61 replies to this topic

[Professor T]

sutemi, on 16 November 2012 - 05:40 AM, said:

Beany, Prof T and SM Kid, I like your posts. Can I share this 14 min vid with you all. I think it touches on what you have all  touched on in your posts. Hope you like it. Take care

Wow, that was brilliant..
Thanks for posting that..

[StarMountainKid]

Great video, sutemi. A very Zen-like message, and I agree with everything he says. Everything is basically energy, and we don't know what this energy is!  Energy seems to be an unknowable or indefinable entity, and that would be its ubiquity.

Is energy the fundamental reality, the I Am, devoid of human illusions and delusions of self? Consciousness only conscious of consciousness? Maybe so.

Edited by StarMountainKid, 16 November 2012 - 06:47 AM.

[Beany]

It seems paradoxical that we need thoughts & words & things to describe this kind of consciousness, doesn't it? The video reminded me once again of how often my experiences lead me to  misunderstand the nature of my own existence. I thought I learned years ago not to make the mistake of letting stuff, things, property, goods, etc. define myself or my life, and yet I find that in some ways I still do that. Maybe some degree of that is necessary just to navigate, maybe value can be derived from doing that, lessons learned, etc. It's like I have two diverging threads of thought & consciousness, one very much grounded in the mundane & practical, the other knowing & experiencing that which is greater than I and of which I'm a part of. What I try to practice is keeping them in balance and letting them both inform me, without having anxiety about my "performance" or placing value judgments on either. Does this make any sense?

[sutemi]

Hi Beany, SMKid, ProfT, so glad you all liked the vid. This topic is such an important one for this world. There is so much one can say and yet  I have find that any concept I have compiled can never describe  this Wonderful mystery that is beyond logic. Its just like trying to describe food, one really needs to just eat it then no description required so I know I just need to meditate/focus inside and experience it. Can I offer another vid I have already shared it with SMKid, I think it is another special talk. It talks about the mind/brain at the start and then the doctor explains what she experienced in a difficult situation (a stroke) . I have managed over a 30 odd year period to experience this same ‘state’ through meditation it is as she says an amazing treasure, we all carry and I find the vid inspiring and I hope you enjoy it to. Take care  

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UyyjU8fzEYU  

“You are the Universe expressing itself as a human for a little while”. Eckhart Tolle

Edited by sutemi, 18 November 2012 - 07:48 AM.

[Beany]

I love what Jill said about us being a lifeforce power of the universe. And I wonder if religion was borne of these kinds of transcendent experiences, in an attempt to explain, organize, or codify them for those who haven't transcended the physical.

[sutemi]

Beany, on 19 November 2012 - 12:38 AM, said:

I love what Jill said about us being a lifeforce power of the universe. And I wonder if religion was borne of these kinds of transcendent experiences, in an attempt to explain, organize, or codify them for those who haven't transcended the physical.

Glad you liked the vid. I like your point about religion, every teacher of Peace through out history has tried to give people knowledge of this wonder of Oneness that we are a part of. But sadly when they die this knowledge becomes lost to us, as meditation is difficult, not the techniques but the effort and time required to keep the focus throughout the day, then there is the element of power that the religious leaders that are left have they don’t want to lose and so we get corruption that leads to ‘only our god is the real god’ and we must wait for HIM to come back. The left brain has taken over and so we become logical and trapped in the world of separateness. Every one is ‘THE’ Life force power as we are alive, covered over by the noise of mind, Jill was freed of the delusion of separateness because of the malfunction and consequent silence and in that silence she became aware of what she really ‘IS’. This state is called Enlightenment. I laugh when I hear her talk about her left brain; “details, details and more details about those details” because when I sit down to practice I become aware of this - as Jill called it “brain chatter” and through the use of the meditational techniques I have the possibility to experience ’La la Land’, to feel like the ‘genie released from the bottle’. This experience is what is lost to us all and we search for it in things, people, we call it many things- satisfaction, peace, fulfillment, contentment, yet if we shut down the “Mind Chatter” it is there inside of us. It is the most important thing for us to experience as Jeff Liebermann said in the other vid. You seem to be able touch this inner Peace from what I read in your posts, you are lucky yet you could through meditation become even more aware of this experience of Peace, Meditation is the medication.  I wish you well Beany take care.

Teacher after teacher -

Look within! Be still. Free from fear and attachment, Know the sweet joy of the way. Buddha

Can you coax your mind from its wandering and keep to the original oneness? Lao Tzu

‘At the still point in the centre of the circle one can see the infinite in all things’. Chuang Tzu

'This, my dear Socrates,' said the stranger of Mantineia, 'is that life above all others which man should live, in the contemplation of beauty absolute; a beauty which if you once beheld, you would see not to be after the measure of gold’…….. ‘Remember how in that communion only, beholding beauty with the eye of the mind, he will be enabled to bring forth, not images of beauty, but realities‘ Plato’s Symposium

‘One Love it is that pervades the whole world, few there are who know it fully:
They are blind who hope to see it by the light of reason, that reason which is the cause of separation’ Kabir

