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Why do we fear snakes?


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#61    Junior Chubb

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Posted 22 June 2012 - 10:07 PM

View Postpsyche101, on 22 June 2012 - 05:40 AM, said:

Gidday Sakari

The one I know of is Mark Vogel, he was killed by his black widow, and when the found him he was covered in webs and snakes, and his gecko was munching down on him. The Spiders and snake were most likely not feeding on the corpse, but the insects and animals feeding on the corpse along with his pet Gecko. You are right, I probably worded that badly.

This one

Mark Voegel, 30, was found dead in his Dortmund, Germany apartment. His body was draped in spider webs and more than 200 spiders, several snakes, thousands of termites, and a gecko were feasting on his corpse.



LINK





I know he died and was killed by his pet black widow, that much is at find a grave

Birth: 1974 Death: 2004 Posted Image
Mark lived in Dortmund, Germany. He enjoyed owning exotic pets, including more than 200 spiders, several snakes and a gecko. Cause of death was attributed to a bite from his "pet" black widow spider, Bettina. Burial:
Cremated, Other.
Specifically: Dortmund, Germany
Created by: Always with Love
Record added: Feb 13, 2011
Find A Grave Memorial# 65608616


Most definitely not my type of pet. I'll stick with my little puppy :D

Cheers.

Nice to know not all Urban Legends are Urban Legends.

I've flown from one side of this galaxy to the other. I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to show me where the hell Helen of Annoy has been for the past couple of months.

#62    Junior Chubb

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Posted 22 June 2012 - 10:13 PM

View PostQuiteContrary, on 22 June 2012 - 02:50 AM, said:

Sorry, did not know asterisks are used that way. No, I had originally written King Cobra but edited later.

Don't be sorry, it was a good read and the **** Cobra made me smile.

I don't know if the use of asterisks is wide spread but it's the first thing that popped into my mind.

I've flown from one side of this galaxy to the other. I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to show me where the hell Helen of Annoy has been for the past couple of months.

#63    Q-C

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Posted 22 June 2012 - 10:23 PM

View PostJunior Chubb, on 22 June 2012 - 10:13 PM, said:

Don't be sorry, it was a good read and the **** Cobra made me smile.

I don't know if the use of asterisks is wide spread but it's the first thing that popped into my mind.

Yeah I thought it was ****ing amazing. lol.
None of my friends would touch it.
I was like "Sure"!

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#64    TheSpoonyOne

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Posted 22 June 2012 - 10:25 PM

I think what's even more curious is how Northern Europeans are one of the groups most likely to have a strong phobia of spiders, yet all the spiders that are actually dangerous to humans live on the other side of the world to their environment.

You would assume, since Europeans evolved in a colder climates, they would have less of an innate fear of spiders than say Amerindians in South America who would have evolved along side hundreds of species of deadly spiders.

Edited by TheSpoonyOne, 22 June 2012 - 10:25 PM.


#65    SCFan

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 08:56 PM

View PostTheSpoonyOne, on 22 June 2012 - 10:25 PM, said:

I think what's even more curious is how Northern Europeans are one of the groups most likely to have a strong phobia of spiders, yet all the spiders that are actually dangerous to humans live on the other side of the world to their environment.

You would assume, since Europeans evolved in a colder climates, they would have less of an innate fear of spiders than say Amerindians in South America who would have evolved along side hundreds of species of deadly spiders.

South America doesnt have hundreds of species of deadly spiders, but they do have exotic species of black widows, brown recluses, and one of the most deadliest spiders in the world the Brazilian Wandering Spider (Phoneutria ssp.). They have alot of tarantulas which are no doubt intimidating for their size and those large fangs, but have never caused deaths IIRC.

"I charge thee in the sight of God, who giveth life to all things, and of Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed the good confession; that thou keep the commandment, without spot, without reproach, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ: which in its own times he shall show, WHO IS THE BLESSED AND ONLY POTENTE, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS; who only hath immortality, dwelling in light unapproachable; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honor and power eternal. Amen" (I Tim 6:13-16).

