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Red Cross: Saddam should be charged or freed


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#1    DC09

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 04:46 AM

Saddam Hussein must either be released from custody by June 30 or charged if the US and the new Iraqi government are to conform to international law, the International Committee of the Red Cross said last night.
Nada Doumani, a spokeswoman for the ICRC, told the Guardian: "The United States defines Saddam Hussein as a prisoner of war. At the end of an occupation PoWs have to be released provided they have no penal charges against them."

Her comments came as the international body, the only independent group with access to detainees in US custody, becomes increasingly concerned over the legal limbo in which thousands of people are being held in the run-up to the transfer of power at the end of the month.

The occupation officially ends on June 30 and US forces will be in Iraq at the invitation of its sovereign government.

"There are all these people kept in a legal vacuum. No one should be left not knowing their legal status. Their judicial rights must be assured," Ms Doumani said.

Saddam and other senior officials of the old regime are the only Iraqi detainees to have been given PoW status. Hundreds of other Iraqis have been seized since the war often, according to critics, on flimsy suspicion and held for long periods without charge, usually without their families knowing for weeks where they are.

The ICRC visited the notorious Abu Ghraib prison in early June and found 3,291 detainees, including three women and 22 boys under 18. This was less than half the 6,527 it found in March.

President George Bush has promised to close the prison where US guards indulged in pornographic abuse of prisoners and several groups of releases have taken place since. But many prisoners have been transferred to other prisons.

The ICRC is angry that it has not been given exact figures for releases or the whereabouts of those who are moved from Abu Ghraib and it is hoping the end of the occupation will put pressure on the authorities to clean up their act. "If we consider the occupation ends on June 30, that would mean it's the end of the international armed conflict. This is the legal situation.

"When the conflict ends the prisoners of war should be released according to the Geneva conventions," Ms Doumani said.

She accepted that US and other foreign forces would remain in Iraq.

Whether that meant an occupation continued would be "determined by the situation on the ground". The presence of foreign forces ought to be governed by a legal agreement with the host government.

The ICRC has made at least two visits to the former Iraqi president who is believed to be in a special prison at Baghdad airport.

Around 40 other members of the so-called "pack of cards", Washington's list of high-level members of the former regime, are also there, most in solitary confinement.

Interrogation has been sporadic and none has been charged or allowed visits by their lawyers. A few have had family visits.

Full Article

*sigh*  rolleyes.gif  


#2    bathory

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 07:57 AM

i wonder what the Red Cross would say if they let him go  rolleyes.gif  


#3    doomgirl

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 03:11 PM

well they can't keep him for ever, soon or later they are going to have to give him up

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#4    snuffypuffer

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 05:28 PM

I thought I read in the Guardian months ago that he'd already been turned over to the Iraqis, and was awaiting trial.

Nothing to see here.

#5    stillcrazy

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 06:14 PM

I still wonder why the IRC is so damned worried about the civil and legal rights of Saddam, and those with links to terrorism, but says nothing in regards to guys like Nick Berg, the Iraqis who are being killed by the terrorist, many islamic controlled nations that kill people for minor offenses and such.

I agree that Saddam needs to be charged and brought to trial, but why the big deal right now, when others are still dying because of him.

Just a thought.

Nuff said.


#6    Talon

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 10:11 PM

I really can't stand these bleeding hearts who go on about the civil rights and liberties of criminals, now we have to deal with hearing the rights of fascist dictators too.

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." -Plato

#7    Fluffybunny

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 10:18 PM

QUOTE (stillcrazy @ Jun 14 2004, 11:14 AM)
I still wonder why the IRC is so damned worried about the civil and legal rights of Saddam, and those with links to terrorism, but says nothing in regards to guys like Nick Berg,

I think it may be a matter of job security... rolleyes.gif

Without guys like Saddam around, the IRC would have to wait around until we had a tornado or hurricane...

With Saddam on the loose(and the other ilk like him) they know that there will always be a need for their services...

And the donations keep rolling in...

