25266 replies to this topic

[Hazzard]

badeskov, on Aug 9 2009, 02:34 PM, said:

I wholeheartedly agree. Honestly, in *mumble* years I think we will see this as a foot note in history like the belief in fairies and gnomes.

Im afraid that your right here, Badeskov.

I would of course love it if your wrong about this. That we, in our lifetime, could get that final scientific proof of ETI.

But nah, I dont think so.

[badeskov]

Hazzard, on Aug 9 2009, 09:18 AM, said:

Im afraid that your right here, Badeskov.

I would of course love it if your wrong about this. That we, in our lifetime, could get that final scientific proof of ETI.

But nah, I dont think so.

Oh, trust me. There is nothing I would rather see than the US Government admitting that Roswell actually happened or some other Government disclosing real proof of ET visitation or that ET decided to pay us a visit in a very public way.

Unfortunately, my hope for either is very low.

Cheers,
Badeskov

[skyeagle409]

Ra_Sun-God, on Aug 9 2009, 11:10 AM, said:

Well well well, you are so wrong

The scientists confirmed the crashed Roswell UFO debris as Extraterrestrial origin!

There are those who don't want to accept reality, yet, they accepted the false weather balloon story with no problem, and both Roswell reports, which have since been proven as false.

What's up with that???

Edited by skyeagle409, 10 August 2009 - 02:51 AM.

[skyeagle409]

badeskov, on Aug 9 2009, 03:34 PM, said:

I wholeheartedly agree. Honestly, in *mumble* years I think we will see this as a foot note in history like the belief in fairies and gnomes.

I'll make sure no BBQ is around, albeit with the amount of beer required to actually grab one of those I would doubt my ability to coordinate my leg movements for walking, let alone running

No BBQ?! How about a nice plate of Crow?!

[skyeagle409]

Evangium, on Aug 9 2009, 01:57 PM, said:

Mainstream ufology his its Hoaxlands, it Greer's, Lazaars, Bragalias, Friedmans and a whole host of supporting cast.

Let's stack them up against the skeptic's heroe's.

Phil Klass:

* SR-71 as a UFO that manuevered around a satellite more than 20,000 miles in space

* Planets to explain UFOs that maneuvered around a B-747

* Ice clouds in clear skies after it was determined that those UFOs were also tracked on radar, which the skeptics found later to their dismay

* Plasma as UFOs. Phil later threw out that explanation out the window after he was hoaxed with a photo.

And then, we have:

* Dave  Thomas

* Donald Menzel

* CSI

* The Skeptical Inquirer

* Joe Nickell

* The Skeptic's Dictionary

My favorite:

* Tim Printy

But there are more as well, but we can highlight their past explanations on UFOs that I could have used at Comedy Central in Las Vegas.

So, if you want to compare believers and skeptics, then be my guess!

[skyeagle409]

badeskov, on Aug 9 2009, 09:32 AM, said:

That said, there are a lot of scientists in the field of UFOlogy effectively, albeit not visibly so. They are astronomers, atmospheric scientists, astrophysicists etc. They work scientifically and rigorously on data they continuously obtain, some of which shows unknown events and phenomena. However, since they publish in peer reviewed scientific journals (where the populist field of UFOlogy very, very rarely goes) , they discuss with all options open and somehow have discovered and explained a lot of hitherto unknown natural phenomena. Or left the observations as of unknown origin until better models and/or more data can be obtained. But that is obviously not very appealing for a nmber of people, people for which the process of independent verification and falsification are completely unknown entities.

Sightings by Astronomers

http://www.ufoeviden...tion=Astronomer

http://www.bufora.or...rs_and_UFOs.pdf

Edited by skyeagle409, 10 August 2009 - 02:43 AM.

[skyeagle409]

Braveheart, on Aug 7 2009, 09:44 PM, said:

That's the one!

Here's the star-map Betty drew:





Here's the actual layout of http://www.bufora.or...rs_and_UFOs.pdf:

Perhaps, if we wait long enough, the skeptics will eventually claim that Zeta Reticuli was that UFO that maneuvered around a B-29 years ago. After all, they have claimed that Jupiter and Mars were the UFOs that maneuvered around a B747 in 1986!

Edited by skyeagle409, 10 August 2009 - 02:52 AM.