#66    SCFan

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 09:02 PM

View PostSeeker79, on 22 June 2012 - 12:05 PM, said:

They are supposed to be in the desert, but they are spreading. When I was a child they were around my dads fruit business. At the time we did not know what they were so we called them vampire bugs. I never went barefoot around that place.

Just a few years ago a small one crawled out of the mats at my martial arts school. I kept it for a while as a pet.

They are cool, bug ugly as hell.

Another one that creeps me out are house centipedes. I did not know what those were for a long time either. Turns out they have a nasty sting and run around houses at night.... Lovely.

No, house centipedes (Scutigera) dont possess strong venom and have relatively weak bite. I have even handled one here in California and it couldnt break the skin on my fingertip even though it tried and tried and tried. Centipedes are the ones  that can  possess medically significant venom and can break the skin. Here in North America, it is the giant centipedes (Scolopendra) in Arizona and Texas are the ones to be cautious with.

"I charge thee in the sight of God, who giveth life to all things, and of Christ Jesus, who before Pontius Pilate witnessed the good confession; that thou keep the commandment, without spot, without reproach, until the appearing of our Lord Jesus Christ: which in its own times he shall show, WHO IS THE BLESSED AND ONLY POTENTE, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS; who only hath immortality, dwelling in light unapproachable; whom no man hath seen, nor can see: to whom be honor and power eternal. Amen" (I Tim 6:13-16).

#67    Sakari

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Posted 23 June 2012 - 10:44 PM

God I hate doing this, but it is just in my blood......Off topic a bit, but to clarify...

The German man being killed by a black widow is a Urban Legend..`..I thought I remembered this, so here is hopefully enough information to show this, if not I will dig more if needed.Somewhere on this site, it is all ready " debunked "...

Anyway, see for yourself......


Spider bait

Let’s cheer ourselves up with another recent Daily Tele beat-up. Though it did appear only on-line, this one’s a doozy – and it’s almost as old as Lawsie’s jokes.


A man was found dead in his apartment draped in spider webs and more than 200 spiders, several snakes, thousands of termites, and a gecko were feasting on his corpse.

Mark Voegel, 30, was found dead in Dortmund, Germany.

— The Daily Telegraph Online, 26th February, 2011

Read the full Daily Telegraph Online story


Oh yuck! Gruesome! So when did this happen? No hint in the story itself, but we know it was at least three years ago. Look at this...


Pet creepy-crawlies eat human owner.

— news.com.au, 29th August, 2007

Read the full news.com.au story


And yes, it was the same unfortunate German...


Police found Mark Voegel, 30, in his apartment partially eaten by his pet spiders... Sun.co.uk reported.

— news.com.au, 29th August, 2007

Ah, The Sun! Gotta be true then, innit? And when did The Sun find out about Mr Voegel? Let’s see, here it is


Pet spider kills its owner

A man who lived in his own "zoo"... was fatally bitten by a pet black widow spider, then eaten by the other creepy-crawlies.

— The Sun Online

Hey, that’s an even better story. Sure it’s the same bloke? Yep...


Police broke in to Mark Voegel’s apartment...

— The Sun Online

And when was this?


Published: 27 Feb 2004

— The Sun Online, 27th February, 2004

Read the full Sun Online story


Almost exactly seven years ago.

We ask the Dortmund police about Mr Voegel's ghastly fate. They described it as...


a hoax or urban myth

— Wolfgang Wieland, Dortmund Police, 4th March, 2011

All that is true is this:


In 2004 the body of a (at the time) 30 year old male was found in a flat in Tucholsky Street in Dortmund...There were terrariums with spiders in the flat.

— Wolfgang Wieland, Dortmund Police, 4th March, 2011

But the man’s name wasn’t Voegel, he didn’t die of a spider bite, and no spiders, snakes, termites, or geckos were feeding on his corpse. In fact...


Apart from the facts stated above, everything is fabricated...

With friendly greetings

Wolfgang Wieland

— Wolfgang Wieland, Dortmund Police, 4th March, 2011


And freundlichen Grüßen to you too, Wolfgang.

Whoever originally did the fabricating, the story’s been doing its job for years. According to the Tele, one of its most-read stories online last week was...


