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The Pyramid and the Yard

great pyramid

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#16    questionmark

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 07:27 PM

View PostRayGday, on 15 June 2013 - 07:13 PM, said:

The "short" cubit is 18 inches or half a yard. ("a Foot and a half" - Isaac Newton.)
The perimeter of the Great Pyramid is 2000 cubits or 1000 yards.

http://www.xrayb.com...nd_the_yard.php

And we all eat with our ears, give or take an inch...

Mixing up measuring systems of at least 3 civilizations and a span of 5000 years is certainly not scientific.

The ancient Egyptian cubit changed several times over history and due to external influences, at Pharaohnic times the valid cubit was 7 4 finger palms or 28 digits. That comes to around 52 centimeters or 20.47 inches. Several measuring rods with that measure have been found from that time and no two are exactly alike diverging by several tenths of a centimeter... a good indication that precise reproducibility was an unknown art at the time. That alone drives the whole arc second theory at absurdum.

Edited by questionmark, 15 June 2013 - 07:28 PM.

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#17    shrooma

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 07:44 PM

There was also a short cubit of 44.9
centimeters/ 17.68 inches .
.

The "short" cubit is 18 inches or half
a yard. ("a Foot and a half" - Isaac
Newton.)
The perimeter of the Great Pyramid
is 2000 cubits or 1000 yards.
.
there's a third of an inch difference between 17.68  inches and 18 inches.
multiply that by your 2000 cubit measure and you're left with a discrepancy of 50ft.
from an engineering perspective, that kind of tolerance level is unacceptable.
A.Thom tried this kind of thing when he argued for a 'megalithic yard' for the circle builders of europe. when you're measuring things out with string (as the circle & pyramid builders would've done), different tension levels used by different individuals would produce wildly different results.
a yardstick would've been too impractical.
the builders obviously had some kind of measuring system, you need one to engineer things (ancient theodolite anyone....?), but I don't think your way is the solution OP.
.
*edited for brandy spolling mistake*

Edited by shrooma, 15 June 2013 - 07:46 PM.

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#18    cormac mac airt

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 07:54 PM

View PostRayGday, on 15 June 2013 - 07:13 PM, said:

The "short" cubit is 18 inches or half a yard. ("a Foot and a half" - Isaac Newton.)
The perimeter of the Great Pyramid is 2000 cubits or 1000 yards.

http://www.xrayb.com...nd_the_yard.php

17.68 inches or just a little over 17 5/8'ths of an inch. That you wish it to be rounded off to 18 inches (1/2 yard) is irrelevant.

The perimeter of the Great Pyramid in Royal Cubits is 1758.37 cubits (2051.78 short cubits) or 1007.64 yards. Which means that you've overshot the mark by 241.62 Royal Cubits; undershot the mark by 51.78 short cubits and undershot the yardage by 7.64 yards.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#19    cladking

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 07:59 PM

View Postshrooma, on 15 June 2013 - 07:44 PM, said:

There was also a short cubit of 44.9
centimeters/ 17.68 inches .
.

The "short" cubit is 18 inches or half
a yard. ("a Foot and a half" - Isaac
Newton.)
The perimeter of the Great Pyramid
is 2000 cubits or 1000 yards.
.
there's a third of an inch difference between 17.68  inches and 18 inches.
multiply that by your 2000 cubit measure and you're left with a discrepancy of 50ft.
from an engineering perspective, that kind of tolerance level is unacceptable.
A.Thom tried this kind of thing when he argued for a 'megalithic yard' for the circle builders of europe. when you're measuring things out with string (as the circle & pyramid builders would've done), different tension levels used by different individuals would produce wildly different results.
a yardstick would've been too impractical.
the builders obviously had some kind of measuring system, you need one to engineer things (ancient theodolite anyone....?), but I don't think your way is the solution OP.
.
*edited for brandy spolling mistake*

Unacceptable?

If the Egyptians could  estimate the diameter of the earth so closely, I'd call it "impressive".

Men fear the pyramid, time fears man.

#20    questionmark

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 08:02 PM

View Postcladking, on 15 June 2013 - 07:59 PM, said:

Unacceptable?

If the Egyptians could  estimate the diameter of the earth so closely, I'd call it "impressive".

Could you please show us where the ancient Egyptians knew the diameter of the Earth?

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#21    shrooma

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 08:24 PM

View Postcladking, on 15 June 2013 - 07:59 PM, said:



Unacceptable?

If the Egyptians could  estimate the diameter of the earth so closely, I'd call it "impressive".
.
I wouldn't call a 50ft discrepancy in a 1000yd measurement ''impressive'' in any way, shape, or form CK, i'd call it an abysmal faliure.
but that's the difference between people who build things in real life, and people who don't I guess.
did you actually even read the post?
it would seem not, as nowhere did it concern the measurement of the earth, but the measurement of the GP.
unless of course, you consider the earth's diameter to be 2000 cubits....?
you really should start reading things through before you jump in King, you'd make a bit more sense that way, and have to spend less time wiping the egg from off your face.....
;-)

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#22    RayGday

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 08:36 PM

View Postquestionmark, on 15 June 2013 - 08:02 PM, said:

Could you please show us where the ancient Egyptians knew the diameter of the Earth?


