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The thought on time travel


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#46    Universal Absurdity

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Posted 29 February 2004 - 09:36 AM

wanna see something funny on this topic?  link

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43 things

#47    strichar

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Posted 29 February 2004 - 09:44 AM

That is pretty funny.

Avatar Animation done by thBarman. Thanks Barman.

Posted Image
"A man's dreams are an index to his greatness."

-- Cardinal Durand XVIII

The point is to discover that core of uniqueness that is in each of us, that is beyond all social roles and to make that the point from which we act, live, and think in the world.

#48    Xenojjin

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Posted 29 February 2004 - 10:57 PM

  laugh.gif  laugh.gif  laugh.gif  

Posted Image

#49    Cerberus817

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Posted 03 March 2004 - 10:15 PM

Of course time travel exsits - there's no question about it.  As the point has already been made, the easiest means of time travel is looking to the sky.  Think about it though - it takes sun 8 mintues to send us it's wonderful light.  It shows us that distance very much effects time.   We only need to find a way to harness it, and learn how to turn the dials.  Look at jet lag!  Our bodies are not only worn the from trip itself but the traveling in time may leave us often tired or exhausted.  And what about all the reports of people just walking down streets and then finding themself back in time.  I do agree that not all accounts may be creditable but the idea has to flourish from some truth, of course it is to an extent.  
And what about the speeds of sound and light!  Surely these are not the only two senses we have as humans, so maybe there are speeds of all the senses!  There has to be.  Absolutely anything is possible.  And if the gov't is in on all of this, it wouldn't surprise me.  The american government is not involved with the people, it only looks out for the people who work there in those high places.  Ans so they only share amongst themselves. And the way we are sculpted as a society - we can't handle these sort of things.  Outcomes are always chaotic.


#50    aquatus1

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Posted 09 March 2004 - 09:03 PM

According to modern physics, traveling to the future is theoretically possible, in the sense that there is nothing saying we can't do it.  We cannot, however travel to the past.  The only way to time travel is by creating a local time distortion (let's say a phone booth).  As this phone booth approaches the speed of light, it moves faster through time.  It cannot, however, move backwards, because it would approach the time before it began moving backwards, a paradox that would cut off travel to the past before it begun.  The only way to go to the past is to transcend the third dimension, ours, and go into the fourth dimension, in which Time is medium to move through like space is for us.  This would allow us to go back in time in a parallel dimension, and possibly save others from Hitler, but not ourselves.
Time is not a concept, it is a dimension which we can only detect but not influence, in much the same way that 2-dimensional creatures can detect, but not influence the 3rd dimension.


#51    sunfiredreamer

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Posted 10 March 2004 - 02:16 AM

Time Can be Turned Back
by Olga Zharina
03/01/2004 15:37

Time has been one of the most complicated and less studied scientific
issues since ancient times Eight years ago, American and British
scientists who conducted investigations in Antarctica made a
sensational discovery. US physicist Mariann McLein told the
researchers noticed some spinning gray fog in the sky over the pole
on January 27 which they believed to be just ordinary sandstorm.
However, the gray fog did not change the form and did not move in the
course of time. The researchers decided to investigate the phenomenon
and launched a weather balloon with equipment capable to register the
wind speed, the temperature and the air moisture. But the weather
balloon soared upwards and immediately disappeared.

In a little while, the researchers brought the weather balloon back
to the ground with the help of a rope attached to it before. They
were extremely surprised to see that a chronometer set in the weather
balloon displayed the date of January 27, 1965, the same day 30 years
ago. The experiment was repeated several times after the researchers
found out the equipment was in good repair. But each time the watch
was back it displayed the past time. The phenomenon was called "the
time gate" and was reported to the White House.

Today investigation of the unusual phenomenon is underway. It is
supposed that the whirl crater above the South Pole is a tunnel
allowing to penetrate into other times. What is more, programs on
launching people to other times have been started. The CIA and the
FBI are fighting for gaining control over the project that may change
the course of history. It is not clear when the US federal
authorities will approve the experiment.

Famous Russian scientist Nikolay Kozyrev conducted an experiment to
prove that moving from the future to the past was possible. He
substantiated his views with the hypotheses on instant information
spreading through physical characteristics of time. Nikolay Kozyrev
even supposed that "time could execute the work and produce energy."
An American physics theorist has arrived at a conclusion that time is
what existed before existence of the world.

It is known that each of us feels a different course of time under
different conditions. Once lightning hit a mountain-climber; later
the man told he saw the lightning got into his arm, slowly moved
along it, separated the skin from the tissues and carbonized his
cells. He felt as if there were quills of thousands hedgehogs under
his skin.