‘If you could get rid of yourself just once, the secret of secrets would open to you. The face of the unknown, hidden beyond  the universe would appear on the mirror or your perception.’ Rumi

You are here for no other purpose than to realize your inner divinity and manifest your innate enlightenment. Foster peace in your own life and then apply the Art to all that you encounter. Morehi Ueshia

‘This Universe is amazing, but the fascinating thing is not understanding the Universe, but understanding that what powers the Universe happens to be within us right now and we can experience it. And when you do, you are filled with Peace, with Clarity, with joy. This is when you experience the truest, truest happiness.’ P.Rawat  

[TheProphetMark]

If it didn't exist, people wouldn't be replying to this thread you just created. We all see the same thing, granted some people are color blind but that's just them being color blind. A deaf person who can't hear cannot speak because they never heard sound therefore they don't know how but that doesn't mean they don't have the ability to speak.

[The Id3al Experience]

freetoroam, on 15 November 2012 - 06:03 PM, said:

I always found this a strange one. It just shows how highly man thinks of himself. There are other living things in the forest and if a tree falls, its certain that it will make an animal jump, maybe squash a few insects, set a few birds flying. So man does not have to be everywhere for life to carry on. The fact is life other than humans do share this planet and cows may see grass as orange, its still grass.

Hence why the sentence is no one? one doesnt mean Human, no one can mean any observer. So the statement is correct.

[freetoroam]

The Id3al Experience, on 19 November 2012 - 11:20 PM, said:

Hence why the sentence is no one? one doesnt mean Human, no one can mean any observer. So the statement is correct.

So the "no one" actually includes all the other living things which exist in there?
I understand that, but I only hear humans ask the question, unless you know differently?

[The Id3al Experience]

freetoroam, on 19 November 2012 - 11:28 PM, said:

So the "no one" actually includes all the other living things which exist in there?
I understand that, but I only hear humans ask the question, unless you know differently?

This is generally because the saying is a Buddhist Koan, therefore only humans have used this statement. it is intended to breakdown logical thinking... many people take it at face value.

I read a physicist's comment (cannot recall the name) say that the sound doesnt exist, simply because in order for a sound to be 'created', an observer needs to detect this. otherwise it is simply a wave that has the potentional of a sound once the observer has converted the energy released into sound.

Who knows, tricky questions.

[freetoroam]

The Id3al Experience, on 19 November 2012 - 11:38 PM, said:

This is generally because the saying is a Buddhist Koan, therefore only humans have used this statement. it is intended to breakdown logical thinking... many people take it at face value.

I read a physicist's comment (cannot recall the name) say that the sound doesnt exist, simply because in order for a sound to be 'created', an observer needs to detect this. otherwise it is simply a wave that has the potentional of a sound once the observer has converted the energy released into sound.

Who knows, tricky questions.

so how would you explain a sound making someone jump if they do not have time to convert it?
And when I say someone, that includes my dog, cos he jumps at sounds too, does that mean he is converting it?
Some sounds can break glass through its vibration, how would you explain that, or can that only happen when a human or 'observer' is present?

Edited by freetoroam, 19 November 2012 - 11:50 PM.

[tapirmusic]

A similar discussion started on a different message board.
It's an interesting debate to read:

http://vigilantcitiz...php?f=7&t=17798

[The Id3al Experience]

freetoroam, on 19 November 2012 - 11:49 PM, said:

so how would you explain a sound making someone jump if they do not have time to convert it?
And when I say someone, that includes my dog, cos he jumps at sounds too, does that mean he is converting it?
Some sounds can break glass through its vibration, how would you explain that, or can that only happen when a human or 'observer' is present?

Yes your dog is a observer, he is consious, how consious is up for debate, he is aware of happenings but can he determine which is which consiously or is it instint etc. for example habbit is something we all know happens without consious thought, Some argue dogs know when you are coming home after work due to some connection, and some argue its habbit, he isnt consiously aware thats its 5pm and home time, or he just by habbit knows about this time my owner comes home. Im no expert, and am curently reading and looking into this stuff myself as I have a huge interest in this subject.

Sound is vibration, transmitted to our senses through the mechanism of the ear, and recognized as sound only at our nerve centers. The falling of the tree or any other disturbance will produce vibration of the air. If there be no ears to hear, there will be no sound

Edited by The Id3al Experience, 20 November 2012 - 01:14 AM.

[MistyW]

I think everything is just really "in the eye of the beholder". After all, different animals might see things with different colors and vision, so there's no telling if the grass is actually green or its just human eyes that make it that way. If there were any deities out there, I suppose only their vision would be the "absolute reality". Everyone else's is just from a unilateral perspective, due to physical restraints and what not.

[Rlyeh]

The Id3al Experience, on 20 November 2012 - 01:11 AM, said:

Sound is vibration, transmitted to our senses through the mechanism of the ear, and recognized as sound only at our nerve centers. The falling of the tree or any other disturbance will produce vibration of the air. If there be no ears to hear, there will be no sound

These are called sound waves even if nothing around to perceive them.