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The RB-47 UFO Incident


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#121    quillius

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 03:55 PM

View PostHazzard, on 20 June 2012 - 03:15 PM, said:

Im looking for independent verification of these claims made by zoser about Hessdalen,... but cant find any.

This is quite interesting:

http://home.cropcirc...-hessdalen.html

from the link:

As everyone knows, it is a circular explanation: no-one really knows what the earth lights are. The lights are seen (and filmed) mostly in night-time but the local people have also told about grey disc or cigar shaped objects in the air which don't reflect light. There haven't been any observations of aliens and no abductions have occurred though there's been a couple of strange animal deaths that resemble "animal mutilations".

possible interpretation issues.

I have also read that there is no heat associated with Hessdalen lights, which illiminates one type of possible cattle death.


#122    TheMcGuffin

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:16 PM

View Postquillius, on 20 June 2012 - 03:55 PM, said:

This is quite interesting:

http://home.cropcirc...-hessdalen.html

from the link:

As everyone knows, it is a circular explanation: no-one really knows what the earth lights are. The lights are seen (and filmed) mostly in night-time but the local people have also told about grey disc or cigar shaped objects in the air which don't reflect light. There haven't been any observations of aliens and no abductions have occurred though there's been a couple of strange animal deaths that resemble "animal mutilations".

possible interpretation issues.

I have also read that there is no heat associated with Hessdalen lights, which illiminates one type of possible cattle death.


My problem with plasmas, ball lightning and other similar explanations for UFOs is that they are usually very short duration events, generally only a fraction of a second or a few seconds in length, and I can't imagine them going on as long as this RB-47 incident or similar UFOs reported right around this time.  I also can't imagine them responding correctly to encrypted IFF messages or showing up on radar and radar detection equipment for a prolonged period.

If they did, they must be the most remarkable plasmas on record, and ones for which I can find no evidence in the scientific literature.  You'd think that such a remarkable phenomenon would by itself have provoked considerable scientific interest and curiosity because nothing like it had even been seen before.

"The stuff that dreams are made of"

#123    quillius

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:25 PM

View PostTheMcGuffin, on 20 June 2012 - 04:16 PM, said:

My problem with plasmas, ball lightning and other similar explanations for UFOs is that they are usually very short duration events, generally only a fraction of a second or a few seconds in length, and I can't imagine them going on as long as this RB-47 incident or similar UFOs reported right around this time.  I also can't imagine them responding correctly to encrypted IFF messages or showing up on radar and radar detection equipment for a prolonged period.

If they did, they must be the most remarkable plasmas on record, and ones for which I can find no evidence in the scientific literature.  You'd think that such a remarkable phenomenon would by itself have provoked considerable scientific interest and curiosity because nothing like it had even been seen before.

The scientific interest in Hessdalen doesnt seem that great but I could be wrong with this perception, I am suprised that it isnt being jumped all over, this is however based on the  premise of limited interest being correct.

not sure what to make of this article , some may be interested.

http://skeptoid.com/episodes/4270

I feel there is an underlying dig at the guys over at Hessdalen.


#124    Hazzard

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:35 PM

View PostTheMcGuffin, on 20 June 2012 - 04:16 PM, said:

My problem with plasmas, ball lightning and other similar explanations for UFOs is that they are usually very short duration events, generally only a fraction of a second or a few seconds in length, and I can't imagine them going on as long as this RB-47 incident or similar UFOs reported right around this time.  I also can't imagine them responding correctly to encrypted IFF messages or showing up on radar and radar detection equipment for a prolonged period.

If they did, they must be the most remarkable plasmas on record, and ones for which I can find no evidence in the scientific literature.  You'd think that such a remarkable phenomenon would by itself have provoked considerable scientific interest and curiosity because nothing like it had even been seen before.

#109 in this very thread,... There is also ball lightning. It usually is seen shortly before or after, or during, a thunderstorm. Its duration varies from a few seconds to a few minutes.

Im not saying that plasma or ball lightning is to blame for all UFO sightings, but Im pretty sure its quite a few over the years.

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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#125    TheMcGuffin

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:40 PM

View PostHazzard, on 20 June 2012 - 04:35 PM, said:

#109 in this very thread,... There is also ball lightning. It usually is seen shortly before or after, or during, a thunderstorm. Its duration varies from a few seconds to a few minutes.

Im not saying that plasma or ball lightning is to blame for all UFO sightings, but Im pretty sure its quite a few over the years.

It's a very old and shopworn explanation that goes back to the "foo fighters" of World War II, and perhaps it explains some of the short duration UFOs seen at night, but not something like the RB-47 case, which is far more complicated.

It is a good enough "explanation" to be fed to the incurious public, but also serves as a substitute for real thinking and analysis.  If it had been an acceptable explanation for all or most UFOs, it would have been used a lot more over the years, except that it can't be made to fit all the facts.  Nothing can.

