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Could Atlantis be under Greenland's Ice?


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#466    Mario Dantas

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 02:09 AM

Quaetum,

When you say:

Quote

Your scoop analogy isn't valid because approximately 95% of Greenland's coast is raised at least 500 m (1600+ ft).  Even if Greenland were moving, because most of the coast is raised, it wouldn't scoop up the Ice on the water but would just push it aside.

It is also invalidated due to insects in the core sample being 450,000 years old.  If Greenland were scooping ice, the insects would be around 12,000 years old
.

I do not know why you got that idea, but IMO since throughout the Last Glacial Maximum (during the Quaternary glaciation) the existing ice reached thicknesses of 4 km, thus, it would seem rather credible for Greenland to have «scooped up»:a large portion of that ancient ice.

Posted Image


Northern Hemisphere glaciation during the Last Glacial Maximum.

The creation of 3 to 4 km (1.9 to 2.5 mi) thick ice sheets caused a global sea level drop of about 120 m (390 ft).

http://en.wikipedia....nary_glaciation


Regarding the bugs trapped within the ice, i disagree that they would be only as old as 12.000 years. Whatever got trapped would become and actually is an unsuspitioned part of the old whole Pleistocenic ice that existed, and consequently, all the dating could have been done on samples that were ripped off from the larger body of ice, as i had stated in the analogy.

Regards,
Mario Dantas

Edited by Mario Dantas, 22 February 2013 - 02:11 AM.

1. Catalog of Images
https://picasaweb.google.com/106047243612755133722

2. Was Atlantis in Greenland?
http://a7lan7is.blogspot.com

#467    Quaentum

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Posted 22 February 2013 - 07:03 PM

View PostMario Dantas, on 22 February 2013 - 02:09 AM, said:

Quaetum,

When you say:



I do not know why you got that idea, but IMO since throughout the Last Glacial Maximum (during the Quaternary glaciation) the existing ice reached thicknesses of 4 km, thus, it would seem rather credible for Greenland to have «scooped up»:a large portion of that ancient ice.

Posted Image


Northern Hemisphere glaciation during the Last Glacial Maximum.

The creation of 3 to 4 km (1.9 to 2.5 mi) thick ice sheets caused a global sea level drop of about 120 m (390 ft).

http://en.wikipedia....nary_glaciation


Regarding the bugs trapped within the ice, i disagree that they would be only as old as 12.000 years. Whatever got trapped would become and actually is an unsuspitioned part of the old whole Pleistocenic ice that existed, and consequently, all the dating could have been done on samples that were ripped off from the larger body of ice, as i had stated in the analogy.

Regards,
Mario Dantas

The LGM happened about 18,000 BCE.  BY 10,000 BCE (When Atlantis supposedly sank beneath the waves) the ice age was over and the glaciers had retreated to their normal positions.  If Greenland had moved as you said, it would have encountered only the normal ice  which can be found on the ocean and not 4km thick glaciers

Insects do not live in the middle of the Atlantic as there is nothing for them to eat and no where for them to reproduce.  So any insects that would be under the ice would be the ones that already existed on Greenland and would only be as old as when the ice formed on Greenland, which should be about 10,000 BCE (12,000 years ago), if Greenland were indeed Atlantis and not 450,000 years ago.

Two more problems with your scoop theory:

1 - Ice, large enough to have been pushed onto Greenland, would have caused massive erosion to the northern mountains as it passed over and between them.  This erosion is not visible.

2 - Ice pusing onto the northern part of Greenland would tend to accumulate there and it is there that it should be thickest, but the thickest part is actually in the center of the island.

AA LOGIC
They didn't use thousands of workers - oops forgot about the work camps
There's no evidence for ramps - You found one?...Bummer
Well we know they didn't use ancient tools to cut and shape the stones - Chisel marks?  Craps
I still say aliens built them!

#468    D2thaShizzle

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Posted 26 February 2013 - 10:42 PM

Plato first wrote about Atlantis in his dialogues Timaeus and Critias. Plato lived 424 BC to 348 BC. With that in mind, also consider that Greenland's first Norse settlement started in AD 986. The gap in the timeframe does not do well for your idea. It's an interesting thought, I recommend researching it.


#469    Mario Dantas

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 10:37 AM

View PostQuaentum, on 22 February 2013 - 07:03 PM, said:

The LGM happened about 18,000 BCE.  BY 10,000 BCE (When Atlantis supposedly sank beneath the waves) the ice age was over and the glaciers had retreated to their normal positions.  If Greenland had moved as you said, it would have encountered only the normal ice  which can be found on the ocean and not 4km thick glaciers

Insects do not live in the middle of the Atlantic as there is nothing for them to eat and no where for them to reproduce.  So any insects that would be under the ice would be the ones that already existed on Greenland and would only be as old as when the ice formed on Greenland, which should be about 10,000 BCE (12,000 years ago), if Greenland were indeed Atlantis and not 450,000 years ago.

