Saudi Arabia’s proxy wars

[Phaeton80]

Source: Yemen Times

Saudi Arabia appears resolute: It wants Bashar Al-Assad out of Damascus. The Saudis view the fighting in Syria with the same intensity that they did the civil war in Yemen that raged in the 1960s—as a conflict

with wide and serious repercussions that will shape the political trajectory of the Middle East for years to come.

The Syrian war presents the Saudis with a chance to hit three birds with one stone: Iran, its rival for regional dominance, Tehran’s ally Assad and his Hezbollah supporters. But Riyadh’s policy makers are wary.

They know that once fully committed, it will be difficult to disengage. And so they are taking to heart the lessons of another regional war that flared on their border 50 years ago.

...

http://stratrisks.com/geostrat/15602

[Black Red Devil]

These Saudi Peninsular tribal buffoons (they're called the Royal family these days) haven't stopped spreading their wings since they spread Islam around the world some centuries ago. Now they're getting particularly cute with the type of Islam they're trying to spread.

Somebody stop them!!

[Frank Merton]

Money has always been the Saudi royal family's technique, but they are not alone, they just happen to have tons of it.

[Frank Merton]

I think the Phaeton80 post about the Saudi objectives is correct, but they will not directly intervene. They are too smart for that. It so happens that it appears American and Turkish and Iraqi interests also line up with them, so they are for now on pretty much the same page.

It is interesting that Israel, other than being adamant about chemical weapons (for good reason), has been less eager to see Assad go.

[Phaeton80]

Please be so kind as to elaborate on your statement 'Israel is less eager to see Assad go'.

Based on what (logic), would you find it wise to state this?

[Knight Of Shadows]

based on logic he protected israel borders peaceful for 40 year " he and his father "

without a single shot being shot at that direction for 40 years

while the whole military weapons directed and used on people when the demanded their freedom

and their under table deal to sell Golan Heights for israel in exchange of Israel allowing them into power

after syria went down in last war with israel and turning blind eye on them taking over power

becoming israel first ally under the table

Edited September 26, 2013 by Knight Of Shadows

[Frank Merton]

Please be so kind as to elaborate on your statement 'Israel is less eager to see Assad go'.

Based on what (logic), would you find it wise to state this?

Assad is a known quantity.

[Phaeton80]

Well yes, a known opposing / hostile sovereign quantity backed by Iran, Russia & China.

One of two o/t last remaining hostile sovereign nations in the area (given Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya have already been terminated, by complete and utter chance, ofcourse).. Syria also embodies a gateway to the last and foremost hostile nation, Iran.

I'd put my money on Israel opting for destabilisation and eventually fracturing 'unfriendly' neighboring Arab states as part of Israeli expansionist aspirations.

"The Yinon plan is an Israeli strategic plan to ensure Israeli regional superiority.

It insists and stipulates that Israel must reconfigure its geo-political environment through the balkanization of the surrounding Arab states into smaller and weaker states.

The plan operates on two essential premises. To survive, Israel must 1) become an imperial regional power, and 2) must effect the division of the whole area into small states by the dissolution of all existing Arab states. Small here will depend on the ethnic or sectarian composition of each state. Consequently, the Zionist hope is that sectarian-based states become Israel’s satellites and, ironically, its source of moral legitimation… This is not a new idea, nor does it surface for the first time in Zionist strategic thinking. Indeed, fragmenting all Arab states into smaller units has been a recurrent theme."

[Knight Of Shadows]

Well yes, a known opposing / hostile sovereign quantity backed by Iran, Russia & China.

One of two o/t last remaining hostile sovereign nations in the area (given Iraq, Afghanistan and Libya have already been terminated, by complete and utter chance, ofcourse).. Syria also embodies a gateway to the last and foremost hostile nation, Iran.

I'd put my money on Israel opting for destabilisation and eventually fracturing 'unfriendly' neighboring Arab states as part of Israeli expansionist aspirations.

"The Yinon plan is an Israeli strategic plan to ensure Israeli regional superiority.

It insists and stipulates that Israel must reconfigure its geo-political environment through the balkanization of the surrounding Arab states into smaller and weaker states.

The plan operates on two essential premises. To survive, Israel must 1) become an imperial regional power, and 2) must effect the division of the whole area into small states by the dissolution of all existing Arab states. Small here will depend on the ethnic or sectarian composition of each state. Consequently, the Zionist hope is that sectarian-based states become Israel’s satellites and, ironically, its source of moral legitimation… This is not a new idea, nor does it surface for the first time in Zionist strategic thinking. Indeed, fragmenting all Arab states into smaller units has been a recurrent theme."

are you even listening mate

hostility is not by words .. it's by action

and name an action from 40 years was done by syria that oppose israel

name single incident before the syrian revolution

i dare you to name one

[Phaeton80]

are you even listening mate

hostility is not by words .. it's by action

and name an action from 40 years was done by syria that oppose israel

name single incident before the syrian revolution

i dare you to name one

So what youre telling us is.. Iran and Syria are friends of the Israeli state because there wasnt 'an incident' in the last 40 years.

