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Beijing War Prep


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#1    OverSword

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 09:53 PM

From the article;

United States intelligence agencies recently detected China’s military shifting road-mobile ballistic missiles closer to its southern coast near the disputed Senkaku Islands amid growing tensions between Beijing and Japan over the islands dispute.
U.S. defense officials said the movements are being watched closely as China’s military is also holding large-scale military exercises that some fear could be a trigger for a conflict with Japan that could involve U.S. forces.
The officials did not provide details of the missile movements that were tracked by U.S. aircraft, ship-based, and satellite surveillance systems in the region.

http://freebeacon.com/beijing-war-prep/


#2    Ashotep

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 10:28 PM

If China attacks Japan the US should stop all products made in China from being sold here.  It might give our economy a boost if we have to start making our own junk.

If there is a war between them I'm sure we will be drug right in the middle of it.


#3    OverSword

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Posted 27 February 2013 - 11:02 PM

View PostHilander, on 27 February 2013 - 10:28 PM, said:

If China attacks Japan the US should stop all products made in China from being sold here.  It might give our economy a boost if we have to start making our own junk.

If there is a war between them I'm sure we will be drug right in the middle of it.
If Japan is attacked we are obligated through treaty to defend them.


#4    Uncle Sam

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 01:37 AM

View PostOverSword, on 27 February 2013 - 11:02 PM, said:

If Japan is attacked we are obligated through treaty to defend them.

Been stating that for a long time. It is inevitable we will in the end, have to battle China over their land grabs and assertive policy that leads to confrontation. Besides I have a extremely bad feeling about this one, it feels the PLA is going to make a move that will put peace on the back burners.

Edited by Uncle Sam, 02 March 2013 - 01:55 AM.

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#5    and then

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Posted 02 March 2013 - 01:54 AM

I just cannot imagine China risking nuclear war over energy deposits of unknown value.  But if they DO, I will blame our weak kneed president for their miscalculations.

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#6    Yamato

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 09:49 AM

View Postand then, on 02 March 2013 - 01:54 AM, said:

I just cannot imagine China risking nuclear war over energy deposits of unknown value.  But if they DO, I will blame our weak kneed president for their miscalculations.
What is going to bring about the coming war isn't a Bible story, it isn't Chinese antagonism over Japan or Taiwan, and it isn't Sharia law.  It's the coming financial collapse that's going to ripple through the world and set the table for WW2 much like the Great Depression did in the '30s.  There will be all kinds of tertiary problems and issues for one to pick up and cling to like there are with every war i.e. Northern Ireland is all about land, but they'll wrap it up in religion anyway.

"The power to declare war, including the power of judging the causes of war, is fully and exclusively vested in the Legislature.  The Executive has no right, in any case, to decide the question" ~ James Madison
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#7    MichaelW

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 10:36 AM

So, China is moving ballistic missiles to it's southern coast at immediately we scream "OMG war is on the horizon!!!"

Let's look at this from a more logical perspective. Firstly, these missiles are short range ballistic missiles that are currently in development and these may be a first test batch of some kind or even the first production batch (they enter service in 2013 so they may not even be actively deployed yet and the US may have confused them with examples like the DF-15 already in service). Secondly, there is nothing on the islands at all. There are no military installations and the local government body that controls most of the islands has been forbidden from developing them. And fourthly, before any genius suggests it, ballistic missiles can't hit ships. Plus, their estimated range is only about 800 or so kilometres.

So China's deployment of missiles that may or may not be in active service really is nothing more than propaganda to get the likes of Japan and the US worked up. I'm not defending China at all, mind you. But this really isn't the big issue that the OP (and the article he posted) is hyped up as it's claimed.

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#8    Frank Merton

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 11:33 AM

I don't think they are planning war; they are engaging in scare tactics.  Still, it tells us unfortunate things about the nature of the rulers.


#9    ExpandMyMind

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Posted 03 March 2013 - 11:37 AM

View PostMichaelW, on 03 March 2013 - 10:36 AM, said:

So, China is moving ballistic missiles to it's southern coast at immediately we scream "OMG war is on the horizon!!!"

