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Scientists succeed in "teleporting" atom by


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#1    Still Waters

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 01:37 PM

www.npr.org said:

"Quantum entanglement" may sound like an awful sci-fi romance flick, but it's actually a phenomenon that physicists say may someday lead to the ability to teleport an object all the way across the galaxy instantly.

It's not exactly the Star Trek version of teleportation, where an object disappears then reappears somewhere else.Rather, it "entangles" two different atoms so that one atom inherits the properties of another.

"According to the quantum theory, everything vibrates," theoretical physicist Michio Kaku tells NPR's Guy Raz. Kaku is a frequent guest on the Science and Discovery channels. "When two electrons are placed close together, they vibrate in unison. When you separate them, that's when all the fireworks start."

This is where quantum entanglement sometimes described as "teleportation" begins. "An invisible umbilical cord emerges connecting these two electrons. And you can separate them by as much as a galaxy if you want. Then, if you vibrate one of them, somehow on the other end of the galaxy the other electron knows that its partner is being jiggled."

This process happens even faster than the speed of light, physicists say.

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#2    Blacksabbath

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Posted 02 August 2010 - 01:46 PM

Quote

It could one day lead to new types of computers, and some even think entanglement may explain things like telepathy.

Very interesting.

Edited by Blacksabbath, 02 August 2010 - 01:49 PM.


#3    laserbluemini

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 12:44 PM

so where does the soul go if you're teleported... lol...


#4    Druidus-Logos

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 12:58 PM

View Postlaserbluemini, on 03 August 2010 - 12:44 PM, said:

so where does the soul go if you're teleported... lol...

It does not and never has existed.  The body is all there is.  You are a continually varying pattern of information in a material matrix, that's all.  If you transmit the matter in exactly the same pattern of information (or, more accurately, copy the pattern onto other matter), then you have transmitted/copied-pasted everything that the pattern ever was.  Do it to a person, and you HAVE teleported/copied the person, and the copy should feel just like the original.  But only if you can manage to keep the integrity of the pattern perfectly.

There is no such thing as a "soul", this is a vestige of religion and the idea of homunculi.  There is no reason to suggest the soul's existence, everything that we are can be explained physically.  This doesn't reduce th beauty of the world (and even if it did, that's no argument against it - the world doesn't HAVE to be magnificent), in fact, I'd say, it increases it.  The world's just amazing, and not having this fictional "soul" doesn't make it any less so.

I don't need the security blanket of the "soul".  I exist as a pattern.  I always have, I always will.  Even if I should die, the pattern remains as an influencing factor on the universe, and also remains in existence as a part of the pattern of the entire cosmos, in the past.  I don't need to pretend that I have a "soul" so that I can deal with death by imagining that my soul will survive and so I will.  That's a little childish, it's certainly self-serving.  With no reason to postulate the soul's existence, you are merely using a crutch to support yourself; you are afraid to see things as they really are.

Believe all you want.  But don't act surprised when someone calls you on your unwarrented beliefs.  You can't talk about these beliefs/opinions as if they are well-supported by science; it'll only make those who understand the science want to explain why you're wrong to profess them, at least scientifically wrong.

That said, it is definately true that even if you recreate the pattern in a new matrix, you don't have the original pattern.  It is a new and identical pattern.  If it is a person, for all practical purposes it will be the same person.  But there will be no genuine continuity.  You wouldn't appear in a new location in the same body.  It would be a new body, same pattern.  It would feel like the real person, the original, and for all real purposes it would be.  But, again, it's a new identical pattern in a new material matrix.  It's not the same person, and it's not even really teleportation.  Even if the person feels like there is a sense of continuity, this is an illusion created by copying the pattern and placing it in a new matrix.  It wouldn't be you if you did it, not really.  Imagine if you could retain both identical patterns, on both sides of the "teleporter".  Both would feel they were you, the original.  They would both be exactly the same, down to an atomic level.  They would have the same memories, attributes, characteristics, etc.  So who would really be the real you?  Both, though one pattern is older and more "real" in this way.  You are creating a new person when you do this, though with an old pattern.  The moment you both start to diverge is the moment that two people have come to exist, and not just a copy of an old one.  You will evolve in different ways because of differing environments.  This isn't really teleportation, it's a fancy way of flash-cloning people.  I think it may have more uses in medecine, if we can advance to transmitting advanced patterns of information and not be limited to single atom patterns.

