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WTC 911 EyeWitness~Hoboken


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#1681    skyeagle409

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:04 AM

View PostQ24, on 22 May 2013 - 11:20 PM, said:

Posted Image

THERMITE!

Lower-right picture the molten flow from WTC2 which initiated in the minutes prior to collapse.

Centre picture shows what thermite reaction can do to structural steel.

This video shows what 175 pounds of thermite could not do.



I might add that the corner of WTC2 where the molten flow originated, is the location where much of the aluminum airframe of United 175 came to rest.

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#1682    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:20 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 22 May 2013 - 11:35 PM, said:

I might add that those silvery droplets are not molten steel and there is no evidence that thermite or thermate were used. I might add that Steven Jones and Richard Gage were caught lying and as a result, there were those who were duped. Even the colleagues of Steven Jones have distanced themselves from him and do not agree with his thermite assessment. .

What sort of blinkered nitwit looks at some “silvery droplets” in preference to the great flow of fiery molten metal pouring from the building?  I guess the same sort of blinkered nitwit who thinks an ideal physical match to thermite is not useful evidence.  The same sort of blinkered nitwit who mentions nothing of NIST’s Shyam Sunder when he deceptively and unashamedly describes the fiery molten flow as, “a silverish colour molten material” but has the nerve to call Jones and Gage liars.


View Postskyeagle409, on 22 May 2013 - 11:35 PM, said:

Ever wondered why demolition companies use RDX and dynamite to demolish tall buildings?

I wonder more why you ask such pointless questions.


View Postskyeagle409, on 22 May 2013 - 11:35 PM, said:

Now, let's take a look at the WTC towers. Given their unique design, what would happen if I used a torch to cut every steel column in their cores? Will they collapse or simply remain standing? The fact the buildings were buckling just prior to their collapse event was an indication that fires were weakening their steel structures and nothing to do with explosives.

First, refer to response above.

The buckling appeared or increased at just the timeframe the WTC2 molten flow began.  What a coincidence.  Indication that thermite was responsible for the collapse initiations.

Err... random skyeagle-esque sidetrack...

“Shortly before the building collapsed, several NYPD officers and Con-Edison workers told me that Larry Silverstein, the property developer of One World Financial Center was on the phone with his insurance carrier to see if they would authorize the controlled demolition of the building........ ”

Posted Image

http://www.foxnews.c...ero-sept-shame/


That is all it needs for any rationale person to expect a full investigation and questioning of Silverstein.

Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1683    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:22 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 22 May 2013 - 11:35 PM, said:

I might add that those silvery droplets are not molten steel and there is no evidence that thermite or thermate were used. I might add that Steven Jones and Richard Gage were caught lying and as a result, there were those who were duped. Even the colleagues of Steven Jones have distanced themselves from him and do not agree with his thermite assessment. . Ever wondered why demolition companies use RDX and dynamite to demolish tall buildings?

And furthermore!



Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1684    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:29 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 22 May 2013 - 11:35 PM, said:

I might add that those silvery droplets are not molten steel and there is no evidence that thermite or thermate were used. I might add that Steven Jones and Richard Gage were caught lying and as a result, there were those who were duped. Even the colleagues of Steven Jones have distanced themselves from him and do not agree with his thermite assessment. . Ever wondered why demolition companies use RDX and dynamite to demolish tall buildings?

And this is proven incorrect as thermite was used.

Quote

NIST initially denied the fact of
free-fall in its final draft report released
in August 2008. In the technical briefing
that followed, NIST’s lead investigator,
Shyam Sunder explained, “A free-fall time
would be an object that has no structural
components below it.” He claimed that
WTC7 took 40% longer than “free-fall
time” to collapse, “and that is not at all
unusual because there was structural
resistance that was provided in this
particular case. And you had a sequence
of structural failures that had to take place
and everything was not instantaneous.”
However, physics instructor and
AE911Truth associate David Chandler had
used network television videos to carefully
measure the acceleration of the building during its fall and shown conclusively
that a significant period of free-fall was an indisputable fact. He publicly
challenged NIST’s claims at the technical briefing. Along with several others,
he filed formal requests for corrections during the public response period.
In its final report NIST reversed itself on its denial of free-fall, but it
couched its revised statement in deceptive language and failed to address
how free-fall could be compatible with its fire-induced progressive collapse
analysis. For the observed straight-down collapse, a thick network of heavy
steel columns and beams, had to be forcibly
removed and more than 400 structural
steel connections had to fail per second,
evenly all across each of the eight floors
involved. These failures had to occur
ahead

of the collapsing section – NOT caused by it
– because a free-falling object cannot exert
force on anything in its path without slowing
its own fall.


http://www2.ae911tru..._AE911Truth.pdf

Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1685    skyeagle409

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:34 AM

View PostQ24, on 23 May 2013 - 12:22 AM, said:

And furthermore!



That video is highly flawed. Check out  time line 11:53. What is he saying? Now, let's take a look at WTC7, and tell us, what is it that you don't hear?



