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Edgar Mitchell says a lot.......


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#106    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 12:32 AM

View PostScudbuster, on 24 March 2013 - 11:23 PM, said:

Right - but given the current state of affairs - secrecy, denial, feigned indifference, etc , this is all we have to go on - testimony from military & NASA folks.

Problem is I fins is that it is misused. How many times have I posted Edgar Mitchell's own words saying he saw nothing in space, but herd stories on the ground,l yet people still think he saw something in space. 7 pages and Edgars words have been posted several times, yet the ETH'ers do not take note of them. They grabe the words, take the authority of Edgars accomplishment s and then use that to read between the lines to create their own tale. Never has Edgar once said, or implied that he has ever seen anything, he has been very clear about his information coming from outside of this workplace, but accuses his workplace, so the media confuses the two, and people believe it.
It's all contrived.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#107    badeskov

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 12:40 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 25 March 2013 - 12:14 AM, said:

Gidday Bade

I find though that if one Googles Edgar Mitchell, one gets more results on aliens than one does about his real accomplishments. With people so dependant on the net, I do feel this is the wrong thing to do. I personally know a young man whom I know grew up with e good education tried to tell me recently that man did not land on the moon. I was deeply saddened as I know the young man well, and I told him that I was very disappointed in him as I know he had a better education than that, which he seems to have rejected.
I also noticed that when I watched "When We Left Earth" That Coops and Edgar got almost no mention. Many others were interviewed, and goodness knows Edgar enjoys a camera (did he ever sort that NASA Mess out?) but those two got a wide berth. And I guess one canot blame anyone for the decision consider the controversial nature of the alternate agenda these two developed in the interim, with I am sure, plenty assistance from irresponsible media sources.
With so many on the net these days, and so few reading books, I do fear this is a very real concern. I expose my children to as much as is possible with regards to real history but people like Zoser make out an exciting new alternate exists, when it does not.
I hope your right, but I feel perhaps a tad optimistic.

Cheers.

Gidday Psyche,

You may be right and I am probably the eternal optimist in that respect, but I do hope that the kook crowd will not prevail and soil his legacy with these silly stories.

Cheers,
Badeskov

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#108    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 01:49 AM

View Postbadeskov, on 25 March 2013 - 12:40 AM, said:

Gidday Psyche,

You may be right and I am probably the eternal optimist in that respect, but I do hope that the kook crowd will not prevail and soil his legacy with these silly stories.

Cheers,
Badeskov


Gidday Mate

Deep down, I really hope you are right and I am wrong, but when I watched "When We Left Earth" and noticed a distinct lack of Mitchell/Cooper footage and opinion, I had to feel sad right then and there. These men might have been led astray into the land of woo woo, but as you say, it does not for one second detract from the amazing feats and accomplishments we have seen from these men, and the inspiration they give us to push harder which well exceeds their lifespans and accomplishments.

I just hope of we point out to a few what the kooks are doing that word might get around on the good side, I would hate for a new mind to have such a bad impression to be the first thing imprinted on it. I'd like to have more faith in mankind, but when we get even Nuclear Physicists running around and making up Aliens that seem to have become a part of everyday culture, and believed, my faith in humanity falters. That people look up to these kooks and believe they are 100% genuine is a diservice to social order I feel, particularly for the kooks whom we know, know better. I just expect educated people to be more responsible, but alas, that is too big an ask.

Cheers.

Edited by psyche101, 25 March 2013 - 01:50 AM.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#109    Scudbuster

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 02:00 AM

View Postpsyche101, on 25 March 2013 - 12:32 AM, said:

Problem is I fins is that it is misused. How many times have I posted Edgar Mitchell's own words saying he saw nothing in space, but herd stories on the ground,l yet people still think he saw something in space. 7 pages and Edgars words have been posted several times, yet the ETH'ers do not take note of them. They grabe the words, take the authority of Edgars accomplishment s and then use that to read between the lines to create their own tale. Never has Edgar once said, or implied that he has ever seen anything, he has been very clear about his information coming from outside of this workplace, but accuses his workplace, so the media confuses the two, and people believe it.
It's all contrived.

No argument with you there - what I heard was the accumulation of stories that others confided in him over the years.


#110    JimOberg

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 07:23 AM

It's a valid question to look into Mitchell's 'will to believe' paranormal interpretations of events, such as his bold but fatally sloppy space ESP experiment results. I'm intrigued by his accoun t of Uri Geller's success at 'teleporting' a lost personal item, a broken tie tack, during a meeting at Geller's home. Mitchell had challenged him to teleport back his camera he left on the Moon. Not long afterwards, the tie tack 'mysteriously' dropped out of thin air in front of him.