Too many people on both sides of the spectrum have fallen into this mentality that a full one half of the country are the enemy for having different beliefs...in a country based on freedom of expression. It is this infighting that allows the focus to be taken away from "we the people" being able to watch, and have control over government corruption and ineptitude that is running rampant in our leadership.

People should be working towards fixing problems, not creating them.

#8    DC09

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 10:21 PM

QUOTE (Talon S. @ Jun 14 2004, 05:11 PM)
I really can't stand these bleeding hearts who go on about the civil rights and liberties of criminals, now we have to deal with hearing the rights of fascist dictators too.

Oh God, I know! The UCLA (United Civil Liberties Union) here in America even defends the rights of pedophiles for free.  : rolleyes.gif

Personally I think they should just rot.

whistling2.gif  


#9    snuffypuffer

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Posted 14 June 2004 - 10:30 PM

Let's all get together and sing the "hypocrisy song."

And a one and a two.....

Nothing to see here.

#10    Fenris

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 12:11 AM

QUOTE (Talon S. @ Jun 14 2004, 11:11 PM)
I really can't stand these bleeding hearts who go on about the civil rights and liberties of criminals, now we have to deal with hearing the rights of fascist dictators too.

Uphold his rights, set the guy free.... just be in the middle of a Kurdish city when you do it, walk away and let them take care of it from there wink2.gif  

In the dead of night
A shimmewin' wight
Gweem of a bwade
And dah devew was paid
When dah axe comes down
A chiwin' sound
Steel hits da head
Anothaw wabbit's dead
I'm a wabbit swayer
A guitaw pwayaw
With a nasty habbit

Kill dah wabbit!!! (hah hah hah)
AhhhaahooOhhh

I'm a mean mistweetah
A wabbit feastah
And I pwedict
A bwoody Eastaw
A scuwowing shadow
And dah shadow was dis wabbit
And dah night air echoes
Kill dah wabbit!!!
Kill dah wabbit!!!
.........................

#11    Talon

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 12:21 AM

QUOTE
Oh God, I know! The UCLA (United Civil Liberties Union) here in America even defends the rights of pedophiles for free. :


Oh we have the same thing with the European Human Rights Court. As pro-Europe as I am, I can't stand that our laws on crime and punishment are made by some rich snobs living in manors never really seeing the world who beleive its a nice place were everyone should have a list of rights to make they're existance easier.

Err.. wrong, try living in the real world. I'd like to put these people in a counciling estate for a month or two and then decide whether the vandels and gangs in the area deserve the comunity service that they give them, or the 3 year hard labour the people who suffer under them wish they got. Oh and when was the last time a European court issued a decent length of time on murders, rapists of phediophiles?

75% of the population want the death penalty reinstated for these people, why don't the rich snobs in their manors answer.

QUOTE
Uphold his rights, set the guy free.... just be in the middle of a Kurdish city when you do it, walk away and let them take care of it from there


If I had my way, child murders, child rapists and phedophiles, after being found guilt,would be put into a room, told to wait, while entering a minute behind them the child's father would be given a baseball bat and told anything done in the next 5 minutes is perfectly legal.

Edited by Talon S., 15 June 2004 - 12:23 AM.

"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something." -Plato

#12    DC09

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 04:45 AM

U.S. Said to Give Iraq Saddam in 2 Weeks

BAGHDAD, Iraq - The United States will hand over Saddam Hussein and all other detainees to Iraq's new government over the next two weeks as sovereignty is restored, the interim prime minister said Monday.


U.S. officials have said they plan to continue to hold up to 5,000 prisoners deemed a threat to the coalition even after the restoration of Iraqi sovereignty at the end of this month. They say as many as 1,400 detainees will either be released or transferred to Iraqi authorities.


However, in an interview with Al-Jazeera television, Prime Minister Iyad Allawi said Iraqi officials expect to take possession of Saddam and all other detainees with the transfer of power.


