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Does god have free will?


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#1    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 05:44 AM

Does the christian /jewish/ muslim god, in particular, have free will?

Do entities labelled god(s), in general, have free will?

Any opinions appreciated, but rationales/reasons for your opinions would be particularly interesting.

You dont have to believe in the existence of a god or gods to answer this.

It is a theological/philosophical/cosmological  question,  which goes to the potential nature of god(s),

imagined, constructed or real.

Edited by Mr Walker, 01 September 2012 - 05:46 AM.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#2    notoverrated

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:11 AM

um idk can they even truly think? or is it just some kind of computer that runs programs?

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#3    Artaxerxes

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:18 AM

I am deeply suspicious of free will and lean heavily towards fate and predestination.

I have no idea whether "God" has free will or not.  I know very little about the nature of God.   I believe we live in some kind of strange holographic universe but as far as a Creator deity and all that, I really don't know.   Many near death experiencers come back and talk about "the Light" and say the Light is alive and conscious and sentient.  

I think the most accurate way of explaining God is by saying that we are a part of God, perhaps each one of us is like a cell in God's body.   And that we are all expressions of God much in the same way that the characters on the holodeck on the Star Ship Enterprise are generated by the Ship's computer.

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#4    The Mule

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:26 AM

wouldnt be much of a god without free will, would it?

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#5    QuiteContrary

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:27 AM

Where do you see evidence of a restricted will?

Imo, only humans can restrict a god's will.

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#6    JGirl

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:33 AM

god is not a person, certainly god is not a human being and therefore the question is irrelevent considering free will is a mortal issue

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#7    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:40 AM

View Postnotoverrated, on 01 September 2012 - 06:11 AM, said:

um idk can they even truly think? or is it just some kind of computer that runs programs?

That is for you to decide. Does a fully sapient and self aware artificial intelligence have free will?

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#8    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:43 AM

View PostArtaxerxes, on 01 September 2012 - 06:18 AM, said:

I am deeply suspicious of free will and lean heavily towards fate and predestination.

I have no idea whether "God" has free will or not.  I know very little about the nature of God.   I believe we live in some kind of strange holographic universe but as far as a Creator deity and all that, I really don't know.   Many near death experiencers come back and talk about "the Light" and say the Light is alive and conscious and sentient.  

I think the most accurate way of explaining God is by saying that we are a part of God, perhaps each one of us is like a cell in God's body.   And that we are all expressions of God much in the same way that the characters on the holodeck on the Star Ship Enterprise are generated by the Ship's computer.

Art
An articulate and thoughtful response. Most appreciated, even if it doesnt help me answer the questions. Do you consider, hypothetically, that a god would be different from humans (who might not have free will,) in having free will as a aspect of their nature power, or is your belief in the predeterminism of life/the universe so complete that it even encompasses god(s)?

Ps, out of interest , what evidences, experiences, or logical deductions/rationales, " leans you heavily towards fate and predestination"?

Edited by Mr Walker, 01 September 2012 - 06:45 AM.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#9    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:48 AM

View PostThe Mule, on 01 September 2012 - 06:26 AM, said:

wouldnt be much of a god without free will, would it?
Do you extend that analogy/statement towards humans as well? I am interested in this statement as it goes to the heart of what a god is, and also to whether a god is fundamentally the same as, or different from, any other sapient self aware entity.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#10    The Mule

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:51 AM

lack of freewill relieves oneself from responisiblity of their actions. Lack of freewill is then just a BS excuse, for gods or mortals. But again, a god lacking in freewill would not be much of a god.

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#11    dlonewolf85

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:52 AM

In my opinion, the question regarding the existence of something called either free-will or of predeterminism cannot be answered or even imagined, without knowing whether there is a purpose for any of this. I mean, without knowing the purpose of existence of life, this universe or an entity called god (if it does exist), I don't see how the question of free will or destiny can be answered. Just a thought...

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#12    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:52 AM

View PostJGirl, on 01 September 2012 - 06:33 AM, said:

god is not a person, certainly god is not a human being and therefore the question is irrelevent considering free will is a mortal issue
Do you consider god to be sapient and self aware? Can a god alter the universe through the application of thought, intent and /or technology? Do you think a god is aware of the consequences of its actions? Does a god form intent, and act on that  intent ? Or is your construct of god basically of an immaterial and non conscious entity? Or are you saying that god must have free will, while mortal humans  may not?

The relevance of the question is in eliciting thoughts and opinions from people on the nature of god as they see it /him

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#13    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:56 AM

View PostQuiteContrary, on 01 September 2012 - 06:27 AM, said:

Where do you see evidence of a restricted will?

Imo, only humans can restrict a god's will.
Moi? I see no evidence of any true restriction on the free will of any sapient self aware entity. There appears to be no physical restriction preventing the formation of intent, or of the capacity to initiate action based on intent. IMO all self aware sapient entities, including gods and humans have free will, as a consequence of their self awareness. Any entity which can extrapolate the results of their actions and form decisions in that knowledge, inherently has free will.

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#14    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 06:58 AM

View PostThe Mule, on 01 September 2012 - 06:51 AM, said:

lack of freewill relieves oneself from responisiblity of their actions. Lack of freewill is then just a BS excuse, for gods or mortals. But again, a god lacking in freewill would not be much of a god.

I tend to agree.  At least in can be used in this manner.
So you argue that humans AND gods have free will and the responsibility which comes from that?

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.

#15    Mr Walker

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Posted 01 September 2012 - 07:03 AM

View Postdlonewolf85, on 01 September 2012 - 06:52 AM, said:

In my opinion, the question regarding the existence of something called either free-will or of predeterminism cannot be answered or even imagined, without knowing whether there is a purpose for any of this. I mean, without knowing the purpose of existence of life, this universe or an entity called god (if it does exist), I don't see how the question of free will or destiny can be answered. Just a thought...

OK so , in your opinion, you cannot know. What do you choose to BELIEVE? Do you believe you have free will ? Do you believe somethng we call a god would have free will. Does it make a material difference what you (or others) believe?
In other words, can believing in free will cause people to create quite different outcomes in their world,  from  what would occur, from them NOT believing in free will?

You are a child of the universe, no less than the trees and the stars; you have a right to be here. And whether or not it is clear to you, no doubt the universe is unfolding as it should.

Therefore be at peace with God, whatever you conceive Him to be, and whatever your labors and aspirations, in the noisy confusion of life keep peace with your soul.

With all its sham, drudgery and broken dreams, it is still a beautiful world..

Be cheerful.

Strive to be happy.




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