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The formation of earth’s submarine canyons


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#1    Riaan

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 05:31 PM

Dear all,

You may remember my Terra-Australis=Atlantis theory that I have previously posted on this forum. My argument is that the ocean floor around Australia and New Zealand must have been above sea level before the impact of a comet forced it 4000 m below sea level. As proof of this I argued that the Bounty Trough canyon could not have been formed by turbidity currents, but only by rushing water. This theory was shot down by a simple argument - were the submarine canyons all around the world then also above sea level at the time of the impact? Certainly not.

I very recently realized that the most logical explanation for the formation of the submarine canyons on the continental shelves is that they were formed when the earth was still too hot for the oceans to exist and a cycle of evaporation, condensation and precipitation formed the canyons as shown here.

What do you think of the idea? If you know any geologists familiar with theories on this topic, would you be as kind as to ask them about this?

Riaan

Author of Thera and the Exodus, published February 2013

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#2    Abramelin

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 06:01 PM

I think we discussed this earlier:

http://www.unexplain...20#entry3513927


#3    Riaan

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:19 PM

Yes, but not how it was formed as far as I can recall.

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#4    cormac mac airt

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 07:50 PM

View PostRiaan, on 06 May 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

Dear all,

You may remember my Terra-Australis=Atlantis theory that I have previously posted on this forum. My argument is that the ocean floor around Australia and New Zealand must have been above sea level before the impact of a comet forced it 4000 m below sea level. As proof of this I argued that the Bounty Trough canyon could not have been formed by turbidity currents, but only by rushing water. This theory was shot down by a simple argument - were the submarine canyons all around the world then also above sea level at the time of the impact? Certainly not.

I very recently realized that the most logical explanation for the formation of the submarine canyons on the continental shelves is that they were formed when the earth was still too hot for the oceans to exist and a cycle of evaporation, condensation and precipitation formed the canyons as shown here.

What do you think of the idea? If you know any geologists familiar with theories on this topic, would you be as kind as to ask them about this?

Riaan

This idea doesn't work well for two areas I can think of. One being the large underwater channel north/northeast of Maine which would have more to do with the large outflow of water and glacial ice at the end of the last glacial period. The other would be just inside the Straits of Gibraltar which would have been the result of the end of the Messinian Salinity Crisis some 5-6 million years ago. Neither of which has anything to do with the formation of the earth billions of years ago.

cormac

Edited by cormac mac airt, 06 May 2013 - 07:51 PM.

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#5    Irna

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 08:10 PM

View PostRiaan, on 06 May 2013 - 05:31 PM, said:

I very recently realized that the most logical explanation for the formation of the submarine canyons on the continental shelves is that they were formed when the earth was still too hot for the oceans to exist and a cycle of evaporation, condensation and precipitation formed the canyons as shown here.

Are you aware that the formation of the oceans dates back to 4.4 billion years, that is little more than 100 million years after the formation of the Earth itself? and that that was before any continent existed? The first continents appeared in the early Archean, and most of these first continents have been destroyed repeatedly since then. What is left of these early continents forms the basis of the present cratons, that are situated well inside the continents, not on the margins. Most of the continental shelves and continental margins are fairly recent geologically speaking, and there is no way any of the canyons in the continental slopes could have been formed at the time of the formation of the oceans.


#6    J. K.

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 08:41 PM

Pardon this sideways question...what is the origin of the motion of tectonic plates?  What imparted momentum to them in the first place?

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#7    Irna

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 08:51 PM

View PostJ. K., on 06 May 2013 - 08:41 PM, said:

Pardon this sideways question...what is the origin of the motion of tectonic plates?  What imparted momentum to them in the first place?

Mantle convection is still considered, as far as I know, the main driving force of this movement; but it's probably influenced also by other mechanisms such as gravity and tidal forces.


#8    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 09:07 PM

View PostIrna, on 06 May 2013 - 08:51 PM, said:

Mantle convection is still considered, as far as I know, the main driving force of this movement; but it's probably influenced also by other mechanisms such as gravity and tidal forces.

Earth north pole becomes south pole,magnetism switch why? We know only tiny fraction of geological proces.

About plate tectonics on other hand we knows a lot.
It all started with Abramelin country man 16 century Dutch Flemish Abraham Ortilius who questioned how Africas west coats fits with South America.
(16 and 17 century is one of interesting periods in human history due Dutch republic)

After him Benjamin Franklin, Alfred Wegener, Admiral Hess, my countryman Andrija Mohorovčić, Motonori Matuyama gave stamp on theory we knows as plate tectonics.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.
For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

#9    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 09:22 PM

And in a sense plate tectonics theory is legacy, good sideeffect of WW2.

Edited by the L, 06 May 2013 - 09:23 PM.