What you didn't hear are explosions as WTC7 collapsed, which automatically debunks his claim of explosives.

Edited by skyeagle409, 23 May 2013 - 01:16 AM.

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#1686    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:38 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 23 May 2013 - 12:34 AM, said:

That video is highly flawed. Check out  time line 11:53. What is he saying. Now, let's take a look at WTC7, and tell us, what is it that you don't hear?

What you didn't hear were explosions as WTC7 collapsed, which automatically debunks his claim of explosives.

Your answer is flawed because apparently you did not get the hint that thermite was used to initiate the collapses.

Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1687    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:40 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 23 May 2013 - 12:34 AM, said:

That video is highly flawed. Check out  time line 11:53. What is he saying. Now, let's take a look at WTC7, and tell us, what is it that you don't hear?

What you didn't hear were explosions as WTC7 collapsed, which automatically debunks his claim of explosives.

And here is why you are mistaken: -



Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1688    skyeagle409

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:44 AM

View PostQ24, on 23 May 2013 - 12:20 AM, said:

What sort of blinkered nitwit looks at some “silvery droplets” in preference to the great flow of fiery molten metal pouring from the building?

Well, let's take a look at the photo.

Posted Image

Yes indeed, those silvery droplets are aluminum and they originated from the same corner of WTC2  where much of the aluminum airframe of United 175 came to rest.

Quote

I guess the same sort of blinkered nitwit who thinks an ideal physical match to thermite is not useful evidence.  The same sort of blinkered nitwit who mentions nothing of NIST’s Shyam Sunder when he deceptively and unashamedly describes the fiery molten flow as, “a silverish colour molten material” but has the nerve to call Jones and Gage liars.

Others have also called them liars as well. Let's take a short look at Steven Jones.

Quote

Letter to the Editor
April 09, 2006

Dear Editor,
After reading in the Daily Herald the presentations made by Professor Steven E. Jones (BYU Physics) to students at UVSC and BYU, I feel obligated to reply to his "Conspiracy Theory" relating to the terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center (9/11/01).

I have studied the summary of the report by FEMA, The American Society of Civil Engineers and several other professional engineering organizations. These experts have given in detail the effects on the Towers by the impact of the commercial aircraft. I have also read Professor Jones' (referred to) 42 page unpublished report. In my understanding of structural design and the properties of structural steel I find Professor Jones' thesis that planted explosives (rather than fire from the planes) caused the collapse of the Towers, very unreliable.

The structural design of the towers was unique in that the supporting steel structure consisted of closely spaced columns in the walls of all four sides. The resulting structure was similar to a tube. When the aircraft impacted the towers at speeds of about 500 plus mph, many steel columns were immediately severed and others rendered weak by the following fires. The fires critically damaged the floors systems. Structural steel will begin to lose strength when heated to temperatures above 1000 degrees Fahrenheit. Steel bridge girders are bent to conform to the curved roadway by spot heating flanges between 800 and 1000 degrees Fahrenheit. It is easy to comprehend the loss of carrying capacity of all the structural steel due to the raging fires fed by the jet's fuel as well as aircraft and building contents.

Before one (especially students) supports such a conspiracy theory, they should investigate all details of the theory. To me a practicing structural engineer of 57 continuous years (1941-1998), Professor Jones' presentations are very disturbing.

D. Allan Firmage

http://www.debunking911.com/jones.htm

Now, let's' take a look at Richard Gage.

Quote

ARCHITECT Magazine
The Magzine of the American Institute of Architects

The boardroom at the Washington, D.C., headquarters of the American Institute of Architects is an impressive place: Beautiful concentric wooden desks, with microphones in front of every seat, encircle a small central dais, offering the impression that important discussions are had here. “It feels like the United Nations,” a guest recently commented.

This room recently served as a peculiar venue for the 23rd stop on the 30-city “world premiere tour” of AIA member Richard Gage’s new film 9/11: Explosive Evidence—Experts Speak Out: Final Edition. Since 2006, Gage has been traveling all over the world under the banner of his organization, Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth—an organization that has no affiliation with the AIA, express or otherwise—to preach the theory that the Twin Towers and 7 World Trade Center were actually brought down by explosives on September 11, 2001, and not the impact of two hijacked jetliners and the resulting fires and debris.

“I had to be dragged kicking and screaming into believing that our government and the Israeli government, the Israeli Mossad, could be responsible for the Twin Towers demolition,” one member of the DC chapter of 911truth.org declared from the AIA-emblazoned podium.


The accusations of Gage’s organization are the typical hodgepodge of pseudo-scientific claims. Along with other esoteric and debunked technical arguments, he says that melted steel was visible at the Ground Zero site proving that the fires burned too hot to have been caused by jet fuel; that because the buildings collapsed at “near free fall speed” there must have been a controlled demolition; and that traces of athermitereaction found in the World Trade Center debris proves that explosives were used.


All of Gage’s so-called evidence has been rebutted in peer-reviewed papers, by the Federal Emergency Management Agency, by the National Institute for Standards and Technology, by the American Society of Civil Engineers, by the 9/11 Commission Report, and, perhaps most memorably, by the 110-year-old engineering journal Popular Mechanics.


