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New proposed Space Currency


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#16    Ins0mniac

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 01:41 PM

GirlInBlack on Oct 20 2007, 04:04 AM, said:

ridiculous..

If we are still using currency by the time we are able to travel to other stars I will feel sorry for the human race. The world will evolve along with technology. We should eventually have no need for any type of money. We will work to better humanity, not to make money. People will realize that a select few people being rich while others are poor isn't right. Everyone will have the same quality of life, and everyone will do their part to better the human race. How pathetic would we be if we still used money in the future?


So we'll all become communists?

Human's are generally self interested by nature. What is there that would make that change? Not evolution, evolution would suggest the opposite if anything. Nor technology.

Some people will always do their part to better the human race. While most will always free ride, if given the chance.

At least with currency, there is a form of incentive to be more productive. And until we can somehow fundamentally change human nature (which I don't see how), it's the best system we have for what we've got.

Edited by Ins0mniac, 22 October 2007 - 01:42 PM.

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#17    Luka the Rentboy

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Posted 22 October 2007 - 06:45 PM

Ins0mniac on Oct 22 2007, 03:41 PM, said:

So we'll all become communists?

Human's are generally self interested by nature. What is there that would make that change? Not evolution, evolution would suggest the opposite if anything. Nor technology.

Some people will always do their part to better the human race. While most will always free ride, if given the chance.

At least with currency, there is a form of incentive to be more productive. And until we can somehow fundamentally change human nature (which I don't see how), it's the best system we have for what we've got.


Oh noes! The pinko commies will destroy us! Call Senator McCarthy! Surely he is our last hope!

There are many ways to theoretically change human nature. Behavorial conditioning? Might not work very well all the time these days. But time will progress, and, hopefully, society will begin to regard knowledge as noble. Sooner or later, lest humanity be destroyed by some very fortunate but unlikely event, we will be able to mold the human body and mind, and thusly be able to phase out ineffecient and undesirable things, such as self-interest. Your argumentation is weak. Currency has, so far, always been used, even by self-professed "socialist states", such as the USSR; and barther systems also had incentives to be more productive.

This is ultimately about the future pillaging of space, spatial pioneering and exploitation of extraterrestrial resources by the dreadfully corrupt and loathsome beasts we call "humans", which some have accredited to grand titles such as "the crown of creation" and alike. Humanity now desires to expand their lebensraum a bit, by colonising space; well, bring on the caravans of freight ships carrying ore from one of Jupiters moons, bring on the space currency, bring on the regional space malls, the gigantic space advertisement boards ($39.95, save $5 on the latest luxury commodities, only tonight!) that you cannot escape. Let spread our disease throughout the universe.

I hope some intelligent race of beings annihilates us.

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#18    Ins0mniac

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Posted 23 October 2007 - 05:22 AM

Seora on Oct 23 2007, 05:45 AM, said:

There are many ways to theoretically change human nature. Behavorial conditioning? Might not work very well all the time these days. But time will progress, and, hopefully, society will begin to regard knowledge as noble. Sooner or later, lest humanity be destroyed by some very fortunate but unlikely event, we will be able to mold the human body and mind, and thusly be able to phase out ineffecient and undesirable things, such as self-interest.


mass behavioural conditioning or something. That would require some sort of government in power with the will to carry it out, and a public that would let it happen. Governments tend to be more interested in power than enlightening society. That's why they are in power. Would have to be a bit of a fluke.

Seora on Oct 23 2007, 05:45 AM, said:

Your argumentation is weak. Currency has, so far, always been used, even by self-professed "socialist states", such as the USSR; and barther systems also had incentives to be more productive.


Yes, however capitalism is based a lot more on the incentives of money than communism.

My argument is that, if you somehow make a society full of altruists, then you can get rid of money. Sure. But until then, it's the best way to deal with humanity. Just getting rid of money wont stop greed. It'll make it worse. Some people wont pull their weight but they will be able to hide it even more easily.

Seora on Oct 23 2007, 05:45 AM, said:

This is ultimately about the future pillaging of space, spatial pioneering and exploitation of extraterrestrial resources by the dreadfully corrupt and loathsome beasts we call "humans", which some have accredited to grand titles such as "the crown of creation" and alike. Humanity now desires to expand their lebensraum a bit, by colonising space; well, bring on the caravans of freight ships carrying ore from one of Jupiters moons, bring on the space currency, bring on the regional space malls, the gigantic space advertisement boards ($39.95, save $5 on the latest luxury commodities, only tonight!) that you cannot escape. Let spread our disease throughout the universe.