Thats wonderful.

Duly noted.

[Kaa-Tzik]

Still on topic for this thread. Today two terrorist scums have been arrested in Russian city of Kirov. The terrorists had a hideout with bomb making equipment only 500m from the Maradykovo chemical weapons destruction facility. Had they been succesfull, Kirov, depending on atmospheric conditions, may well have been enveloped by poison gas and many casulaties occuring. Why this is for this thread is that the terrorists have been found to be Wahabists. Terrorists in the Caucasus and in Syria are supported by the Wahabist Saudis, so, when is the "war on terror" going to touch these Wahabists were it hurts. Or will $ be lost if the right action, the moral action, is taken.....

[+and-then]

Could you please source this "Yinon Plan"?

Actually it does sound like a good plan for strengthening Israel in the midst of her enemies - what's wrong with a nation trying to keep her citizens safe? Or is it wrong just because they are uhhhh Zionists? Nevermind on that one - it was rhetorical. My issue with the idea of "Balkanizing" "unfriendly" (now there's a term ) Arab states is that they are ALL unfriendly (being Muslim) and they are much too homogeneous culturally to be sundered in such a way. So it sounds like this plan is a way to weaken Israel's enemies - what's wrong with that?

Edited October 16, 2013 by and then

[Yamato]

Could you please source this "Yinon Plan"?

Actually it does sound like a good plan for strengthening Israel in the midst of her enemies - what's wrong with a nation trying to keep her citizens safe? Or is it wrong just because they are uhhhh Zionists? Nevermind on that one - it was rhetorical. My issue with the idea of "Balkanizing" "unfriendly" (now there's a term ) Arab states is that they are ALL unfriendly (being Muslim) and they are much too homogeneous culturally to be sundered in such a way. So it sounds like this plan is a way to weaken Israel's enemies - what's wrong with that?

What's wrong with it is that it jeopardizes the security of Israelis more than it keeps Israelis safe. Israel's hyper-militancy does that as well. People are going to hate the open-air prison Israel has turned Gaza into. One doesn't need to be Arab, Muslim, Palestinian, or Gazan to understand that.

Hardcore Zionists on "Shalom TV" regard American Jewish families who haven't migrated to Israel with at least one of their family members to be a form of soft treason. They talk about American Jews like they're second-class citizens to the heavenly extremists bunkered up on the hilltops with the Pals. With all the religious justification for Israel by many Zionists, these are people who genuinely believe Israelis are the chosen ones. Zionists like Ben Masada even think they're the beeping Messiah.

I don't care whether someone thinks they're the chosen one or not, (and I see enough of that from individuals not to expect it from states too now and then), that is NOT a reason to subsidize it. Shalom TV can illicit a welfare response from many of its viewers that they have to send donations to Israel ASAP and that's fine, so long as they don't buy out our politicians and succeed in shaping our policy with the money. And since that's exactly what's happening, we need to rethink welfare to Israel.

[Yamato]

I agree it's a wonderful idea for Assad to get out of Damascus just like it's simultaneously a wonderful idea for Muhammad bin Saud to get out of Arabia.

[+and-then]

What's wrong with it is that it jeopardizes the security of Israelis more than it keeps Israelis safe. Israel's hyper-militancy does that as well. People are going to hate the open-air prison Israel has turned Gaza into. One doesn't need to be Arab, Muslim, Palestinian, or Gazan to understand that.

Hardcore Zionists on "Shalom TV" regard American Jewish families who haven't migrated to Israel with at least one of their family members to be a form of soft treason. They talk about American Jews like they're second-class citizens to the heavenly extremists bunkered up on the hilltops with the Pals. With all the religious justification for Israel by many Zionists, these are people who genuinely believe Israelis are the chosen ones. Zionists like Ben Masada even think they're the beeping Messiah.

I don't care whether someone thinks they're the chosen one or not, (and I see enough of that from individuals not to expect it from states too now and then), that is NOT a reason to subsidize it. Shalom TV can illicit a welfare response from many of its viewers that they have to send donations to Israel ASAP and that's fine, so long as they don't buy out our politicians and succeed in shaping our policy with the money. And since that's exactly what's happening, we need to rethink welfare to Israel.

I was being partly facetious but it doesn't really matter. They are rejected and vilified almost universally. Held to a standard much higher than the average. And absolutely they have faults and do stupid things as a government and a people. But asking them to "act as if" their enemies rhetoric isn't real intention is madness. They have had proof time and again that the rhetoric is all too real.