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Iran is Building Flying Saucers.


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#1651    kumaran

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 12:01 PM

I  am obsessed with Keshe and all free energy and antigravity. I want it to be true and when it dosent pan out I get obsessed and feel like threatening and calling them scams to make them release the technology. I suffer from schizophrenia. I am more gullible than most people. I want to get off the planet .

Edited by kumaran, 10 February 2013 - 12:03 PM.


#1652    DONTEATUS

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Posted 10 February 2013 - 11:06 PM

View Postkumaran, on 10 February 2013 - 12:01 PM, said:

I  am obsessed with Keshe and all free energy and antigravity. I want it to be true and when it dosent pan out I get obsessed and feel like threatening and calling them scams to make them release the technology. I suffer from schizophrenia. I am more gullible than most people. I want to get off the planet .
Wow ! "K man "  thats kinda sad,They do have meds for that though. I hope you get well !
I do know a little secret though. Some where out there The energy is Free

This is a Work in Progress!

#1653    kumaran

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:23 AM

View PostDONTEATUS, on 10 February 2013 - 11:06 PM, said:

Wow ! "K man "  thats kinda sad,They do have meds for that though. I hope you get well !
I do know a little secret though. Some where out there The energy is Free
I dont think meds will help though. I recently bought two of Searls books on the SEG and IGV. I believe Searl was suppressed by the british government and his work destroyed. I ordered his two CDs so that when I make money in the near future I can replicate the device myself.


#1654    psyche101

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:35 AM

View Postbee, on 09 February 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

He also has this on his blog...


http://stuxnet.blogs...st-nuclear.html


doesn't sound very rational (or unbiased) to me...


And here is another reply on the page you linked to...





.

What?

Do you know who those people are, and what they accomplished? Papp is a stage show guy, Meyers was proven in a court of law to be fibbing about his device, and Marty and Pons have written themselves into history for making claims that were untrue! They continued to work on these devices but never got anywhere RIP Marty, and withdrew their claims when they were submitted for peer review!!!

LOL, some inspiration there! Keep it up, soon everyone should know what a scam these things are!!

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#1655    psyche101

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:37 AM

View Postkumaran, on 10 February 2013 - 12:01 PM, said:

I  am obsessed with Keshe and all free energy and antigravity. I want it to be true and when it dosent pan out I get obsessed and feel like threatening and calling them scams to make them release the technology. I suffer from schizophrenia. I am more gullible than most people. I want to get off the planet .

You have read an awful lot, have you considered trying to make your own path? Do you see any part of what you have studied as something you would like to pursue in particular? Any particular, engine, process, something you think is the most promising avenue?

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#1656    psyche101

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 04:46 AM

View Postkumaran, on 11 February 2013 - 04:23 AM, said:

I dont think meds will help though. I recently bought two of Searls books on the SEG and IGV. I believe Searl was suppressed by the british government and his work destroyed. I ordered his two CDs so that when I make money in the near future I can replicate the device myself.

I do not think he was. It's a lovely idea, but you cannot just pull energy out of the air. The concept of reusing energy is not new, just this application is. If the machine worked, he would not be suppressed  he would be rich, and so would the Government. Suppression does not really make sense. Why lock it up and share profits with everyone else on oil? If the real motivator is money, why not kill Searle, take the information and release it after his death, and make squillions of dollars from it and smash the oil market, have it all for your lonesome? I mean if the Government really is evil and money hungry, then why not take full advantage of such a situation? What do they care about one man? Why would they employ half a moral?
The think the biggest problem with the SEG is that Sealre did not actually design it. It apparently came to him a series of dreams. Not the best classroom I am afraid. It is by definition "A Dream".