Two more problems with your scoop theory:

1 - Ice, large enough to have been pushed onto Greenland, would have caused massive erosion to the northern mountains as it passed over and between them.  This erosion is not visible.

2 - Ice pusing onto the northern part of Greenland would tend to accumulate there and it is there that it should be thickest, but the thickest part is actually in the center of the island.


Quaentum,

I am sorry it took this long to answer...

You bring interesting new interrogations to this “dialog”, thank you for your input. Nevertheless, it is my opinion you are too attached to details, which forcibly prevents you from seeing the big picture.

When you refer to the LGM as having occurred 18.000 years and not 10.000 years ago, i remind you that this is supposed to be a “timeless” experiment, thus, small age differences (in the order of thousands of years between the end of the Pleistocene and the Holocene) should not be taken under consideration, furthermore, the dating should be necessarily different (wrong), because the planet did not evolve as gradually as we tend to think (for want of a definite proof).

Regarding insects found under the ice, all i can say is that i misunderstood what you said at first, but chances are those results are also adulterated, by means of a disturbing event that provoked a “shoal of mud” underneath Greenland’s inland ice:



Quote

GRIP/GISP

See main articles: GRIP, GISP


The GRIP and GISP cores, each about 3000 m long, were drilled by European and US teams respectively on the summit of Greenland. Their usable record stretches back more than 100,000 years into the last interglacial. They agree (in the climatic history recovered) to a few metres above bedrock. However, the lowest portion of these cores cannot be interpreted, probably due to disturbed flow close to the bedrock.[27] There is evidence the GISP2 cores contain an increasing structural disturbance which casts suspicion on features lasting centuries or more in the bottom 10% of the ice sheet.[28] The more recent NorthGRIP ice core provides an undisturbed record to approx. 123,000 years before present. The results indicate that Holocene climate has been remarkably stable and have confirmed the occurrence of rapid climatic variation during the last ice age.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice_core

in the same vein:


Quote

The Greenland ice sheet did not develop at all until the late Pliocene, but apparently developed very rapidly with the first continental glaciation. This had the unusual effect of allowing fossils of plants that once grew on present-day Greenland to be much better preserved than with the slowly forming Antarctic ice sheet.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ice-sheet

Continuing...

I had read before about north Greenland, but my main interest lie further down south, where i propose the Cape Verde islands to have been attached, since the beginning of times.

I roughly studied the southern part of Greenland and worked out possible models (notice the Ketilidian mobile belt in the south of Greenland(f), which is exactly the same size and located where i propose the Cape Verde islands to have existed in the past, as a part of the larger island).

Posted Image



Posted Image







Relation between the Cabo Verde Islands and South of Greenland (2010)

https://plus.google....554744863948769


Contrary to what you propose, the northern part of Greenland is known for its gravel banks, and therefore i should presume that it could be the byproduct of erosive processes (hidden from our knowledge) other than the extensive glacial erosion activity. Gravel and silt are profusely distributed in temporary islands. I ask, is there not a great coincidence that these things happen?

Why aren’t there high mountains in the north of Greenland (only one out of the highest 100’s) as in the rest of the island?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mountains_in_Greenland

Regarding Greenland’s center being too high where it “should” be lower, in all honesty, i never thought about it, until now that you mentioned it. I am sure there is a *logic* explanation.

Sorry again for replying this late. These posts are very important to me and i do not usually have the time to think and research properly into the subjects you bring up. As i said, i have read plenty of material regarding a great deal of scientific fields. Unfortunately, i am not  able to articulate as i wished, on all of the subjects i am studying (if any).

Regards,
Mario Dantas

Edited by Mario Dantas, 28 February 2013 - 10:52 AM.

1. Catalog of Images
https://picasaweb.google.com/106047243612755133722

2. Was Atlantis in Greenland?
http://a7lan7is.blogspot.com

#470    aryannatimothy

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 10:41 AM

Great thread. I always fascinate Atlantis and how beautiful its civiliation is as much as the place. I must also agree that there are tons of information about the location of Atlantis but there are no proven facts that this place did exist. Perhaps the very mystery kept a lot of people to wonder where Atlantis is really located or is it true in the first place.

Discover the power of the mind and know how to manifest what you want. Click mind power secrets to know more.

