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The Garden of Eden


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#1    UM-Bot

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Posted 09 June 2013 - 10:35 AM

<strong class='bbc'>Image credit: sxc.hu</strong>
Image credit: sxc.hu
Vladimir Vinitzki: We may find in Thera island (Santorini Greece), a lot more than the legendary Atlantis: Thera was certainly the location of the most mysterious and the most pursued event of all: the Garden of Eden, and which shaped the existing human settlements into the very first civilization. There are numerous scientific and amazing facts suggesting, and even confirming, that the episode of the Garden of Eden, cited in the Book of Genesis, really did happen, during the Neolithic era, and the evidences that its occurrence took place on Thera island, are quite overwhelming and very strong. There are ancient Scriptures claiming to tell the story of our world and the evolution of human civilization, and a honest truth seeker should look at these Scriptures without prejudice, besides the archaeological records and others sources.

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#2    danielost

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 03:22 AM

Mormons believe the garden is in the united states, along the mississippi river.  It is the only place that fits the discription of it.  Other than one river name in iraq.  But, then there were two groups of canninites one before one after the flood.

I am a mormon.  If I don't use mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the mormon faith. Thank for careing and if you don't peace be with you. http://fremerica.freeforums.net/

#3    Abramelin

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 11:22 AM

View PostAbramelin, on 17 September 2012 - 03:54 PM, said:

The most recent building phase at Göbekli Tepe (Level II) has been dated both comparatively and absolutely (C14) to ca 8,000 BC, with an earlier primary building phase (Level III) ending as early as 9,000 BC. The age of the earliest occupation cannot yet be determined; the depth of the deposit, however, would suggest a period of several millennia, which signifies that the site had already existed in early Palaeolithic times.

==

Karahan Tepe, a site only discovered in the late 1990s and still awaiting full excavation. This is located near Sogmatar on the Harran Plain, and dates back 11,000 years at least. Already a large number of T-Shaped pillars and stone rows have been uncovered here.

Karahan Tepe lies 60 km east from Urfa in an area called Tektek Daglari. Some 266 in situ pillars (Like the Göbekli pillars...only smaller) cover the field and are visible 50-60 cm above ground level. The rest of the pillars are still covered under the earth.

http://www.ancient-w...rkeygobekli.htm


+++++



But there was a problem for these early farmers, and it wasn't just that they had adopted a tougher, if ultimately more productive, lifestyle. They also experienced an ecological crisis. These days the landscape surrounding the eerie stones of Gobekli is arid and barren, but it was not always thus. As the carvings on the stones show - and as archaeological remains reveal - this was once a richly pastoral region.

There were herds of game, rivers of fish, and flocks of wildfowl; lush green meadows were ringed by woods and wild orchards. About 10,000 years ago, the Kurdish desert was a 'paradisiacal place', as Schmidt puts it. So what destroyed the environment? The answer is Man.

As we began farming, we changed the landscape and the climate. When the trees were chopped down, the soil leached away; all that ploughing and reaping left the land eroded and bare. What was once an agreeable oasis became a land of stress, toil and diminishing returns.

And so, paradise was lost. Adam the hunter was forced out of his glorious Eden, 'to till the earth from whence he was taken' - as the Bible puts it.

Of course, these theories might be dismissed as speculations. Yet there is plenty of historical evidence to show that the writers of the Bible, when talking of Eden, were, indeed, describing this corner of Kurdish Turkey.

In the Book of Genesis, it is indicated that Eden is west of Assyria. Sure enough, this is where Gobekli is sited.
Likewise, biblical Eden is by four rivers, including the Tigris and Euphrates. And Gobekli lies between both of these.

In ancient Assyrian texts, there is mention of a 'Beth Eden' - a house of Eden. This minor kingdom was 50 miles from Gobekli Tepe.

Another book in the Old Testament talks of 'the children of Eden which were in Thelasar', a town in northern Syria, near Gobekli.

The very word 'Eden' comes from the Sumerian for 'plain'; Gobekli lies on the plains of Harran.

Thus, when you put it all together, the evidence is persuasive. Gobekli Tepe is, indeed, a 'temple in Eden', built by our leisured and fortunate ancestors - people who had time to cultivate art, architecture and complex ritual, before the traumas of agriculture ruined their lifestyle, and devastated their paradise.

It's a stunning and seductive idea. Yet it has a sinister epilogue. Because the loss of paradise seems to have had a strange and darkening effect on the human mind.

A few years ago, archaeologists at nearby Cayonu unearthed a hoard of human skulls. They were found under an altar-like slab, stained with human blood.

No one is sure, but this may be the earliest evidence for human sacrifice: one of the most inexplicable of human behaviours and one that could have evolved only in the face of terrible societal stress.

Experts may argue over the evidence at Cayonu. But what no one denies is that human sacrifice took place in this region, spreading to Palestine, Canaan and Israel.

