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Is feeding your children raw vegan diet nuts


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#61    Coffey

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 10:38 AM

View PostQueen in the North, on 25 March 2013 - 11:18 PM, said:

We aren't in the US, as far as I'm concerned the FDA can do what they want.

Can I have some sources for this statement though?

MHRA is practically the same thing as the FDA, they are just as corrupt.

http://informaticsou...services/?p=159

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#62    bmk1245

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 12:12 PM

View PostCoffey, on 25 March 2013 - 06:03 PM, said:

I have natural Spirulina from a company who sources it from fair trade etc, not some pharmacutical supplement. I would never touch anything from a pharmaceutical company. They lie all the time and don't care about peoples health. They create customers not cure people.
Those who put all known adverse effects on the label are bad, and those who falsely claim Spirulina has B12 are good. Nice...

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
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If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#63    bmk1245

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 12:15 PM

View PostAliveInDeath7, on 26 March 2013 - 01:59 AM, said:

Apple and Moses? Really..
No wonder I've lost faith in mankind..
[...]
Few wackily crazy Liths is not the reason to loose faith in mankind... :innocent:

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#64    Coffey

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 03:57 PM

View Postbmk1245, on 26 March 2013 - 12:12 PM, said:

Those who put all known adverse effects on the label are bad, and those who falsely claim Spirulina has B12 are good. Nice...

Yeah I'm sure Bayer put HIV as an adverse affect on the label.... :whistle:

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#65    bmk1245

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 07:59 PM

View PostCoffey, on 26 March 2013 - 03:57 PM, said:

Yeah I'm sure Bayer put HIV as an adverse affect on the label.... :whistle:
No. That was bad.
I'm not saying path of the pharmaceutical companies is without bumps, but, how many people were helped with not infected treatment? You, I suppose, know that number, don't you?

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#66    Coffey

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 08:09 PM

View Postbmk1245, on 26 March 2013 - 07:59 PM, said:

No. That was bad.
I'm not saying path of the pharmaceutical companies is without bumps, but, how many people were helped with not infected treatment? You, I suppose, know that number, don't you?

How many people where given a disease that has plagued a country and forced countless charities to throw money at pharmaceutical companies for more drugs to try and cure etc.

The fact is if you eat the right thing and use natural remedies you would never need pharmaceuticals. Pharmaceuticals are mostly natural things that have been synthesized and then messed around with.

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#67    bmk1245

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 08:36 PM

View PostCoffey, on 26 March 2013 - 08:09 PM, said:

How many people where given a disease that has plagued a country and forced countless charities to throw money at pharmaceutical companies for more drugs to try and cure etc.
[...].
Heh, name one disease country was plagued by pharmaceutical companies.

View PostCoffey, on 26 March 2013 - 08:09 PM, said:

[...]
The fact is if you eat the right thing and use natural remedies you would never need pharmaceuticals. Pharmaceuticals are mostly natural things that have been synthesized and then messed around with.
... and you'd be probably dead by now (if not haven't been born) if not modern medicine. What is the life expectancy in, for example, Mongolia (plenty of natural healers, no wars, and less modern medicine), huh? You don't realize (B12 deficiency?) that herbs have "bad" stuff besides "good". Should I provide you with scientific paper on that? Just ask me, I'll send you.

Edited by bmk1245, 26 March 2013 - 08:37 PM.

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#68    Coffey

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Posted 26 March 2013 - 09:03 PM

View Postbmk1245, on 26 March 2013 - 08:36 PM, said:

Heh, name one disease country was plagued by pharmaceutical companies.

Africa.... Aids, as proven already in this thread.

View Postbmk1245, on 26 March 2013 - 08:36 PM, said:

... and you'd be probably dead by now (if not haven't been born) if not modern medicine. What is the life expectancy in, for example, Mongolia (plenty of natural healers, no wars, and less modern medicine), huh? You don't realize (B12 deficiency?) that herbs have "bad" stuff besides "good". Should I provide you with scientific paper on that? Just ask me, I'll send you.