Russian investigator of anomalous phenomena, philosopher and author
of numerous books Gennady Belimov published his article under the
headline "Time Machine: First Speed On" in the newspaper On the Verge
of Impossible. He described unique experiments conducted by a group
of enthusiasts led by Vadim Chernobrov, the man who began creation of
time machines, devices with electromagnetic pumping in 1987. Today
the group of enthusiasts can slow down
      =>Latest News:

     * Men with no memory
     * Mutual attraction between museums and cats
     * Russia started producing more movies for children
     * Dinosaurs originated from Antarctica?
     * Hermitage Museum opens its branch in Netherlands

or speed up the course of time using special impact of the magnetic
field. The biggest slowing down of time made up 1.5 seconds within an
hour of the equipment's operation in labs.

In August 2001, a new model of the time machine meant for a human was
set in a remote forest in Russia's Volgograd Region. When the machine
even operated on car batteries and had low capacity, it still managed
to change the time by three per cent; the change was registered with
symmetrical crystal oscillators.

At first, the researchers spent five, ten and twenty minutes in the
operating machine; the longest stay lasted for half an hour. Vadim
Chernobrov said that the people felt as if they moved to a different
world; they felt life here and "there" at the same time as if some
space was unfolding. "I cannot define the unusual feelings that we
experienced at such moments."

Neither TV nor radio companies reported the astonishing fact; Gennady
Belimov says the Russian president was not informed of the
experiment. However, he tells that already under Stalin there was a
Research Institute of the Parallel World. Results of experiments
conducted by Academicians Kurchatov and Ioffe can be now found in the
archives. In 1952, head of the Soviet secret police organization
Lavrenty Beria initiated a case against researchers participating in
the experiments, as a result of which 18 professors were executed by
shooting and 59 candidates and doctors of physical sciences were sent
to camps. The Institute recommenced its activity under Khruschev. But
an experimental stand with eight leading researchers disappeared in
1961, and buildings close to the one where experiments were conducted
were ruined. After that, the Communist Party political bureau and the
Council of Ministers decided to suspend researchers of the Institute
for an uncertain period.

The program was resumed in 1987 when the Institute already functioned
on the territory of the Soviet Union. A tragedy occurred on August
30, 1989: an extremely strong explosion sounded at the Institute's
branch office on the Anjou islands. The explosion destroyed not only
the experimental module of 780 tons but also the archipelago itself
that covered the area of 2 square kilometers. According to one of the
versions of the tragedy, the module with three experimenters collided
with a large object, probably an asteroid, in the parallel world or
heading toward the parallel world. Having lost its propulsion system,
the module probably remained in the parallel world.

The last record made in the framework of the experiment and kept at
the Institute archives says: "We are dying but keep on conducting the
experiment. It is very dark here; we see all objects become double,
our hands and legs are transparent, we can see veins and bones
through the skin. The oxygen supply will be enough for 43 hours, the
life support system is seriously damaged. Our best regards to the
families and friends!" Then the transmission suddenly stopped.
--------------------------------------------------------------

NAMASTE


And so my question (to the original poster of this topic) is this, ....how do you know time has not already been altered, or that it isn't constantly altered...Time travel rules out God, and gives conspiricy theroists a "stiffy" (please don't delete this post for that)

~sunfiredreamer
TADARAKA DAREBESA

My gift is my song, and she sings so sweetly
The stars are my love, and she doth complete me.


The only sin is the projected perception of such a thing
The only unnatural act is the one which cannot be commited - Oscar Wilde

If we all gave up on the only thing worth fighting for,
       then we would ceace to fight

#52    Fox Mulder

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Posted 10 March 2004 - 03:58 AM

I think that before time travel is possible a way must be developed to make timetravellers entirely undectable...i.e invisible. Their very presence in a time other than the present could have catastrophic effects.  They need to be able to walk around in the new time period and make absolutly no impression on it whatso ever.

Time travel sounds way cool, but pretty risky too.   blink.gif  thumbsup.gif
  

Oh, i have friends all right...they just dont like me very much...

#53    sunfiredreamer

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Posted 10 March 2004 - 06:17 PM

yes, invisible time travelers would be kool. How about this, I will figure out how to do it, then in about thirty five years or so, i'll come back and put up a post before you "without anybody ever knowing it hadn't been there before". What do you think? whistling2.gif  

My gift is my song, and she sings so sweetly
The stars are my love, and she doth complete me.


The only sin is the projected perception of such a thing
The only unnatural act is the one which cannot be commited - Oscar Wilde

If we all gave up on the only thing worth fighting for,
       then we would ceace to fight

#54    sunfiredreamer

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Posted 10 March 2004 - 06:19 PM

OMG, it worked... but before; it was Seraphina that replied... hmmm, anyone else remember?  thumbsup.gif  

My gift is my song, and she sings so sweetly
The stars are my love, and she doth complete me.