Archaeological evidence suggests that victims were killed in huge death pits, children were buried alive in jars, others roasted in vast bronze bowls.

These are almost incomprehensible acts, unless you understand that the people had learned to fear their gods, having been cast out of paradise. So they sought to propitiate the angry heavens.

This savagery may, indeed, hold the key to one final, bewildering mystery. The astonishing stones and friezes of Gobekli Tepe are preserved intact for a bizarre reason.

Long ago, the site was deliberately and systematically buried in a feat of labour every bit as remarkable as the stone carvings.

http://www.dailymail...arden-Eden.html


+++++



The history of Şanlıurfa is recorded from the 4th century BC, but may date back to 9000 BC, when there is ample evidence for the surrounding sites at Duru, Harran and Nevali Cori. It was one of several cities in the Euphrates-Tigris basin, the cradle of the Mesopotamian civilization. According to Turkish Muslim traditions Urfa (its name since Byzantine days) is the biblical city of Ur of the Chaldees, due to its proximity to the biblical village of Harran.

http://en.wikipedia....&#382;anlıurfa


+++++


Harran seems to have been the home of Abram (Gen 12:1,4), not Ur, though Ur, according to Cyrus Gordon, was the nearby town later called Edessa (Urfa) but which was called Urfu, at that time, not the Ur near the junction of the two rivers much further south. Apollonius Molo, even in the first century BC, tells a different story about the origin of Abraham from Genesis. The Patriarch was born in the mountainous edges of Syria, fringing on the northern steppes, after his ancestors had fled from Armenia. This description fits the same place—it is the neighbourhood of Urfa and Harran, a place known as Beth Eden (Bit Adini)! Biblicists have always know where Eden was, but they did not care to say.

http://www.askwhy.co...Patriarchs1.php


<snip>




#4    Reann

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 05:38 PM

View PostUM-Bot, on 09 June 2013 - 10:35 AM, said:

<strong class='bbc'>Image credit: sxc.hu</strong>
Image credit: sxc.hu
Vladimir Vinitzki: We may find in Thera island (Santorini Greece), a lot more than the legendary Atlantis: Thera was certainly the location of the most mysterious and the most pursued event of all: the Garden of Eden, and which shaped the existing human settlements into the very first civilization. There are numerous scientific and amazing facts suggesting, and even confirming, that the episode of the Garden of Eden, cited in the Book of Genesis, really did happen, during the Neolithic era, and the evidences that its occurrence took place on Thera island, are quite overwhelming and very strong. There are ancient Scriptures claiming to tell the story of our world and the evolution of human civilization, and a honest truth seeker should look at these Scriptures without prejudice, besides the archaeological records and others sources.

Posted Image View: Full Article
It's possible. Reading of genesis in the above article reminded me of a movie i recently watched  on net flix .The Genesis Code. The movie provided thought and insight  of science and the bible  both being  correct  in the dating and timing of creation.Both realities are correct at different universal speed of reality due to gravity and light years of existence apart from gravity ( I think ). Was interesting . I'd like to discover and understand more about  the nature of physics.


#5    Irrelevant

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Posted 14 June 2013 - 11:49 AM

This is similar to how the gates of hell were recently found in Greece..


#6    CS Lewis

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Posted 18 June 2013 - 01:13 AM

Urantia:
ubthenews.com

Garden of Eden (Urantia Report)




#7    Abramelin

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Posted 18 June 2013 - 08:21 AM

View PostCS Lewis, on 18 June 2013 - 01:13 AM, said:

Urantia:
ubthenews.com

Garden of Eden (Urantia Report)


The problem with Robert Sarmast's / Urantia's location for Eden is this:

Genesis 2:8
“And the Lord God planted a Garden eastward, in Eden, and there he put the man whom he had formed."

East of what? East of Greece?  Or east of the east-coast of the Mediterranean where the Hebrews/Canaanites lived? In the last case you'll arrive at the plains of Harran, not in Crete.

Another problem:

http://www.nationalc...mud-anyone.html


.

Edited by Abramelin, 18 June 2013 - 08:21 AM.


#8    Br Cornelius

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Posted 18 June 2013 - 10:25 AM

You know where I think Eden is/was and it certainly ain't in Santoria or America or even Göbekli Tepe (though that certainly makes a better candidate site).
Considering that the Mesopotamians thought Eden was in the east, and the Canaanite's borrowed the idea from them, it suggests a location East of Arabia.

Br Cornelius

Edited by Br Cornelius, 18 June 2013 - 10:27 AM.

I believe nothing, but I have my suspicions.