#471    Mario Dantas

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Posted 28 February 2013 - 10:56 AM

View PostD2thaShizzle, on 26 February 2013 - 10:42 PM, said:

Plato first wrote about Atlantis in his dialogues Timaeus and Critias. Plato lived 424 BC to 348 BC. With that in mind, also consider that Greenland's first Norse settlement started in AD 986. The gap in the timeframe does not do well for your idea. It's an interesting thought, I recommend researching it.

D2thaShizzle,

Why is the gap you mention, a problem to my theory? Sorry i did not understand...

Regards,
Mario Dantas

1. Catalog of Images
https://picasaweb.google.com/106047243612755133722

2. Was Atlantis in Greenland?
http://a7lan7is.blogspot.com

#472    Nean

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 01:41 AM

If it is we won't find anything, the glaciers will grind it to bits.

Sundaland seems a lot more plausible. We even have the evidence of roads and buildings, and it would have been entirely above water 10000BC . Maybe Mu and Atlantis are the same thing?

As far as advanced goes, compared to what? Compared to ancient Greece, maybe. If someone else made tech comparable to moder then they'd have left tons of signs, not the least of which being huge amounts of CO2 in the ancient ice cores.


#473    Abramelin

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 06:36 AM

View PostNean, on 04 March 2013 - 01:41 AM, said:

If it is we won't find anything, the glaciers will grind it to bits.

Sundaland seems a lot more plausible. We even have the evidence of roads and buildings, and it would have been entirely above water 10000BC . Maybe Mu and Atlantis are the same thing?

As far as advanced goes, compared to what? Compared to ancient Greece, maybe. If someone else made tech comparable to moder then they'd have left tons of signs, not the least of which being huge amounts of CO2 in the ancient ice cores.

I'd like to see that evidence.


#474    Nean

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 05:26 PM

Let me google that for you bro...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundaland

I shouldn't say 'evidence' but actual roads and buildings. It's surprising more attention hasn't been paid to this.


#475    Mario Dantas

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Posted 08 March 2013 - 11:13 PM

Quote



Quaternary geologists win timescale vote


Redefinition rescues once-threatened terminology from extinction.

Amanda Leigh Mascarelli


Posted Image

J. BLAIR/CORBIS



In 2006, astronomers reached a decision on the planetary status of Pluto; now, geologists may have done the same for the status of the Quaternary, the time period in which humans evolved and live today. But, as was the case with Pluto, resolving this long-standing controversy has left some researchers feeling alienated.

The International Commission on Stratigraphy (ICS) has elected to formally define the base of the Quaternary at 2.6 million years before present, and also to lower the base of the Pleistocene — an epoch that encompasses the most recent glaciations — from its historical position at 1.8 million years to 2.6 million years ago. The decision, finalized on 21 May, will now be passed to the executive committee of the International Union of Geological Sciences (IUGS) for ratification, which is expected in the next month or two.

The vote shifts an 800,000-year slice, formerly part of the Pliocene epoch, into the Pleistocene. "It's kind of a land grab," says Philip Gibbard, a geologist at the University of Cambridge, UK, who has fought for the redefinition since 2001. "But we see it as just putting straight a mistake that was made 25–30 years ago."

In 1985, the beginning of the Pleistocene was defined at 1.8 million years ago, calibrated to an outcropping of marine strata in southern Italy. But some geologists have long felt that was a localized, arbitrary boundary that did not reflect worldwide changes — and argued instead for the 2.6-million-year mark, when the entire planet cooled.

The term Quaternary was adopted in the early 1800s, when geologists divvied up fossil records of Earth's history into four periods: the Primary, Secondary, Tertiary and Quaternary. The first two terms were discarded long ago, and although Tertiary is still sometimes used, in recent decades some geologists came to consider the Quaternary an outmoded relic. In 2004, a major publication left the Quaternary out of the ICS timescale altogether, making it vulnerable to extinction from scientific nomenclature. In place of the Quaternary, it extended the prior 'Neogene', which began 23 million years ago, up to the present. The Quaternary community went into open revolt.

"The geologic timescale is fundamental for expressing the history of the Earth," says Stan Finney, a geologist at California State University in Long Beach and chair of the ICS. "This is our clock — we need the units of our timescale and their boundaries to be precisely defined."
http://www.nature.co...ll/459624a.html


Edited by Mario Dantas, 08 March 2013 - 11:20 PM.