Edited by psyche101, 11 February 2013 - 04:47 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#1657    kumaran

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:05 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 11 February 2013 - 04:46 AM, said:

I do not think he was. It's a lovely idea, but you cannot just pull energy out of the air. The concept of reusing energy is not new, just this application is. If the machine worked, he would not be suppressed  he would be rich, and so would the Government. Suppression does not really make sense. Why lock it up and share profits with everyone else on oil? If the real motivator is money, why not kill Searle, take the information and release it after his death, and make squillions of dollars from it and smash the oil market, have it all for your lonesome? I mean if the Government really is evil and money hungry, then why not take full advantage of such a situation? What do they care about one man? Why would they employ half a moral?
The think the biggest problem with the SEG is that Sealre did not actually design it. It apparently came to him a series of dreams. Not the best classroom I am afraid. It is by definition "A Dream".
Lets just say it is a dream. But Searl has been shown to have weight reduction by independent replication by two parties.


#1658    kumaran

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:10 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 11 February 2013 - 04:35 AM, said:

What?

Do you know who those people are, and what they accomplished? Papp is a stage show guy, Meyers was proven in a court of law to be fibbing about his device, and Marty and Pons have written themselves into history for making claims that were untrue! They continued to work on these devices but never got anywhere RIP Marty, and withdrew their claims when they were submitted for peer review!!!

LOL, some inspiration there! Keep it up, soon everyone should know what a scam these things are!!
Actually cold fusion or LENR is real but unfortunately not replicable 100% of the time. Sometimes they get excess heat sometimes not. The US navy DARPA did do research and I watched a presentation. I think people should not give up on LENR yet. I am glad some scientists still research LENR. Maybe some genius in the future will manage to replicate it 100% of the time. Then you will have real LENR. Same with Searl. Nobody has achieved consistent results with these devices.

Edited by kumaran, 11 February 2013 - 07:12 AM.


#1659    kumaran

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Posted 11 February 2013 - 07:27 AM

I believe Keshe teams who are trying to replicate will also not be able to 100% replicate weight reduction and overunity every time. I believe that is why Keshe has not released the reactors. He is using the replication teams to do his research for him. In a way it is a brilliant tactic but dishonest nonetheless. But it is due to the fact that such anomalies are ignored that forces some scientists to exaggerate to get support. If I had money I would probably fund a team to look into replicating Keshe myself. Unfortunately I cant. I just cant make up my mind about if Keshe is real or not. I guess it is the split mind syndrome of schizophrenia.

Edited by kumaran, 11 February 2013 - 07:27 AM.


#1660    kumaran

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Posted 13 February 2013 - 11:55 PM

Enemies of free energy here https://www.evernote...f60866634801b2b . Keshe is one of those who matches this.

"3. Delusion and Dishonesty in the FE Movement
The third force operating to postpone the public availability of free energy technology consists of the group of deluded inventors and outright charlatans and con men. On the periphery of the extraordinary scientific breakthroughs that constitute the real free energy technologies lies a shadow world of unexplained anomalies, marginal inventions and unscrupulous promoters. The first two forces have constantly used the media to promote the worst examples of this group, to distract the public's attention and to discredit the real breakthroughs by associating them with the obvious frauds.

Over the last 100 years, dozens of stories have surfaced about unusual inventions. Some of these ideas have so captivated the public's imagination that a mythology about these systems continues to this day. Names like Keely, Hubbard, Coler and Hendershot immediately come to mind. There may be real technologies behind these names, but there simply isn't enough technical data available in the public domain to make a determination. These names remain associated with a free energy mythology, however, and are cited by debunkers as examples of fraud. But the idea of free energy taps very deeply into the human subconscious mind.

However, a few inventors with marginal technologies that demonstrate useful anomalies have mistakenly exaggerated the importance of their invention. Some of these inventors also have mistakenly exaggerated the importance of themselves for having invented it. A combination of "gold fever" and/or a "Messiah complex" appears, wholly distorting any future contribution they may make. While the research thread they are following may hold great promise, they begin to trade enthusiasm for facts, and the value of the scientific work from that point on suffers greatly. There is a powerful yet subtle seduction that can warp a personality if they believe that "the world rests on their shoulders" or that they are the world's "saviour".

Strange things also happen to people when they think they are about to become extremely rich. It takes a tremendous spiritual discipline to remain objective and humble in the presence of a working free energy machine. Many inventors' psyches become unstable by the inventors' just believing they have a free energy machine. As the quality of the science deteriorates, some inventors also develop a "persecution complex" that makes them very defensive and unapproachable. This process precludes them from ever really developing a free energy machine, and fuels the fraud mythologies tremendously.

