66 replies to this topic

[AsteroidX]

I personally dont think its any of my business as an American first. But that body count is getting pretty high.

I ask you how many of those deaths are civilians.

[and then]

the L, on 01 January 2013 - 07:29 PM, said:

What I want to ask those who support FSA and revolution is:

1) Do you see any parallel between this revolution and revolution in Iran when Pahlavi was replaced with Khomeni? Do you think that we can see similar scenario in Syria?
2) Do you think that Assad will try to establish Alavite state? And Kurds some Kurdistan state?
3) Do you think that if secularism in Syria under Assad didnt won over Islam radicalism that something will change when Islam radicals came on throne?
4) What do you think what would happened to Chemical weapon after Assad is gone and when Islam radicals get hand on chemical weapon?
5) Are you affraid that Islam radicalism could use chemical weapon against Israel as counterweight to their nuclear program?
6) Do you think that Syria under FSA could attack Israel?
7) Dont you think that when Islamists see FSA success in Syria they would try to overthrown King in Jordan? In that way turn pro western Jordan as another middle east islam state with radicalism?
8) Dont you think that when FSA took Syria under their control that Sunni muslim in Lebanon will try to dominate there too? And that way ruin peace in Lebanon?

Thanks in advance.

As a human being I think that Assad has proven his inhumanity by how he has treated his own people - especially the children.  The FSA have been rumored to have committed atrocities and no doubt have done in some ways.  This still does not equate the two IMO.  
I believe that if Assad truly reaches the point where he realizes his life and regime is forfeit then he certainly will attack Israel with chemical weapons - he has said so publicly.  The members of the FSA are an unknown quantity and I doubt that the west can trust them to secure (unsupervised) those chemical weapons once Assad falls.
He may try to retrench and form an Alawite state protected by chemical weapons and a smaller armed force but I think it would only delay the inevitable fall.
And finally, if Islamists take control then they will focus on attacking Israel as their primary goal once they have consolidated power.  I believe this is what will lead to the fulfillment of Isaiah 17 prophecy of the destruction of Damascus.

[the L]

I hope member the-Unexpected-Soul will answer on my question as well.

[the L]

None of those 7 votes for FSA still didnt respond.

[Corp]

the L, on 01 January 2013 - 07:29 PM, said:

What I want to ask those who support FSA and revolution is:

1) Do you see any parallel between this revolution and revolution in Iran when Pahlavi was replaced with Khomeni? Do you think that we can see similar scenario in Syria?
2) Do you think that Assad will try to establish Alavite state? And Kurds some Kurdistan state?
3) Do you think that if secularism in Syria under Assad didnt won over Islam radicalism that something will change when Islam radicals came on throne?
4) What do you think what would happened to Chemical weapon after Assad is gone and when Islam radicals get hand on chemical weapon?
5) Are you affraid that Islam radicalism could use chemical weapon against Israel as counterweight to their nuclear program?
6) Do you think that Syria under FSA could attack Israel?
7) Dont you think that when Islamists see FSA success in Syria they would try to overthrown King in Jordan? In that way turn pro western Jordan as another middle east islam state with radicalism?
8) Dont you think that when FSA took Syria under their control that Sunni muslim in Lebanon will try to dominate there too? And that way ruin peace in Lebanon?

Thanks in advance.

1) Iffy. Both tried to crack down and both got revolts as a result. Don't see Syria following in Iran's footsteps though since Assad is an ally of Iran.
2) An Alavite state might be a possible solution but highly unlikely. These tend to be an all or nothing deal, not bits of country breaking off. As for a Kardish state...not going to happen. Turkey and Iraq would likely step in to try and prevent that from happening.
3) It remains to be seen if Islamic radicals will take over Syria if Assad falls. People who telling anyone who would listen that Libya would be run by radicals and instead we have radical political groups being banned, Islamic parties not doing that well in elections, and Islamic militia being peacefully disarmed. I hope that once the dust has settled the moderate members of the FSA can work out a deal with the Assad supports and block out the radicals from power.
4) I would hope that there'd be international pressure to have the chemical weapons destroyed. Sure the new government would likely hold on to them.
5) No more than I'm afraid Assad will.
6) Highly unlikely, at least not without a few other countries joining in. A one on one war would go very badly for Syria and the FSA should know this.
7) From what I know the king in Jordan is popular and protests there have long since died out after some reforms were put in. And I believe those protests were more directed at the prime minister, not the king. Unless something major changes I think Jordan will stay quiet.
8) Peace in Lebanon was ruined decades ago. I would hope that with Assad gone that the terrorist groups in Lebanon might weaken and things could improve.