Let's look at this from a more logical perspective. Firstly, these missiles are short range ballistic missiles that are currently in development and these may be a first test batch of some kind or even the first production batch (they enter service in 2013 so they may not even be actively deployed yet and the US may have confused them with examples like the DF-15 already in service). Secondly, there is nothing on the islands at all. There are no military installations and the local government body that controls most of the islands has been forbidden from developing them. And fourthly, before any genius suggests it, ballistic missiles can't hit ships. Plus, their estimated range is only about 800 or so kilometres.

So China's deployment of missiles that may or may not be in active service really is nothing more than propaganda to get the likes of Japan and the US worked up. I'm not defending China at all, mind you. But this really isn't the big issue that the OP (and the article he posted) is hyped up as it's claimed.

While I agree with the rest of your post, China has developed anti-ship (aircraft carrier) ballistic missiles. They could be quite advanced by this stage.

Quote

China has reportedly developed and tested the world's first anti-ship ballistic missile (ASBM) called DF-21D, with a maximum range of around 2,700 kilometres (1,700 mi),[10] in 2005, according to the US Department of Defense. It is estimated to have reached initial operating capability in 2007 or 2008. The guidance system is thought to be still in an evolutionary process as more UAV and satellites are added.[11] The DF-21 anti-ship ballistic missile itself is assumed to have entered active service by 2009

http://en.wikipedia....llistic_missile

I posted about them on this forum around 2-3 years ago.


#10    MichaelW

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 01:47 AM

View PostExpandMyMind, on 03 March 2013 - 11:37 AM, said:

While I agree with the rest of your post, China has developed anti-ship (aircraft carrier) ballistic missiles. They could be quite advanced by this stage.

Indeed, but the gist of my post was that these missiles are for propaganda purposes anyway. Basically, Beijing is telling Tokyo that they mean business. From a strategic military standpoint, the deployment of these missiles is pointless. I also forgot to mention that the Japanese Ministry of Defense actually rents some of the islands but I don't really see how it's relevant.

Quote

I posted about them on this forum around 2-3 years ago.

Difference being is that the DF-21D you mentioned is an intercontinental ballistic missile which is supposed to be complicated and advanced otherwise it's just a big phallus for waving around (like the mockup North Korea put on parade). The DF-16 missiles in the article posted by the OP have a range of between 800 and 1000km. In other words, they could probably just hit the Japanese mainland from bases inside China (and even then, they'd have to be pretty close to the coast).

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#11    OverSword

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 03:51 PM

View PostYamato, on 03 March 2013 - 09:49 AM, said:

What is going to bring about the coming war isn't a Bible story, it isn't Chinese antagonism over Japan or Taiwan, and it isn't Sharia law.  It's the coming financial collapse that's going to ripple through the world and set the table for WW2 much like the Great Depression did in the '30s.  There will be all kinds of tertiary problems and issues for one to pick up and cling to like there are with every war i.e. Northern Ireland is all about land, but they'll wrap it up in religion anyway.
You are correct.  Was watching a report last night about the chinese housing bubble.  Construction of entire cities which stand empty and the apartments in those cities costing more than the average chinese can afford.  The Chinese economy is on the verge of total collapse, mark my words.

Edited by OverSword, 04 March 2013 - 03:52 PM.


#12    CrimsonKing

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Posted 04 March 2013 - 04:38 PM

This is mostly just sabre rattling at the moment to see how all involved respond.Though with the world economies being shaky as they are one stupid slip up could cause all out war.

"If it is not advantageous,do not move.If objectives can not be attained,do not employ the army.Unless endangered do not engage in warfare.The ruler cannot mobilize the army out of personal anger.The general can not engage in battle because of personal frustration.When it is advantageous,move;when not advantageous,stop.Anger can revert to happiness,annoyance can revert to joy,but a vanquished state cannot be revived,the dead cannot be brought back to life." Sun-Tzu




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