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Obama: Gun-control advocates have to listen


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#31    Uncle Sam

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:21 AM

View PostLikely Guy, on 27 January 2013 - 08:16 AM, said:

And that was the Declaration of Independence, written expressly in reference to the British Empire. Not your own government. I may be wrong. Please educate me.

The Declaration of Independence was sent to the British stating we, the people, are hereby succeeded from the British Empire. Thus United States of America was born, which originally the thirteen colonies. This was written while we were at war with British Empire which they were losing. This was the first document, while the second was the Constitution that gave us our inalienable rights, which both were signed July 4th in 1776.

Edited by Uncle Sam, 27 January 2013 - 08:23 AM.

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#32    Likely Guy

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:24 AM

View PostAsteroidX, on 27 January 2013 - 08:18 AM, said:

I disagree that it was written specifically for the British Government. It was written to them yes. But it expresses the morals and values of the writers of both the Declaration and Constitution (many of whom wrote and signed both). It is a legacy document. Not a one shot article sent overseas.

Legally I dont know if it holds any weight but morally and sensibly it holds much

I beg to disagree. It was the 'Declaration of Independence' from the British Commonwealth. The Constitution was something completely different, which was never inviolable, but ammended many times.


#33    Frank Merton

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:25 AM

View PostUncle Sam, on 27 January 2013 - 08:11 AM, said:

Criminals regardless if we have guns or not, will find them on the black market or smuggle them in from other countries. It is your short sightedness that will be your undoing. Besides your from vietnam, you have no say in what our constitution should have or not have.
For some strange reason that has not proved true here.  I think it's a myth if you have competent police.  As far as your Constitution goes, this seems to show me that there is at least some foolishness in it, but I don't care.  I was addressing the wisdom of having a gun around, not the legality.


#34    Likely Guy

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:28 AM

View PostUncle Sam, on 27 January 2013 - 08:21 AM, said:



The Declaration of Independence was sent to the British stating we, the people, are hereby succeeded from the British Empire. Thus United States of America was born, which originally the thirteen colonies.

Actually it was 12, Delaware was at best a protectorate.


#35    Uncle Sam

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:29 AM

View PostFrank Merton, on 27 January 2013 - 08:25 AM, said:

For some strange reason that has not proved true here.  I think it's a myth if you have competent police.  As far as your Constitution goes, this seems to show me that there is at least some foolishness in it, but I don't care.  I was addressing the wisdom of having a gun around, not the legality.

If you are not willing to understand, then I am wasting my energy on you. 2nd Amendment is to protect us from foreign or domestic threats, that isn't just for criminals, it encompasses a wide range of threats to our inalienable rights.


View PostLikely Guy, on 27 January 2013 - 08:28 AM, said:

Actually it was 12, Delaware was at best a protectorate.

Where the heck did you get 12 from?

Declaration of Independence Signing

Edited by Uncle Sam, 27 January 2013 - 08:40 AM.

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#36    AsteroidX

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:29 AM

Id like to add any e-talk from undisclosed locations anywhere in the world that when we have a conversation that is of an agitator stance against our government in America that we would be exceptionally infantile to not look at what our Forefathers found to be so grievous that it became necessary to leave the British Empire.

To consider our own grievances great we must first understand what great grievances were historically thought to be great in this country. Then we can only compare our current situation and decide amongst ourselves (The People).

Grievances and patience can be found in several books and journals dating around 1774-1775 and the Declaration of Independence. FOR ME that is the Litmus test and I believe we tested positive.


#37    AsteroidX

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:34 AM

I cant teach vernacular English Likely Guy. I linked the appropriate document and even the specific exerp I speak of but how you interpret it is your right as we are not in a position to defend our positions in a legal setting.

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The term "vernacular English" (like the term "standard English") refers only to syntax. It does not refer to pronunciation or vocabulary choice.



#38    Uncle Sam

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:37 AM

View PostAsteroidX, on 27 January 2013 - 08:34 AM, said:

I cant teach vernacular English Likely Guy. I linked the appropriate document and even the specific exerp I speak of but how you interpret it is your right as we are not in a position to defend our positions in a legal setting.

That would be great if you can do that AsteroidX. Seems we need to reeducate people the importance of the constitution and why we need it.

View PostHasina, on 27 January 2013 - 08:01 AM, said:

It's this part I'm surprised no one understands:

'A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.'

Does everyone in Washington need to go back to elementary school to have vocubaulary explained to them again? (The answer is: yes)

You right on this, we do need to send them back to elementary. Funny how they are so great in word-play as mostly lawyers, but they understand nothing about the constitution or hold it in high regards.

Edited by Uncle Sam, 27 January 2013 - 08:39 AM.

A man's ethical behaviour should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death. - Albert Einstein

#39    Frank Merton

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:38 AM

View PostUncle Sam, on 27 January 2013 - 08:29 AM, said:

If you are not willing to understand, then I am wasting my energy on you. 2nd Amendment is to protect us from foreign or domestic threats, that isn't for criminals, it encompasses a wide range of threats to our inalienable rights.
You actually think that a provision designed for a time when society was rural and guns consisted of muskets that took several minutes to reload has any meaning for today?  You've been watching too many movies.  In the meantime because of such absurdities, gun deaths go on and on and on.

I have to say most of the world looks at America with amazement.


#40    Uncle Sam

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:42 AM

View PostFrank Merton, on 27 January 2013 - 08:38 AM, said:

You actually think that a provision designed for a time when society was rural and guns consisted of muskets that took several minutes to reload has any meaning for today?  You've been watching too many movies.  In the meantime because of such absurdities, gun deaths go on and on and on.

I have to say most of the world looks at America with amazement.

You have no understanding what our constitution is for, why we need it, why it is there, or why our forefathers foresaw this? Research the subject even more and try to understand it, until then, you are just trolling me and other Americans.

A man's ethical behaviour should be based effectually on sympathy, education, and social ties and needs; no religious basis is necessary. Man would indeed be in a poor way if he had to be restrained by fear of punishment and hope of reward after death. - Albert Einstein

#41    AsteroidX

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:46 AM

Quote

I have to say most of the world looks at America with amazement.

Hopefully we wont dissapoint

Edited by AsteroidX, 27 January 2013 - 08:46 AM.


#42    AsteroidX

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:50 AM

I mean FFS. This is what America looks like today. Call us stupid. But lets not be ignorant about whats happening.




#43    Frank Merton

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 08:56 AM

View PostUncle Sam, on 27 January 2013 - 08:42 AM, said:

You have no understanding what our constitution is for, why we need it, why it is there, or why our forefathers foresaw this? Research the subject even more and try to understand it, until then, you are just trolling me and other Americans.
You manage to ignore any points I make by repeating that I'm not an American.

I've got news for you; guns are not just an American thing.  Perhaps America could learn a few things from the rest of the world.


#44    AsteroidX

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 09:03 AM

Watch the video Frank. WE are not the ones doing this. The Government is coming after us and doing it fully armed its appearing slowly and certainly.


#45    Professor Buzzkill

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Posted 27 January 2013 - 09:08 AM

View PostAsteroidX, on 27 January 2013 - 08:50 AM, said:

I mean FFS. This is what America looks like today. Call us stupid. But lets not be ignorant about whats happening.



After seeing that video my suspicions are raised. Is there any reason for a joint police/military exercise involving machine gun shooting practise from military helicopters above heavily populated cities?

Could any resistance to tighter gun regulations be used as an excuse for martial law?





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