93 replies to this topic

[Setton]

TrueBeliever, on 09 September 2012 - 11:04 PM, said:

unlike with christianity I do not scare little kids(or adults) with the threat of hell and eternal damnation if they do not think like i do. I encourage people to think.

Christianity proposes absurd untestable hypotheses and then screams you can't question it! it is divine command! I know because God tells me...lol..........can you NOT see the problem with that? I encourage questioning and talking and analyzing......christianity does not....and it threatens bodily and spiritual harm if one dares stray from its doctrines.

Say rather that some denominations of Christianity propose absurd hypotheses and...

All it takes to be a 'Christian' really is to follow the teachings of Jesus. Given that the only source of these is a book written by men that contradict itself, it is up to the individual in question as to what they feel the real message is. In that way, Christianity can be a very personal faith. Generalisations such as those you mention and throughout this forum are understandable. If people don't make a fuss about their faith and allow everyone else to get on with their lives, it does not make the news or an interesting forum topic. If, however, they try to force them on others or make inflammatory comments, someone will get offended and people assume everyone under that label is the same. It's unhelpful to tar everyone with the same brush. As such, I'd say judge people as individuals not by a label. That goes for any group not just Christians.

[Bling]

Setton, on 10 September 2012 - 09:10 PM, said:

Topic title:
I'm an atheist who understands christians


That may be where the confusion is coming from.

What would you like me to call the topic, bearing in mind I am limited to a certain amount of letters? I really don't think some people are understanding my meaning behind this topic, I was trying to be nice.....

[The world needs you]

If you believe this is a topic that riles others up and you have to try to be nice about...that reveals much about your approach but little about the approach of others.

Accusing others of your own disposition will not change that but not everyone is approaching this as you.

This whole topic was meant to put down others. That is not understanding them.

Edited by Chasingtherabbit, 10 September 2012 - 10:15 PM.

[Setton]

Bling Zombie, on 10 September 2012 - 10:03 PM, said:

What would you like me to call the topic, bearing in mind I am limited to a certain amount of letters? I really don't think some people are understanding my meaning behind this topic, I was trying to be nice.....

Maybe 'I'm an atheist who used to be Christian'. As that seems to be the only real message to be gained from the topic.

Perhaps you do think you were trying to be nice but the way it comes across is condescending; suggesting that because you have been both a christian and atheist people should just take whatever you say even if they find it offensive. It looks rather like you're setting yourself up to go an a tirade about Christianity so that, when people call you out on it, you can point to this topic and say 'but I used to be one so I understand what's offensive to you better than you do'.

Not saying that's your intention, just how it comes across.

[The world needs you]

This thread is also proof that just because one is or was part of something does not mean they understand it.

[Bling]

I don't see how my topic and original post was in any way offensive to christians. I can only suggest the haters read it again with an open mind. People have been offensive to me by saying I don't understand what it is to be a christian and even criticising the title of the topic! Come on, bigger picture here! I was merely giving things from my persceptive and experience, I never said I was right.

I'm getting bored of this now!!!

[Setton]

Bling Zombie, on 10 September 2012 - 11:04 PM, said:

I don't see how my topic and original post was in any way offensive to christians. I can only suggest the haters read it again with an open mind. People have been offensive to me by saying I don't understand what it is to be a christian and even criticising the title of the topic! Come on, bigger picture here! I was merely giving things from my persceptive and experience, I never said I was right.

I'm getting bored of this now!!!

Well if you're going to give a title then claim it's not what you meant, people will criticise.

As far as I have seen, there are no 'haters' here, merely those who disagree with you. I repeat, if you're not prepared for that, don't start a topic.

You weren't merely giving your experiences and things from your perspective. You went further by saying that these meant you understood Christians. And yet when people point out that you actually only understand a subset of Christians, you become upset. You explicitly said in your OP that, as you had once been a Christian, you would never say anything that was offensive towards them. Yet who are you to judge what someone may be offended by? As I previously stated, I am sure many people would be offended by you referring to parts of their faith as 'fairy tales' yet you did that right in the first post.

I'm not trying to antagonise you or make enemies here, I'm merely suggesting that you put some more thought and consideration into things before claiming to understand something.