The only sin is the projected perception of such a thing
The only unnatural act is the one which cannot be commited - Oscar Wilde

If we all gave up on the only thing worth fighting for,
       then we would ceace to fight

#55    Druidus

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Posted 11 March 2004 - 12:47 AM

I don't know if it's been said already but if hitler had never risen to power, who would have opposed Stalin?  Read this piece of speculative fiction:



          " There is no avoiding war; it can only be postponed
                      to the advantage of others "

                        ~ Niccolò Machiavelli


The Events that set it into motion 60 years ago:


1. Introduction:


May, 1945.  The end of World War II.  The defeat of Adolph Hitler and the destruction
of Germany.  The flight of the Enola Gay over Hiroshima and Nagasaki.  The surrender
of Japan.  The extermination of over 6 million Jewish people and several hundreds of
thousands of other people that were marked for death by the Nazi ideology.  5 years
of war that ravaged the European continent, drew the United States of America into a
massive naval battle against Japan, caused the first nuclear strikes in history and
resulted in the loss of over 30 million human lives.

Up to here, reality as we know it and the reality of the alternate Universe are completely parallel... Until 1949, 4 years after the end of the se-
cond World War.  During this year, in a classified military research facility at
Trinity, New Mexico, a chain of events was set into motion that separated our reality from that of the alternate Universe.  The person who was responsible was a man known
as Albert Einstein.



2. The Paradox Equation:

A genius mathematician, scientist, and theorist who lived in the early part of the
20th Century created the theory of Relativity and in doing so became the first human
being to gain an understanding of the fabric of the Space -Time Continuum.  His name
was Albert Einstein.  A man considered to be one of the greatest thinkers in the
field of science, mathematics and philosophy in the 20th Century, and quite possibly
throughout human history.  One of his more famous theories was the equation of e=mc2
(energy = matter x the speed of light2 ), proving that all energy is made up of light
and matter.  This knowledge would eventually lead to the "Manhattan Project" and
resulted in the creation of the first nuclear weapons, the most powerful form of
weaponry ever to be created by humans.  It was this, as well as many other theories
which led to the birth of a new science called "Quantum Physics", the complex study
of matter, energy, light and the bases of all life - the atom.  Later on in his life,
Einstein was allowed the opportunity to work with a very famous man named Nikola Tesla.
Tesla was the leading scientist in the field of electricity at the time, so to Albert
Einstein, it was a great notability for his career, as well as Tesla's.  At a certain
point in time however, when they met, they were approached by the United States go-
vernment to undergo a Black Project, which would later become known as the ominous
Philadelphia Experiment.  The reason for the advance by the United States government
was, in-part, due to the research that both Einstein and Tesla conducted together,
during their brief meetings.  Einstein came up with the Unified Field Theory, which
spoke of the ability to jam certain types of radar, thereby making objects become
invisible.  It would be some time later in the late 1970's and early 1980's that the
United States Air Force would complete this device, which would be code-named "Athena."
It had the potential to eliminate the radar bands which would be hitting the plane,
by sending back a return signature of the given radar band.  However, the project
would be dropped due to lack of funding.  The reason why Tesla was chosen as the se-
cond leading scientist along with Albert Einstein was due to his knowledge and insight
in generating a large amount of electricity with little or no effort.  The United
States Office of Naval Research would eventually hire both of them to conduct an expe-
riment to try and make an object invisible to radar as well as actual sight.  On June
12, 1939, the Navy prepared seven gigantic Tesla Coils and configured them according
the calculations of Einstein's theory of Relativity and beamed them towards the USS
Eldridge, a medium-sized battle cruiser berthed just outside Philadelphia.  The re-
sults of the experiment were as stunning as they were awesome.  The ship would vanish
completely for about seven to ten minutes.  When the ship reappeared, Naval research-
ers and scientists would discover the horrific results of the experiment.  Several
members of the crew were found decapitated and some seemed to have actually materia-
lised as a part of the ship's hull, partly embedded into it's structure.  It appeared
that the experiment had caused a complete breakdown of the Einstein suggested Space -
Time continuum.