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#9    Abramelin

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Posted 18 June 2013 - 11:55 AM

View PostBr Cornelius, on 18 June 2013 - 10:25 AM, said:

You know where I think Eden is/was and it certainly ain't in Santoria or America or even Göbekli Tepe (though that certainly makes a better candidate site).
Considering that the Mesopotamians thought Eden was in the east, and the Canaanite's borrowed the idea from them, it suggests a location East of Arabia.

Br Cornelius

Following your reasoning, the Eden east of Mesopotamia could be what has also been suggested: the Pamir Plateau (and already in the 19th century):

Posted Image


#10    Reann

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Posted 18 June 2013 - 03:50 PM

I thought the garden of Eden  was just a story , like a metaphor .There's other cultures that talk about a garden story. too. My favorite Garden story was always the one told in the magic garden ....with Carole and Paula, loved them ♥




#11    danielost

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Posted 18 June 2013 - 06:50 PM

I think everyone has forgotten one main problem in the garden story, its size.  We don't know how big it is.  Is it the size of a small island or a contanet.

I am a mormon.  If I don't use mormons believe, those my beliefs only.
I do not go to church haven't for thirty years.
There are other mormons on this site. So if I have misspoken about the beliefs. I welcome their input.
I am not perfect and never will be. I do strive to be true to myself. I do my best to stay true to the mormon faith. Thank for careing and if you don't peace be with you. http://fremerica.freeforums.net/

#12    Br Cornelius

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Posted 19 June 2013 - 11:47 AM

View Postdanielost, on 18 June 2013 - 06:50 PM, said:

I think everyone has forgotten one main problem in the garden story, its size.  We don't know how big it is.  Is it the size of a small island or a contanet.
Like almost all things in the Bible it is an allegorical myth probably based on a real original fact. As such it is a literal impossibility to place any of the ancient Biblical tales into a geographical context.
However the prevalence of "Eden" type myths across the Eurasian continent suggest that man did start out in some particularly favourable geographical zone within the Eurasian region. There are ethnological methods available which can allow us to focus in on a probable locus for al;l of these "Eden" type myths. My favourite candidate is still Sunderland in South East Asia.

I think the desire to place "Eden" into some Mediterranean or even Middle Eastern context is at best naïve and at worst is a throw back to a racist classical prejudice in Archaeology which is becoming increasingly untenable in the light of recent discoveries which are pushing "civilizations" origins further and further back into history and further and further away from Europe.  

However Eden may simply refer to our original primitive state in continental Africa, a proto "out_of_Africa" creation myth.

Br Cornelius

Edited by Br Cornelius, 19 June 2013 - 11:56 AM.

I believe nothing, but I have my suspicions.

Robert Anton Wilson

#13    Frank Merton

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Posted 19 June 2013 - 11:51 AM

I have been told that it is buried under the waters of the Persian Gulf.  That would fit a lot of the other speculations above.

More than likely there is no historical basis, or at least none that we could ever discern with the sources that remain.


#14    Reann

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Posted 19 June 2013 - 06:09 PM

View Postdanielost, on 18 June 2013 - 06:50 PM, said:

I think everyone has forgotten one main problem in the garden story, its size.  We don't know how big it is.  Is it the size of a small island or a contanet.
Isn't the garden actually the entire earth? I know it mentions something about four  rivers or something ? I think all water meets, right? So wouldn't that  sort of mean the entire world  is the garden, technically?


#15    Abramelin

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Posted 19 June 2013 - 07:28 PM

View PostReann, on 19 June 2013 - 06:09 PM, said:

Isn't the garden actually the entire earth? I know it mentions something about four  rivers or something ? I think all water meets, right? So wouldn't that  sort of mean the entire world  is the garden, technically?

The Bible specifically  mentions 4 rivers:


From:

A Mechanical Translation of the Book of Genesis
The Hebrew text literally translated word for word


Jeff A. Benner 2007



“Elohiym [Powers]” made all of the
trees spring up from the ground
being a craving to appearance and
functional for nourishment and a
tree of the life in the midst of the
garden and a tree of the
discernment of function and
dysfunction,

and a river going out from “Eden
[Pleasure]” to make the garden
drink and from there he will be
divided apart existing to four heads,

the title of the one is “Pishon
[Scatter]”, the one going around all
of the land of the “Hhawilah
[Twisting]” where there is the gold,

and the gold of that land is
functional, there is the amber and
the stone of the shoham,

and the title of the second river is
“Giyhhon [Burst]”, he is the one
going around all of the land of
“Kush [Black]”,

and the title of the third river is
“Hhideqel [Rapid]”, he is the one
walking eastward of “Ashur [Step]”
and the fourth river he is “Perat
[Break]”,

and “YHWH [He exists]” of
“Elohiym [Powers]” took the
human and he caused him to be
deposited in the garden of “Eden
[Pleasure]” to serve her and to
guard her,

http://www.scribd.co...d-word-for-word


.

Edited by Abramelin, 19 June 2013 - 07:43 PM.





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