JFK: "And we are as a people, inherently and historically, opposed to secret societies, to secret oaths, and to secret proceedings.
For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

#10    Abramelin

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 10:36 PM

View PostRiaan, on 06 May 2013 - 07:19 PM, said:

Yes, but not how it was formed as far as I can recall.

Yes, and in that thread you also asked a couple of times, lol. And I told you how these canyons were formed. Just click on the link, and read on.


#11    Parsec

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Posted 06 May 2013 - 10:39 PM

View Postthe L, on 06 May 2013 - 09:22 PM, said:

And in a sense plate tectonics theory is legacy, good sideeffect of WW2.


[Hi The L!]
I don't follow you here. What?


View Postthe L, on 06 May 2013 - 09:07 PM, said:

Earth north pole becomes south pole,magnetism switch why? We know only tiny fraction of geological proces.

About plate tectonics on other hand we knows a lot.
It all started with Abramelin country man 16 century Dutch Flemish Abraham Ortilius who questioned how Africas west coats fits with South America.
(16 and 17 century is one of interesting periods in human history due Dutch republic)

After him Benjamin Franklin, Alfred Wegener, Admiral Hess, my countryman Andrija Mohorovčić, Motonori Matuyama gave stamp on theory we knows as plate tectonics.

Irna gave a precise explanation about tectonics.
As far as I recall, the the magnetic reversal is caused by a slighlty different speed rotation of the two iron cores inside Earth (the one of molten iron and the one of solid iron), but I could be completely wrong  :lol:


#12    cormac mac airt

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 12:53 AM

View PostIrna, on 06 May 2013 - 08:10 PM, said:

Are you aware that the formation of the oceans dates back to 4.4 billion years, that is little more than 100 million years after the formation of the Earth itself? and that that was before any continent existed? The first continents appeared in the early Archean, and most of these first continents have been destroyed repeatedly since then. What is left of these early continents forms the basis of the present cratons, that are situated well inside the continents, not on the margins. Most of the continental shelves and continental margins are fairly recent geologically speaking, and there is no way any of the canyons in the continental slopes could have been formed at the time of the formation of the oceans.

While you went back further with your example, I went with a more recent one. But what should have been obvious to Riann IMO is that before the breakup of Pangaea there were no continental shelves for most of the eastern Americas nor for the western part of Europe and Africa. This should have been his first clue that his idea was flawed.

cormac

The city and citizens, which you yesterday described to us in fiction, we will now transfer to the world of reality. It shall be the ancient city of Athens, and we will suppose that the citizens whom you imagined, were our veritable ancestors, of whom the priest spoke; they will perfectly harmonise, and there will be no inconsistency in saying that the citizens of your republic are these ancient Athenians. --  Plato's Timaeus

#13    Riaan

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 04:37 PM

View PostAbramelin, on 06 May 2013 - 10:36 PM, said:

Yes, and in that thread you also asked a couple of times, lol. And I told you how these canyons were formed. Just click on the link, and read on.

Yes, I did reply a bit too quickly - realized it the moment I sent my response! Nevertheless, I read through it again. It is the old theory that the Bounty Canyon was formed by sediment dispersal into the ocean. However, if you consider the slope of the canyon (<0.4°), it is inconceivable that fine sediment in the first instance could have travelled that far (900 km) and secondly that it could have eroded away such a deep canyon. This is even more true for the Agadir Canyon, where turbidity currents are supposed to have carried landslide debris over the ocean floor for 1800 km at an average slope of less than 0.2°! This is a totally ridiculous proposition.

I cannot judge the theories about the formation of the continents, but if accurate, scientists must come up with a better hypothesis for the formation of submarine canyons like to Bounty Trough. In my opinion, at least, hence my proposal. Thanks for the inputs so far.

Author of Thera and the Exodus, published February 2013

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#14    Big Bad Voodoo

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 05:02 PM

Hello Parsec!


Admiral Hess is best known for his theories on sea floor spreading. While he sail in pacific he have a lot time to think.
Also, during WW2 and after devices for searching submarines were invented
When you took magnetometer on ship and sail over mountain ranges you found extraordinairy big magnetic signals.

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For we are opposed around the world by a monolithic and ruthless conspiracy..."

#15    Irna

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Posted 07 May 2013 - 05:29 PM

View PostRiaan, on 07 May 2013 - 04:37 PM, said:

I cannot judge the theories about the formation of the continents, but if accurate, scientists must come up with a better hypothesis for the formation of submarine canyons like to Bounty Trough.

As far as I know, the Bounty Trough is not considered a classic submarine canyon, but rather a failed rift.

Quote

This is a totally ridiculous proposition.

Surely, before you offer this opinion, you have studied the dynamics of turbidity currents and submarine debris flows?

PS Just have a look at what happened to the transatlantic cables after the 1929 Grand Banks earthquake, to have an idea of what "fine sediment" plus water is able to do.

Edited by Irna, 07 May 2013 - 05:34 PM.





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