Then there are the outright con men. In the last 15 years, there is one person in the USA who has raised the free energy con to a professional art. He has raised more than US$100,000,000, has been barred from doing business in the state of Washington, has been jailed in California, and he's still at it. He always talks about a variation of one of the real free energy systems, sells people on the idea that they will get one of these systems soon, but ultimately sells them only promotional information that gives no real data about the energy system itself. He has mercilessly preyed upon the Christian and Patriot communities in the USA and is still going strong.

This person's current scam involves signing up hundreds of thousands of people for locations where he will install a free energy machine. In exchange for letting him put the FE generator in their home, they will get free electricity for life and his company will sell the excess energy back to the local utility company. After becoming convinced that they will receive free electricity for life, with no out-front expenses, they gladly buy a video--which helps draw their friends into the scam as well. Once you understand the power and motivations of the first two forces I have discussed, it is obvious that this person's current "business plan" cannot be implemented. This one person has probably done more harm to the free energy movement in the USA than any other force, by destroying people's trust in the technology.

So, the third force postponing the public availability of free energy technology is delusion and dishonesty within the movement itself. The motivations are self-aggrandisement, greed, want of power over others and a false sense of self-importance. The weapons used are lying, cheating, the "bait and switch" con, self-delusion and arrogance, combined with lousy science"


#1661    DONTEATUS

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Posted 14 February 2013 - 12:59 AM

Do any of these weapons include Really working ?

This is a Work in Progress!

#1662    kumaran

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Posted 15 February 2013 - 01:21 PM

This is another list for how a con aartist works here http://web.archive.o...g/e/con_man.htm . Keshe once again meets most of the signs

"Becoming a Con man of crackpot technology for fun and profit

last updated 2003-02-23 - found at http://www.phact.org/e/con_man.htm

how to make a living pitching free energy machines

A number of people have made a decent living ripping off (usually elderly) investors, promising they will get rich on free energy.
---- the following tips can help any charismatic salesman get lots of money and notoriety ----