Would I really? Cause I've hardly ever had pharmaceutical drugs in my life. I certainly haven't touched them in the last 3 years and been far healthier.

That's a ridicules argument, what does some herbs being bad for us have to do with anything. lol As for Mongolians, they live in a tundra environment, to even consider using them as an example is clutching desperately at straws. lol

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#69    bmk1245

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Posted 27 March 2013 - 08:26 AM

View PostCoffey, on 26 March 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

Africa.... Aids, as proven already in this thread.
[...]
Which was born in Africa...

View PostCoffey, on 26 March 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

[...]
Would I really? Cause I've hardly ever had pharmaceutical drugs in my life. I certainly haven't touched them in the last 3 years and been far healthier.
[...]
Its not evening yet, just wait...

View PostCoffey, on 26 March 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

[...]
That's a ridicules argument, what does some herbs being bad for us have to do with anything. lol As for Mongolians, they live in a tundra environment, to even consider using them as an example is clutching desperately at straws. lol
Are you saying TMM is BS?! Holy...

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#70    Coffey

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Posted 27 March 2013 - 11:21 AM

View Postbmk1245, on 27 March 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

Which was born in Africa...

Might want to learn your history there, that was only a theory and not a fact and that is going down the SIV evolving into HIV route. Which is often said to be impossible without Human intervention.... Hence why ther eis so many theories about Humans creating HIV in a lab from using SIV.... Then Bayer selling it to Africa.... Then Africa having an Aids problem.

The first recognized cases of Aids where in the US in 1980 NOT Africa.

"This could explain more than the spread of HIV-1: it may account for the emergence of HIV-2, the less common Aids strain, which is most closely related to a virus that infects another monkey, the sooty mangabey, in west Africa. But these ideas are speculative. The origins of Aids remain mysterious."

Source: http://www.telegraph...-come-from.html


View Postbmk1245, on 27 March 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

Are you saying TMM is BS?! Holy...

I didn't even mention that... They live in a tundra environment, it's far harsher than what we live in.

When the power of love overcomes the love of power, the world will know peace.

#71    ouija ouija

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Posted 27 March 2013 - 11:57 PM

View PostTheLastLazyGun, on 24 March 2013 - 07:17 PM, said:

Of course, humans aren't supposed to be vegetarians.  Humans are omnivores not herbivores.  This means that the healthiest diet for the human body is an omnivorous diet of both vegetables AND meat, not one or the other.

What these stupid parents don't realise is that whilst their vegan diet may be making them and their kids feel healthier, such an effect is only a short-term effect.  Over the long-term, however, such a diet eventually causes problems.

And what are the health problems caused by a vegan diet?  Here they are:
  • inadequate milk production for nursing mothers, as well as retarded physical and mental development in some children who are strictly on a vegan or raw food diet (someone especially needs to let the parents in that article know about this);
  • slow metabolism leading to a much less robust lifestyle;
  • a general lack of vitality;
  • low body temperature (always cold);
  • a weak, touchy digestive system with a loss of digestive strength (unable to metabolize food quickly, have to be careful what you eat, how much, must practice food combining to be able to digest food, etc.);
  • food cravings (especially among women);
  • stalled weight loss because metabolism is too low (predominately in women);
  • inability to gain weight, resulting in shrunken, cadaverous-looking bodies (predominately in men);
  • weight gains from overeating on carbohydrates;
  • amenorrhea (menstrual cycles cease), even in young women;
  • loss of libido;
  • hair loss and nail problems;
  • dental cavities, tooth loss, and gum problems;
  • joint pain
  • inability to conceive
So these parents may think they are making themselves and their children healthier by eating only vegetables and shunning meat and dairy products, but they are doing so only in the shortiterm.   If they keep doing it then their health will start to become worse due to them not receiving all the proper vitamins and minerals they need and they could start suffering some quite serious health problems.

