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President to discuss Immigration Teusday


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44 replies to this topic

#16    Bama13

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 08:29 PM

View Postninjadude, on 29 January 2013 - 04:38 AM, said:

Would you rather they drive unsupervised, uneducated, unregulated and kill people? that;s the impetus for the law. immigration is a civil matter not a criminal one.

No I'd rather they get deported then come back legally. I'm fairly certain that illegal immigrants are criminals. Legal immigration is a civil matter, illegal immigration is a criminal matter. Since we are talking about illegal immigrants it is a criminal matter.

" Mighty little force is needed to control a man whose mind has been hoodwinked; contrariwise, no amount of force can control a free man, a man whose mind is free. No, not the rack, not fission bombs, not anything —you can't conquer a free man; the most you can do is kill him" - Robert Heinlein

#17    Hasina

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 08:34 PM

Break a law? Commit a crime? Go to jail. Simple. Go to jail illegal immigrants, you've broke laws and committed crimes by entering any country illegally. If I did this to, say, Germany, crossed their border illegally, they'd haul my snoozle all the way to jail. America? Free pass! Get on in here!

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#18    Gromdor

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Posted 29 January 2013 - 08:50 PM

View PostBama13, on 29 January 2013 - 08:29 PM, said:

No I'd rather they get deported then come back legally. I'm fairly certain that illegal immigrants are criminals. Legal immigration is a civil matter, illegal immigration is a criminal matter. Since we are talking about illegal immigrants it is a criminal matter.

Unfortunately the way we have our current immigration laws, being an illegal immigrant isn't a criminal matter- it is a civil matter.  So right now it is in the same category as parking tickets, divorce, breach of contract and foreclosure.   Perhaps Obama will press for legislation to make it a criminal matter on the Federal level but I doubt it.


#19    CrimsonKing

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 02:32 AM

View PostGromdor, on 29 January 2013 - 08:50 PM, said:

Unfortunately the way we have our current immigration laws, being an illegal immigrant isn't a criminal matter- it is a civil matter.  So right now it is in the same category as parking tickets, divorce, breach of contract and foreclosure.   Perhaps Obama will press for legislation to make it a criminal matter on the Federal level but I doubt it.

This is total bs if i did anything illegal its just that i would get in trouble,yet here we are 2013 and my tax dollars pay for free healthcare,free education,free food,free everything as long as your ILLEGAL!

"If it is not advantageous,do not move.If objectives can not be attained,do not employ the army.Unless endangered do not engage in warfare.The ruler cannot mobilize the army out of personal anger.The general can not engage in battle because of personal frustration.When it is advantageous,move;when not advantageous,stop.Anger can revert to happiness,annoyance can revert to joy,but a vanquished state cannot be revived,the dead cannot be brought back to life." Sun-Tzu

#20    acidhead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 02:43 AM

View PostGromdor, on 29 January 2013 - 08:50 PM, said:

Unfortunately the way we have our current immigration laws, being an illegal immigrant isn't a criminal matter- it is a civil matter.  So right now it is in the same category as parking tickets, divorce, breach of contract and foreclosure.   Perhaps Obama will press for legislation to make it a criminal matter on the Federal level but I doubt it.

Not gonna happen under Obama.  He's more concerned with protecting borders in the ME than the borders back home in the USA.

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#21    AsteroidX

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 02:46 AM

Hes interested in building bigger fences however. Is there anyone around from Germany to tell us how a large fence between 2 peoples works in the real world ?


#22    Gromdor

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 02:49 AM

He spoke in Vegas it seems.  Bi-partisan bill with 4 planks.   1) Tougher borders   2) Cracking down employers who hire illegals  3) Making it easier to come here legally and 4) A path for citizenship for illegals here already.  Nothing about sending them back,  told you guys both parties want them here for the labor.