Edited by Druidus-Logos, 03 August 2010 - 01:09 PM.

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Censorship has always been used as a tool to subjugate minority ideas, regardless of validity.  Used to delegitimize certain points of view.  This kind of arbitary censorship will always be an injustice to humanity; it tries to brush ideas under the rug.  It forces the adoption of certain mainstream views, making it impossible to teach, learn, or speak about ideas that the censors disagree with.  This will always be unethical.

#5    ExpandMyMind

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 01:51 PM

i love these stories - i've been following them on UM for over a year now

http://www.unexplain...t&fromsearch=1

http://www.unexplain...1

http://www.unexplain...1

:)


#6    HybridGS

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 02:29 PM

If thats how its done  Druidus-Logos then we could resurrect people in the same way, that would be amazing, i might be able to see my mum again one day.

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#7    Druidus-Logos

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 03:12 PM

View PostHybridGS, on 03 August 2010 - 02:29 PM, said:

If thats how its done  Druidus-Logos then we could resurrect people in the same way, that would be amazing, i might be able to see my mum again one day.

We could only resurrect people if we recorded their exact pattern BEFORE death, unfortunately.  Otherwise, we'd copy a corpse.  We need ALL of the information from EVERY particle in the body of a person before you can "teleport" that person, and so anyone who is already dead would be ineligable.  The only way around this would be to make up the information missing, creating a similar person but not the same person who died, because of the degradation that would have happened to the pattern.

Still, it's a lovely idea.  If it could be done, then you could regularly get back ups of your pattern, maybe once a week or something.  If you died, could paste the backup pattern onto a new material matrix, and then have a new you.  But, unfortunately, this is really just a selfish thing, because it wouldn't REALLY be you.  It'd be like birthing a fully grown new you, really just to help the living, not you at all.  The original you, the older you, would still be dead, the new you would have the same memories and be identical in every way except in actually being you.  Still, it is a kind of immortality...

~I am a dark melody of chaos and order, a shadowed figure painted upon the heavens of dusk.~
Censorship has always been used as a tool to subjugate minority ideas, regardless of validity.  Used to delegitimize certain points of view.  This kind of arbitary censorship will always be an injustice to humanity; it tries to brush ideas under the rug.  It forces the adoption of certain mainstream views, making it impossible to teach, learn, or speak about ideas that the censors disagree with.  This will always be unethical.

#8    Drj312

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 03:36 PM

the teleportation of particles has already been done. it is even possible, although technologically impossible for us, to teleport any object. the hard part is finding every bit of information for every particle in an object


#9    Wyrdlight

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 04:04 PM

View PostDruidus-Logos, on 03 August 2010 - 03:12 PM, said:

We could only resurrect people if we recorded their exact pattern BEFORE death, unfortunately.  Otherwise, we'd copy a corpse.  We need ALL of the information from EVERY particle in the body of a person before you can "teleport" that person, and so anyone who is already dead would be ineligable.  The only way around this would be to make up the information missing, creating a similar person but not the same person who died, because of the degradation that would have happened to the pattern.

Still, it's a lovely idea.  If it could be done, then you could regularly get back ups of your pattern, maybe once a week or something.  If you died, could paste the backup pattern onto a new material matrix, and then have a new you.  But, unfortunately, this is really just a selfish thing, because it wouldn't REALLY be you.  It'd be like birthing a fully grown new you, really just to help the living, not you at all.  The original you, the older you, would still be dead, the new you would have the same memories and be identical in every way except in actually being you.  Still, it is a kind of immortality...


This reminds of the "Broken Angles" sci-fi book and series.

Copies of peoples minds and personalities as well as genetic make-up are stored, if somone dies, they can simply "decant" a copy of thier mind into a new body, even an identical version of thier original one.