Einstein would be forced to rethink his theory and write a very lengthy report on what
occurred in the Black Project.  It would be some years later, that he would again work
with his Unified Field Theory.  Yet instead of making an object invisible, he decided
to put the theory of time-traveling to the test.  Experimenting with ideas of using a
large magnetic field and electricity to generate a small, controllable wormhole, he
soon learned of the power and complexity of creating a rip in the fabric of time and
space.  It would take many grueling years working with colleagues and deciphering the
multifaceted equation which would reveal how to slow down time and create the possi-
bility of traveling backwards through it.  It also would lead to the explanation of
what exactly occurred during the Philadelphia Experiment in 1939.  After some years,
he was able to create a device which could be considered a "Time Machine" based on the
theories of wormholes, black holes, magnets, and electricity.  The name of the theory,
which he would endow upon time traveling, would be "Chronoshifting."  It would later
be defined as "the ability of shifting from one place to another in a certain time
window.".  Thus Einstein named his "Time Machine" the "ChronoSphere."

Then it suddenly began to become clear that Einstein was having a second agenda that
no-one was aware of.  He apparently reached the final stages of the research and com-
pleted the ChronoSphere device independently with the aid of only one of his most
trusted assistants, without any knowledge of either his team or the supervisors of
the project.  The location was Trinity, New Mexico.  The date was sometime in the year
1949.  It would be this independent action of Albert Einstein to initiate the experi-
ment on his own, that would separate our dimension from the Command And Conquer Uni-
verse.  Einstein's motives are unclear, and we must consider the fact that this man's
intelligence far out ways that of our own.  Therefore, it will never truly be under-
stood why he committed these acts.  Nevertheless, the most plausible explanation is a
humane one.  World War II had cost an amount of human lives so numerous that no person
can truly comprehend the consequences for those involved.  It had caused severe damage
to an entire continent, led to the creation and utilization of the most dreadful form
of weaponry ever to be created and it brought a number of ideologies to the human mind
that manifested themselves as both highly regenerative and severely hazardous to world
peace.  Therefore, we must consider the possibility that when Einstein realized he had
the ability of accomplishing time-travel, he decided to use it to prevent the horror
of World War II of ever taking place.  In order to accomplish this aim, Einstein knew
that there was only one way: take away the source out of the course of history.  His
Prime Directive was to eliminate Adolph Hitler and halt World War II.  By doing this,
the Jews would not suffer from the concentration camps in Europe, the naval war be-
tween America and Japan could be avoided and the releasing of the atom bomb on Hiro-
shima and Nagasaki would've never happened.  The only way to do this was to disrupt
the historical timeline and come into contact with Hitler himself.  When the "Time-
Traveler" would meet Hitler, the history of mankind would be changed, thus elimina-
ting the existence of Hitler and ensuring the survival of all those who both directly
as well as indirectly suffered under his destructive terror.  That "Time-Traveler"
would be Einstein.  Throughout the course of World War II history, there was both
only one place and time where Einstein would be able to come into personal contact
with Adolph Hitler.  A time when Hitler had not risen to power and a place where his
exact whereabouts were completely confirmed.  The place was Landsberg, Germany.  The
time was somewhere in 1924, when Hitler was released from custody after his initial
coup on the German government several years back.  By the laws of Quantum Physics,
any entity that is in a state of Space-Time Continuum flux had to avoid physical
contact with any entity native to the visited timeline.  If any physical contact be-
tween the fluxuating entity and the native entity would happen, the theorized effect
was something defined as a "Temporal Paradox".  This "Paradox" would result in the
immediate Space - Time restoration of the fluxuating entity, but cause a complete
dimensional dislocation of the native entity.  Apparently, Albert Einstein was very
aware of this, and knew that all that had to be done to accomplish his mission was
to somehow establish physical contact with Adolph Hitler.

Somewhere in Trinity, New Mexico in the year 1949, The ChronoSphere was activated by
Einstein's unidentified assistant and Einstein found himself standing in front of...

A prison in Landsberg, Germany, 1924.

Then the moment arrived.  A young man stepped out of the prison door.  Einstein walked
toward him and said in German: "Herr Hitler!". (Mister Hitler!)  The young man turned
around, looked at him and answered: "Ja?  Was ist loos?  Ich habe keine Zeit um hier
rund zu stehen.".  (Yes?  What is it?  I don't have time to be standing around
here.)  In which Einstein prophetically replied:  "Ja.... ich ferstehe."  (Yes...
I know / I understand)  Then he held out his hand towards Hitler as to invite him to
shake hands.  Hitler did so, and in touching Einstein, the theory of the Temporal
Paradox became true.  Einstein returned to 1949 New Mexico.  Adolph Hitler had never
even existed.  It would be this fateful day that changed the history of mankind for-
ever.