"All the detainees will be transferred to the Iraqi authorities and the transporting operation will be done within the two coming weeks," Allawi said. "Saddam and the others will be delivered to the Iraqis."


He said the former Iraqi president would stand trial "as soon as possible" but gave no specific timeframe. The detainees and "Saddam as well will be handed to the Iraqi government, and you can consider this as an official confirmation," he added.


Saddam has been in American custody at an undisclosed location in Iraq since his capture last December near Tikrit. His status has been under discussion as the formal end of the U.S.-led occupation approaches.


In Geneva, the spokeswoman of the International Committee of the Red Cross said coalition authorities must file criminal charges against Saddam or let him go when sovereignty is transferred.


Under international and military law, prisoners of war and civilian internees are supposed to be freed at the end of the conflict and occupation, unless there are charges against them, Red Cross spokeswoman Nada Doumani said.


Saddam was granted prisoner of war status after his capture. Although he is alleged to have committed crimes against his own people, he has not been charged with any offense.


"If he is not charged, then the law says that at the end of war, of occupation, he should be released," Doumani told Associated Press Television News.


In Geneva, the chief spokeswoman of the international Red Cross, Antonella Notari, said the organization was not calling for Saddam's release but simply stating the rules under international law.


"We're not making any ultimatums or calls for release," Notari said. "What we're saying is: Saddam Hussein, as far as we understand today, is a POW, prisoner of war, protected by the third Geneva Convention as all prisoners of war are.


"In theory, when a war ends and when an occupation ends, the detaining force has to release prisoners of war or civilian detainees if there are no reasons for holding them," she said.


But Notari added that "a prisoner of war who is suspected of having committed a crime must not just be released. Of course, he must be prosecuted, tried, through a legal proceeding."


She said it was up to U.S. authorities to decide what they will do about Saddam whether to charge him, or hand him over to the Iraqis for trial.

Full Article






#13    joc

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 05:08 AM

QUOTE
Uphold his rights, set the guy free.... just be in the middle of a Kurdish city when you do it, walk away and let them take care of it from there wink2.gif


Again, I am surprised at my own genius! tongue.gif   I said in an earlier thread that eventually Fenris and I would find something to agree on......and so we have. thumbsup.gif

now wondering if Fenris was just being facetious  

Edited by joc, 15 June 2004 - 05:11 AM.

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#14    Fenris

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 09:08 AM

QUOTE (joc @ Jun 15 2004, 06:08 AM)
QUOTE
Uphold his rights, set the guy free.... just be in the middle of a Kurdish city when you do it, walk away and let them take care of it from there wink2.gif


Again, I am surprised at my own genius! tongue.gif   I said in an earlier thread that eventually Fenris and I would find something to agree on......and so we have. thumbsup.gif

now wondering if Fenris was just being facetious  

Your a regular leg end in your own lunch time  tongue.gif

Its what I'd do....

It would solve the problem, is no less than natural justice and wouldn't even cost much to do! unfortunatly there are too many bleeding-heart types in the world for them to actualy get away with doing it. wacko.gif  

In the dead of night
A shimmewin' wight
Gweem of a bwade
And dah devew was paid
When dah axe comes down
A chiwin' sound
Steel hits da head
Anothaw wabbit's dead
I'm a wabbit swayer
A guitaw pwayaw
With a nasty habbit

Kill dah wabbit!!! (hah hah hah)
AhhhaahooOhhh

I'm a mean mistweetah
A wabbit feastah
And I pwedict
A bwoody Eastaw
A scuwowing shadow
And dah shadow was dis wabbit
And dah night air echoes
Kill dah wabbit!!!
Kill dah wabbit!!!
.........................

#15    joc

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Posted 15 June 2004 - 12:03 PM

QUOTE
Your a regular leg end in your own lunch time  tongue.gif 

Its what I'd do....

It would solve the problem, is no less than natural justice and wouldn't even cost much to do! unfortunatly there are too many bleeding-heart types in the world for them to actualy get away with doing it.  wacko.gif 


Amen brother! thumbsup.gif



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