My simple question is -- did Mitchell drive his own car to Geller's home, and in the hours between the challenge to teleport something impossible, and the appearance of the tie tack, had Mitchell's car been locked? To be blunt, would it have been possible for some trickster -- as we know Geller to always have been -- to have snuck outside [or sent a confederate outside] to rifle behind the car seat cushions and elsewhere to dig out the detritus of years of living that EVERYbody's car seats accumulate? And opportunistically discover a personal item that he could then dramatically conjure up with a flick of his wrist in front of a clearly eager-to-believe Mitchell?

Such a scenario, along with his remote-healing experience, would help establish a consistent pattern of gullibility and willful misinterpretation in which the Roswell UFO tales fit very nicely.


#111    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 07:51 AM

View PostJimOberg, on 25 March 2013 - 07:23 AM, said:

It's a valid question to look into Mitchell's 'will to believe' paranormal interpretations of events, such as his bold but fatally sloppy space ESP experiment results. I'm intrigued by his accoun t of Uri Geller's success at 'teleporting' a lost personal item, a broken tie tack, during a meeting at Geller's home. Mitchell had challenged him to teleport back his camera he left on the Moon. Not long afterwards, the tie tack 'mysteriously' dropped out of thin air in front of him.

My simple question is -- did Mitchell drive his own car to Geller's home, and in the hours between the challenge to teleport something impossible, and the appearance of the tie tack, had Mitchell's car been locked? To be blunt, would it have been possible for some trickster -- as we know Geller to always have been -- to have snuck outside [or sent a confederate outside] to rifle behind the car seat cushions and elsewhere to dig out the detritus of years of living that EVERYbody's car seats accumulate? And opportunistically discover a personal item that he could then dramatically conjure up with a flick of his wrist in front of a clearly eager-to-believe Mitchell?

Such a scenario, along with his remote-healing experience, would help establish a consistent pattern of gullibility and willful misinterpretation in which the Roswell UFO tales fit very nicely.

That's quite possible, I had always assumed that Edgar gave Uri a god description, and Uri simply hunted down a similar item. It seems some time since Edgar had seen it, so I am not entirely convinced it was "The" Tie Tack. Edgar seems all to eager for a healthy result, I have no doubt his enthusiasm got the better of him.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#112    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 07:52 AM

View PostScudbuster, on 25 March 2013 - 02:00 AM, said:

No argument with you there - what I heard was the accumulation of stories that others confided in him over the years.

Indeed, but some of those stories came from sources like Stephen Greer and Bob Lazar, not the best references.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#113    quillius

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 05:37 PM

View PostJimOberg, on 25 March 2013 - 07:23 AM, said:

It's a valid question to look into Mitchell's 'will to believe' paranormal interpretations of events, such as his bold but fatally sloppy space ESP experiment results. I'm intrigued by his accoun t of Uri Geller's success at 'teleporting' a lost personal item, a broken tie tack, during a meeting at Geller's home. Mitchell had challenged him to teleport back his camera he left on the Moon. Not long afterwards, the tie tack 'mysteriously' dropped out of thin air in front of him.

My simple question is -- did Mitchell drive his own car to Geller's home, and in the hours between the challenge to teleport something impossible, and the appearance of the tie tack, had Mitchell's car been locked? To be blunt, would it have been possible for some trickster -- as we know Geller to always have been -- to have snuck outside [or sent a confederate outside] to rifle behind the car seat cushions and elsewhere to dig out the detritus of years of living that EVERYbody's car seats accumulate? And opportunistically discover a personal item that he could then dramatically conjure up with a flick of his wrist in front of a clearly eager-to-believe Mitchell?

Such a scenario, along with his remote-healing experience, would help establish a consistent pattern of gullibility and willful misinterpretation in which the Roswell UFO tales fit very nicely.

Hello Jim,

I looked at the links you provided but still cannot find the specifics of his 'test'. Without the numbers I cannot see how we can understand which of, either his 3000-1 odds or the more 'skeptical' touted 25-1 is correct.

With regards to the tie tack discussed above, didnt he say this happened in a 'lab' somewhere also when only he and one other person was present?

I can see how the car could 'possibly' be a plant but not so much the other (if this is true of course)

hmmm as for Mitchell and ' willful misinterpretation ' ....I havent seen this happen can you again please be specific as to where this has happened.

thanks


#114    Valdemar the Great

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 05:46 PM

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 24 March 2013 - 11:35 AM, said:

Where NASA messed up is those test pilots turned astronauts live on adrenaline. Problem is there is a long list of UFO landings, UFO Landing feet cases, scambling after UFOs. I do not believe astronauts would be talking about UFOs, details that others report, if there was nothing to it. It's more likely the astronauts are brave enough to go against the monster of a sad system we live in. Astronauts who are brave enough to talk about the truth are still the hero's.
Actually a test pilot who lived on adrenaline wouldn't last very long. The thing you need to be a test pilot is not to be an adrenalien junkie, it's to be calm and methodical. As they say, there are old pilots, and there are bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

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:cat:


#115    topsecretresearch

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 08:33 PM

View PostLord Vetinari, on 25 March 2013 - 05:46 PM, said:

Actually a test pilot who lived on adrenaline wouldn't last very long. The thing you need to be a test pilot is not to be an adrenalien junkie, it's to be calm and methodical. As they say, there are old pilots, and there are bold pilots, but there are no old, bold pilots.