As Einstein found himself in the ChronoSphere laboratory again, he found his assis-
tant waiting there for him.  Realizing that due to their proximity to the ChronoSphere
they had some minutes left before being integrated into the new timeline themselves,
a short conversation took place in the ChronoSphere laboratory.  A room that had be-
come unreal, as for those last few moments, it was all that was left of the timeline
that we tend to call reality.  The assistant asked "....did you find him?", in which
Einstein slowly replied: "Hitler is... out of the way...".  The anxiety on the assis-
tants's face was obvious: "Congratulations professor!  With Hitler removed...!".  But
he never got to finish the sentence.  Einstein raised his hand which silenced his
assistant.  While looking at his old pocket watch, which was apparently going berserk,
he spoke the final words of our reality.


            " Time will tell...sooner or later...time will tell... "

                   ~ Albert Einstein, 1949 Trinity, New Mexico





3.  The Great World War II


After the completion of Einstein mission, a great many things had changed.  GPS exis-
ting in the 1950'ies.  The sophistication of rockets understood within 10 years.  Satel-
lites, super computers, etc...  All accomplished before the 1960'ies arrived.  One of
the many examples of the changes was the Philadelphia Experiment turning out to be a
success, and in turn, the United States Government declassified the project and passed
it out to countries who were in the United Nations.  But most importantly, World War 2
had never taken place.  Einstein went out to accomplish the impossible, and succeeded.
Yet, in those final moments in the Space - Time isolated lab, he had a feeling his
work was not done correctly and there might be some drastic consequences in what he
did.  This terrifying notion came when he gazed at his pocket watch after returning
from his trip.  He noticed that the watch had been going haywire and that on his watch,
time itself had stopped.  But it was his own ironic statement which he said to his as-
sistant that would haunt him in those last moments.

" Time will tell...sooner or later...time will tell... "

The reason for this remark will forever remain a mystery, but deep down inside, Einstein seemed to think that what he had done was a horrible mistake and that mankind
as he knew it may be in grave danger.

In the early 1950'ies, the already established United Nations noticed that the Soviet Union was becoming a Super Power in the world and was beginning to build up a vast
army, as well as progress in the technological field faster than anyone ever imagined.
Within a few short years, the Soviets were able to break the speed of sound and have
the capability of launching a nuclear warhead.  Under the rule of Stalin, the Soviet-
Union would undergo a drastic change as they began to build up in strength and inteligence.  There was a purpose though, and that would soon be announced to the world
when Stalin would launch the first of a series of attacks on Europe.  Although Hitler
was gone, Stalin still remained.  He would take his place in the role of historical
global conquest, and would be far worse in military strength, determination, quantity
of troops, and especially the quality of his war technology.  The intensity of war
would reach its peak as the Soviet-Union blanketed most of Eastern Europe in an
"Iron Curtain."  This war between the Soviet-Union and the Allied European Nations
would later be known as...

" The Great World War II. "



4. Fight for Freedom


By the time Einstein realized his mistake of interfering with the natural Timeline,
it was already too late.  The effects of the ChronoSphere wore off and he himself and
his assistant were integrated into the new timeline, completely unaware of what they
had once done.  The Iron Curtain began to fall upon all of Europe and the Allies (the
military unification of the beleaguered European Nations) were left with a bigger
problem then they could have ever anticipated.  Unlike Hitler's concentration camps
and mass killings, Stalin decided to take all of Europe by sheer force.  Hitler and
the Axis Power had taken about 1/4 of Europe in World War II.  In this "Great World
War II," Stalin would take approximately 3/4 of Europe, leaving only England and some
other countries in the wake of the destruction.  The Chaos Theory had taken place.
It would take some time before the Allies would realize the power which the Soviet-
Union possessed.  The fight for the freedom of Europe from the Soviets had begun but
it might already be too late, as the United Nations was reluctant to come to the aid
of the European allies into a war that could turn worldwide very easily.

Einstein's plan to avoid a worldwide armed conflict was a failure, as all of Europe
was under Red Alert.  The Soviets had a powerful army and air force, consisting of
MiGs, Tanks, and V2 Rocket Launchers.  Their quality, as well as their
quantity, was the best in the world at the time.  The European Allies (under the
brilliant command of German General Gunther Von Esling and Greek Colonel Nikos
Stavros) would prove to be a worthy adversary however, as they managed to battle the
Soviet invaders for many months regardless the unimaginable losses of lives and
territory, desperately trying to get the "neutral" United Nations on their side
against Stalin.  Having the genius of the Albert Einstein of the new timeline
available to them, they would be able to use many new technological devices that
would highly aid in the war.  The Chronoshift technology, which was indirectly re-
sponsable for the entire situation, was an example of this, as it helped outsmart-
ing the power of the Soviet war machine.

Eventually, due to the near heroism of the European Allies in holding ground against
the Soviet seat of power, and due to the fact that the United Nations became aware
that Europe was just the first step in Stalin's eyes, several of the world's most
powerful nations including the United States of America, India and Japan turned
against the Soviet-Union and allied themselves with the European defenders.  After
several months, the Allies finally broke through the last lines of Soviet defenses
and Stalin was killed in the last siege on Moscow.