200 giant spiders, termites feast on man

— The Daily Telegraph Online, 1st March, 2011

Expect to read about the sad fate of Herr Voegel again in, say, 2014. It’s known as click-bait.


Source :

http://www.abc.net.a...ts/s3157350.htm

Edited by Sakari, 23 June 2012 - 10:52 PM.

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#68    Junior Chubb

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 10:49 AM

View PostSakari, on 23 June 2012 - 10:44 PM, said:

God I hate doing this, but it is just in my blood......Off topic a bit, but to clarify...

The German man being killed by a black widow is a Urban Legend..`..I thought I remembered this, so here is hopefully enough information to show this, if not I will dig more if needed.Somewhere on this site, it is all ready " debunked "...

Anyway, see for yourself......
Source :

http://www.abc.net.a...ts/s3157350.htm

Well well well, the Urban Legend is an Urban Legend or isn't or is it?

I feel like I am being lead on a wild goose chase (maybe I should just look into it myself).

I've flown from one side of this galaxy to the other. I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to show me where the hell Helen of Annoy has been for the past couple of months.

#69    msmike1

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 01:39 PM

View PostJunior Chubb, on 22 June 2012 - 12:27 AM, said:

Interesting figures and facts (especially the venom info').

As for Dogs vs Snakes in the danger stakes, I don't think you can really compare the two with these figures.

Firstly you have to consider contact, how many people come into to contact with dogs everyday compared to snakes? I would say there is a lot more contact with dogs therefore its an unfair comparison.
Second, anti-venom. A simple injection (if administered in time) can stop death from most would-be fatal snake bites. As for dog bites, there are doctors but no instant fix such as an anti venom, again probably an unfair comparison.
Now if we look at breeds and species, the majority of snakes pose no threat to people whatsoever, most breeds of dog can kill, some can be stamped on like a spider, without knowing breeds and species again its an unfair comparison.
Unprovoked dog attacks (usually bad owners cause these) against a defensive snake attack (mostly uneducated people again) is again an unfair comparison especially if you are looking at a domesticated animal versus a wild animal.

You are doing with dogs what most people do with snakes, you need to separate a Pitbull from a Chihuahua the same way you would probably like people to separate a Rattlesnake from a Grass Snake.

Venomous Snakes versus Wolves might be a fairer comparison. (Sounds like the title of a YouTube video :unsure2: ).

I could never change your view on dogs being more dangerous than snakes (because a Bull Snake is less dangerous than a German Shepherd dog) but your figures might...

1 in 1363 snake bite victims die but only 1 in 50,000 dog bite victims die.

But like I said its an unfair comparison so we will have to agree to disagree.

I don't, and don't really know if anyone else does, have any figures stating how many people come into contact with snakes on a daily basis. I can assure you it is more than you would think,as most encounters between humans and snakes are known only by the snake. Anti-venom is also a bit more than a simple injection. Not every anti-venom can work for every snakebite. Anti-venoms for the most part are species specific, and if you don't have the right antivenom on hand not just any will work. It is normally injected by the vile and in severe cases it could take upwards of 25 to 30 viles to counter act the venom. Now that is with a highly venomous snake. Not every venomous snake is as dangerous as the next.

To say "most breeds of dogs can kill" is a little of base. I understand what you are saying, but that statement is not supported by any fact, it is just opinion. I respect your opinion, don't get me wrong, but a yorkie could kill someone in the right instance. Domestic vs. Wild is a valid point, and I understand your opinion on the matter. I love dogs too, and have several different breeds of them also, so don't think I am advocating hate towards dogs.

mike


#70    Junior Chubb

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 01:51 PM

View Postmsmike1, on 25 June 2012 - 01:39 PM, said:

I don't, and don't really know if anyone else does, have any figures stating how many people come into contact with snakes on a daily basis. I can assure you it is more than you would think,as most encounters between humans and snakes are known only by the snake. Anti-venom is also a bit more than a simple injection. Not every anti-venom can work for every snakebite. Anti-venoms for the most part are species specific, and if you don't have the right antivenom on hand not just any will work. It is normally injected by the vile and in severe cases it could take upwards of 25 to 30 viles to counter act the venom. Now that is with a highly venomous snake. Not every venomous snake is as dangerous as the next.