Hopefully this post will shock any vegans reading it into changing their diet to include meat and dairy products.

View PostTheLastLazyGun, on 24 March 2013 - 07:27 PM, said:

No, it isn't.  Do you realise the harm you are doing by only eating raw food?

Vegans persist in thinking that eating only raw food is good for you because they believe it is "natural".  After all, aren't animals SUPPOSED to eat only raw food?

In fact scientists such as evolutionary biologists are now of the opinion that humans have been used to eating cooked food for such a long time - a few million years - that the human body now needs cooked food to stay healthy.  Evolution has caused us to need cooked food.

Studies have suggested that eating meat and COOKING food made us human, enabling the brains of our prehuman ancestors to grow dramatically over a period of a few million years, making us the extremely intelligent species we are today.  It would have been biologically implausible for humans to evolve such a large brain on a raw, vegan diet and that meat-eating was a crucial element of human evolution at least 1 million years before the dawn of homo sapiens.

Denise Minger wrote about the dangers of eating only raw food in her book "Raw Gone Wrong, When the Honeymoon is Over":

"…Almost without fail, the beginning of the diet yields a brilliant honeymoon phase—filled with surging energy, renewed vigor, and zest for your lively cuisine.

But somewhere down the line—months for some people, years for others—the wonder starts to wane. Maybe you start feeling like something is inexplicably missing. Maybe your energy takes a dive and noontime naps become the norm. Maybe your weight loss plateaus. Maybe your last dentist visit wasn’t so pretty. Maybe those niggly health problems you had prior to raw—aches and pains, lethargy, allergies, arthritis, skin conditions—start resurfacing out of nowhere. Whatever the reason, raw just doesn’t seem to be working as well as it did in the beginning. Your enthusiasm diminishes, and in its place comes doubt, discontentment, and a plethora of questions.

In other words, you start seeing raw foods’ freaky nose hairs and you begin to wonder: what did I get myself into?

My own raw honeymoon ended around the one-year mark. Intermittent fatigue, dental woes, hair loss, concentration problems, and some not-so-happy blood test results forced me to rethink the dietary regimen I was so tightly clutching. During this time, I started scouting out the counsel and wisdom of other disgruntled rawbies. What I discovered was this “honeymoon end” was a common phenomenon among raw foodists, and that its occurrence usually led to two things:

1. an expulsion from the raw community for being a dissenter or pot-stirrer for doubting the diet, and
2. a foray into other dietary regimens, such as paleo, low-carb, cooked vegan, macrobiotic, or ayurvedic."

Several people have asked questions about what you have posted here ....... won't you come back and explain further/justify?

Life is all too much ............................................. and not enough.

Imagination, the real and eternal world of which this Vegetable Universe is but a faint shadow. by William Blake, Jerusalem

#72    bmk1245

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 08:45 AM

View PostCoffey, on 27 March 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

Might want to learn your history there, that was only a theory and not a fact and that is going down the SIV evolving into HIV route. Which is often said to be impossible without Human intervention.... Hence why ther eis so many theories about Humans creating HIV in a lab from using SIV.... Then Bayer selling it to Africa.... Then Africa having an Aids problem.

The first recognized cases of Aids where in the US in 1980 NOT Africa.

"This could explain more than the spread of HIV-1: it may account for the emergence of HIV-2, the less common Aids strain, which is most closely related to a virus that infects another monkey, the sooty mangabey, in west Africa. But these ideas are speculative. The origins of Aids remain mysterious."

Source: http://www.telegraph...-come-from.html
[...]
Anecdote and sensationalism seeking journalist. Good to know.


View PostCoffey, on 27 March 2013 - 11:21 AM, said:

[...]
I didn't even mention that... They live in a tundra environment, it's far harsher than what we live in.
Heh, fresh air, no "evil" chemicals in food, powerful herbs, etc, and they lived shorter. So much support for naturalistic fallacy.