The surviving Allies would win the war, realizing that their victory had cost them
all but their lives.  Europe was completely decimated.  Over 100 million human li-
ves were lost.

After this great disaster in Europe, a secret organization would be formed by the
United Nations to deal with terrorism and to stop another incident like the Great
War from ever occurring again.


             " When you kill one... it is a tragedy; when you kill a
                       million ... it is a statistic. "

                              ~ Josef Stalin




                ______________________________________________________




Additional Information:

The following section contains specific and detailed information about the prime
armed factions involved in The Great World War II; The European Allies and the
Soviet-Union.


I. The Alliance of Democratic Nations:


Commonly known as the Allies, they consisted of Britain, Germany, France, Italy,
Greece, Turkey, Spain, and a number of other Western and Northern European nations.
Formed to defend Europe against the tyranny of the Soviet-Union, the Allies ground
units consisted of small, guerilla style units and mid-level armor units.  The naval
power of the Allies was incredible however, as it was based primarily off of the
awesome fleets of Britain and Scandinavia.  However, the Soviets managed to steal
the submarine designs when they captured Berlin, and sub technology gave them a
slight balance.  It has been recently disclosed that the United States did supply
the Allies with some technology during the war, such as the Apache Longbow and the
M1 tank which the Allies dubbed the "Medium Tank".  The battles of Great World War
II were intense.  Many a time the Allies were heavily outgunned and outnumbered.
But several highly skilled Allied commanders held through with superior tactics,
guerilla style warfare and sabotage missions.  Some of the more famous battles were
the rescues of Einstein and of Tanya Adams (a female guerilla expert who defined
the way commandos work today), the collapse of Germany and Greece, the defending of
the first operational ChronoSphere prototype and finally the attack on Moscow itself.

After the defeat of the Soviet-Union, leaders of the Allied nations and the Soviet-
Union met at the United Nations Headquarters in New York to write a peace treaty.
The first condition was that the Soviet-Union must be dissolved back into the
nations it was before the Russian Revolution known as "Red October".  The next was
the destruction of the Communist party and the execution of the high military
officers and political officials that were still alive.  Only one, supposedly
Stalin's personal advisor, was unaccounted for.  The only records that proved he
existed were some documents and records signed by Stalin himself addressed to a man
called "Kane".  The third condition was that all military technology be turned over
to the Allies and the UN.  Fanatical Russian nationalists destroyed some of the
high-level technology of the Soviet-Union, chiefly the Heavy and Mammoth Tank con-
struction techniques.  The fourth condition was that Russia itself would for ten
years be under total control of the UN.  After those ten years Russia would regain
self rule but had to act in accordance with the UN until the year 2000.  Russian
leaders eagerly accepted the treaty, as resisting it would mean the disbanding of
Russia itself and the placing of the remnants at the hands of Allied nations that
still bore grudges.  The UN was slow to bring the world the defense force it had
promised in The Great World War II, so the Alliance stayed active and made the
agreement with the UN to disband only when the UN stated its world task force.  The
UN found this as a fair compromise, and the Alliance (similar to the NATO except
used more often) remained as the unofficial "protectors" of the planet.  However,
when The Brotherhood Of Nod violently appeared in the early 1990'ies with members
of all thinkable nationalities, it was recognized that it was politically too
dangerous for a European based military organization to directly interfere with Nod
activities.  Thus the UN decided to finish their efforts and wrote the UNGDA.  The
Allies dissolved, replaced by the Global Defense Initiative on October 12, 1995.




Known Facts about the Alliance of Democratic Nations -

Ratified - Generally the accepted date is that of the first Soviet acts of aggression
           against the European Democratic states in 1953.

Disbanded - Replaced by the Global Defense Initiative on October 12, 1995.

Ideology - To resist Soviet aggression against any first and second world powers.
           Uphold ideals defined in World Association of Nations charter.

Official Supreme Commander during GWWII - German General Gunther Von Esling, Supreme
                                          Commander of Allied Forces.

Former Base of Operations - Headquarters of Unified Operations: London.  Northern
                            Theatre: Oslo.  Southern Theatre: Madrid.

Former Military Strength - Enlisted forces of about 3.4 million.  Non-regular forces,
                           including guerrilla and resistance forces, about 1.7
                           million.  Armament classified per DEFCOM document 177.4,
                           Allied Defense Regulations.  [Records listed are statis-
                           tics taken before the war.]

