anything that cannot be readily explained, and some that can be explained, must be the work of the 'devil'
unless this phenomena, whatever it may be, is being done by one of their deities in which case it is a 'miracle'!

An ardent teetotaller might argue that changing water into wine was the work of the 'devil' ? ( most of us would not agree) so it is just a matter of perspective
There will no doubt be those who oppose the idea of some crop designs having a foreign or spiritual origin on the basis that this might challenge their particular
religious beliefs and concept of the divine unless of course it transpired that it was their deity making them. In the 'Mowing Devil' case all those years ago when people were much more superstitious the local clergy, not knowing the cause, would cast it as evil and spin some yarn about it being due to an evil farmer who had better come to church and pray for forgiveness. This is because the route to the divine was only through the church and hence the clergy.
In secular Britain today the attitude would be very different with very few, if any, people diving for the church door when a crop circle appears

[laver]

Peter Cox, on 10 January 2013 - 10:25 AM, said:

Proof is what you lack here Real Proof. Can you direct me to a page or book oir paper or anything that PROVES beyond doubt that some are not made by humans?

And an argument of they to maths detailed cannot be made. As the statment is controdictry, if we dont understand the math behind them how can we say its to complex? So if we understand the math behind them we can design them and in such make them.

Proof as in a UFO video that is proven not to be a hoax, or little green men themselves making them

You see I can PROVE beyond any doubt that humans have made the circles, and you have agreed with me. Now it is your turn....

The truth is there is no PROOF that is beyond questioning to back you up, yet I can produce case after case to back me up. See the diffrence in the way the debate has gone so far?

And again WHAT religious text? the bible? Chapter and verse? Same for the others? if its just acient writings and not religious text, where can I find it and re-view it myself and who did the translation using what method? Real proof please

Of course humans make some crop circles but that is a very long way from then saying they make 'all' crop designs

Do please simply click on the internet to research the matter - as Jesus said seek and you will find

Then you can make an informed decision on the matter or if in doubt keep an open mind and wait and see if anything further turns up

[laver]

Wearer of Hats, on 10 January 2013 - 11:03 AM, said:

I'm curious as to how the churches of revelation play into this - as we know where each and everyone of those churches are (Turkey) and IIRC why they're mentioned in Revelation. How do they connnect to crop circles?

Please see previous posts for the explanation

[Peter Cox]

I have done so several time in the past.

and at best its frindge.

That is why Im asking you for your EXACT refrence and sites/paper/books. as all I can come up with via the lack of proof is humans have made ALL crop designes. so please furnish as others have asked your proof and research.

You cant make the statment and then say you search it, how would you handle it if you were giving a lecture on the topic at a school of sorts and a pupil said where is your refrence matterial? Would you say search for it yourself?

[laver]

Peter Cox, on 10 January 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

I have done so several time in the past.

and at best its frindge.

That is why Im asking you for your EXACT refrence and sites/paper/books. as all I can come up with via the lack of proof is humans have made ALL crop designes. so please furnish as others have asked your proof and research.

You cant make the statment and then say you search it, how would you handle it if you were giving a lecture on the topic at a school of sorts and a pupil said where is your refrence matterial? Would you say search for it yourself?

Peter Cox, on 10 January 2013 - 12:13 PM, said:

I have done so several time in the past.

and at best its frindge.

That is why Im asking you for your EXACT refrence and sites/paper/books. as all I can come up with via the lack of proof is humans have made ALL crop designes. so please furnish as others have asked your proof and research.

You cant make the statment and then say you search it, how would you handle it if you were giving a lecture on the topic at a school of sorts and a pupil said where is your refrence matterial? Would you say search for it yourself?

Yes I would because I am not giving a lecture I am meerly pointing out correlations between different factors that this may be a time of Revelation one of which is crop design with a focal point in southern Britain where ancient landscape geometry also has a focal point. This is covered in previous posts if you would care to have a look.

[Peter Cox]

This may very well be the end times from a biblical point of view (but thern again the bible says no man knows when the lord is coming again)

but from a crop circle point of view its no more than the fun times for the people making them

[Tesla II]

Peter Cox, on 10 January 2013 - 12:58 PM, said:

This may very well be the end times from a biblical point of view (but thern again the bible says no man knows when the lord is coming again)

but from a crop circle point of view its no more than the fun times for the people making them

Here is the first crop circle record from 1966, they didn't know what or how to do them but humans most certainly weren't to blame, as it was said the thing left the shape in the field when leaving so... no offical explanation was given since they too didn't know what it was.. but later hoaxers came and overshined the entire event ...