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Visual Reorientation Illusions (VRIs)


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#106    starlight1020

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Posted 09 July 2012 - 04:52 AM

View PostHugh, on 07 July 2012 - 09:58 PM, said:

Could we actually be at least 4D, being able to see light from our perceived 3D world coming from different directions within higher dimensional space? :)
i don't know, but i'm intrigued. i'm curious if you've ever tried to astral project?


#107    Hugh

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Posted 09 July 2012 - 08:03 AM

View Poststarlight1020, on 09 July 2012 - 04:52 AM, said:


i don't know, but i'm intrigued. i'm curious if you've ever tried to astral project?

I don't think I've ever achieved that ability, but I believe in the possibility of it.

Do you think you've ever possibly experienced a VRI? Like when you've come up from a subway, or out of a movie theatre, have you started walking in the "wrong direction", thinking you were going in the right one? Then your whole world gets "flipped back to your normal viewpoint" and you then have your correct bearings back again?


#108    starlight1020

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 02:43 AM

View PostHugh, on 09 July 2012 - 08:03 AM, said:

Do you think you've ever possibly experienced a VRI? Like when you've come up from a subway, or out of a movie theatre, have you started walking in the "wrong direction", thinking you were going in the right one? Then your whole world gets "flipped back to your normal viewpoint" and you then have your correct bearings back again?
oh yes, i've definitely felt like that before. i always just assumed something was off with my head ;) i have gotten turned around many, many times but not in the last few years that i can remember and never on purpose. would be cool to make it happen though.


#109    Hugh

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 03:30 AM

View Poststarlight1020, on 10 July 2012 - 02:43 AM, said:

oh yes, i've definitely felt like that before. i always just assumed something was off with my head ;) i have gotten turned around many, many times but not in the last few years that i can remember and never on purpose. would be cool to make it happen though.

It's great to hear you've experienced being turned around starlight... it's easy to think of it as something being off, but if you think about it, there is a really interesting part of it to consider... and that is... how is it possible that we can see our surroundings from different directions, if those different directions didn't actually exist?

This is why I believe it has something to do with higher dimensions of space, is that it seems that the space we are in, and that we are made of, has all these extra directions available for viewing...

It's really cool to make it happen by conscious thought... it is then that one realizes that it could be less of a disability, and more of an ability...

The ability to see the space around us from the other directions available.

Take for example this 2D representation of a 3D necker cube:

Posted Image
You can look at the top picture and see it in either of the 2 bottom orientations just by thinking it, with the ability of your mind to make it instantly flip.

In the same way, it may be possible to see the 3D "slice" of 4D space around us in any of the possible orientations just by thinking it, with the ability of your mind to make it instantly flip with a VRI.

Next time you're in a movie theatre, please try to flip to another direction facing theatre... the opposite one is the easiest for everyone I've ever talked to about this... and let me know if you were successful!

It's so fun to flip back and forth at will to all four different orientations, such a feeling of freedom and power! :)

Edited by Hugh, 10 July 2012 - 03:37 AM.


#110    starlight1020

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 10:51 PM

I don't understand how to make it happen though?


#111    Hugh

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 11:24 PM

View Poststarlight1020, on 10 July 2012 - 10:51 PM, said:

I don't understand how to make it happen though?

It takes concentration and awareness of which direction you are facing, and the ability to do spatial rotations in your mind's eye.

Do you have any problem seeing the two bottom cubes in the top cube?

If you can see those two cubes quite easily, you should be more capable of experiencing a VRI.

I'm going to quote an earlier post in which I explain how to do a Movie Theatre VRI...

What helps the most is to have a pre-existing mental image of your surroundings in the position you want to go to. Once you have experienced the flip, and seen things in a room from different directions before, it is easier to re-visit that viewpoint.