Be very careful to have any investors forfeit their right to legal action any way possible. - this can be a last minute statement to sign, often you can hide silencing terms in a nondisclosure agreement.
Start with outrageous enough claims to filter the more skeptical people out as early as possible. But, be careful about making too many bogus scientific claims, or you may find self-righteous skeptics trying to debunk you - if this happens, tell your followers they (or any critics) are part of the conspiracy - maybe nitpick at fine points of their arguments, but don't ever respond to their main thrust.
Claim you are not in it for the money, just to save humanity. Say you have already been offered huge sums, but want to sell it to the little guy (i.e. the gullible guy). Try to market it to older mid-western Christian farmers - they've always bought in in the past. Build excitement for something wonderful.
Focus investors attention away from evaluating claims on technical grounds. The following distractions are recommended:
  • get them involved in political issues. Convince them you have some large secretive benefactor.
  • focus their attention on an elaborate multi-generational international conspiracy which has kept everyone pitching free energy to fail. Make your audience outraged against the conspiracy, yet empowered that they can finally overcome it by giving you money.
  • talk about your valiant battles with the patent office or some government bureaucracy (that always warms people up)
  • get into religion quick (religious people are already taught to have faith) -appear to have God on your side
  • get people to focus on your theory rather than measurable evidence.
  • claim it already has been proven so you need not offer any proof   Tell them you are done proving it and need big money to start mass production.
  • Write an autobiography (self-published, of course) where you can "control" the facts. When someone questions your shady past simply say, "Buy my book and learn the truth about what REALLY happened." Naive people won't question the "facts" because, after all, it's in a book.  If your book is long enough, you may mesmerize them.
  You must focus on the big conspiracy. It's very important to make people believe in the big conspiracy - because that's your excuse for past failures, present lack of evidence, the critics, and future delays. Locking horns with bureaucrats or the scientific community can distract from your lack of evidence and get you great free press. Make people believe exciting claims of bad guys wanting to steal or bury your ideas. - then claim you will destroy your prototypes and records rather than let them fall into the hands of the bad guys.
  Be bold, sell books, consider taking out full page ad or get on the radio. People will feel that something this out in the open can not possibly be a fly by night Con. The most successful cons are ones lasting for a few years not the quick cons.
  Watch your target market, Go after people predisposed to believing in conspiracy theories such as the militias, JFK conspiracy, and UFO cover-up groups.
  If you are forced to demonstrate some device, consider the following important tips: bore the skeptics right out of the room with long discourses on elementary science; claim you have some adjustments to make, yet; say it worked yesterday; run your machine for just a few seconds and move on to some other important point. - or do the Newman trick of openly hooking up input power and just promising it's less than what comes out.
  A good final lesson, if the heat from impatient investors and public scrutiny gets too much, do what Keely did - just walk away from it all (just claim it doesn't work because the remaining people don't understand it) , and just start some new investment scheme for some other amazing claim.
  operate from a state which is soft on fraud and organized crime.
  Get people to pay around 20 - 100$ for "information kits" or video tapes.  Once they've paid that much, it's easier to get them to start paying more money.
  Discourage investors from contacting each other and cover up evidence of earlier bitter investors.
  Get followers to sell your stuff to their friends, family and churches - try multilevel schemes- promise they will get rich by commissions on getting others to invest (who cares if this destroys their friendships).
  Be open to having newer investors buy out older more impatient investors.  Always promise a disgruntled investor that someone else will soon buy him out.
  Don't be afraid of lawsuits, if OJ got off so can you - they can be one more excuse for delays. Most attorney generals will just bluff with a cease and desist order and then move on to someone else.
  Don't be afraid of investors defecting, most of them will feel too stupid to go public with their story - even if some do start successful attacks on you, just say they are agents of the big conspiracy.
  Jealously guard your list of investors, a good sucker list is worth its weight in gold and can even be sold to other con men.
  Don't be afraid of the press, they don't usually evaluate outlandish claims, and even if they do - your audience won't likely listen.
  Be open to 'red-lining' your investors (i.e.: tell them if they don't come up with just a little more money, they will lose it all)
  Be ready to move to another state with corrupt or weak DA's - if you are done 'harvesting' your initial area. (i.e.: New Jersey is known as an east coast haven for the mob, prostitution and home repair scams)  Most states don’t bother to track people down across state lines.
  If you are really bold, you could give commissions for investors to find more investors. Better to also make others responsible for building the machines - it buys you time and gives you another person to blame.
Explain complex subjects simply, (leaving out lots of details) so that the mark feels as though he understands the subject well enough to make informed decisions.
How to deal with skeptics and detractors:
There are a number of approaches to deal with self righteous people who like to point out your flaws of reason, lists of previous victims, etc. out on the internet:
  • Label your detractors as CIA agents, or stupid or part of the great conspiracy.
  • say they are unqualified unless they are experts in your crazy theory.
  • try to restrict your message to newsletters and limited forums where the skeptical voice can be filtered out.
  • in a public forum deaden the audiences interest with tons of distracting counter "information".
  • try to delete their pages from the search engines, or bury their objections in enough distractions to make people avoid the debate
  • trying threatening your detractors with lawsuits - it will make some of them shut up
  • give up and only try to market to people too old or stupid to get on the internet. - or try selling to the Amish or more stupid ethnic groups.
--- hope no one gets too offended by this conjecture - most of it is inspired by a neat book, "Con Men and their methods". By the way, I've gotten taken a few times myself (maybe that's why I'm fascinated by the subject) ======== this page will be live updated at http://www.phact.org/e/con_man.htm