Chuck Yeager Pushing The Limits (The Right Stuff)


#116    topsecretresearch

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM

View Postpsyche101, on 25 March 2013 - 12:05 AM, said:

Lousy sidestep there.

And no, it does not seem very plausible.

It's just spin drivel. Someone disputes Cooper. This someobe could be covering things up or lying.

All the UFO testimony by Gordon Cooper matches what others have reported. He could be making up stories but I tend to believe UFOs are bieng covered-up and the gist of such testimony is true.

View Postpsyche101, on 25 March 2013 - 12:05 AM, said:

Of course you would believe it. You grasp at every straw left hanging.
"Astronauts" do not go out on a limb, each one has a very different experience and epiphany to share, with Cooper, he has a case of sour grapes to share. I respect what he did, I find it very hard to respect his actions since Shepherd was granted captain of Apollo 13, obviously later relocated to Apollo 14 and 13 reassigned to Lovell.

Ain't it a massive coincidence that the Astronaut with bad blood is the one reporting seeing flying saucers.



As a speaker at UFO clubs and the poster boy for UFOlogy, what on earth would you expect?

More spin doctoring nonsense.

From: The UFO Encyclopedia by Margaret Sachs


Although they were not involved in any UFO sightings, astronauts Eugene Cernan, Edgar Mitchell, and Harrison Schmitt have spoken out in the possibility that earth has been visited by extraterrestrials.

Gordon Cooper, astronaut who observed UFOs stated, "Intelligent beings from other planets regularly visit our world in an effort to enter into contact with us...NASA and the American government know this and possess a great deal of evidence. Nevertheless, the remain silent in order not to alarm people....I am dedicated to forcing the authorities to end their silence."

Rumor purports that Apollo 11 astronauts observed and filmed two UFOs that landed near the lunar module. The film has supposedly been put under tight security wraps by NASA. The agency denies that any such sighting ever occurred.

:yes:


#117    psyche101

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Posted 25 March 2013 - 11:44 PM

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

It's just spin drivel. Someone disputes Cooper. This someobe could be covering things up or lying.

What is drivel is still trying to believe without bothering to investigate the supplied information, which makes more sense than the extraordinary claim. You see a bullet coming for your favourite camp fire story and you are trying to dodge it.

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

All the UFO testimony by Gordon Cooper matches what others have reported. He could be making up stories but I tend to believe UFOs are bieng covered-up and the gist of such testimony is true.

As I said, of course it does, Coops is on the net, in the papers, every place he can be - like he has a vendetta. And there is reason to believe he does. Allan Shepherd. THis is inspiration to people, when blockbuster movies come out it inspires UFO reports, sometimes as part of a marketing campaign, sometimes just because the subject is hot. The gist is Sci Fi.

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

More spin doctoring nonsense.

Well, Quillius see's that as a positive trait, and he is better at this than you are, so I am OK with that.

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

From: The UFO Encyclopedia by Margaret Sachs

LOL, ohhhh the encyclopedia of UFO's !!

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

Although they were not involved in any UFO sightings, astronauts Eugene Cernan, Edgar Mitchell, and Harrison Schmitt have spoken out in the possibility that earth has been visited by extraterrestrials.

Big deal so have I, we may even have received an alien signal with the WOW! signal, but no convincing evidence to confirm interstellar visitation exists.

There are two types of believers I feel, one lot down there with the Ickes, the Lazars, the Adamski's, The Stitichin's, and because some of that fringe group wave qualifications around people think there is some sort of genuine investigation is going on, but people like Friedman and Greer still belong at the bottom of the barrel with the other verified crackpots. But there is hope, the Drakes, the Hawking's, the Hynek's, the Sagan's who rise above this rubbish to actually show some real initiative and try so solve this conundrum of how to reach out to other species. This is the contingent that the other borrows credibility from to get as far as they do, but despite their personal evaluations of themselves, they only contribute toward a reverse momentum with regards to the subject.

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

Gordon Cooper, astronaut who observed UFOs stated, "Intelligent beings from other planets regularly visit our world in an effort to enter into contact with us...NASA and the American government know this and possess a great deal of evidence. Nevertheless, the remain silent in order not to alarm people....I am dedicated to forcing the authorities to end their silence."

