144 replies to this topic

[Order66]

supervike, on 13 October 2012 - 08:51 PM, said:

Couple that with the fact the Affordable Care Act is nothing more than a retooling of Governor Romeny's Massachussetts Health Care plan.  A plan that came directly from Conservatives.

It's not just an issue of how the plan is structured, it's an issue of what the federal government has the power to mandate. I don't livein Massachusetts, I don't care what they do. If it works for them, great, but let my state decide how it wants to manage it's health benefits, not the federal government. If the death penalty is legal in one state, then it should be legal everywhere? No, it's an issue which each state has the right to decide for itself.

[Merc14]

Biden BS.  Anyone who believes what Biden was saying in the debate is either a sap, a zealot or both.

http://video.foxnews.../1897646466001/

Edited by Merc14, 14 October 2012 - 01:22 AM.

[Merc14]

Woman sick of being mischaracterized by the Obama campaign speaks out

http://qctimes.com/n...19bb2963f4.html

[and then]

supervike, on 13 October 2012 - 08:51 PM, said:

I read a great article the other day that showed how the '5 point plan' is basically the same as what President Obama has been doing.


Couple that with the fact the Affordable Care Act is nothing more than a retooling of Governor Romeny's Massachussetts Health Care plan.  A plan that came directly from Conservatives.

We HAVE to have some sort of National Health Care plan, because the alternative isn't working.  Too many people without insurance that go to the emergency room for the sniffles force the price up for those that DO have coverage.

The plan isn't perfect, and it's expensive, but the alternative is way more expensive and way more impacting to the middle class.

I agree but when was the last time you heard of ANY government program being administered efficiently?  What is most likely is that it will become a hugely bloated, inefficient bureaucracy that makes healthcare mediocre at best for everyone.  But hey - at least everyone will be equal...except those who can pay for real physicians.

Edited by and then, 14 October 2012 - 04:15 AM.

[docyabut2]

Not that Obama care is a bad thing, its just not the right time when the economy is failing, no jobs and the deficit is one trillion.Won`nt it just put our country into a great debt to early bankrupty. I sure would`nt  want to rely on any other countires to bail us out when America has always been strong. China and Japan had said to destroy America is to buy her out, our debt? .Is that whats going to happen?

[docyabut2]

Sorrry for going off topic, but somebody got to fix America,s problems and I don`t think the Obama adminastration can do it.

[questionmark]

docyabut2, on 14 October 2012 - 11:09 AM, said:

Sorrry for going off topic, but somebody got to fix America,s problems and I don`t think the Obama adminastration can do it.

Nor can Romney, the only difference could be is who profits from the demise, those who earn over 250k or those who earn less.

To fix America the first thing that needs to be done is to vote in a Congress willing to work.

[Legaia]

questionmark, on 14 October 2012 - 11:14 AM, said:

Nor can Romney, the only difference could be is who profits from the demise, those who earn over 250k or those who earn less.

To fix America the first thing that needs to be done is to vote in a Congress willing to work.

Why can't people understand that these people NEED to profit for the economy to work. Anyone that owns a small business can easily gross (that is the key word that needs to be understood) $250k a year.

[questionmark]

Legaia, on 14 October 2012 - 11:21 AM, said:

Why can't people understand that these people NEED to profit for the economy to work. Anyone that owns a small business can easily gross (that is the key word that needs to be understood) $250k a year.

Capitalism only works as long as everybody benefits from it. As soon as the benefits end up in the same 1000 pockets it is over. The best then is a right dictatorship, the worst a left dictatorship that will come of it. Don't you guys ever learn anything from history?

[Legaia]

questionmark, on 14 October 2012 - 11:39 AM, said:

Capitalism only works as long as everybody benefits from it. As soon as the benefits end up in the same 1000 pockets it is over. The best then is a right dictatorship, the worst a left dictatorship that will come of it. Don't you guys ever learn anything from history?

I could ask you the same question. The writers of the constitution certainly learned from it.

[questionmark]

Legaia, on 14 October 2012 - 11:50 AM, said:

I could ask you the same question. The writers of the constitution certainly learned from it.

They never said that the rich had to have a least tax burden than the poor, as far as I can remember. And they have never said either that the constitution was there that some get rich at the expense of the misery of others but clearly in the preamble: to promote the common welfare.

Yes, they learned, problem is that most of those who keep squealing constitution do not know what they are talking about.

[Legaia]

questionmark, on 14 October 2012 - 12:18 PM, said:

They never said that the rich had to have a least tax burden than the poor, as far as I can remember. And they have never said either that the constitution was there that some get rich at the expense of the misery of others but clearly in the preamble: to promote the common welfare.

Yes, they learned, problem is that most of those who keep squealing constitution do not know what they are talking about.

The problem with your logic is there would be no need for taxes the likes of which we have today if the constitution was followed. The federal government has no place or authority to be involved in the majority of social affairs that it is currently involved in. To believe anything otherwise would suggest that you, in fact, know nothing about the constitution. A government that has the power to give us everything also has the power to take it all away. How can you believe, based on history alone, that a governing power would hold dear the best interest of the people?

As ludicrous as this idea is, let's suppose that our federal government does care deeply for us. Even if that were the case, it would still fail because a few bureaucrats in Washington simply cannot efficiently manage the lives of an entire nation.

[docyabut2]

Most businesses are all ready saying if this Obama care kicks in, they will lay half their people off, so hows that going to work in giving more jobs.


plus,reduce Medicare $500 billion?

• Reduce Medicare home health care payments: $40 billion
  
• Reduce certain Medicare hospital payments: $22 billion
  
• 
  
• What about the old Medicare people that worked so hard to now have the benefits cut.

[questionmark]

docyabut2, on 14 October 2012 - 01:16 PM, said:

Most businesses are all ready saying if this Obama care kicks in, they will lay half their people off, so hows that going to work in giving more jobs.


plus,reduce Medicare $500 billion?

• Reduce Medicare home health care payments: $40 billion
  
• Reduce certain Medicare hospital payments: $22 billion
  
• 
  
• What about the old Medicare people that worked so hard to now have the benefits cut.

And you can show that through this reduction in the foreseeable future any medicare recipient will get anything less?

I can that through Romney restoring the previous status they will.

[questionmark]

Legaia, on 14 October 2012 - 01:00 PM, said:

The problem with your logic is there would be no need for taxes the likes of which we have today if the constitution was followed. The federal government has no place or authority to be involved in the majority of social affairs that it is currently involved in. To believe anything otherwise would suggest that you, in fact, know nothing about the constitution. A government that has the power to give us everything also has the power to take it all away. How can you believe, based on history alone, that a governing power would hold dear the best interest of the people?

As ludicrous as this idea is, let's suppose that our federal government does care deeply for us. Even if that were the case, it would still fail because a few bureaucrats in Washington simply cannot efficiently manage the lives of an entire nation.

So who would pay to protect your behind from possible bad, bad Islamic invasions (sadly we got no more commies to invade us)?

Who would pay for scientific research that does not give immediate returns? (or are we, just like with the Large Hadron Collider, let the scientific leadership return to Europe)?

There is no place in the world requiring a government that does not need something to pay for it, and that something is called taxes. If you don't want to pay them on the Federal level you will have to pay them on the State level, with one slight difference, there is no single state capable of stemming a mega project like the Federal government is and there is no State that will create an Army controlled by the Feds.

And only those two positions require more money than what is collected in taxes. The other 1/3 of the budget is financed by making debt.

So nobody can tell me that there are enough taxes collected, in fact, the last time it was so Clinton was Prezz and Gingrich the leader of the house. That is quite some time ago.