62 replies to this topic

[Michelle]

freetoroam, on 26 January 2013 - 09:24 PM, said:

"Ch Insp Drummond-Smith added: "We have recovered a firearm of sorts, it hasn't been fully examined yet so I'm unable to confirm whether its a replica or a genuine firearm."
if the police could not tell then how could people who are not used to seeing guns?  You have no idea if they knew it was fake or not.
Anyway, why are we discussing this on this thread, I only pointed out the other thread as an example.

I believe that is why we are discussing it...because you brought it up as a prime example of why you don't need guns and how brave and sanctimonious you all are.

It sounds like the facts are still coming out about the gun. Maybe the press is like you and don't want to point out the heinous actions of their fellow countrymen.

Stay on your soapbox and I'll ignore you from now on.

Edited by Michelle, 26 January 2013 - 09:36 PM.

[freetoroam]

Michelle, on 26 January 2013 - 09:33 PM, said:

I believe that is why we are discussing it...because you brought it up as a prime example of why you don't need guns.

It sounds like the facts are still coming out about the gun. Maybe the press is like you and don't want to point out the heinous actions of their fellow countrymen.

You actually make me laugh, you say heinous actions for a community who defended themselves and yet you are all up for carrying a gun and using it to defend yourself.
Both actions lead to the same thing but in completely different ways. There is far more chance of killing someone when you have a gun in your hand and are scared out of your wits, to pinning a man down who is wearing a gas mask, thats just bad luck for him, they did not intend to kill him and he would have survived had he not had the gas mask on. at the end of the day, a gas mask is a lot different to a balaclava.

[Michelle]

freetoroam, on 26 January 2013 - 09:39 PM, said:

You actually make me laugh, you say heinous actions for a community who defended themselves and yet you are all up for carrying a gun and using it to defend yourself.
Both actions lead to the same thing but in completely different ways. There is far more chance of killing someone when you have a gun in your hand and are scared out of your wits, to pinning a man down who is wearing a gas mask, thats just bad luck for him, they did not intend to kill him and he would have survived had he not had the gas mask on. at the end of the day, a gas mask is a lot different to a balaclava.

Even most cops here have never had to shoot anyone. But, you are right....it takes a lot longer to kill someone and much more time to reason through a situation when they are holding a man down to the point he dies, whereas a gunshot is an instantaneous reaction to an immediate danger.

Edited by Michelle, 26 January 2013 - 09:51 PM.

[zebra99]

There are few replicas over here that might fool me,except maybe the de-activated ones.But there again I'm used to handguns, having had several of my own for many years until they were banned a few years back.(I was a registered member of a gun club)
The average bloke over here wouldn't know the difference until it was shown to him.The cops comments were a typical non committal answer for the press.How the bloke died we don't know yet,but probably from asphyxiation with several guys sitting on him.The inquest will decide.

This whole American gun thing can't really be commented on from over here.The majority here have never been in the position where it's the norm to own or carry one like in the States. Even with strict registration there would be millions not accounted for after so many years.

[Yamato]

ninjadude, on 26 January 2013 - 09:26 PM, said:

Turns out, you're paranoid about noises. This was much ado about nothing at all.

Oh, an insult!  Hindsight is so 20/20.  

And what would you have done at nine years old?   Flown your Lego spacecraft downstairs to investigate?   Stayed in the room and continued playing?   At least we moved to a safe location and thought about our next move from there.   Which included jumping off the roof and going to my house, going back in the house to investigate ourselves, or going back in the house to call my parents.   We chose the third option.   What harm was done by what we chose to do, child counselor?   Would you have berated your son for being paranoid in this scenario?

[Michelle]

Yamato, on 27 January 2013 - 04:10 AM, said:

Oh, an insult!  Hindsight is so 20/20.  

And what would you have done at nine years old?   Flown your Lego spacecraft downstairs to investigate?   Stayed in the room and continued playing?   At least we moved to a safe location and thought about our next move from there.   Which included jumping off the roof and going to my house, going back in the house to investigate ourselves, or going back in the house to call my parents.   We chose the third option.   What harm was done by what we chose to do, child counselor?   Would you have berated your son for being paranoid in this scenario?

I can relate, Yamato. A friend of mine and I were home alone one night and we heard a noise at one of the windows. We tried to put it down to imagination or the bush brushing against it, but after a few minutes we realized it wasn't either one. Even though I knew where the guns were in the house, and had access to them, I called the next door neighbor to come over and investigate. Apparently, he scared whoever it was off, because the storm window and screen had been taken off the window and there were pry marks on the window sill.

Either way, I'm glad we didn't have to bother the police.