That's one of the reasons that I think that doing the VRI in a movie theater for the first time is the easiest place to try, because we already have a pre-conceived mental map image of "a theater" in each of the four directions - facing north, south, east and west. Having a big flat screen far away as a common element to focus on helps a lot.

Think of the times in your life when you have seen a movie at the theater, in each of the four different directions, and get an orientational sense of each of the positions. Picture yourself sitting facing north, then south, then east and then west in each of those theaters.

Now visit a movie theater, arriving well before it starts, and think of which direction that you are currently facing. See it in your mind's mental map. Now think of being in the opposite facing theater, for myself, and everyone I've ever talked to about this, the 180 degree flip is the easiest one to achieve. Just let the flip happen. It may take a while. Think about other things, other times you've seen other movies, in other places, which direction that you were facing in those other theaters. If the movie starts and you still haven't experienced the flip, during the movie, every few minutes, just take a second to imagine yourself in one of those other facing theaters, then watch the movie again. The flip should happen at some point if you focus on it enough. You'll think, hey, wasn't I facing the other way when I came in here? The more that you become aware of the VRI, the easier it is to do it.

Let me know if you have any success with it if you try it there starlight. :)


#112    starlight1020

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 11:44 PM

So concentration is key? I'll definitely let you know! And thanks for answering all of my questions :)


#113    starlight1020

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Posted 10 July 2012 - 11:46 PM

Oh and yes I can see the two bottom cubes in the top cube easily.


#114    Hugh

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Posted 11 July 2012 - 12:04 AM

View Poststarlight1020, on 10 July 2012 - 11:44 PM, said:

So concentration is key? I'll definitely let you know! And thanks for answering all of my questions :)

I'm glad to help! Just look at the picture of the back to back theatres I posted earlier, and next time you're at the movies, just imagine yourself switching theatres just like you easily switch cubes! :)



#115    PrintingRay

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Posted 13 July 2012 - 05:51 PM

Yes, I can cee two bottom cubes in top picture easily. Will you please let me know that what do you want to extract from this?


#116    Hugh

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Posted 13 July 2012 - 06:19 PM

View PostPrintingRay, on 13 July 2012 - 05:51 PM, said:

Yes, I can cee two bottom cubes in top picture easily. Will you please let me know that what do you want to extract from this?

Hi PrintingRay. Being able to see the bottom cubes in the top picture easily means you have an abiltiy and awareness of doing those spatial rotations in your mind.

Seeing VRIs involves a similar ability and awareness, but instead of involving a 2D image as above, it involves seeing your whole perceived 3D world around you in a different orientation.

It's like being in a 3D necker cube yourself, and doing the  spatial rotation in your mind, and seeing everything from a new 3D perspective from within the cube!

Have you ever experienced a VRI? Here's another thread on the forum here if you're interesting in reading more about them:

http://www.unexplain...howtopic=159285

Thanks. :)


#117    wanderer_

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Posted 14 July 2012 - 08:33 PM

I've noticed this too! And yes, I do believe this could be "evidence" of higher dimensions--but think about this: it is evidence to you, and to me, but in order for us to call it evidence, we had to experience it. This is a special kind of knowledge--spiritual knowledge, you could call it.

To me, this phenomenon shows how self-constructed our own realities truly are. That "flip" into recognizing your surroundings? That's sort of just your brain being able to anticipate its surroundings. It's familiarity, a sense of knowing where you are, as you pointed out. But before that flip--that instantaneous moment--you could literally be ANYWHERE. I mean, doesn't it feel that way? Like, you could be in an infinite number of places, and you may never know? I'm talking about if you took that small moment before the flip, and expanded it into an observable, describable experience. Trippy isn't it? :P


#118    Hugh

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 02:53 AM

View Posthearingcolors, on 14 July 2012 - 08:33 PM, said:

I've noticed this too! And yes, I do believe this could be "evidence" of higher dimensions--but think about this: it is evidence to you, and to me, but in order for us to call it evidence, we had to experience it. This is a special kind of knowledge--spiritual knowledge, you could call it.

