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How many of you can get to the starting line?


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#256    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 01:53 PM

View Postnopeda, on 16 January 2013 - 07:18 PM, said:

You brought up a very significant aspect. With all the stars out there it's almost certain there are beings who are traveling to different star systems. The bigger question is whether any have been to this one or not.

This is a question of massive proportions.

Saying NO might not be accepable in majority of population since MEDIA ( internet,newspapers,TV and radio ) made its case by posting various material on this subject thus people created image that every second strange thing in the sky is UFO... even when that "ufo" is airplane,aerial phenomena or something manmade.

By saying YES ( with a proof or firm evidence of such ) would change world fundamentally. I can only say it like that because it would affect so many things in our lives that people couldn't even start to comprehend such an answer.

Yes we know people have reported UFO practically everywhere on earth or skies...i have seen massive number of videos and footage of such things, well i like being in the flow with current information stream. And i came to conclusion that we don't have evidence a firm proof of ETI visiting our planet, we do have  loads of sighting reports, which means something was going on or still is..this is irrefutable fact.

So it all comes down to a simple mental subject... belief.. and it will stay like that until offical contact is made and reported on global scale.

I can say from my perspective i've seen footage that is just out there...simply cannot be explained by human mind...UFOs, most of those which in my opinion were very real looked like some sort of science fiction craft. In some cases the craft deployed another smaller craft and main part flew away while smaller one did some sort of survey ( that is just speculation, i don't have a firm idea of what it was doing ). At one time there was event with some sort of a probe observed at sea, which was just hovering there while crew recoreded it, what it was doing i don't have a clue but entire thing looked very spooky...

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#257    quillius

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 01:57 PM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 17 January 2013 - 01:51 PM, said:

It's just as frustrating for those more skeptical when, more often than not, the "bar" for what constitutes evidence for the existance of ET's having been here appears to have been lowered to a point beyond ridiculous. And the oft touted "starting line", particularly in this thread, would not be explaining how or when ET's got here but that they exist FIRST. Otherwise it's just another case of putting the cart before the horse.

cormac

ok granted that is putting the cart before the horse, however I would imagine it depends if you are convinced they are/have been here which by default means they exist, so naturally you now look for when, how and why


#258    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:03 PM

View PostDingoLingo, on 17 January 2013 - 02:54 AM, said:


so lets see..

UFO's seen in the sky - blurry photo's of a fake ufo.. - No hard evidence - FACT - FALSE
People meeting aliens - testimonies of different aliens - No hard evidence - FACT - FALSE
Crashed UFO's - testimonies from people who have seen it. Odd things put forward as Alien - No hard evidence - FACT _ dont know about that one
Government Coverup's of UFO's - again testimonies .. supposed reports.. and I could go on.. - again No hard evidence - FACT- FALSE
Ancient Aliens - there is a nice long thread on this which to be honest.. shows there is nothing in this at all so - No hard evidence - FACT_FACT

So you see.. there is no hard evidence of ufo's.. there never has been..

There is plenty of evidence which might SUGGEST ET activity you are just simply ignoring it... i don't believe it either but it does SUGGEST that something is happening... From radar images to NOT blury pictures and video which clearly show something strange. You deny everything on this topic while others take it in consideration.    i'll search for the event i said earlier about that thing at sea...

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#259    Valdemar the Great

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:04 PM

View Postquillius, on 17 January 2013 - 11:41 AM, said:

good, I am glad we agree on the FACT UFO's are real......as for what they are, well......I know what they are not.....Venus :alien: :tu:
Balloons.

Edited by Lord Vetinari, 17 January 2013 - 02:04 PM.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

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#260    Valdemar the Great

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:08 PM

View PostNuke_em, on 17 January 2013 - 01:53 PM, said:

This is a question of massive proportions.

Saying NO might not be accepable in majority of population since MEDIA ( internet,newspapers,TV and radio ) made its case by posting various material on this subject thus people created image that every second strange thing in the sky is UFO... even when that "ufo" is airplane,aerial phenomena or something manmade.

By saying YES ( with a proof or firm evidence of such ) would change world fundamentally. I can only say it like that because it would affect so many things in our lives that people couldn't even start to comprehend such an answer.

Yes we know people have reported UFO practically everywhere on earth or skies...i have seen massive number of videos and footage of such things, well i like being in the flow with current information stream. And i came to conclusion that we don't have evidence a firm proof of ETI visiting our planet, we do have  loads of sighting reports, which means something was going on or still is..this is irrefutable fact.

So it all comes down to a simple mental subject... belief.. and it will stay like that until offical contact is made and reported on global scale.

I can say from my perspective i've seen footage that is just out there...simply cannot be explained by human mind...UFOs, most of those which in my opinion were very real looked like some sort of science fiction craft. In some cases the craft deployed another smaller craft and main part flew away while smaller one did some sort of survey ( that is just speculation, i don't have a firm idea of what it was doing ). At one time there was event with some sort of a probe observed at sea, which was just hovering there while crew recoreded it, what it was doing i don't have a clue but entire thing looked very spooky...
The thing that I think is, the standard explanations are often just unsatisfactory; there are so many flaws in the "secret military aircraft" explanation that it really wouldn't stand up for a moment, and easy explanations like "balloon" or "Lighthouses" for some of the best known cases still don't answer all the questions. People seem to say that "Well, we know that secret military aircraft exist, so therefore they must be more likely", or "we know there was a Lighthouse, so I'm going to say that that's what it was", and just don't seem to worry about any of the questions that remain, now that they've decided that that's the explanation.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#261    quillius

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:09 PM

View PostLord Vetinari, on 17 January 2013 - 02:04 PM, said:

Balloons.

santa :santa:


#262    cormac mac airt

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:21 PM

View Postquillius, on 17 January 2013 - 01:57 PM, said:

ok granted that is putting the cart before the horse, however I would imagine it depends if you are convinced they are/have been here which by default means they exist, so naturally you now look for when, how and why

Assuming the conclusion is not how one gets others to believe them. Presenting verifiable evidence in support of same IS. If one is convinced of their existance here before the facts then it's not a matter of it being a fact, it's a matter of belief. The belief in ET's being/having been here don't interest me, nor many others I'd imagine. The facts however DO interest me. Yet so far there are none.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#263    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:24 PM

This is it, it starts at 15.00 and it most certainly isnt a ballon if it were it would fly high to the sky since it would follow the steam of warm air, but this object just hovers there.