Sir Isaac Newton could not complete his Theory of Gravitation until he knew the circumference of the earth which he discovered was enshrined in the proportions of the Great Pyramid.
During the years 1637-82, Tito Burattini, an Italian architect, Egyptologist, scientist and engineer, measured the Great Pyramid of Giza four times. He and Newton used these measurements in an attempt to determine the precise dimensions of the Earth.

This information must have been known since the Pyramid was built.

The perimeter of the Great Pyramid is 1000 yards, exactly as designed.

#23    questionmark

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 08:49 PM

View PostRayGday, on 15 June 2013 - 08:36 PM, said:

Sir Isaac Newton could not complete his Theory of Gravitation until he knew the circumference of the earth which he discovered was enshrined in the proportions of the Great Pyramid.
During the years 1637-82, Tito Burattini, an Italian architect, Egyptologist, scientist and engineer, measured the Great Pyramid of Giza four times. He and Newton used these measurements in an attempt to determine the precise dimensions of the Earth.

This information must have been known since the Pyramid was built.

And what does the love life of Mississippi mosquitoes has to do with something that happened 3000 years ago?

And I would like a link showing that Newton actually tried to measure the circumference of the earth  using the pyramid as basis.

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#24    cormac mac airt

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 09:43 PM

View Postshrooma, on 15 June 2013 - 08:24 PM, said:

.
I wouldn't call a 50ft discrepancy in a 1000yd measurement ''impressive'' in any way, shape, or form CK, i'd call it an abysmal faliure.
but that's the difference between people who build things in real life, and people who don't I guess.
did you actually even read the post?
it would seem not, as nowhere did it concern the measurement of the earth, but the measurement of the GP.
unless of course, you consider the earth's diameter to be 2000 cubits....?
you really should start reading things through before you jump in King, you'd make a bit more sense that way, and have to spend less time wiping the egg from off your face.....
;-)

Since we're talking about circumference and not diameter, regardless of cladkings post, the distance of 50 feet doesn't even come close. It's more like 167.095 MILES between Harte's modification of the OP's number and the actual number of 43,826,728.

(24,901.55 X 5280 feet per mile / 3 feet per yard = 294,088 yards / 1760 yards per mile = 167.095 miles)

cormac

Edited by cormac mac airt, 15 June 2013 - 09:48 PM.

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#25    shrooma

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 10:52 PM

(the 50ft discrepancy was on the measurement of the pyramid, not the earth. dunno where the confusion's coming from as it states that in three posts. guess i've got some kind of speech impediment.....)
;-)

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#26    cormac mac airt

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 11:00 PM

If you'll notice, in quoting your post cladking switched gears from your mention of the perimeter of the GP to the diameter of the Earth. The latter of which he was calling "impressive" but which has neither anything to do with the GP's perimeter nor the Earth's circumference.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#27    shrooma

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 11:16 PM

THAT'S what I can't understand cormac, how to go from a 2000 cubit measurement to a 25,000mile one?? guess i'm not drunk enough yet to figure out the leap.....
:-S

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#28    cormac mac airt

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 11:21 PM

View Postshrooma, on 15 June 2013 - 11:16 PM, said:

THAT'S what I can't understand cormac, how to go from a 2000 cubit measurement to a 25,000mile one?? guess i'm not drunk enough yet to figure out the leap.....
:-S

He was trying to be relevant to either discussion and failed miserably IMO on both counts.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#29    cladking

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Posted 16 June 2013 - 12:13 AM

A 5%  error in circumferance is  pretty close to the proper diameter.  If the OP is
correct then it appears to be a good approximation based on their available knowledge.

A believe there was a 3% error even in the 17th century.

In real life nothing ever works out correct to five or ten decimal points.  Remember,
they lacked access to computers and modern technology and knowledge.

Men fear the pyramid, time fears man.

#30    Mangoze

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Posted 16 June 2013 - 12:21 AM

View Postcormac mac airt, on 15 June 2013 - 07:54 PM, said:

17.68 inches or just a little over 17 5/8'ths of an inch. That you wish it to be rounded off to 18 inches (1/2 yard) is irrelevant.

The perimeter of the Great Pyramid in Royal Cubits is 1758.37 cubits (2051.78 short cubits) or 1007.64 yards. Which means that you've overshot the mark by 241.62 Royal Cubits; undershot the mark by 51.78 short cubits and undershot the yardage by 7.64 yards.

cormac
Would it be mischievous to mention the height of the Great Pyramid is about 280 Royal Cubits?

:devil:






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