Hi hearingcolors. You've experienced VRIs as well? I'd love to hear more about your experiences with them... When did you first notice them, how often do they happen, and can you control them by making them happen by conscious thought?

View Posthearingcolors, on 14 July 2012 - 08:33 PM, said:

To me, this phenomenon shows how self-constructed our own realities truly are. That "flip" into recognizing your surroundings? That's sort of just your brain being able to anticipate its surroundings. It's familiarity, a sense of knowing where you are, as you pointed out. But before that flip--that instantaneous moment--you could literally be ANYWHERE. I mean, doesn't it feel that way? Like, you could be in an infinite number of places, and you may never know? I'm talking about if you took that small moment before the flip, and expanded it into an observable, describable experience. Trippy isn't it? :P

Yes. :)


#119    Pascal0038

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Posted 25 April 2013 - 08:38 AM

I don't believe that everybody can experience those "VRI". Starting to look for informations about that, I found an article from the NYT ( http://www.nytimes.c...wanted=all&_r=0 )
It doesn't deal exactly with the VRI, but there is this insteresting sentence :

Quote

It is not easy for us to conceive how Guugu Yimithirr speakers experience the world, with a crisscrossing of cardinal directions imposed on any mental picture and any piece of graphic memory."

and the example in the previous paragraph :

Quote

One way of understanding this is to imagine that you are traveling with a speaker of such a language and staying in a large chain-style hotel, with corridor upon corridor of identical-looking doors. Your friend is staying in the room opposite yours, and when you go into his room, you’ll see an exact replica of yours: the same bathroom door on the left, the same mirrored wardrobe on the right, the same main room with the same bed on the left, the same curtains drawn behind it, the same desk next to the wall on the right, the same television set on the left corner of the desk and the same telephone on the right. In short, you have seen the same room twice. But when your friend comes into your room, he will see something quite different from this, because everything is reversed north-side-south.

for me it is an evidence that without forcing my mind to do a VRI, the two rooms will look differently. However the author of the article, who is interrested in world perception, seems to be unable to understand what can be different.


#120    Hugh

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Posted 04 May 2013 - 01:53 PM

View PostPascal0038, on 25 April 2013 - 08:38 AM, said:

I don't believe that everybody can experience those "VRI". Starting to look for informations about that, I found an article from the NYT ( http://www.nytimes.c...ed=all&_r=0 )
It doesn't deal exactly with the VRI, but there is this insteresting sentence :


and the example in the previous paragraph :


for me it is an evidence that without forcing my mind to do a VRI, the two rooms will look differently. However the author of the article, who is interrested in world perception, seems to be unable to understand what can be different.

Hi Pascal, welcome to the forum. That was a very interesting article!

It is great to hear you have experienced VRIs as well. Yes, the two rooms would be very different to me as well, because they are oriented 180 degrees oppositely rotated around from each other. It does appear that the author seems unable to understand what is different between the two rooms. I have also found that many people that I have described VRIs to also are not able to discern a spatial difference.

For me, the way a space is oriented has everything to do with how it is perceived and remembered.

It is fascinating to hear the person mentioned in the article, (Guugu Yimithirr) experiences spatial orientation exactly as it is represented in 3D space including exact awareness of the cardinal directions at all times. For me, I have a similar awareness of the cardinal directions as long as I am on a straight line orientational grid. As soon as there are curved streets or underground subway turns though, my orientational bearings get "turned around". When coming back to a place that I normally have seen in a certain orientation, I may find it "turned around" 90 or 180 degrees, and this is where the 90 or 180 degree instant VRI turn "back to normal" takes place.

I wonder if Guugu Yimithirr ever experiences VRIs.

Pascal, I'd like to ask you how long you've experienced VRIs and how much that you are able to make them happen just by thinking about it. Are you able to control them and turn a space around that you are in to the four available orientations at will?





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