In an effort? You have got to be kidding me? A species can cross space and they struggle to make contact with an intelligent species?

What alarm? What a load of malarky, I sure hope you do not think ORson Wells is some sort of support for this outrageous nonsense. The world has evolved and developed, we are not in war times, there is no fear, that is a crock. I cannot believe you would be sucked in by such corny rhetoric.

Private Enterprise has the means to monitor space just as well as the Government, in fact NASA is becoming if not already largely privatised. So you can take the Government element back out again.

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

Rumor purports that Apollo 11 astronauts observed and filmed two UFOs that landed near the lunar module. The film has supposedly been put under tight security wraps by NASA. The agency denies that any such sighting ever occurred.

:yes:


Please do go on.

Posted Image

Come on, ante up, I know the tale, spit it out man, who tells that tall tale? Lets analyse your claim shall we?

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#118    JimOberg

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 01:30 AM

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 09:55 PM, said:

It's just spin drivel. Someone disputes Cooper. This someone could be covering things up or lying.

All the UFO testimony by Gordon Cooper matches what others have reported. He could be making up stories but I tend to believe UFOs are bieng covered-up and the gist of such testimony is true.

All investigation into his stories shows that exactly the opposite is true. Every other claimed witness, everyone else involved directly or peripherally with these alleged Cooper events, tells stories mutually consistent but grossly at variance with the 'Cooper version'. And you can check this out youself -- see for example the James McCampbell account of the 1957 Edwards AFB event.


Is it your view that EVERYONE ELSE is lying?


Now, the notion that UFO Cooper's stories might be 'improved' or dramatized to please his intended audiences would suggest that he did this consistently in related fields such as space flights he made. And when checking his versions of his space missions, indeed one finds many examples of exactly that: enhancement of garbled half-facts that are again totally inconsistent with every other historical record and recollection of these space flights.

Where do you draw the line in admitting Cooper MAY have severely distorted ANY of his stories?

Quote


From: The UFO Encyclopedia by Margaret Sachs

Although they were not involved in any UFO sightings, astronauts Eugene Cernan, Edgar Mitchell, and Harrison Schmitt have spoken out in the possibility that earth has been visited by extraterrestrials.

Mitchell, we all agree, was relaying hearsay. He had no personal experience in space or on Earth.

Re Cernan and Schmitt:  That's what Sachs says they said, but nobody seems to be able to find any source where THEY are directly quoted as saying it. I have known both men for decades. They both assure me that any alleged quotations of theirs supporting the idea of secret proofs of alien Earth visits are bogus, made up by writers to thrill their target audiences.

Quote

Gordon Cooper, astronaut who observed UFOs stated, "Intelligent beings from other planets regularly visit our world in an effort to enter into contact with us...NASA and the American government know this and possess a great deal of evidence. Nevertheless, the remain silent in order not to alarm people....I am dedicated to forcing the authorities to end their silence."

This is supposedly a quotation from an Italian journalist named Ferrando, a translation from Italian of the original article that translated from English. The original interview transcript and tape seem to have vanished from this planet, if they ever existed at all.

Quote

Rumor purports that Apollo 11 astronauts observed and filmed two UFOs that landed near the lunar module. The film has supposedly been put under tight security wraps by NASA. The agency denies that any such sighting ever occurred.

Rumors do indeed purport this. All alleged participants and sources of such stories calmly explain, again and again, that the rumors are BS, counterfeit mind-candy for naive UFO nuts.

You seem determined to cling to non-evidenced rumors while resolutely closing your mind and eyes to checkable investigative reports on these claims. Is there any evidence you can offer, in the face of this pathetic behavior, that you are actually a reasonable, rational, straight-thinking human being?


#119    Valdemar the Great

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 08:03 AM

View Posttopsecretresearch, on 25 March 2013 - 08:33 PM, said:

You're taking the film The Right Stuff as evidence of the day to day work of a test pilot? (and note I'm talking about the everyday work of a Test pilot, not one-off occasions like breaking the Sound barrier).

Edited by Lord Vetinari, 26 March 2013 - 08:05 AM.

Life is a hideous business, and from the background behind what we know of it peer daemoniacal hints of truth which make it sometimes a thousandfold more hideous.

H. P. Lovecraft.


:cat:


#120    Hazzard

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 08:53 AM

View PostJimOberg, on 26 March 2013 - 01:30 AM, said:

You seem determined to cling to non-evidenced rumors while resolutely closing your mind and eyes to checkable investigative reports on these claims. Is there any evidence you can offer, in the face of this pathetic behavior, that you are actually a reasonable, rational, straight-thinking human being?

This is one of those not so flattering personality traits topsecretresearch share with many of the ET on Earth believers.

Sad really.

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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