You can watch entire thing, some really good footage in there even if something else was hoaxed i don't think the object in question was...

Link

This guy Dennis has more similar videos on hes channel, i liked maybe 2 or 3 everything else is not in my interest.

Edited by Nuke_em, 17 January 2013 - 02:24 PM.

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#264    Valdemar the Great

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:27 PM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 17 January 2013 - 02:21 PM, said:

Assuming the conclusion is not how one gets others to believe them. Presenting verifiable evidence in support of same IS. If one is convinced of their existance here before the facts then it's not a matter of it being a fact, it's a matter of belief. The belief in ET's being/having been here don't interest me, nor many others I'd imagine. The facts however DO interest me. Yet so far there are none.

cormac
Do you apply the same stringent criteria to explanations for UFO cases, as mentioned above, or are you happy to follow the principle of "we know that Lighthouses (or secret Aircraft) exist, so that's good enough for me (and never mind any questions there may be about that as an explanation)"?

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#265    quillius

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:27 PM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 17 January 2013 - 02:21 PM, said:

Assuming the conclusion is not how one gets others to believe them. Presenting verifiable evidence in support of same IS. If one is convinced of their existance here before the facts then it's not a matter of it being a fact, it's a matter of belief. The belief in ET's being/having been here don't interest me, nor many others I'd imagine. The facts however DO interest me. Yet so far there are none.

cormac

ok try this.

20 people in a field, they all see a UFO land, three aliens get out of craft and communicate in strange language, they get back in craft and vanish. NO one speaks to eachother until after writing down a statement, the statements are all very similar.

Belief or fact?

fact but they cannot present it as such therefore does it go back to belief?


#266    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:28 PM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 17 January 2013 - 02:21 PM, said:

Assuming the conclusion is not how one gets others to believe them. Presenting verifiable evidence in support of same IS. If one is convinced of their existance here before the facts then it's not a matter of it being a fact, it's a matter of belief. The belief in ET's being/having been here don't interest me, nor many others I'd imagine. The facts however DO interest me. Yet so far there are none.

cormac

Well then you are on the wrong website...FACT IS SOMETHING IS HAPPENING it's up to you to accept that or deny it... i dont need a proof to understand the happenings over last 7-8 decades they speak for themselves.. Yes some are hoaxs but what about those which arent? You goona deny those too even that they don't have any offical explanation? Here is where it gets crazy...

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#267    cormac mac airt

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:37 PM

View PostLord Vetinari, on 17 January 2013 - 02:27 PM, said:

Do you apply the same stringent criteria to explanations for UFO cases, as mentioned above, or are you happy to follow the principle of "we know that Lighthouses (or secret Aircraft) exist, so that's good enough for me (and never mind any questions there may be about that as an explanation)"?

For the most part I leave Unexplained Flying Objects as just that, "Unexplained". But I also don't automatically equate them with extraterrestrials. And I did not say that all UFO sightings can be explained by Black Projects but I do know that many of those, that eventually became well known military aircraft later in time were, when inadvertantly seen earlier in their development (much to the consternation of the military), were mistaken for and reported as UFO's. This is not supposition, this is fact.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#268    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:44 PM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 17 January 2013 - 02:37 PM, said:

For the most part I leave Unexplained Flying Objects as just that, "Unexplained". But I also don't automatically equate them with extraterrestrials. And I did not say that all UFO sightings can be explained by Black Projects but I do know that many of those, that eventually became well known military aircraft later in time were, when inadvertantly seen earlier in their development (much to the consternation of the military), were mistaken for and reported as UFO's. This is not supposition, this is fact.

cormac

Yes but back then people didn't knew what a Blackbird would look like for them it might just be UFO, but nowdays people know what we have what we developed how might our design look like. and by saying that i would like to say that i feel that UFO reports did indeed decreased lately ( 5-8 years ). Just an observation i don't know if it's true..

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#269    cormac mac airt

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:44 PM

View Postquillius, on 17 January 2013 - 02:27 PM, said:

ok try this.

20 people in a field, they all see a UFO land, three aliens get out of craft and communicate in strange language, they get back in craft and vanish. NO one speaks to eachother until after writing down a statement, the statements are all very similar.

Belief or fact?

fact but they cannot present it as such therefore does it go back to belief?

In this hypothetical it may be fact to them, but without verifiable evidence they can present to others it's meaningless to anyone else. And therein lies the rub, you can't present something as fact to others with verifiable evidence you don't have.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#270    cormac mac airt

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Posted 17 January 2013 - 02:46 PM

View PostNuke_em, on 17 January 2013 - 02:28 PM, said:

Well then you are on the wrong website...FACT IS SOMETHING IS HAPPENING it's up to you to accept that or deny it... i dont need a proof to understand the happenings over last 7-8 decades they speak for themselves.. Yes some are hoaxs but what about those which arent? You goona deny those too even that they don't have any offical explanation? Here is where it gets crazy...

And I've never said that nothing is happening, but one shouldn't automatically jump to the conclusion that the explanation is extraterrestrials. However, more often than not, that's exactly what happens.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus




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