The future happens so fast :-)


#10    Jaygatz

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 07:44 PM

View PostDruidus-Logos, on 03 August 2010 - 12:58 PM, said:

It does not and never has existed.  The body is all there is.  You are a continually varying pattern of information in a material matrix, that's all.  If you transmit the matter in exactly the same pattern of information (or, more accurately, copy the pattern onto other matter), then you have transmitted/copied-pasted everything that the pattern ever was.  Do it to a person, and you HAVE teleported/copied the person, and the copy should feel just like the original.  But only if you can manage to keep the integrity of the pattern perfectly.

There is no such thing as a "soul", this is a vestige of religion and the idea of homunculi.  There is no reason to suggest the soul's existence, everything that we are can be explained physically.  This doesn't reduce th beauty of the world (and even if it did, that's no argument against it - the world doesn't HAVE to be magnificent), in fact, I'd say, it increases it.  The world's just amazing, and not having this fictional "soul" doesn't make it any less so.

I don't need the security blanket of the "soul".  I exist as a pattern.  I always have, I always will.  Even if I should die, the pattern remains as an influencing factor on the universe, and also remains in existence as a part of the pattern of the entire cosmos, in the past.  I don't need to pretend that I have a "soul" so that I can deal with death by imagining that my soul will survive and so I will.  That's a little childish, it's certainly self-serving.  With no reason to postulate the soul's existence, you are merely using a crutch to support yourself; you are afraid to see things as they really are.

Believe all you want.  But don't act surprised when someone calls you on your unwarrented beliefs.  You can't talk about these beliefs/opinions as if they are well-supported by science; it'll only make those who understand the science want to explain why you're wrong to profess them, at least scientifically wrong.

That said, it is definately true that even if you recreate the pattern in a new matrix, you don't have the original pattern.  It is a new and identical pattern.  If it is a person, for all practical purposes it will be the same person.  But there will be no genuine continuity.  You wouldn't appear in a new location in the same body.  It would be a new body, same pattern.  It would feel like the real person, the original, and for all real purposes it would be.  But, again, it's a new identical pattern in a new material matrix.  It's not the same person, and it's not even really teleportation.  Even if the person feels like there is a sense of continuity, this is an illusion created by copying the pattern and placing it in a new matrix.  It wouldn't be you if you did it, not really.  Imagine if you could retain both identical patterns, on both sides of the "teleporter".  Both would feel they were you, the original.  They would both be exactly the same, down to an atomic level.  They would have the same memories, attributes, characteristics, etc.  So who would really be the real you?  Both, though one pattern is older and more "real" in this way.  You are creating a new person when you do this, though with an old pattern.  The moment you both start to diverge is the moment that two people have come to exist, and not just a copy of an old one.  You will evolve in different ways because of differing environments.  This isn't really teleportation, it's a fancy way of flash-cloning people.  I think it may have more uses in medecine, if we can advance to transmitting advanced patterns of information and not be limited to single atom patterns.


I hate to tell you this but you are absolutly 100% EEEEEHHHH WORNG.
All energy has a half life.  Even the energy in our bodies.  Call it a soul if you want but regarless of what you call it, the engergy / Eletricity has a half life. Meaning after we die the engery contained in your brains or body will continue on in some fashion.

That is all :)

Edited by Jaygatz, 03 August 2010 - 07:49 PM.


#11    Druidus-Logos

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 08:33 PM

View PostJaygatz, on 03 August 2010 - 07:44 PM, said:

I hate to tell you this but you are absolutly 100% EEEEEHHHH WORNG.

Sounds like you can't really prove it so you use personal enthusiasm to attempt to make me wrong.  I'm not sorry at all to tell you that this isn't a valid debating tactic. You can't just claim someone's wrong and expect to be taken seriously with no backup argument at all.

Quote

All energy has a half life.  Even the energy in our bodies.

Oh, so you mean that half of the energy in us is lost in a certain period of time?  Because that's what a half-life is.  Energy/substances that ar subject to a half-life will halve themselves over the period of the half-life.  I dont think you really understand what a half-life is.

Quote

Call it a soul

Why would I want to use your hokey vestigial language?

Quote

regarless of what you call it, the engergy / Eletricity has a half life.