I hope some intelligent race of beings annihilates us.


Hmm. A pessimistic idealist. Interesting.

In my view, humanity has good and bad in it.

Hmm. In hoping some intelligent race of beings annihilates us, it seems you're assuming a more intelligent race of beings would also be more more 'enlightened'. They could just as easily be worse than us.

Without exploitation of resources, you wouldn't have access to the computer you're using right now. Are you leading my example and living a simple life in some shack in the mountains with a vegetable garden or are you part of it?

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#19    Luka the Rentboy

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Posted 23 October 2007 - 11:12 AM

Ins0mniac on Oct 23 2007, 07:22 AM, said:

mass behavioural conditioning or something. That would require some sort of government in power with the will to carry it out, and a public that would let it happen. Governments tend to be more interested in power than enlightening society. That's why they are in power. Would have to be a bit of a fluke.


It does not quite require a governmental power; though it does require a concentration of power. This might just as well be in the hand of any expansionist corporate conglomerate, though it's desire to execute such "reforms" of the human nature would undoubtedly have to be at the hands of a person desiring it so. The same would most likely go for a governmental power as well, it would require a person with alot of power who at whim would carry out the project, possibly in secret for the great populace.

Quote

Hmm. In hoping some intelligent race of beings annihilates us, it seems you're assuming a more intelligent race of beings would also be more more 'enlightened'. They could just as easily be worse than us.


Not really, merely hopeful they would be, as they'd realise the fruitlessness of persuing emotional fullfillment and the individual. It is however, as you pointed out, nothing inherit in enlightenment per se. It would more have to do with their biological nature. I'm hoping they'd be made of matter entirely unknown to us, something strange & alluring that makes no sense to us.

Quote

Without exploitation of resources, you wouldn't have access to the computer you're using right now. Are you leading my example and living a simple life in some shack in the mountains with a vegetable garden or are you part of it?


One does not know what one goes without when one has never had it. I'm setting my example in being a parasitic being not contributing to the national GDP, however. Much rather would I wish to have never been born, but alas, the thing closest to that is suicide, which I am sadly incapable of committing myself to.


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#20    Ins0mniac

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Posted 23 October 2007 - 11:36 AM

Seora on Oct 23 2007, 10:12 PM, said:

It does not quite require a governmental power; though it does require a concentration of power. This might just as well be in the hand of any expansionist corporate conglomerate, though it's desire to execute such "reforms" of the human nature would undoubtedly have to be at the hands of a person desiring it so. The same would most likely go for a governmental power as well, it would require a person with alot of power who at whim would carry out the project, possibly in secret for the great populace.



Yeah, I guess that's possible. Hopefully such a person wouldn't mess it up. Changing human nature to fit with how a person thinks we SHOULD be would be very precarious.



Seora on Oct 23 2007, 10:12 PM, said:

Not really, merely hopeful they would be, as they'd realise the fruitlessness of persuing emotional fullfillment and the individual. It is however, as you pointed out, nothing inherit in enlightenment per se. It would more have to do with their biological nature. I'm hoping they'd be made of matter entirely unknown to us, something strange & alluring that makes no sense to us.


Yeah, hopefully. It would be nice. Although, I'm not sure if they could exist from a matter entirely unknown by us. There's only a certain amount of ways you can configure an atom to make a 'stable' element. And if it's not made with atoms, is it really 'matter' or something else?



Seora on Oct 23 2007, 10:12 PM, said:

One does not know what one goes without when one has never had it. I'm setting my example in being a parasitic being not contributing to the national GDP, however. Much rather would I wish to have never been born, but alas, the thing closest to that is suicide, which I am sadly incapable of committing myself to.


Hmmm. It must be depressing to have such thoughts.  sad.gif


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#21    Waspie_Dwarf

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Posted 23 October 2007 - 12:35 PM

Seora and Ins0mniac, as interesting as your conversation maybe you have wandered way off topic. May I remind you that this is the Space and Astronomy forum. If you wish to discuss the pros and cons of various political systems then may I suggest that the World Events & Current Affairs forum would be a more appropriate place?

Edited by Waspie_Dwarf, 23 October 2007 - 12:35 PM.

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