1. Catalog of Images
https://picasaweb.google.com/106047243612755133722

2. Was Atlantis in Greenland?
http://a7lan7is.blogspot.com

#476    Abramelin

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Posted 13 March 2013 - 09:24 AM

View PostNean, on 04 March 2013 - 05:26 PM, said:

Let me google that for you bro...http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sundaland

I shouldn't say 'evidence' but actual roads and buildings. It's surprising more attention hasn't been paid to this.

I have read as much about Sundaland as I have read (and posted) about Doggerland (see thread), but never did I read about 'actual roads and buildings' found in the submerged part of Sundaland.

So if you have a link, please post it. Your Wiki link doesn't show/mention any roads or buildings.

+++

EDIT:

Posted Image

Posted Image

http://www.unexplain...30#entry4450418


.

Edited by Abramelin, 13 March 2013 - 09:37 AM.


#477    Michael Collins

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Posted 24 March 2013 - 12:56 AM

Hi, a new theory says it was in mid-Pacific - see Before The Delusion by Wm Gleeson. Worth reading
Regarding 'real' evidence its interesting that on the [Pacific] island of Pohnpei in 1920s? the Japanese recovered tonnes of platinum from underwater. Actual metal not ore. It was listed in their official list of mining resources.
The Greeks called it orichalum ?
Now how did that happen, and why do we take so little notice of it?
Cheers MC


#478    Abramelin

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 01:00 PM

Whatever there was in the middle of the Pacific, it could not have been Atlantis, unless we forget about Plato altogether.


#479    Mario Dantas

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 03:50 PM

Quote

Topo de Coroa is Santo Antão's tallest and Cape Verde's second tallest mountain after Pico do Fogo (2,829 m). It is in the western portion of the island. Its height is 1,979 m. The mountain is entirely of volcanic origin and is the most westerly mountain of Africa. The mountain area contains several valleys, and its ranges run to the east, the north and the west. Nearest places includesPonta do Sol and Porto Novo.



Posted Image



Posted Image



1. Catalog of Images
https://picasaweb.google.com/106047243612755133722

2. Was Atlantis in Greenland?
http://a7lan7is.blogspot.com

#480    Mario Dantas

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Posted 07 July 2013 - 06:01 PM

Just interrogations going on my mind...

The Ketilidian mobile belt (South Greenland) is delimiting the exact same surface that was left behind (the surface of the Cape Verde islands)



Quote

Tectonic Displacements and Thermal Activity in Two Contrasting Proterozoic Mobile Belts from Greenland



Abstract

The Proterozoic Nagssugtoqidian and Ketilidian mobile belts are comparable in scale with those of the Phanerozoic rather than those of the Archaean. These two Proterozoic belts differ from one another both in the tectonic displacements which gave rise to them, and in their thermal activities as expressed by igneous and metamorphic characteristics. Similar differences between modern tectonic belts have been interpreted in terms of plate tectonics. The Nagssugtoqidian is characterized by considerable crustal shortening, very limited igneous activity, and high-pressure regional metamorphism which may be related to crustal thickening resulting from both ductile and brittle overthrusting of the Nagssugtoqidian rocks over the Archaean foreland. Evidence of crustal shortening in the Ketilidian is limited, but vertical and transcurrent movements are important. Widespread igneous activity throughout the active history of the belt resulted in the formation of mainly acid volcanic supracrustal rocks and widespread granite intrusion. The appinite suite is also well represented. Metamorphism is mainly of low-pressure type. A tentative comparison can be made between the Alpine and Nagssugtoqidian belts on the one hand, and Andean and Ketilidian belts on the other.
http://rsta.royalsoc...nt/273/1235/513


Is it not of a great coincidence that south Greenland does seem to match that of the Cape verde islands? What about the similar geologic features patent in both regions? crustal shortening? Tectonic Displacements? Intrusions, dykes, breccias, etc, etc. The ancient eruptive complex (in Cape Verde) existing in nearly all islands (except perhaps Fogo), must be the old rock that remained from south Greenland, buoying upon the magma. Vestiges of rock metametamorphism exist also in both places (Greenland/Cape Verde).

Some time ago after observing an album of geoid images i realized, the Kettilidian Mobile Belt must be the geologic remaining region from where the Cape Verde islands got separated. The Cape Verde islands have the highest anomaly in the geoid representation, without exception...

Since large earthquakes can be perceptible in the geoid imagery, i would assume, if there was something big enough happening in the Atlantic, the sign would most certainly be there...

The mid Atlantic ridge is only perceptive (gravitational anomalies) in the Vicinity of Gibraltar, near Azores.

Posted Image



1. Catalog of Images
https://picasaweb.google.com/106047243612755133722

2. Was Atlantis in Greenland?
http://a7lan7is.blogspot.com




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