Former Economic Strength - Information never released.  Was to be declassified by
                           the end of the First Tiberium War, but the Tiberium assi-
                           milation of Earth's ecosystems causing a dislocation of
                           most of human civilization as well as the destruction
                           caused by The Brotherhood Of Nod resulted in a loss of
                           the data.  Historical researchers are working on recalcu-
                           lating.

Former Political Strength - Not Applicable.  Operated as a modified Military Junta.

Former Affiliations - United Nations, Russia.

See Also - Einstein, A.: "A History of Allied Weaponry."; Fort, Charles A.:
           "F-Invasions and Telemetry", General Gunther von Esling, Colonel Nikos
           Stavros.




_____________________________




II. The Union of Soviet Socialist Republics:


When the Communist-based Soviet-Union was first created in 1922, many western coun-
tries feared it because of the anti-capitalistic propaganda it fed to the easily
influenced masses.  The same year the Treaty of Rapallo was reformed to help secure
the Soviet-Union and to re-strengthen Germany after its devastation during the first
World War.  Things went relatively well, but there was notion of a new political
movement in Germany which was known as the National Socialistic party or Nazi party.
This German political movement was highly nationalistic and highly anti-Communist,
which gained them a great number of supporters among the German population and the
sympathies of the catholic church which regarded the Nazi's as defenders of the
faith against the increasing influence of the godless Communists.  However, due to
a series of violent acts against Jewish German civilians and due to regular internal
conflicts, the Nazi party fell apart around 1926 due to the lack of efficient orga-
nisation and a leading figure capable of unifying them and their ideas.  After the
collapse of the Nazi party, Germany became much more democratic, and relations with
the rest of Western Europe had improved greatly.  However, with the Nazi's official-
ly disbanding, one of their members proclaimed through the media that he suspected
Communist infiltration to be the main reason for their breakdown.  Because of this
politically sensitive statement, tensions began to arise between Germany and the
Soviet-Union.  Eventually, the diplomatic relations between the two nations soared
and the Treaty of Rapallo was repealed.

With the rebuilding of Germany, and the already powerful Britain and France, the
United States decided to launch a global program to act as the sovereign voice on
major matters.  The nations of Western Europe and North America also welcomed the
Communists to join, mainly because it was an attempt to unify the world.  Stalin
and other Communist leaders decided to observe to see what the UN was really about.
The Communists were initially pleased to see actual attempts to stop world problems
like the offset of the ecosystem.  But nothing could stop the total breakdown be-
tween German and Soviet relations that was already happening.

The Soviet-Union was shocked by Germany's turning away.  It was also offended by the
repeal of the Treaty of Rapallo.  Soviet political leaders threatened military action
against Germany if it did not formally apologize to the Soviet-Union and allow Com-
Intern (Communist International Party) to be allowed in the country again.  Germany
agreed to the apology, but it realized ComIntern was essentially a Soviet political
platform designed to dislocate capitalistic countries, so the allowance of any Commu-
nist or Socialist party in Germany itself was absolutely refused.  When the Soviets
appeared true to their warning and began to mobilize, the other Western European
nations reacted by forming the Alliance of Democratic Nations, a military junta
similar to the NATO that stated if one nation was attacked by a non-European aggres-
sor, all would fight together.  The Allies warned the Soviets to stand down so a
peaceful settlement could be arranged.  Stalin, however, was too enraged at Germany
and kept pushing towards it.  When the Soviets finally invaded Poland and started
moving further west into Europe, all nations in the Alliance declared war on the
Soviet-Union.   The Great World War II had begun.

The Soviets' technology was more brute force than finesse.  Although they did manage
to build submarines, that technology, like their V2 rockets, were originally German
designs.  The Soviet-Union managed to capture that technology before the Allies could
even build the first prototypes.  Their own Tesla Coil and Mammoth Tank were further
proof of this.  For the first half of the war, the Reds were on the offensive, attack-
ing Eastern Europe with fourteen tank divisions, while the Allies only had three
divisions mobilized.  With such a small force for defense, the important countries of
Germany and Greece were easy targets for the Soviet-Union.  Guerilla fighting still
raged all throughout Greece, with MiG bombers destroying much of Athens, including
the Acropolis, to be replaced by Soviet structures when appropriate forces arrived.
Meanwhile, the battle was taken to the Aegean Sea, where Allied naval forces dealt a
major blow to the Soviet's high tech Iron Curtain project.  The war entered an extre-
mely critical stage when a high ranking Soviet officer who disagreed with Stalin's
nuclear policies defected to the Alliance and revealed that at least four 500 Kiloton
nuclear warheads were in production and were to be used against the major cities of
Europe, including London and Paris.  A strike team was sent in an attempt to shut
down the Soviet Nuclear program, but failed.  The warheads were operational and were
launched at Leningrad (currently St. Petersburg) from the Central Command at the Krem-
lin.  In an operation that made the history books, a team of "special volunteers"
under the command of a female commando called Tanya Adams infiltrated the nuclear pro-
duction facilities and managed to disarm the warheads while in mid-flight towards
their targets.  The warheads crashed down on the surface of the targeted cities and
were destroyed during the impact, never detonating.  The Alliance made it through
its darkest hour alive.


