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Steven's Greer Alien x-ray body


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#16    psyche101

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 09:59 AM

View Postbison, on 06 February 2013 - 04:16 PM, said:

Dr. Greer seems to have involved himself in some serious scientific investigation of this mysterious little body. Ordinary explanations for it  appear to have been carefully considered, and ruled out, by experts.  I look forward to his sharing the results of this work with other scientists and getting it independently confirmed, if possible.
A viable six inch tall being appears to be an extreme example of dwarfism, even among the group of reportedly diminutive ETs. If, as seems likely, they can control their own  genetics, such dwarfism appears conceivable. The reason for wishing the existence of such a small being is unclear. Perhaps it was intended to live in an unusual environment, where its small size was necessary, or at least offered notable advantages.
One wonders what happened to this being, and how its body came into the hands of the scientists.



Extremely small indeed, however the San Pedro Mountains Mummy was purported to be a mere 14 inches standing, Lucia Zarate reached a grand height of 20 inches at the age of 17.

Extreme, but within the realm of Microcephalic osteodysplastic primordial dwarfism - perhaps.

However, the name Greer is a giant red flag. Big enough to cover the entire globe I would say.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#17    bison

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Posted 07 February 2013 - 06:56 PM

View PostChrlzs, on 07 February 2013 - 09:38 AM, said:

It sounds as if you are involved - could you tell us more - show us/cite the reports/investigations and also the credentials of the experts?  Now I'm not suggesting that Mr Greer is not credible - oh no, not me - I mean, who wouldn't believe the moth analyst... <_< You'll note that ATS now pretty much dumps anything by Greer into its 'Hoaxes' section.  Not that ATS are always right, but if you haven't seen Greers many scams, then you haven't really researched him at all.  Start here.. or perhaps here..


???  But it sounded like you were satisfied about the 'experts' already doing that just a second back..  As for me, I'll wait too, before making any claims about what has or has not been ruled out by supposed experts.


Ooh, I think I might know the answer to that one!!  I should wait on the 'independent confirmation' too.. but I may be back later to post some other stuff I have here about these supposed alien bodies - it is a pretty obvious scam, I'm sorry to say, and I believe you'll find the 'carcase' dates back to 2006...  Funny how they are still waiting on those genetic tests - the longer you tease, the more money you can scam...
I am not personally involved in Dr. Greer's work. I made no claims on his behalf; merely stated what appeared to be the case. I assume he is in ernest in this matter, until and unless the reverse is demonstrated. I am aware of certain accusations made against him. These have no bearing on the validity or lack of it, of the information and  reported scientific work about the tiny body. These will, of course, need to stand up to independent scientific verification, if they are to be accepted. The scientific experts Dr. Greer says he consulted will need to identify themselves at the time their work is published in a peer-reviewed scientific journal. Other, independent scientists would then need to examine the evidence, and confirm or discredit it.  I am not concerned with how long the research on this body took. It is not unlikely that Dr. Greer is working within budget constraints.


#18    ChrLzs

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 12:10 AM

View Postbison, on 07 February 2013 - 06:56 PM, said:

I am not personally involved in Dr. Greer's work. I made no claims on his behalf; merely stated what appeared to be the case.
I really don't get this.. Indeed, you did say:

Quote

Ordinary explanations for it  appear to have been carefully considered, and ruled out, by experts.
But it now 'appears' that was based entirely on what Greer himself is claiming.  Me, I think that IS making claims on his behalf..  If you had done some investigative work and somehow verified those claims, fair enough.  But you didn't.  That's why I asked.

Quote

I assume he is in ernest in this matter, until and unless the reverse is demonstrated.

Did you follow any of the links I provided?  I'm afraid it would be a very generous person who would assume Greer is going to change his spots, and he has very clear motivation to try to shamelessly milk this for as long as he can, as he has done elsewhere.

Quote

I am aware of certain accusations made against him.

'Accusations'?  Clearly you didn't follow those links.  He is a proven scammer.

Quote

These have no bearing on the validity or lack of it, of the information and  reported scientific work about the tiny body.

Of course they do!
Greer is known for seeking large sums of money.  CHECK.
Greer is known for accepting and promoting proven fakes, and NOT admitting it later.  CHECK.
Greer is known for lengthy delays in undertaking investigations (it doesn't take 5 years to get something examined by an expert).  CHECK.
Greer is known for simply not producing any reports or investigations or accounting properly for any monies received.  CHECK.

He's quacking like a duck...

Quote

These will, of course, need to stand up to independent scientific verification, if they are to be accepted.

So, UNTIL they exist or are presented (and they won't be for a long while, if at all) it might be prudent to NOT suggest things had been ruled out - they haven't, and..

Quote

.. the experts Dr. Greer says he consulted will need to identify themselves at the time their work is published in a peer-reviewed scientific journal.

