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How many alien civilizations are there ?


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#76    Mike D boy

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 09:29 AM

It would appear endless, but many astronomers and scientists place the number at 1 billion out of 100 billion trillion stars thought to be in our universe alone! :unsure2: (can't think of anything so vast and mysterious) The ratio of any civilization intelligent and advanced enough to reach another planet in a nearby star goes down to less than 100,000 ... and the chances of Earth visited by another species of extraterrestrials is less than one (some people believe they have arrived). The possibilities are there, and the only problem is where to detect the nearest alien civilization in any stage of scientific advancement, whether or not they are able to transport themselves to other solar systems filled with planets harboring life.

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#77    quillius

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 10:05 AM

View Postbmk1245, on 08 December 2012 - 06:15 PM, said:

Yeap. I think you don't realize how far 1 LY is, not to mention 1000, or 10000 Lys.

actually I do, and what you say above actually strengthens my point which seems to have been missed by most (except 747).

Yes 1LY is such a great distance we will not do it in a single lifetime rendering the distance of 1LY impossible right? so what difference is 1000LY to 10000 LY...both impossible in a lifetime? is one more impossible than the other??

let me give one final analogy:

can I swim 1000 miles under water? is it less likely I can swim 10000 miles under water?


#78    quillius

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 10:07 AM

View Postbmk1245, on 09 December 2012 - 01:08 AM, said:

But 10000, then, would be more impossibly farther.

so something as definitive as 'impossible' you are suggesting has a range..i.e. 'more'??? impossible is impossible I thought...oh well...


#79    quillius

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 10:14 AM

View Postbadeskov, on 09 December 2012 - 03:42 AM, said:

Quite a bit, actually, I would think. First of all, there are a lot more stars within a 10000 LY range than within a 1000 LY range. Secondly, as you mention in another post is the actual travel. I don't know about that one. I think it depends on the technology whether 10000 LY is the same as 1000 LY. But another matter would be the chances of actually finding us.

Cheers,
Badeskov

I cant agree Badeskov, with regards to the first part which I assume is strictly pointing at the probability of 'other' life, granted that 10000 LY range will have considerably more 'opportnuity' for life than 1000 LY range, however when you look at how many stars this relates to I think the difference is negligable. Even so, if we accept this I thought it was the distance we were discussing rather than 'probability of life. And I still think the difference between 1000 v 10000 LY is irrelevant, hopefully my swimming analogy may make my point clearer.


#80    quillius

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 10:17 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 10 December 2012 - 09:16 AM, said:

Nah, mate, these distances are not "Blocks" they are light years. Difference between 100 light years and 200 light years? 9,461,000,000,000 km or 5,878,000,000,000 miles is the distance covered in one light year. That is even going to make quite an impact on FTL, and render most of space as unreachable. Some things will be achievable, some not, but we have to get the technology up and running first off.

Hey Psyche, this is more or less my point......do you see everything from say 100LY to 1000000LY as part of space that is unreachable? if so then there is no difference between the 100LY and the 1000000LY as both as unreachable....


#81    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 07:29 PM

View Postbadeskov, on 10 December 2012 - 02:55 AM, said:

Since that would have to be accomplished world wide, yes it is. You didnt think that one through, I believe.




Every so often, there is a discussion on the Internet about SETI signals being jammed, and about the military's SETI project.


http://www.google.co...354675689,d.eWU


#82    itsnotoutthere

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Posted 10 December 2012 - 07:31 PM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 10 December 2012 - 12:47 AM, said:

That you know of, but I know about one.

Do tell....

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#83    DONTEATUS

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 02:47 AM

Love the "Do Tell" Mac-G the balls are back in your court ! :clap:

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#84    psyche101

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 03:28 AM

View Post747400, on 10 December 2012 - 09:26 AM, said:

Would it, though? Surely it'd be academic if one got in a spaceship to travel to a star 1000 light years away , or sent a message there hoping to get a reply, as to whether you sent one 10,000 l.y. From the point of view of anyone hoping to get a reply, it really wouldn't make any difference at all would it.

