23 replies to this topic

[Kryso]

I see our outer selves as a means to an end. We are who we are, as you have said. No matter what happens to the outer shell we will always remain the same inside – regardless of how much cosmetic surgery a person has! Some people may have issues that need attention. But, everyone is an individual, but even if they do change their outer self they will still be unique.
Everybody has choices in their life, and if that choice is being able to change an aspect of themselves, then I say go for it. There’s nothing wrong with self improvement.
Personally I think Cindy Jackson looks great. She is obviously happy with her new body, and why shouldn’t she be? She hasn’t gone to an extreme; she still looks natural and healthy.

You've seen her on television, you've seen her in all the newspapers, but Cindy Jackson in the perfect flesh still comes as a surprise. She is much slimmer than you expect and much, much prettier. Not Bionic Woman, not a Barbie doll, but intelligent, direct, engaging and, here's the paradox, real.
Ruth Gorb, H&H Express

Since 1988 she has had just about every op going to transform herself from farm girl to blonde bombshell…Living doll Cindy boasts an IQ of 164 and Mensa membership to counter any bimbo image.
Paula Jones, Sunday Magazine

This is not a stereotypical ditzy blonde. She's incredibly bright and has been very calculating about making these changes to transform her life.
Leeza Gibbons, the Leeza Show

I say, be whatever you want to be. Be the best you can, even if that means you use surgery for a means-to-an-end.

[snuffypuffer]

Those quotes are taken from her very own website, correct? Of course they're going to show her in as positive a light as possible. Cindy Jackson is there to market herself, and telling the world she has some serious identity problems is definately not going to help her case.

And that's exactly what's going on here. Why else would an attractive, intelligent woman go to such great lengths to become an entirely different person? Not only that, but a fictional character that presents an unrealistic ideal?

Unfortunately we live in a society that puts too much focus on what car you drive and how you wear your hair. At the same time, there is this pseudo liberalism, which tells us that whatever you want to do is fine, it's just uptight squares who want to come in and kill your precious buzz. So poor people go to any lengths to change their outer selves, and spend woefully little time improving the aspects of the self that truly do matter. The end result is a shallow, celebrity obsessed society that puts more emphasis on emulating classless trash queens like Paris Hilton than nurturing their souls and molding one another into happy, productive members of society.

I'm all for improving yourself. But true confidence comes from within, and it will shine through no matter what you have going on outside. While it's true, to an extent, how you present yourself visually, your inner beauty will show. And a crooked nose will make you all the more attractive, because it makes you a real human being.

[Kryso]

Firstly, Snuffy, I would like to congratulate you on an excellent argument, against plastic surgery. And I look forward to hopefully having another debate with you soon?

This is now my closing conclusion post!

All the points you make are very valid and clear, and in some underlining points I agree with you. But I still believe that a person has the right to change any aspect of themselves that they are not happy with. We live in a technological world where this has now become a reality that most can obtain, and people are using those choices to change the part of themselves that they don’t like, or feel needs altering to some degree.

I agree with you that the inner person is very important, and changing our outer appearance can’t change what’s inside – but in the sense that it gives them more self-confidence in an area they never had before, I’m all for that.

And I would also like to say that there is a difference between plastic surgery and cosmetic surgery. We have mainly dwelt on cosmetic surgery, because that’s the main issue of this discussion that we have centered around, (even though the title of the debate is Plastic surgery). But plastic surgery in-whole, is also about reconstructive procedures that can beneficially change a persons life, who has been disfigured by accident or nature (see my first post).

So my conclusion is – I believe plastic surgery is beneficial to most and it has changed many people’s lives for the better. Life is very short, and if we can change one aspect of ourselves while we are passing through this haste called life, then I say take that opportunity, become whoever you want to become, change whatever aspect of yourself you personly feel needs changing, because this isn’t a rehearsal, this is the life you have got – make the most of it!

On a personal note, I would like to say thank you to Disinterested and Lottie for keeping the debate board so well organized, and thanks to everyone for taking the time to read my side of the debate.

Kryso…

Sorry just editing some of my spelling mistakes!

Edited by Kryso, 09 May 2005 - 10:57 AM.

[snuffypuffer]

It's been fun, Kryso. I look forward to debating you again, as well. Congratulations on a job well done, and good luck with the judges.

Conclusion

While I agree that it is healthy to change the aspects of oneself that one isn't entirely happy with, I think the prevalence of cosmetic surgery in today's society gives people the wrong message. Folks today carry the false hope that by changing their appearance, they can become a completely different, better, stronger person. As a result, people often neglect to develop the parts of themselves that truly do make them better people.

I agree that changing you appearance does give you a boost of confidence, but sometimes I think it's confidence in the wrong direction. I know several very attractive young women who have absolutely no faith in themselves other than knowing they're pretty. As a result, they don't like themselves much, and as a result get involved in bad relationships and, in the case of one of my old friends, alcoholism. Their looks are all they have, and they try to fill the hole with quick fixes, to relieve that spiritual need that they never took the time to attend to. It's like putting a fresh coat of paint on a piece of rotted wood. It's going to crumble just as fast.

What makes us who we are is not our appearance, or the clothes we wear. What does is how we stand and face the world. Society will see us the way we see ourselves, and no amount of makeup or cosmetic surgery will ever change that. While I do agree that with severe injuries and some horrendous diseases and birth defects plastic surgery is a good thing, even necessary, at the end of the day, the only person who's opinion matters is the one looking back at you from the mirror.

Thanks for reading. Good night.

[Disinterested]

Great debate guys!

I'm now throwing this one to our fabulous judges.

[Walken]

Alrighty, first ever judgement

Debater 1: Kryso
Relevancy: 9
Countering: 6
Style: 8
Persuasiveness: 8
TOTAL: 31

Debater 2: SnuffyPuffer
Relevancy: 9
Countering: 7
Style: 7
Persuasiveness: 7
TOTAL: 30

Twas very close. Both sides debated very well. Well done to both of ye

[gollum]

Debater 1: Kryso
Relevancy: 9
Countering: 7
Style: 8
Persuasiveness: 8
TOTAL: 32

Debater 2: SnuffyPuffer
Relevancy: 9
Countering: 6
Style: 8
Persuasiveness: 8
TOTAL: 31

Well done to both of you, good debate.

[Irish]

Both of you did a great job, Father Jack is now thinking about a make over!

Debater 1: Kryso
Relevancy: 9
Countering: 6
Style: 9
Persuasiveness: 8
TOTAL: 32

Debater 2: SnuffyPuffer
Relevancy: 9
Countering: 8
Style: 8
Persuasiveness: 8
TOTAL: 33

[Disinterested]

This was a close one!

Kryso wins the debate with an average of 31.6 points;
SnuffyPuffer finishes with an average of 31.3.

Thank you both for participating!