" If those bombs had gone off... well, let's just say that those of us left would
           all be learning how to speak Russian just about now. "

      ~ Supreme Allied Commander General Gunther Von Esling, 1954


After word got out that the Soviet-Union attempted a quadruple nuclear strike at Euro-
pe, the United Nations and thus the other major powers in the world came out of their
"neutral" chairs.  Recognizing the near heroism of the Allied forces in protecting
Europe from an overwhelmingly powerful and aggressive adversaries and recognizing the
immense danger that the Soviet-Union had become to the free world, the United States
of America, India and Japan joined the war.  This fact, combined with Allied success
in halting both Soviet super weapon projects, and their own ChronoSphere device fully
operational, the Alliance knew that the time had finally come to commence a major
offensive into the USSR.  Alliance warships, under the command of the British Royal
Navy, began pushing up the major waterways like the Volga River.  Backed by UN rein-
forcements, Allied forces began retaking Germany, Greece, Turkey and Poland, and
started moving into Russia itself.  Allied Supreme Commander General Von Esling used
blitzkrieg warfare to slice through the western blockade.  During the onslaught, the
Soviets managed to get the Iron Curtain technology back online in a last ditch attempt
to push the Allies back.  Unfortunately for them, their Leningrad research installa-
tion and all plans for the Iron Curtain were destroyed.  Soon the Allies were knocking
on Stalin's front door, and even the last operational Iron Curtain device wasn't
enough to stop the Alliance.  Soon Moscow flew the Alliance flag, and in the rubble,
Allied troops discovered the body of Stalin, gagged and buried.  Apparently he might
have lived, but someone else got to him first and strangled him.  No one knew who was
responsable for Stalin's death until none other than Allied Colonel Nikos Stavros ad-
mitted to it over twenty years later.  Also on the Allied agenda of investigation was
the discrepancy of the record of a man named Kane, apparently Stalin's most trusted
advisor.  His body was never found, but it wasn't until the next generation of people
would we know why...



Known Facts about the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics -

Ratified - Officially created in 1922 by the Communist Party in Russia.

Disbanded - At the end of the Great World War II, during the Treaty Of New York,
            which split the Soviet-Union into Russia, Ukraine, Belorussia, and other
            independent states.

Ideology - According to Stalin, the birthright of the Soviet Empire was nothing less
           than conquering and dominating the entire globe.  And the birthright of
           Josef Stalin himself was nothing less than conquering the spirit and domi-
           nating the actions of every Soviet citizen.

Head of State during GWWII - Josef Stalin.

Former Base of Operations - Entire Euro-Asian peninsula.  Command posts identified
                            in Moscow, Kiev, Stalingrad, Khartoum, Karachi and Da
                            Nang.

Former Military Strength - Enlisted forces exceed 14 million.  Non-regular forces,
                           including police and NKVD, about 7 million.  [Records
                           listed are statistics taken before the war.]

Former Economic Strength - Considerable operating assets believed to be in excess of
                           486.2 billion Swiss Francs.  [Records listed are statistics
                           taken before the war.]

Former Political Strength - Because every single person in the Soviet-Union was a
                            member of the Communist Party, an incredible agent network
                            of over 200 million citizens infiltrated the governments
                            of most Pan African, Pan Indian and Pan Asian governments
                            with suspected strongholds in Mexico City and Vancouver.
                            The Socialist/Communist subversions of those countries was
                            a primary political strength as it turned many a country
                            away from the Alliance.  The efforts of achieving world-
                            wide Communism were controlled by the Communist Interna-
                            tional party, commonly known as ComIntern.

Former Affiliations - World Democratic Society, Asian Defense League, Freedom Consor-
                      tium, Communist Political Contingency (CPC), Communist Interna-
                      tional party (ComIntern).

See Also - Henderson, D.K. and Chou, K.L.: "Soviet Terrorist Activities", Treaty Of
           New York, Russia, other former Soviet states.


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#56    DC09

DC09

    Poltergeist

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Posted 11 March 2004 - 12:50 AM

QUOTE (Druidus @ Mar 10 2004, 07:47 PM)
I don't know if it's been said already but if hitler had never risen to power, who would have opposed Stalin?  


Interesting.
If you like history what-ifs try reading some Harry Turtledove novels.  thumbsup.gif  





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