[skyeagle409]

Hazzard, on Aug 8 2009, 10:37 PM, said:

These believers keep complaining about how serious scientists dont want to touch the religion that is UFOlogy... Gosh(!),

Science in Default:

Twenty-Two Years of Inadequate UFO Investigations

American Association for the Advancement of Science, 134th Meeting

General Symposium, Unidentified Flying Objects

James E. McDonald, Professor of Atmospheric Sciences

The University of Arizona

Tucson, Arizona

December 27, 1969

http://dewoody.net/u...in_Default.html

[skyeagle409]

Ra_Sun-God, on Aug 7 2009, 04:38 PM, said:

ROSWELL DEBRIS CONFIRMED AS EXTRATERRESTRIAL: Lab Located, Scientists Named
by Anthony Bragalia

Posted: 11:44 May 26, 2009

Newly discovered documents reveal that in the months immediately following the purported 1947 UFO crash at Roswell, secret government studies began on a material that was previously unknown to science. The "memory metal" that was studied precisely matches some of the debris material reported by several witnesses to the crash. Evidence shows that -under military direction- these unique metal studies were undertaken by a contracted laboratory that possessed advanced technical capabilities that the U.S. government itself did not have at the time. A former high-level scientist employed by the involved laboratory has offered a confession that he was tasked to study the crashed UFO material. Information provided by two U.S. Air Force Generals also offers direct support for this discovery.

The documents suggest that after the crash, the US government attempted to develop a unique material that is today referred to as memory metal. This shape-recovery alloy was reported by several witnesses to the Roswell crash in the summer of 1947. The lightweight "morphing" material was able to be crumpled or deformed and then return itself instantly and seamlessly to its original state. The metallurgical discoveries that resulted from these studies were then "seeded" for further technology development to other government agencies (including NASA) and through a series of military contracts to universities and industry.

The laboratory contracted by Wright Patterson Air Force Base to perform these studies was Battelle Memorial Institute in Columbus, OH. It has been credibly reported that Wright Patterson Air Force Base was the very base where the Roswell UFO debris was flown after the crash.

BATTELLE MEMORIAL INSTITUTE:

WRIGHT PATTERSON AIR FORCE BASE:

Recently obtained documents reveal that these studies for Wright Patterson were conducted at Battelle under the direction of Dr. Howard C. Cross. In the late 1940's, H.C Cross was Battelle's expert scientist in exotic metallurgy and Titanium alloy research.

Curiously –although he was a research metallurgist- Cross was also Battelle's "point person" in later studies on UFOs that Battelle conducted in the early 1950's for the U.S. Air Force's official UFO study, Project Bluebook. Cross is likely an author of Project Bluebook's still-missing Report Number 13. He is also the author of a strange letter from Battelle to Wright Patterson known as "The Pentacle" memo. Dr. Cross' historic role will be detailed in a forthcoming article.

Founded in 1929, Battelle is engaged in research, development and commercialization of technological innovation. They specialize in materials science and engineering, life sciences, energy science and national security. Battelle contract operates many of our country's National Laboratories. This includes some of the U.S.'s most sensitive installations such as Oak Ridge, Lawrence Livermore and Brookhaven laboratories. Battelle is headquartered in proximity to Wright Patterson- and remains one of the nation's leading defense contractors. Their metallurgical capabilities and technical talent continue to be recognized as world-class.

Thank you!!

Military officials and civilian  personnel were also confirming that fact years ago, including the former commanding general of Wright-Patterson AFB, OH.

[skyeagle409]

Hazzard, on Aug 6 2009, 02:35 PM, said:

Ill accept no such thing from this clown Robert D. Morningstar ... you might aswell tell me to accept Richard C Hoaglands nonsense as fact!!

Hazzard, you need to accept reality for what it is!

Remember, the skeptics have been unable to refute any of the case files I've listed and do you know why I listed only those particular case files?!

[Evangium]

skyeagle409, on Aug 10 2009, 12:57 PM, said:

Hazzard, you need to accept reality for what it is!

Remember, the skeptics have been unable to refute any of the case files I've listed and do you know why I listed only those particular case files?!

So why is it so important to 'accept this particular reality'?  Is it of greater importance than healthcare and education, or the 20% of the global population that doesn't have access to safe drinking water?  What do we gain?  Does it improve our quality of life?  
How does 'this particular reality' look when put into this kind of perspective?