OT
BTW, thanks to anti-vaccination freaks and quacks, we already see results.

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)

#73    Coffey

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 11:48 AM

View Postbmk1245, on 28 March 2013 - 08:45 AM, said:

Anecdote and sensationalism seeking journalist. Good to know.


Heh, fresh air, no "evil" chemicals in food, powerful herbs, etc, and they lived shorter. So much support for naturalistic fallacy.

OT
BTW, thanks to anti-vaccination freaks and quacks, we already see results.


I'll go by experience and what I've felt and seen myself over some results done by the companies who would obviously suffer if everyone followed a raw vegan diet.... :rolleyes:

View Postbmk1245, on 27 March 2013 - 08:26 AM, said:

Which was born in Africa...

The simple fact that you said that stops me from taking anything you post seriously.

Edited by Coffey, 28 March 2013 - 11:50 AM.

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#74    Frank Merton

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 12:11 PM

I can see refraining from eating much meat and animal product if there is good scientific reason for it, such as the well-demonstrated fact that animal fats are harmful.  Also omnivore and carnivore meats are much more likely to infect us with various nasty critters.

I can also see restricting eating meat as part of trying to help the environment, as for example it is known that getting our protein from animal souces adds much more pollution and CO2 to the atmosphere than getting them from plant sources like nuts and beans.

I can also see restricting certain animals from our diet because the creatures are highly sentient.  Primates and cetatians for sure, maybe also pork.

I can also see restricting certain animals from our diet for cultural or traditional reasons -- I could never eat dogmeat or horsemeat for those reasons, although, since I see this as cultural, I keep an open mind on this regarding what others do.

Finally there is the business of compassion for all sentient creatures, not just the intelligent ones.  Mammals in particular have emotions -- they all have the same pathways and serotonin receptors that we have and that have been linked to our emotions.  Therefore we should insist on humane slaughter and humane farming methods, and where we cannot obtain them, we should abstain from such products.  If enough behave this way the market will enforce the rules, but only if the public insists.


#75    bmk1245

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Posted 28 March 2013 - 01:06 PM

View PostCoffey, on 28 March 2013 - 11:48 AM, said:

I'll go by experience and what I've felt and seen myself over some results done by the companies who would obviously suffer if everyone followed a raw vegan diet.... :rolleyes:
[...]
Once again, its not evening yet, just wait.
My sister is vegetarian (not even raw vegan) for 20 years, and she constantly tired, its very hard for her to learn new things, yet she still sticks to that diet. :(


View PostCoffey, on 28 March 2013 - 11:48 AM, said:

[...]
The simple fact that you said that stops me from taking anything you post seriously.
Ok, lets see:

Quote

[...]
Tracing the genetic changes that occurred as SIVs crossed from monkeys to apes and from apes to humans provides a new framework to examine the requirements of successful host switches and to gauge future zoonotic risk.
[...]
Figure 1.Origins of human AIDS viruses. Old World monkeys are naturally infected with more than 40 different lentiviruses, termed simian immunodeficiency viruses (SIVs) with a suffix to denote their primate species of origin (e.g., SIVsmm from sooty mangabeys). Several of these SIVs have crossed the species barrier to great apes and humans, generating new pathogens (see text for details). Known examples of cross-species transmis-sions, as well as the resulting viruses, are highlighted in red.
[...]
(doi:10.1101/cshperspect.a006841)

Edit: fixed link

Edited by bmk1245, 28 March 2013 - 01:07 PM.

Arguing with fool is like playing chess with pigeon: he will scatter pieces, peck King's crown, crap on bishop, and fly away bragging how he won the game... (heard once, author unknown).
Zhoom! What was that? That was your life, Mate! Oh, that was quick. Do I get another? Sorry, Mate. That's your lot. Basil Fawlty (John Cleese).
If yesterday you would have stood up proud. Then why tonight have you thrown in with the stoning crowd? (Cradle of Filth)




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