No, it doesn't really have a half-life.  I understand that you're trying to co-opt scientific sounding words to make a point, but it's not working.  Try to explain better what you mean, and, also, the energy in your body is not wholly electrical.  In my post, I refer to the ENTIRE PATTERN, of matter and of energy, within the body.  You're referring soley to energy and/or (it isn't clear) electricity.  Which is inaccurate.  Anything remaining after death is not you, nor does it contain your pattern.  Your pattern is a part of the universe, and will exist after death only in this regard.  You cannot claim this kind of thing, friend, unless you have proof, and unless you've go more text in your post coloured white or something, you've got none.

Quote

Meaning after we die the engery contained in your brains or body will continue on in some fashion.

So will the matter.  But you won't continue, at least outside of this.  Your pattern will never be attached to the same material matrix again.  Even if it could be, it wouldn't be you.  And the existence of a pattern after death does NOT prove the existence of consciousness after death (I know you didn't mention this, but from your words, you probably believe this).  You've got no reason to believe in this after-life "existence".  Not only that, but it IS quite clear that the pattern that you ARE, the pattern that makes you everything you are, dissipates after death.  It may "exist in some form", certainly if you allow that time doesn't matter to the universe, but this is a wholly new form.  It is not the you that you know.

Again, I'm not sorry to try to explain reality without resorting to foolishness with no logical backing. I mean no offense, but foolishness is what I consider these arguments to be.  It's only a real debate if both sides have supporting evidence.

Quote

That is all :)

I'm afraid you haven't explained anything with included logic and evidence or convinced anyone.

~I am a dark melody of chaos and order, a shadowed figure painted upon the heavens of dusk.~
Censorship has always been used as a tool to subjugate minority ideas, regardless of validity.  Used to delegitimize certain points of view.  This kind of arbitary censorship will always be an injustice to humanity; it tries to brush ideas under the rug.  It forces the adoption of certain mainstream views, making it impossible to teach, learn, or speak about ideas that the censors disagree with.  This will always be unethical.

#12    freeman88

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 08:47 PM

"This is where quantum entanglement sometimes described as "teleportation" begins. "An invisible umbilical cord emerges connecting these two electrons. And you can separate them by as much as a galaxy if you want. Then, if you vibrate one of them, somehow on the other end of the galaxy the other electron knows that its partner is being jiggled.""


very interesting. I cant wait for the day we can do full body/conscious teleports instead of sending a clone, if its even possible :blink: but my views of whats possible and whats not seems to grow dimmer and dimmer everyday. :unsure2:


#13    The Silver Thong

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 08:56 PM

View PostJaygatz, on 03 August 2010 - 07:44 PM, said:

I hate to tell you this but you are absolutly 100% EEEEEHHHH WORNG.
All energy has a half life.  Even the energy in our bodies.  Call it a soul if you want but regarless of what you call it, the engergy / Eletricity has a half life. Meaning after we die the engery contained in your brains or body will continue on in some fashion.

That is all :)


The so called energy in your body after death is reserved for the decomposition that starts almost immediately after death.

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#14    ShaunZero

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 11:24 PM

If we teleport, wouldn't it just create a "double" of ourselves, and this instance of "us" would vanish? Imagine it like this: You enter the teleport machine, still conscious. Machine "copies" your data at the destination and rids of the "old you". This instance of "you" no longer exists, and the "double" of you appears at the destination thinking he's you because he has your memories, but in truth "you" dissapeared.

Edited by ShaunZero, 03 August 2010 - 11:26 PM.

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#15    Druidus-Logos

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Posted 03 August 2010 - 11:56 PM

View PostShaunZero, on 03 August 2010 - 11:24 PM, said:

If we teleport, wouldn't it just create a "double" of ourselves, and this instance of "us" would vanish? Imagine it like this: You enter the teleport machine, still conscious. Machine "copies" your data at the destination and rids of the "old you". This instance of "you" no longer exists, and the "double" of you appears at the destination thinking he's you because he has your memories, but in truth "you" dissapeared.

Yeah, that's a good explanation of it, too.

~I am a dark melody of chaos and order, a shadowed figure painted upon the heavens of dusk.~
Censorship has always been used as a tool to subjugate minority ideas, regardless of validity.  Used to delegitimize certain points of view.  This kind of arbitary censorship will always be an injustice to humanity; it tries to brush ideas under the rug.  It forces the adoption of certain mainstream views, making it impossible to teach, learn, or speak about ideas that the censors disagree with.  This will always be unethical.




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