Do let me know when that happens.  I'm willing to place a bet with the moderators of $100 to their chosen charity, when a report by real experts saying that this 'thing' is of non-terrestrial origin is published in a credible peer-reviewed journal.  With a breakthrough like that, I'd expect it in Nature - but there are many other credible journals.  The type of journal I *wouldn't* accept is, f'rinstance, the infamous JSE..

Quote

I am not concerned with how long the research on this body took. It is not unlikely that Dr. Greer is working within budget constraints.

You should be, I think - as above, it is one of many clues to what is going on.

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#19    bison

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 02:02 AM

Thank you, Chrlzs, for indicating that you think me to be a very generous person. I can afford to be. I am only interested in the outcome of this particular matter of the diminutive, allegedly 'alien' body.  Dr. Greer's character or past behavior have no part in the  scientific determination of the real status of this body. Scientifically obtained facts and evidence will be the deciding factor here, not suspicions. If there is even only a small chance that such a remarkable thing as valid scientific evidence of intelligent life from other worlds might be obtained, I think this matter is worth serious attention.
Sir Isaac Newton is generally recognized as a great scientist, but even one as great as he would have  to be classed as a charlatan, fraud, and self deluded, if we base our estimate of him on some of his pursuits.  He spent a great deal of time working in the field of alchemy, which has, of course, been discredited. Does this mean that his discovery of the laws of motion and gravity, and calculus, should  be rejected out of hand, based on his character and behavior, rather than examined for their scientific merit?

Edited by bison, 08 February 2013 - 02:19 AM.


#20    ChrLzs

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 04:53 AM

View Postbison, on 08 February 2013 - 02:02 AM, said:

Sir Isaac Newton is generally recognized as a great scientist, but even one as great as he would have  to be classed as a charlatan, fraud, and self deluded, if we base our estimate of him on some of his pursuits.  He spent a great deal of time working in the field of alchemy, which has, of course, been discredited. Does this mean that his discovery of the laws of motion and gravity, and calculus, should  be rejected out of hand, based on his character and behavior, rather than examined for their scientific merit?
You don't see a difference?  Allow me:
1. Back in Newton's day, we didn't understand elementary physics so alchemy was a genuine pursuit - in fact it led to chemistry.  From Wiki:

Quote

Distinctions between science, superstition, and pseudoscience were still being formulated, and a devoutly Christian Biblical perspective permeated Western culture.
...During Newton's lifetime the study of chemistry was still in its infancy...
...It was not until several decades after Newton's death that ... analytical chemistry ... came to resemble modern chemistry as we know it today.

2. Newton documented his ideas fully, gave mathematics, proved his assertions, and he was dealing with known phenomena - things like planetary motions, things falling to the ground...
3. Newton didn't have a history of fraudulent claims and scams.
4. Newton did not run a sideshow of money seeking events and funding requests, while hiding behind excuses of 'it's not ready yet'.
5. Netwon associated with genuine experts, genuine scientists.
6. Newton has consistently been proven correct in his assertions and theories (to the extent measurable in his day).

Feel free to provide a similar list for Greer..

Anyway, getting back to the topic..  I can't currently view the videos - so I better check - am I correct as identifying this*:
Posted Image
..as the 'alien' carcase in question?

* Clearly this is a composite image - original sources are not certain, but I'm happy to provide links to where I found these copies, if requested.

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#21    psyche101

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 04:59 AM

View PostChrlzs, on 08 February 2013 - 04:53 AM, said:

You don't see a difference?  Allow me:
1. Back in Newton's day, we didn't understand elementary physics so alchemy was a genuine pursuit - in fact it led to chemistry.  From Wiki:
[/size]
2. Newton documented his ideas fully, gave mathematics, proved his assertions, and he was dealing with known phenomena - things like planetary motions, things falling to the ground...
3. Newton didn't have a history of fraudulent claims and scams.
4. Newton did not run a sideshow of money seeking events and funding requests, while hiding behind excuses of 'it's not ready yet'.
5. Netwon associated with genuine experts, genuine scientists.
6. Newton has consistently been proven correct in his assertions and theories (to the extent measurable in his day).

Feel free to provide a similar list for Greer..

Anyway, getting back to the topic..  I can't currently view the videos - so I better check - am I correct as identifying this*:
Posted Image
..as the 'alien' carcase in question?

* Clearly this is a composite image - original sources are not certain, but I'm happy to provide links to where I found these copies, if requested.


Interesting pics huh, I wonder what the function of the Sagital crest is supposed to be when it has no pronounced jawbone? It's more of a weak chin if anything, which really asks questions about the Sagital crest.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo 'If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants.' - Sir Isaac Newton. "Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit." Ed Stewart. Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs. Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Sir Wearer of Hats.