#23    CrimsonKing

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 02:53 AM

View PostGromdor, on 30 January 2013 - 02:49 AM, said:

He spoke in Vegas it seems.  Bi-partisan bill with 4 planks.   1) Tougher borders   2) Cracking down employers who hire illegals  3) Making it easier to come here legally and 4) A path for citizenship for illegals here already.  Nothing about sending them back,  told you guys both parties want them here for the labor.

Cheap labor and votes,screw the rest of us!

"If it is not advantageous,do not move.If objectives can not be attained,do not employ the army.Unless endangered do not engage in warfare.The ruler cannot mobilize the army out of personal anger.The general can not engage in battle because of personal frustration.When it is advantageous,move;when not advantageous,stop.Anger can revert to happiness,annoyance can revert to joy,but a vanquished state cannot be revived,the dead cannot be brought back to life." Sun-Tzu

#24    AsteroidX

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 02:57 AM

They sure did indeed get bipartisan support real fast when it came to a large voting group. So obvious it'd be funny if it wasnt. The good news is they can stuff the pork in the name of bipartisanship.


#25    acidhead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 03:05 AM

Both party's(D's and R's) can go to hell.  They don't work for american citizens.  They work for their campaign donors.  The true opposition to the two party system is the Libertarian Party.  Same here in Canada.... We've got 3 main party's though only two ever get Federal powers.  There are two more fringe party's but monetary and foreign policies are all basically identical.  The illusion of choice is like gazing through a kaleidoscope here in Canada.  I vote Libertarian every time.

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#26    ninjadude

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 03:32 AM

View PostBama13, on 29 January 2013 - 08:29 PM, said:

No I'd rather they get deported then come back legally. I'm fairly certain that illegal immigrants are criminals. Legal immigration is a civil matter, illegal immigration is a criminal matter. Since we are talking about illegal immigrants it is a criminal matter.

we don't have the resources to do that. And it would be detrimental to the economy. Immigration is only a criminal matter under certain circumstances. Otherwise it's decided by a civil immigration court not a criminal one.

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#27    ninjadude

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 03:44 AM

View PostHasina, on 29 January 2013 - 08:34 PM, said:

Break a law? Commit a crime? Go to jail. Simple.

no it's not.

Quote

There are a number of independent court systems in the United States.  The federal government and every state operate their own courts.  However, many people are unaware that there are also courts dedicated to specialized topics.  Immigration Court is one of these court systems.
The Immigration Court is an administrative court run by the U.S. Department of Justice.  There are more than 200 Immigration Judges in 50 Immigration Courts nationwide.
Immigration judges have the authority to grant foreign nationals legal status in the United States.  At the same time, these judges have the authority to order foreign nationals to be deported, or removed, from the United States.
not criminal http://www.legalmatc...tion-court.html

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#28    Wickian

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 03:44 AM

View Postninjadude, on 30 January 2013 - 03:32 AM, said:

we don't have the resources to do that. And it would be detrimental to the economy. Immigration is only a criminal matter under certain circumstances. Otherwise it's decided by a civil immigration court not a criminal one.

The ideal situation would be to make living here illegally be too impractical to be worth it.  Then many of them would leave on their own.

1.  No schooling for illegal children(children born here are citizens so they would get it still).

2.  No medical care for illegals without first notifying to proper authorities.

3.  No housing of any kind for someone who is here illegally.

4.  Strict punishments for employers who hire illegals.

But that's just wishful thinking on my part.  Too many votes to lose for any of those to be passed into law/enforced.


#29    ninjadude

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 03:47 AM

View PostWickian, on 30 January 2013 - 03:44 AM, said:

Then many of them would leave on their own.

no they would not. the idea of "self-deportation" most republicans just don't understand. It was created as a lampoon of republican immigration ideas in California. And it's extremely hilarious that Republicans continue to spout it. It's kind of like using the Colbert Report or the Onion to make your argument.

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#30    acidhead

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Posted 30 January 2013 - 04:11 AM

Feel good laws feed criminals.

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