Sorry my mistake, you are talking communications, I thought you were referring to physical travel, where distance between say 5 light years and 500 could well mark what is possible and what is not.



View Postquillius, on 10 December 2012 - 10:17 AM, said:

Hey Psyche, this is more or less my point......do you see everything from say 100LY to 1000000LY as part of space that is unreachable? if so then there is no difference between the 100LY and the 1000000LY as both as unreachable....

Yep, I think I am onto it now, sorry for the confusion, carry on.

Edited by psyche101, 11 December 2012 - 03:29 AM.

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#85    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 03:54 AM

View Postitsnotoutthere, on 10 December 2012 - 07:31 PM, said:

Do tell....

Haven't I told a great deal already?


#86    psyche101

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 08:14 AM

How many?


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Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#87    Kludge808

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Posted 11 December 2012 - 10:54 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 10 December 2012 - 09:23 AM, said:

Unless 84001 is re-evaluated yet again with yet another conclusion. Maybe we can blame it for the ETH'ers LOL.
It's not the only one with assorted interesting "stuff" but it is one of the more unusual ones.  Since I can't accept that we're alone in the universe, panspermia would also go far toward an environment where life can form on numerous planets which does fit my "vision" of the universe.  There are other mechanisms but this seems the simplest.

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#88    badeskov

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 02:12 AM

Pardon the late response, but I seem to have very little time these days.

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 10 December 2012 - 07:29 PM, said:

Every so often, there is a discussion on the Internet about SETI signals being jammed, and about the military's SETI project.


http://www.google.co...354675689,d.eWU

And every so often (read: every time) the discussion is based on nonsense and initiated by people that does not know one iota about the subject. To accomplish such a feat and jam SETI the military would need some very impressive hardware and, in addition, they would make it blatantly obvious that that were doing it.

SETI uses antennas with high directivity, meaning that they are looking at a very narrow patch of the sky and anything outside of that is pretty much attenuated to the extent where it is in the noise floor. Since SETI is looking towards the sky, the military would have to place their jamming devices in the sky. And they should be broadband noise sources as SETI is scanning over a broad frequency range. But not only that, since SETI is also scanning the sky, said military installation would have to follow overhead as well, further complicating matters significantly. And said military would naturally have to do that across the globe in case somebody else had the audacity to listen in (and there are quite a few, very sensitive radio-telescopes out there).

And it would be known and countered. SETI is in the business of detecting signals and any signals coming from overhead are detected, categorized and analyzed.

Frankly, the notion is rather absurd.

Cheers,
Badeskov

Edited by badeskov, 12 December 2012 - 02:13 AM.

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#89    psyche101

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 02:27 AM

Hey, it is 12:30 here, LUNCH :D


and the 12th of the 12th.


Did I miss the apocalypse? Anyone know how it went?

ETA Ahh no, 21st isn't it. Looks like I still have a few days :D

Edited by psyche101, 12 December 2012 - 02:28 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#90    psyche101

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Posted 12 December 2012 - 02:29 AM

View PostKludge808, on 11 December 2012 - 10:54 AM, said:

It's not the only one with assorted interesting "stuff" but it is one of the more unusual ones.  Since I can't accept that we're alone in the universe, panspermia would also go far toward an environment where life can form on numerous planets which does fit my "vision" of the universe.  There are other mechanisms but this seems the simplest.

I've been doin' ... sorta kinda more or less.  My health hasn't been all that great and I've been back to the ER a few more times.  Ahhh, but Noelle ... she can still kick my overly abundant okole even from 3500 miles away.  The day she can't is the day I'll be seriously worried.  I did finally say the hell with my diet and bought a deep frier and a toaster oven to start making the food I like rather than pretending to follow the VA's dietician's suggestions.  As long as my cholesterol and sodium are under control, which they have been for quite a while, I'll be happy.

I gotta admit, panspermia is a very reasonable hypothesis, I wonder if any feel it is impossible?

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.





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