#22    Esoteric Toad

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:17 AM

View PostChrlzs, on 08 February 2013 - 04:53 AM, said:

You don't see a difference?  Allow me:
1. Back in Newton's day, we didn't understand elementary physics so alchemy was a genuine pursuit - in fact it led to chemistry.  From Wiki:
[/size]
2. Newton documented his ideas fully, gave mathematics, proved his assertions, and he was dealing with known phenomena - things like planetary motions, things falling to the ground...
3. Newton didn't have a history of fraudulent claims and scams.
4. Newton did not run a sideshow of money seeking events and funding requests, while hiding behind excuses of 'it's not ready yet'.
5. Netwon associated with genuine experts, genuine scientists.
6. Newton has consistently been proven correct in his assertions and theories (to the extent measurable in his day).

Feel free to provide a similar list for Greer..

Anyway, getting back to the topic..  I can't currently view the videos - so I better check - am I correct as identifying this*:
Posted Image
..as the 'alien' carcase in question?

* Clearly this is a composite image - original sources are not certain, but I'm happy to provide links to where I found these copies, if requested.

If you were to put the muscle, fluids and skin on that model.... Er skeleton it wouldn't be able to move.... A veritable blob. This from someone with a working knowledge of animation and skeleton rigs.... Just look at the fingers. Not enough space for ligaments, muscle, any sort of circulatory system. Not enough room for the guts as it were.... JMO.


#23    coolguy

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:17 AM

It looks real we will find out


#24    ChrLzs

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:18 AM

To Psyche and Esoteric Toad, indeed...  And all the non-matching er different colours of the bones look a bit .. unusual, and as for those knee/ankle joints..?? (compare to the 'arms' which look pretty earthly)  :cry:   I think the little guy might have needed a teeny weeny wheelchair to get around..

But there ya go - you can't second-guess alien {cough splutter} physiology...

Anyway, Steven says his upcoming PPV documentary will explain all (was supposed to be finished Dec '12..), and although he assures us that he has had this all examined by experts and yup, it's the Real Thing™, he's not showing the reports or giving any detail or linking to the published papers or..  

But ... would anyone like to donate to his cause, so that he can enjoy the liftestyle er the doco can be completed and shipped??? :whistle:

Edited by Chrlzs, 08 February 2013 - 05:21 AM.

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#25    Dr. Mirdad

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 01:00 PM

I saw this the other day. Apparently they found one in Russia as well. Here's the link........ http://divinecosmos....d-south-america They have a lot of good pictures. I haven't read the summary yet, so I'm not well informed enough to give my two sense... but I will leave saying this..

Posted Image

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#26    freetoroam

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 01:20 PM

View Postkeninsc, on 07 February 2013 - 06:14 AM, said:

Interesting, but where is the creature the x-ray was taken of?
Give them time, they have only just finished making the skeleton.

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#27    Sweetpumper

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 03:21 PM

Looks like Beavis.

Posted Image

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#28    DBunker

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 03:51 PM

Sweetpumper is right..... Beavis is dead.

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#29    bison

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 05:40 PM

1.) Newton's associate Robert Boyle had already established the basic principles, and norms of experimentation and communication of modern chemistry, in this era. That Newton, otherwise a pioneer of the intellect, should reject this rational alternative, in favor of the old, unprovable, irrational ideas of alchemy shows him to be a pseudo-scientist, to this extent.                                                        2.)Newton could not have proven his assertions about the essential tenets of alchemy, as they are irrational and can not be proven scientifically. Nor can he be said to have studied only known phenomena, as the core of alchemy is about phenomena not known to science.    3.) I do not propose a lawyerly case of suspicion and circumstance against the possible merits of this specific scientific investigation. It must stand or fall on the findings of science, properly and independently confirmed, not on ad hominem arguments. 4.) In Newton's day, science was much more about thought alone, and far less about technology, which can be very complex and expensive. Many scientific projects in our time struggle to find funding, and are sometimes delayed for years, or cancelled outright, due to the lack of funding. 5.) Dr. Greer reports that he has consulted with scientific experts. When his new presentation is released this year, it will become apparent if he was in ernest about this, and about the evidence he says that have developed.   6.) Newton has had the advantage of several centuries, in which some of his ideas were scientifically tested and verified. His reputation has been established and enhanced, his pseudo-scientific errors largely glossed over. Let us at least see what a few months will do for Dr. Greer's latest claim.

Edited by bison, 08 February 2013 - 05:41 PM.


#30    seeder

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Posted 08 February 2013 - 06:21 PM

Nah not convinced at this stage specially when they were also allegedly found elsewhere as per  Dr. Mrdads link above.  On that link I just realized the xray seems to show flesh or at least dried flesh as it appears as a ghost outline on the xray, plus somethings obviously keeping it all held together nicely.  Also, it says it has internal organs such as a heart (after all, who xrays 'just' skeletons? There wouldnt be any need would there?)


But if they do turn out to be real XT's, well we can know for sure they didnt build puma punku or the pyramids, and we can also know we have nothing to fear from them seeing as they are barely a hands length in size.




.

Edited by seeder, 08 February 2013 - 06:47 PM.

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