Edited by TheMcGuffin, 20 June 2012 - 04:54 PM.

"The stuff that dreams are made of"

#126    Hazzard

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:41 PM

View Postquillius, on 20 June 2012 - 03:55 PM, said:

This is quite interesting:

http://home.cropcirc...-hessdalen.html



Yes, I have red lots of scientific reports on the Hessdalen project,... but I was thinking about the claim made by zoser where "2 tonnes of earth have been surgically dug out and moved a couple of metres; because that happened in Hessdalen".


I cant find anything about it.


Another cover-up? :unsure2:

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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*The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. -Edmund Burke

#127    quillius

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:43 PM

View PostHazzard, on 20 June 2012 - 04:41 PM, said:

Yes, I have red lots of scientific reports on the Hessdalen project,... but I was thinking about the claim made by zoser where "2 tonnes of earth have been surgically dug out and moved a couple of metres; because that happened in Hessdalen".


I cant find anything about it.


Another cover-up? :unsure2:

no dont think cover up....just bad information passed around possibly.....??? also the article says resembles mutilations....and from here the word resemble is removed and off we go :)


#128    Hazzard

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:50 PM

View Postquillius, on 20 June 2012 - 04:43 PM, said:

no dont think cover up....just bad information passed around possibly.....??? also the article says resembles mutilations....and from here the word resemble is removed and off we go :)

Last thing UFOlogy needs is more mud in the water.

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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*The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. -Edmund Burke

#129    zoser

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 04:59 PM

View Postquillius, on 20 June 2012 - 04:43 PM, said:

no dont think cover up....just bad information passed around possibly.....??? also the article says resembles mutilations....and from here the word resemble is removed and off we go :)

The information regarding the massive piece of earth is on the documentaries.  It was thoroughly investigated, and the team noted that it occurred in a remote part of the Hessdalen region with no access to heavy traffic; I recommend scanning through the documentary.  Let me know if you can't find it and I will do a trawl.

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#130    Hazzard

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 05:11 PM

View Postzoser, on 20 June 2012 - 04:59 PM, said:

The information regarding the massive piece of earth is on the documentaries.  It was thoroughly investigated, and the team noted that it occurred in a remote part of the Hessdalen region with no access to heavy traffic; I recommend scanning through the documentary.  Let me know if you can't find it and I will do a trawl.

So, thats it then, someone mentioning it on youtube?!

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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*The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. -Edmund Burke

#131    quillius

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 05:43 PM

View Postzoser, on 20 June 2012 - 04:59 PM, said:

The information regarding the massive piece of earth is on the documentaries.  It was thoroughly investigated, and the team noted that it occurred in a remote part of the Hessdalen region with no access to heavy traffic; I recommend scanning through the documentary.  Let me know if you can't find it and I will do a trawl.

Fair enough, my response to Hazz was in relation to the mutilations aspect.


#132    TheMcGuffin

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 07:22 PM

View Postquillius, on 20 June 2012 - 05:43 PM, said:

Fair enough, my response to Hazz was in relation to the mutilations aspect.

I never heard of any mutes at Hessdalen, but I can't say that I ever followed the case very closely.  I do think that those occur from time to time.

Once, I even heard a story about a guy in Brazil who got dissolved after a UFO sprayed something on him.

"The stuff that dreams are made of"

#133    S2F

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 08:36 PM

View Postquillius, on 20 June 2012 - 05:43 PM, said:

Fair enough, my response to Hazz was in relation to the mutilations aspect.

Speaking of mutilations, has there ever been evidence presented (for any case) that cannot be the result of normal decay and/or insect and animal scavenging?

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#134    TheMcGuffin

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 09:19 PM

View PostSlave2Fate, on 20 June 2012 - 08:36 PM, said:

Speaking of mutilations, has there ever been evidence presented (for any case) that cannot be the result of normal decay and/or insect and animal scavenging?

Possibly, but I admit that it's difficult to prove.  I wish I knew whether there was any truth to the case of  Sgt Jonathan Louette, for example, who was supposedly a victim at White Sands in 1956, but it's difficult to be sure.

Is it only mentioned in the controversial Grudge Special Report 13, which may or may not even have existed?

http://www.think-abo...Mutilations.htm

Edited by TheMcGuffin, 20 June 2012 - 09:25 PM.

"The stuff that dreams are made of"

#135    DBunker

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Posted 20 June 2012 - 09:37 PM

View PostHazzard, on 20 June 2012 - 05:11 PM, said:

So, thats it then, someone mentioning it on youtube?!

What!!?? Are you implying that a youtube video of someone flapping their lips isnt enough for you to SCREAM that Alienzz is here! :tsu:

Now that communications technology has made it possible to give global reach to the bizarre and archive it forever, it is essential for men and women of reason resolutely to counter the delusions of the fringe element. James S. Robbins




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