Edited by Corp, 03 January 2013 - 05:06 PM.

[Yamato]

the L, on 01 January 2013 - 07:29 PM, said:

What I want to ask those who support FSA and revolution is:

1) Do you see any parallel between this revolution and revolution in Iran when Pahlavi was replaced with Khomeni? Do you think that we can see similar scenario in Syria?
2) Do you think that Assad will try to establish Alavite state? And Kurds some Kurdistan state?
3) Do you think that if secularism in Syria under Assad didnt won over Islam radicalism that something will change when Islam radicals came on throne?
4) What do you think what would happened to Chemical weapon after Assad is gone and when Islam radicals get hand on chemical weapon?
5) Are you affraid that Islam radicalism could use chemical weapon against Israel as counterweight to their nuclear program?
6) Do you think that Syria under FSA could attack Israel?
7) Dont you think that when Islamists see FSA success in Syria they would try to overthrown King in Jordan? In that way turn pro western Jordan as another middle east islam state with radicalism?
8) Dont you think that when FSA took Syria under their control that Sunni muslim in Lebanon will try to dominate there too? And that way ruin peace in Lebanon?

Thanks in advance.

If a Syrian was asked questions this detailed about internal affairs in the US, how accurate or credible would his answers be?

I can answer questions about what my country will do, if this or if that.   People sometimes complained that I'm changing the subject when I talk about the US on the ME board.  To whom I can only say, pardon me for having perspective dependent on time and space.  It's none of a Syrian's business what goes on over here and they don't have a clue to be wagering an answer in the first place.   Ditto both ways.  

I'll answer all your questions:  I don't know x 8.

When Knight of Shadows returns, I'll be happy to hear him weigh in on all this.

[Helen of Annoy]

Yamato, on 03 January 2013 - 06:09 PM, said:

If a Syrian was asked questions this detailed about internal affairs in the US, how accurate or credible would his answers be?

I can answer questions about what my country will do, if this or if that.   People sometimes complained that I'm changing the subject when I talk about the US on the ME board.  To whom I can only say, pardon me for having perspective dependent on time and space.  It's none of a Syrian's business what goes on over here and they don't have a clue to be wagering an answer in the first place.   Ditto both ways.  

I'll answer all your questions:  I don't know x 8.

When Knight of Shadows returns, I'll be happy to hear him weigh in on all this.

in the meantime... I'd like to keep this thread alive.






Personally, I don't agree with theory of “grownup” and “immature” nations, where grownups are deciding for immatures, appointing them guardians (dictators) and oppressing them “for their own good”.
It’s so thoroughly racist to assume there are nations, Syrians in this particular case, that are unable to see what’s best for them.



An eye-opener, reasonably un-biased:

http://en.wikipedia....Bashar_al-Assad

Simple Wiki article that contains interesting facts, for instance that elected president can be a hereditary function, that socialist party head can do this:

Quote

  By July 2012, according to analysts, Assad had amassed for himself, his family and associates a fortune of perhaps $1.5bn, which is held in Russia, Hong Kong and offshore tax havens to spread the risk of seizure.^[36]

And that someone who claims he’s fighting Islam radicals has actually better proven ties to radicals than people he tarnishes as such:

Quote

The United States, European Union, the March 14 Alliance, Israel, and France accuse Assad of providing practical support to militant groups active against Israel and against opposition political groups. The latter category would include most political parties other than Hezbollah, Hamas, and Islamic Jihad.^[50] According to the Middle East Media Research Institute, Assad claimed the United States could benefit from the Syrian experience in fighting organizations like the Muslim Brotherhood at theHama Massacre.^[51]

No one ever benefits from massacres. No one.

Edited by Helen of Annoy, 03 January 2013 - 06:50 PM.

[Mr Right Wing]

spud the mackem, on 31 December 2012 - 08:55 AM, said:

I dont support Dictators good or bad.

Funny I thought they had a President (him) and an elected Prime Minister.

By that definition the Queen is a dictator.

[Yamato]

When I finish getting my .50 cal heavy machine gun mounted on the back of my pickup truck, and you guys bring the rocket launchers that we talked about earlier, let's go out and see how gingerly our government treats us when we don't hand over our weapons.  When the giant house of cards comes tumbling down in America and some people actually turn violent against their government, will the rest of our people believe their government is saving them from "the terrorists" still?