To say "most breeds of dogs can kill" is a little of base. I understand what you are saying, but that statement is not supported by any fact, it is just opinion. I respect your opinion, don't get me wrong, but a yorkie could kill someone in the right instance. Domestic vs. Wild is a valid point, and I understand your opinion on the matter. I love dogs too, and have several different breeds of them also, so don't think I am advocating hate towards dogs.

mike

Its a tough judgement to call, too many factors and 'dogs are more dangerous than snakes' is a bit to broad a statement to prove/disprove. Especially just based on fatality figures in one country.

Glad you mentioned your a dog owner and not just a snake owner.

I've flown from one side of this galaxy to the other. I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to show me where the hell Helen of Annoy has been for the past couple of months.

#71    msmike1

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 02:03 PM

View Postpsyche101, on 22 June 2012 - 05:54 AM, said:

Does this mean that whilst you do not advocate it, you abide by others killing venomous snakes? As long as they are venomous?

I live in SE Queensland Australia. Green snakes are likely to be tree snakes, and I rarely see them, but I do not kill them. I avoid them. But I found a Red Bellied Black swimming in my pool. I rang the RSPCA, they did not want to know, so I rang the council, they did not want to know, so I rang the local WIldlife Sanctuary who put me onto the local snake catcher. I rang him up, he was half drunk at a bar and said he could get there in an hour, but it would cost me $80.00 for him to show up, wether the snake had left by then or not.

Nobody wants to help if you have one of these nasties in your backyard, so options tend to be rather limited. Its illegal to kill them here too as far as I know.

No, in no way do I advocate the killing of a snake venomous or not, unless it is a life or death situation. I understand that there are times when a snake must be killed for whatever reason, but I do not advocate the killing of snakes for no reason. While I am familiar with the different species of snake in Australia I have no experience with them first hand and am not sure of the laws governing them, or the proper procedure to remove a snake from your area. It sounds like they NEED a procedure for removing them. I will say that even though I love all snakes venomous or not, that a person has to do what they have to do to protect themselves or family.

Mike


#72    msmike1

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 02:08 PM

View PostJunior Chubb, on 25 June 2012 - 01:51 PM, said:

Its a tough judgement to call, too many factors and 'dogs are more dangerous than snakes' is a bit to broad a statement to prove/disprove. Especially just based on fatality figures in one country.

Glad you mentioned your a dog owner and not just a snake owner.

LOL, my mother in law along with my wife are permitted wildlife rehabbers. This means that they are premitted through a wildlife organization in my state to rehab injured wildlife of all kinds and release them to the wild, or if need be to humanely uethanize them if they cannot be healed. It is normally a zoo around my house and I never really know what I am coming home to. From, kit foxes running around the living room, to bobcats growling at me from a cage in the bathroom, to a whitetail deer fawn sitting on my couch, to a red tailed hawk eating a chicken leg on my porch and on and on and on. LOL. So, around my house all animals are loved and cared for, not just domestic ones.

Mike


#73    Junior Chubb

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 02:12 PM

Watch out for that Whitetail Deer Fawn on the sofa, I hear they grow up to be nasty pieces of work :tu:

I've flown from one side of this galaxy to the other. I've seen a lot of strange stuff, but I've never seen anything to show me where the hell Helen of Annoy has been for the past couple of months.

#74    msmike1

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 05:49 PM

View PostJunior Chubb, on 25 June 2012 - 02:12 PM, said:

Watch out for that Whitetail Deer Fawn on the sofa, I hear they grow up to be nasty pieces of work :tu:

You are right, they can be pretty nasty at times, but we release them all well before that time comes. The fully mature ones that come in, well, thankfully those are few and far between. If you have never been in an altercation with a fully grown whitetail deer, doe or buck, consider yourself lucky because while amusing to anybody watching it is very painful, lol.

Mike


#75    Robin_Shadowes

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Posted 25 June 2012 - 06:05 PM

Funny a thread like this comes up just after I have seen a video of a python eating a gator. I can only say that I never want to meet any of those bloody things in my life! Sheeesh!





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