The Woo-Woo Credo - how to be a general kook
pages exposing Joe Newman and  Dennis Leewho some people suspect of leading a nationwide scam.  Also, Amin, Mills(who may be legit?)  Tilley, Perendev, Bearden Lutec  Tewari. get on an email list for updates about Dennis   Tom Bearden’s MEG device A rational review of meg claims  inconsistancies in his theory  Greer’s offer  Bill Muller and questioning Bearden’s mental health  free energy scams
  NATIONAL FRAUD INFORMATION CENTER and state attorney generals offices and investment fraud -the SEC's number is 202-942-8090
  scambusters gives information mostly on fraud over the internet. great list of scams   FAIR's media contact list   Newspaper Links by State    E&P Media Links - Search Page
  Consumer Sentinel: Complaints - direct form to allow people to submit complaints
http://www.crimes-of-persuasion.com/- a great resource of scams - their report on Dennis's operation
Prosecuting Attorneys, District Attorneys, Attorneys General & US Attorneys on the Web
Internet Fraud Complaint Center
Directory of Investigative Journalists - a good resource to get the media to expose a con man
A restraining order issued against Dennis Lee in 1999
Send any comments to the web pages to, Eric Krieg eric@phact.org
View Eric Krieg's skeptics pages and see more rants by Eric
UPDATE:  Spotlight magazine just blasted Dennis.  You can hear Dennis telling his followers to
send in money saying: , "I need to encourage you to do this no matter what it takes for you to do it. You can take in partners, limited  partnerships, get a loan, break the kids piggy  bank, max out the old credit cards, borrow against the insurance, cash in the Christmas fund or even the college fund because if you get them at $2.50 now before the 15th, it's going to be easy to get that money back".    Don't believe me, hear Dennis's own words:
http://www.phact.org/e/z/dennis3.wav

I got the following response from Dustin

It's sort of depressing how frauds can make hundreds of thousands of dollars on things like free-energy claims without showing any evidence that the device works. After reading your Dennis Lee page I realized that you don't even have to go through the trouble of faking a believable demonstration! If you can make a fortune off of something that doesn't exist it seems like anyone who really comes up with a good idea should become a millionaire. Then I think of how many stories I've heard of independent inventors having their ideas stolen by big companies and spending their whole lives in court trying to get the credit (and money) that they deserve. Now suppose you have actually invented a free energy device. The best way to find the most effective marketing strategy is to see how well different techniques have worked in the past. Given the evidence, your best option is to do as the scam-artists do! Think of the benefits: 1. There is plenty of skeptical literature explaining how people are convinced to give money to support unsubstantiated claims so you don't have to buy expensive "how to" books. 2. Any media coverage you receive will probably be positive. You might even have your own segment on a FOX special. 3. You don't have to convince mainstream scientists that it works. 4. You don't have to let the plans for your invention collect dust due to lack of funding. There are plenty of gullible people willing to give you money before you give any evidence that your device works. 5. On the off chance that there actually is a conspiracy to suppress free-energy, they will either ignore you completely or maybe even support you. After all, the more frauds there are, the less likely a real claim will be believed. 6. Suppose that when you get around to building a prototype you discover that it doesn't work Who cares! If people like Dennis Lee can make a fortune without having any good ideas in the first place, there's no reason why you can't do the same(I suppose it's possible that Mr. Lee originally thought he had free energy then took advantage of this particular benefit). "


#1663    kumaran

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 09:55 AM

Pretty quiet around here lately. So just dropped by to say SCAM SCAM SCUM Keshe. Keshe is scum until he releases free energy and antigravity to the public.


#1664    DONTEATUS

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Posted 10 March 2013 - 11:21 PM

We could re-name the Thread ?" Keshe-Scam" But then ITs always better for these guys to Hang themselfs ! :tu:  SCAM MAN INDEED!

This is a Work in Progress!

#1665    kumaran

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Posted 31 March 2013 - 12:05 PM

View PostDONTEATUS, on 10 March 2013 - 11:21 PM, said:

We could re-name the Thread ?" Keshe-Scam" But then ITs always better for these guys to Hang themselfs ! :tu:  SCAM MAN INDEED!
Keshe is now calling himself the messiah of humanity the one mentioned by all the religions to save mankind. He also claims hs is in contact with aliens. You, psyche and the others who tried to convince me he was a scam are right. Keshe is a scam scam scam. SCAM.

Edited by kumaran, 31 March 2013 - 12:05 PM.





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