[and then]

Yamato, on 03 January 2013 - 11:14 PM, said:

When I finish getting my .50 cal heavy machine gun mounted on the back of my pickup truck, and you guys bring the rocket launchers that we talked about earlier, let's go out and see how gingerly our government treats us when we don't hand over our weapons.  When the giant house of cards comes tumbling down in America and some people actually turn violent against their government, will the rest of our people believe their government is saving them from "the terrorists" still?

Many here on UM from the UK and Europe poo poo the idea of an armed insurrection being possible in the US.  Their logic being that the weaponry of our military is so overwhelming that small arms would be useless.  Insurrections by their nature are asymmetric affairs though.  Ask the Afghans and Iraqis.....

[Yamato]

and then, on 04 January 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

Many here on UM from the UK and Europe poo poo the idea of an armed insurrection being possible in the US.  Their logic being that the weaponry of our military is so overwhelming that small arms would be useless.  Insurrections by their nature are asymmetric affairs though.  Ask the Afghans and Iraqis.....

Or the Syrians.  Or Hezbollah.   Or the Polish.

Some don't think that small weapons can attack military bases and acquire heavy weapons, or that mass defections will bleed out of the military, or that our leaders can be kidnapped, executed with a single bullet, that our political centers of power can be targeted with terrorist attacks.  You'd think after 9/11 people would respect the power of a box cutter, but rifles and pistols, still not so much.   Scared to death of guns on a personal level, but they think government is unassailable.

[the-Unexpected-Soul]

Yamato, on 03 January 2013 - 11:14 PM, said:

When I finish getting my .50 cal heavy machine gun mounted on the back of my pickup truck, and you guys bring the rocket launchers that we talked about earlier, let's go out and see how gingerly our government treats us when we don't hand over our weapons.  When the giant house of cards comes tumbling down in America and some people actually turn violent against their government, will the rest of our people believe their government is saving them from "the terrorists" still?

Assad is only protecting him self, every time some of his forces are hit, he aim at the nearest city and start bombing randomly and then the dead civilians they call them terrorists,he want the people to beg the FSA to stop fighting him because he is un able to defeat them, his actions is what forced the people to fight him with weapons, the people can't accept his existence any more let alone being our president, the people at first wasn't calling for his removal, but his mindless behaviors is what pushed the people into fighting

[Yamato]

the-Unexpected-Soul, on 04 January 2013 - 11:33 AM, said:

Assad is only protecting him self, every time some of his forces are hit, he aim at the nearest city and start bombing randomly and then the dead civilians they call them terrorists,he want the people to beg the FSA to stop fighting him because he is un able to defeat them, his actions is what forced the people to fight him with weapons, the people can't accept his existence any more let alone being our president, the people at first wasn't calling for his removal, but his mindless behaviors is what pushed the people into fighting

It was how many people Assad was killing that changed your mind to oppose him, if I remember right.

KoS disappeared soon after it was announced that Assad was cutting Syria's internet access.  Do you know why you're still able to get online?   Don't reveal your exact location for your own safety, btw.  I just wonder if you have an idea why.

[the-Unexpected-Soul]

Yamato, on 04 January 2013 - 11:42 AM, said:

It was how many people Assad was killing that changed your mind to oppose him, if I remember right.

KoS disappeared soon after it was announced that Assad was cutting Syria's internet access.  Do you know why you're still able to get online?   Don't reveal your exact location for your own safety, btw.  I just wonder if you have an idea why.

yes exactly, it became now crystal clear who is targeting and bombing civilians, it's Assad forces, at first i accepted that he lead the Democracy movement so we could transfare peacefully, but now i understand that he don't deserve to be in office for a minute.  
i'm not in syria right now, but they still have internet access at least the city where my family are.

[Mr Right Wing]

and then, on 04 January 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

Many here on UM from the UK and Europe poo poo the idea of an armed insurrection being possible in the US.  Their logic being that the weaponry of our military is so overwhelming that small arms would be useless.  Insurrections by their nature are asymmetric affairs though.  Ask the Afghans and Iraqis.....

Urban warfare is difficult to fight against no matter how technically advanced you are because you cant tell which are your citizens and which are insurgents. No army in history has beaten an insurgency unless they've massacred everyone like the Mongols or Romans used to do.