As for an open mind, I would no longer really identify myself as a Christian but I don't have a better word. Does that mean I understand them or what it is to be them? No. In fact, as you will see from my sig, I am rather baffled by the approach some of them take. I subscribe rather to the quote from Marcus Aurelius on the left <---

[TrueBeliever]

Bling Zombie, on 10 September 2012 - 11:04 PM, said:

I don't see how my topic and original post was in any way offensive to christians. I can only suggest the haters read it again with an open mind. People have been offensive to me by saying I don't understand what it is to be a christian and even criticising the title of the topic! Come on, bigger picture here! I was merely giving things from my persceptive and experience, I never said I was right.

I'm getting bored of this now!!!

you weren't offensive, but sometimes certain individual christians don't want anything said about them unless it is positively glowing.

[Bling]

TrueBeliever, on 10 September 2012 - 11:23 PM, said:

you weren't offensive, but sometimes certain individual christians don't want anything said about them unless it is positively glowing.

Thank you sweetie (((hugs)))

I understand their attitude, I used to be the same! That's the whole point of this topic, but some people have missed the point entirely!

[Setton]

TrueBeliever, on 10 September 2012 - 11:23 PM, said:

you weren't offensive, but sometimes certain individual christians don't want anything said about them unless it is positively glowing.

Bling Zombie, on 10 September 2012 - 11:51 PM, said:

Thank you sweetie (((hugs)))

I understand their attitude, I used to be the same! That's the whole point of this topic, but some people have missed the point entirely!

Well that's both of you showing a complete failure to understand people here.

[The world needs you]

Bling Zombie, on 10 September 2012 - 11:51 PM, said:

Thank you sweetie (((hugs)))

I understand their attitude, I used to be the same! That's the whole point of this topic, but some people have missed the point entirely!

Doubt you used to be the same. Some want Christians and atheists to accept each other. You don't seem to want that.

[Bling]

You crack me up!

[TrueBeliever]

Bling, on 11 September 2012 - 09:45 PM, said:

You crack me up!

Sometimes some christians feel threatened if we don't worship them. And at heart believe we are heretic infidels. It is in their ideology, their dogma and their doctrines. The Bible says some pretty nasty things about you and me Bling. No matter how warm and welcoming some christians may be, their guidebook, their Bible says we are screwed, we are dead.  And they truly believe THEY know what will save us.......granted we are not lost or in need of saving but they are taught this. Most mean well, but there are always those individials that are just petty and mean and argumentative.  Christianity calls criticism persecution, but feels free and duty bound to berate and look down on the unbeliever...at least they don't burn us at the stake anymore. Progress......it is slow, but they are getting there. Christianity IS a kinder, gentler tyranny now...I mean some folks don't even believe in hell anymore! lol.......very odd to go so long being taught about how I am going to hell..then boom they find out it isn't good PR and they just hit delete! there we go all better now! the revising and editing to try and be civilized is something to watch. They've come a long way baby!

Edited by TrueBeliever, 12 September 2012 - 10:13 AM.

[Ugly1]

Bling, on 08 September 2012 - 11:59 PM, said:

I now regard myself as an atheist but my experience with the christian faith was once a huge part of my life, so I can totally understand the views and morals christian follow. I no longer believe there is a god but for a good few years I was extremely devoted and evangelical, so much so that I got caught up in a cult in my quest to be the best christian I could be. The group I got mixed up with believed they were the one true church of the bible, the church that was set up by jesus' disciples, and not part of the false religions of this world. I was convinced I was going to hell if I did not repent of my sin, be baptised by full immersion, receive the holy spirit and follow the church and bible without question. I was brought up by christian parents who were in the baptist church, so I was indoctrinated from a very early age - I just believed it to be true. So when this group came along I praised god for bringing me into his true church, I had been searching for years for a church who followed the bible fully. I was baptised into this church by full immersion (in a baptisimal tank) within the week of hearing the word of god, and was told that I must receive the holy spirit in order to be saved and be a member of the church. The sign of being filled with the spirit was to speak in tongues, and everyone, even the children who had received the spirit spoke in tongues. I was desperate to be saved from armageddon and hell that I automatically accepted all I was told and within a few weeks I was speaking in tongues. I attended the meetings every wednesday evening, twice on sunday (with a break for dinner inbetween) and every friday with the young peoples group. I told everyone I knew that they had to be saved and if they didn't they would go to hell. I knew the bible like the back of my hand and got great comfort from it as I have had more than my fair share of tough times. I had to break off friendships with anyone who didn't follow the church, including family, and was pushed into speaking gods word whenever I could. I was not popular at work because I was seen as a jesus freak, but that just fed my inner martyr so I talked about things even more. I prayed in tongues twice a day, on my knees, and read the bible scriptures that god revealed to me while I was praying. I believed firmly that jesus was to return soon to this earth after a world nuclear war, started by the russians, and I as I was one of the saved I would be taken up to be with him. Then I would join jesus in the huge task of judging every human who ever lived and once the unbelievers were cast into hell with satan, I would live in a new heaven and earth with the lord. All this I was told was backed up by passages in the bible, so to me it seemed unquestionable. I felt special, I was told I was one of an elite few of true christians who was separated from the false religions of this world. I judged people by the word of god and felt justified in doing so. I was a saint.