[Evangium]

skyeagle409, on Aug 10 2009, 12:34 PM, said:

Let's stack them up against the skeptic's heroe's.

So, if you want to compare believers and skeptics, then be my guess!

Why not?  Of course you do realise that in the eyes of the average person, ufo skeptics and believers are tarred with the same brush...
But you kind of missed my point (no surprises there), the fact that your 'list of heroes' is less of a who's who and more of a who? (or what? in some cases), just confirms what I meant in regarding ufology's showmen.  
Answer this honestly, who has the greater number of conventions/conferences, media and internet presence, the skeptics or propents/individuals riding on the coat tails of the ETH?

[Spankster]

skyeagle409, on Aug 10 2009, 03:57 AM, said:

Hazzard, you need to accept reality for what it is!

Remember, the skeptics have been unable to refute any of the case files I've listed and do you know why I listed only those particular case files?!

First off, im neither a "believer" nor a skeptic. Im open minded but try to be realistic.

You had better be careful Sky Eagle. I, like yourself would love to find evidence of UFO's as extraterrestrial in origin, but im never gonna fall into that trap of desperation you seem to be slipping towards. Never, NEVER believe a one off report from any source about anything. The whole point of verifying evidence IS that the theory is contested by skeptics. Not that its so obscure and difficult to source that skeptics cant realistically critique it.

Example:


GLASGOW POST 7/07/09
By: Alan Grant
Scientists working from their base at Loch Ness Scotland have confirmed that strange tissue samples found by the waterside match that of an ancient extinct Pleaseosaur.

Now. Eagle, Disrove that. On you go.

See? JUst because you cant disprove something doesnt mean its real. It means its obscure and baseless itself. Any one media outlet covering a story which isnt picked up by other professionals in the field is probably a load of crap. It'll be a journalist with an agenda, someone wanting to sell a story, or another hardcore desperate believer clutching at straws.

Like i said, your in trouble of undermining your, and everyones investigations into the origins of UFO's by cluttering and muddying teh waters with dodgy, amateur and baseless information, which further masks and hides any real proof, or evidence which might exists. Infact you should be offended Eagle. Your obviously looking for something, proof of aliens. As many of us are, and theres gonna be utter gits exploiting your ineterest. Theres always someone out there writing down, and palming off a baseless cheap version of what someone wants. Wither its false weight loss advice, fabricated methods of gettinga  woman or duff sexual tips form companies wanting to sell you ******. Dont feed out of their hands. Their laughing in yer face.

Dont go wildly chasing every piece of pro-UFO evidence. Wait for good stuff. It may never come, but its better than just following whatever comes along. And remember dude, im with ya, i'd love to find evidence today, would love it. But im not gonna undermine my own hopes by whoring out my loyalty to idiots with no evidence.

Edited by Spankster, 10 August 2009 - 07:08 AM.

[Evangium]

Spankster, on Aug 10 2009, 04:59 PM, said:

First off, im neither a "believer" nor a skeptic. Im open minded but try to be realistic.
*Edit for space*
Dont go wildly chasing every piece of pro-UFO evidence. Wait for good stuff. It may never come, but its better than just following whatever comes along. And remember dude, im with ya, i'd love to find evidence today, would love it. But im not gonna undermine my own hopes by whoring out my loyalty to idiots with no evidence.

I applaud you for directing your attention to the large target that is Skyeagle, so early on in your time on this forum.  
Unfortunately, Sky has been peddling his take on ufology (and other things) for so long, there is no longer fact nor fiction only 'evidence'.  
Admittedly many of the cases he presents are interesting enough on there own merits, but that unfortunate spin of 'it wasn't one of ours (so therefore it was ET)' is really enough to put most people off discussing them further.  
After all, who wants to talk about something if the only 'answer' that can be given is the one that gives the other guy his ego trip?
But again, applause for stepping up to the plate so soon.  I expect Skyeagle will have one long, cut/paste, heavily edited reply for you soon

[badeskov]

skyeagle409, on Aug 9 2009, 07:38 PM, said:

Sightings by Astronomers

http://www.ufoeviden...tion=Astronomer

http://www.bufora.or...rs_and_UFOs.pdf

Indeed. Astronomers have seen UFOs and they stayed UFOs, i.e. unknown and did not become ET.

Cheers,
Badeskov