Edited by skyeagle409, 23 May 2013 - 12:45 AM.

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#1689    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:50 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 23 May 2013 - 12:44 AM, said:

Well, let's take a look at the photo.


Yes indeed, those silvery droplets are aluminum and they originated from the same corner of WTC2  where much of the aluminum airframe of United 175 came to rest.

Let's take another look at the pictures at the top of the page.

The glowing molten metal is an ideal match to thermite.


View Postskyeagle409, on 23 May 2013 - 12:44 AM, said:

Others have also called them liars as well. Let's take a short look at Steven Jones.

Now, let's' take a look at Richard Gage.

No one called them "liars" in those articles so you must be a liar.

Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1690    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 12:53 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 23 May 2013 - 12:44 AM, said:

Well, let's take a look at the photo.

Posted Image

Posted Image

Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1691    skyeagle409

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 01:03 AM

View PostQ24, on 23 May 2013 - 12:29 AM, said:

And this is proven incorrect as thermite was used.

[/size][/font]

http://www2.ae911tru..._AE911Truth.pdf

About free speed and the WTC towers. Why does this photo debunk claims the WTC buildings fell at free fall speeds?

Posted Image

Notice in the photo that dust plumes and debris are outpacing the collapse of the WTC building, in which case that photo automatically debunks the conspiracist claim the WTC buildings collapsed at free fall speeds.

Now, let's review this video and tell us; How long did it take WTC1 and WTC2 to collapse?



.

Edited by skyeagle409, 23 May 2013 - 01:14 AM.

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#1692    skyeagle409

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 01:11 AM

View PostQ24, on 23 May 2013 - 12:53 AM, said:

Posted Image

Posted Image

You have just committed another serious error (which is what I was looking for). Those towers are not constructed of the same design as the WTC buildings, and I could have taken a simple torch and down those towers without thermtie. Your error depicts your lack of knowledge on structural issues because given the construction technique of each WTC tower, there was no way that thermite could have been responsible for the collapse of the WTC buildings.

Now, tell us, why do demolition companies use RDX and dynamite rather than thermite for demolition implosions of tall buildings?

Edited by skyeagle409, 23 May 2013 - 01:13 AM.

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#1693    Q24

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 01:20 AM

View Postskyeagle409, on 23 May 2013 - 01:11 AM, said:

You have just committed another serious error (which is what I was looking for). Those towers are not constructed of the same design as the WTC buildings, and I could have taken a simple torch and down those towers without thermtie. Your error depicts your lack of knowledge on structural issues because given the construction technique of each WTC tower, there was no way that thermite could have been responsible for the collapse of the WTC buildings.

Now, tell us, why do demolition companies use RDX and dynamite rather than thermite for demolition implosions of tall buildings?

You have just demolished your own argument (which you would notice if you were more observant).  Your lack of knowledge has led you to compare 1,500lbs of thermite melting a 10ft section of steel with a silly little blowtorch!  And that is why thermite was responsible for collapse of the steel core structures of the WTC towers.

Now tell us, why are you asking pointless questions again?

Operation Northwoods was a 1962 plan by the US Department of Defense to cause acts of violence, blamed on Cuba, in order to generate U.S. public support for military action against the Cuban government. The plan called for various false flag actions, such as staged terrorist attacks and plane hijackings, on U.S. and Cuban soil.

#1694    skyeagle409

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 01:28 AM

View PostQ24, on 23 May 2013 - 12:40 AM, said:

And here is why you are mistaken: -



I am not mistaken by any means. Let's examine these facts.

For thermite to be effective against steel columns, like explosives, thermite must be firmly attached to a steel column. Secondly, the collapse of WTC1 and WTC2 were initiated at the locations where each tower was struck an B-767. Thirdly, the collisions were so violent that they dislodged fire protection from the structures of the WTC towers which directly exposed them to raging fires, and such violent collisions would have dislodge any thermite, or explosives for that matter, if attached to steel columns at those locations thus rendering them totally ineffective as in this case if explosives are not firmly attached to the steel structure of a building.

Posted Image

As you can see, there are steel columns sitting within the crater of that huge bomb. And finally, there was no evidence of thermite cuts on the structural columns of the WTC towers.

Edited by skyeagle409, 23 May 2013 - 01:46 AM.

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#1695    skyeagle409

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Posted 23 May 2013 - 01:37 AM

View PostQ24, on 23 May 2013 - 01:20 AM, said:

You have just demolished your own argument (which you would notice if you were more observant).  Your lack of knowledge has led you to compare 1,500lbs of thermite melting a 10ft section of steel with a silly little blowtorch!  And that is why thermite was responsible for collapse of the steel core structures of the WTC towers.

Now tell us, why are you asking pointless questions again?

On the contrary, here is another point that reinforces what I meant.




What do you think clean-up crews were using to cut up those huge steel columns of the WTC buidings?

Posted Image



Edited by skyeagle409, 23 May 2013 - 01:42 AM.

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