However, I'm had a nagging doubt and soon began to question the interpretation of some of the scriptures and after much emotional struggle I left the church. Afterwards I was haunted for 7 years, believing I was going to hell and bad things would happen to me, so much so that after a 7 year break I joined the church again! I was so brainwashed, scared, lonely and vulnerable that I saw no other way to live my life. After a further 2 years of constantly resenting the fact I was called by god to be in his true church, and questioning my faith daily, I once again left. As soon as I did I realised to myself just how deluded I had been - I had believed all these things without ever seeing, hearing or experiencing one piece of evidence. Over the years I have accepted that religion is not for me and that actually I don't believe a word of it now. Even if it was true I wouldn't want to follow god as I can't stand the 'love me or I'll kill you' attitude the god of the bible has. It's all fairy tales to me now, and I am no longer scared and waiting for the end of the world, I can enjoy life fully without fear of doing or saying the wrong thing. I feel liberated from the chains that my faith bound me with.

So if any christians on this forum ever think I am disrespecting their opinion, I'm not. I'm just never going to agree with any christianity ever again, or any other religion. I don't believe the bible is the word of god, I don't believe god exists because if he did he would have heard my heartfelt prayers and not let me suffer, and I don't believe in a god who can turn his back on his creation for so long, day after day, with the promise one day he'll sort everything out once he feels mankind has suffered enough. The whole thing just sounds ridiculous to me now!

Feel free to ask me any questions as there's loads more I could say!

What are you trying to get from religion? You said that you were judging people and felt that you had the right to do this. Jesus is the only one that will be able to judge you for your deeds. You are not a judge, as well as I am not a judge. Keep in mind that when you are hearing scripture, that Satan/Lucifer knows that bible as well as any man. Just because you have someone reading a bible to you, does not mean that you must take every word that they say as true. From what I understand, the bible will speak to you through the Holy Spirit. I often have times where a verse in the bible means something to me, and the preacher will explain it as something else. Sometimes I will understand the logic behind the preachers view point and accept it, while other times I cannot be bothered to change my mind as I feel the Holy Spirit is trying to tell me something.

I was an athiest so to speak for a while. What a lonely existence. What are you if you are going to die here and not be born again? That is a path that you must walk, but I would be careful not to shepherd others away from the lord with your words. Although I love the lord now, I feel that my atheist blasphemies may cause me to not have salvation. I know the lord loves me and forgives, but I may have led a child from light and that just scares the crap out of me.
Mark 9:42

“Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him if a great millstone were hung around his neck and he were thrown into the sea.

[Bling]

Ugly1, on 12 September 2012 - 11:49 PM, said:

What are you trying to get from religion? You said that you were judging people and felt that you had the right to do this. Jesus is the only one that will be able to judge you for your deeds. You are not a judge, as well as I am not a judge. Keep in mind that when you are hearing scripture, that Satan/Lucifer knows that bible as well as any man. Just because you have someone reading a bible to you, does not mean that you must take every word that they say as true. From what I understand, the bible will speak to you through the Holy Spirit. I often have times where a verse in the bible means something to me, and the preacher will explain it as something else. Sometimes I will understand the logic behind the preachers view point and accept it, while other times I cannot be bothered to change my mind as I feel the Holy Spirit is trying to tell me something.

I was an athiest so to speak for a while. What a lonely existence. What are you if you are going to die here and not be born again? That is a path that you must walk, but I would be careful not to shepherd others away from the lord with your words. Although I love the lord now, I feel that my atheist blasphemies may cause me to not have salvation. I know the lord loves me and forgives, but I may have led a child from light and that just scares the crap out of me.
Mark 9:42

“Whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him if a great millstone were hung around his neck and he were thrown into the sea.

Please do not preach to me - ever! I will not even comment on your post.