[acidhead]

No offense but it doesn't matter if the individual bothers the police or not.  Believe me, they collect taxes far more often then saving lives. What matters is acting upon your fears rationally and making smart decisions.  When you are ready you will call.  The first course of action should be protecting yourself in the best ability possible.  If this decision involves bolting out a window and getting the **** outta there, as Yam did, then it effectively removed the individual from danger.

[Michelle]

acidhead, on 27 January 2013 - 04:51 AM, said:

No offense but it doesn't matter if the individual bothers the police or not.  Believe me, they collect taxes far more often then saving lives. What matters is acting upon your fears rationally and making smart decisions.  When you are ready you will call.  The first course of action should be protecting yourself in the best ability possible.  If this decision involves bolting out a window and getting the **** outta there, as Yam did, then it effectively removed the individual from danger.

That is one of the first things they teach you in a gun training course..if you have an exit, take it!  The average person's instinct is to hunker down in the safest place possible in their house. I feel bad for people that can be trapped inside their homes...we cannot.

I'm slightly worried someone would be at the other door, but I also know they would be at my mercy, because I'm not going to go out empty handed. But, I would have to justify killing someone outside of my house if need be.

You have to keep these things in mind when you have a dangerous weapon at hand.

Edited by Michelle, 27 January 2013 - 06:04 AM.

[Uncle Sam]

Michelle, on 27 January 2013 - 05:22 AM, said:

That is one of the first things they teach you in a gun training course..if you have an exit, take it!  The average person's instinct is to hunker down in the safest place possible in their house. I feel bad for people that can be trapped inside their homes...we cannot.

I'm slightly worried someone would be at the other door, but I also know they would be at my mercy, because I'm not going to go out empty handed.

And it is a very smart lesson being taught, because if you stay your ground and shot the intruder, the cops can sometimes throw the books at you regardless if you are defending your home or your family. It happens, which is extremely sad, they are there to protect and serve us citizens, not the criminals who infringe upon other's rights.

[acidhead]

Uncle Sam, on 27 January 2013 - 05:58 AM, said:

And it is a very smart lesson being taught, because if you stay your ground and shot the intruder, the cops can sometimes throw the books at you regardless if you are defending your home or your family. It happens, which is extremely sad, they are there to protect and serve us citizens, not the criminals who infringe upon other's rights.

Yeah... excessive force.  

When the State becomes strong those who serve it become stronger in their positions of power.  It invites criminal activity.

[acidhead]

Michelle, on 27 January 2013 - 05:22 AM, said:

That is one of the first things they teach you in a gun training course..if you have an exit, take it!  The average person's instinct is to hunker down in the safest place possible in their house. I feel bad for people that can be trapped inside their homes...we cannot.

I'm slightly worried someone would be at the other door, but I also know they would be at my mercy, because I'm not going to go out empty handed. But, I would have to justify killing someone outside of my house if need be.

The average person, when dealt a life threatening situation freezes and becomes a victim.  Take an airliner crash for example... the survivors bolt from the carnage while the rest wait in their seat belts for help and burn to death.

[Michelle]

acidhead, on 27 January 2013 - 06:09 AM, said:

The average person, when dealt a life threatening situation freezes and becomes a victim.  Take an airliner crash for example... the survivors bolt from the carnage while the rest wait in their seat belts for help and burn to death.

I've already found out, a few times, I'm very good in a crisis situation. Afterwards, when the police, fire department and paramedics show up and take over I cry like a baby and I'm not afraid to admit it.

[acidhead]

Michelle, on 27 January 2013 - 06:29 AM, said:

I've already found out, a few times, I'm very good in a crisis situation. Afterwards, when the police, fire department and paramedics show up and take over I cry like a baby and I'm not afraid to admit it.

We're all human.  It's not uncommon to lose focus after a high adrenal event.  Blood to water ratio is key in maintaining focus.. trust me, I know...... lol

[Michelle]

acidhead, on 27 January 2013 - 06:48 AM, said:

We're all human.  It's not uncommon to lose focus after a high adrenal event.  Blood to water ratio is key in maintaining focus.. trust me, I know...... lol

Lose focus...hell, I was just glad someone else took responsibility. I did everything I was capable of at that point. lol

Edited by Michelle, 27 January 2013 - 07:05 AM.

[Uncle Sam]

I think us citizens should start teaching our children what the constitution is and how important it is for us if the schools are not willing to do so. At this point in history, we can no longer remain ignorant and naive in situations like this when Obama thinks are only for skeeting and hunting.

Edited by Uncle Sam, 27 January 2013 - 07:31 AM.