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Moderate Muslims pray for Holocaust victims


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#1    Jessica Christ

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 09:13 AM

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Muslim leaders from across the globe paid tribute Holocaust victims this week during a visit to Auschwitz, the former Nazi concentration camp, where they prayed at the Wall of Death for those who were killed by genocide and suffered under violent anti-Semitism.

The imams, who hailed from Saudi Arabia, Jordan, Bosnia, Palestine, Indonesia, Nigeria, Turkey and the United States, performed Islamic prayers while facing Mecca as part of a Holocaust awareness visit organized in part by the International Religious Freedom office of the U.S. State Department.

"What can you say? You're speechless. What you have seen is beyond human imagination," Imam Mohamed Magid, President of the U.S.-based Islamic Society of North America, told Agence France-Presse.

"Whether in Europe today or in the Muslim world, my call to humanity: End racism for God's sake, end anti-Semitism for God's sake, end Islamophobia for God's sake, end sexism for God's sake... Enough is enough," said Magid, who leads the All Dulles Area Muslim Society in Northern Virginia.

Imams Visit Auschwitz, Nazi Death Camp, Pray For Holocaust Victims


#2    Mnemonix

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 09:16 AM

My father says Muslims can't pray for non-Muslims, should show him this.


#3    ealdwita

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 10:43 AM

Sounds like a massive-scale PR exercise to me! Even 'moderate' Muslims (whoever they are) believe all Kafirs will are denied Heaven and "that God will not give light to anyone who does not give Him light or faith. Instead, He will summon them to the depths of darkness within a vast, deep ocean covered with dark clouds  where they will be covered with Shame and Misery."

The Qur'an. verse xxiv:40

I wonder if they'll also be praying for members of the 13th.SS Division (Handschar).

BTW, I notice the good Imam didn't call for an end to Jihad as well!

Edited by ealdwita, 24 May 2013 - 10:44 AM.

"Gæð a wyrd swa hio scel, ac gecnáwan þín gefá!": "Fate goes ever as she shall, but know thine enemy!".
I can teach you with a quip, if I've a mind; I can trick you into learning with a laugh; Oh, winnow all my folly and you'll find, A grain or two of truth among the chaff!
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#4    Mnemonix

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 10:46 AM

View Postealdwita, on 24 May 2013 - 10:43 AM, said:

Sounds like a massive-scale PR exercise to me!

They should have done it such that their right hand didn't know what their left hand was doing.


#5    freetoroam

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 10:49 AM

Sorry, what did the holocaust have to do with the Imans? I am not saying they can not feel the disgust at what happened, but why now?
Are they trying to get the Jewish on their side to build against the west? Which would be quite silly because America is filled with Jewish people.
I just do not understand it, they never did this before and they are acting as if they never knew about any of it.
Can I ask why in the "end" speech, where is end homophobia?

Edited by freetoroam, 24 May 2013 - 10:50 AM.

In an ideal World a law would be passed were NO guns were allowed and all those out there destroyed, trouble is the law makers are not going to take a risk of trying to pass that without making sure they are armed first.

#6    Mnemonix

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 10:50 AM

View Postealdwita, on 24 May 2013 - 10:43 AM, said:

Even 'moderate' Muslims (whoever they are) believe all Kafirs will are denied Heaven and "that God will not give light to anyone who does not give Him light or faith. Instead, He will summon them to the depths of darkness within a vast, deep ocean covered with dark clouds  where they will be covered with Shame and Misery."

And they will be tortured in the grave, and then for all eternity in Hell.

Actually, not all kafirs are denied Heaven, there are exceptions, due to Allah's mercy.

Just some general knowledge...

Also, I think I heard that Muslims cannot be friends with non-Muslims.

So I don't really get why they are praying for them or what they can expect from their prayers.

P.S. A kaffir, doesn't necessarily mean "non-believer" it means something like "someone who rejects truth" or something like that. So if someone never knew about Islam, it doesn't mean he is a kaffir, if someone knows about Islam and rejects it, that makes him a kaffir. I may be wrong, though. I heard that from somewhere.

Edited by Mnemonix, 24 May 2013 - 11:02 AM.


#7    Setton

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:20 PM

View Postealdwita, on 24 May 2013 - 10:43 AM, said:

Sounds like a massive-scale PR exercise to me! Even 'moderate' Muslims (whoever they are) believe all Kafirs will are denied Heaven and "that God will not give light to anyone who does not give Him light or faith. Instead, He will summon them to the depths of darkness within a vast, deep ocean covered with dark clouds  where they will be covered with Shame and Misery."

The Qur'an. verse xxiv:40

I wonder if they'll also be praying for members of the 13th.SS Division (Handschar).

BTW, I notice the good Imam didn't call for an end to Jihad as well!

How is that any different from most Christians?

Honestly, I sometimes wonder what it would take to make you lot happy. When Muslim extremists are in the news, you say moderate Muslims are also to blame because they never speak out. Then when they do, rather than be happy at the things they are condemning, you have to complain about the things they aren't.

Just puts a massive hole in your usual excuse and it really is starting to come across as tarring a whole religion with one brush.

You're running out of excuses.

'Good' is not the same as 'nice'.
'No, murder is running your broadsword through someone because he worships a different God to you... Or is that evangelism? I get confused.'
When they discover the centre of the universe, a lot of people are going to be disappointed - They are not it.
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#8    Jessica Christ

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:24 PM

This is not spirituality vs skepticism. If one wants to attack Islam this is not the ideal thread for it.

Forgiveness, reconciliation, and prayer are the main focus here.

No need to defend what is not under attack.


#9    freetoroam

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:32 PM

View PostSetton, on 24 May 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

How is that any different from most Christians?

Honestly, I sometimes wonder what it would take to make you lot happy. When Muslim extremists are in the news, you say moderate Muslims are also to blame because they never speak out. Then when they do, rather than be happy at the things they are condemning, you have to complain about the things they aren't.

Just puts a massive hole in your usual excuse and it really is starting to come across as tarring a whole religion with one brush.

You're running out of excuses.
No one said it was not different from christians, start another thread if you want to discuss them. Please note the title of the OP! The Christians are not the topic of this thread so  what you are doing is twisting the topic and i can not see why you would want to do that? unless to create a rift between the Christians and muslims on here. I think its best you stick with the original OP because Christianity has nothing to do with this thread.

In an ideal World a law would be passed were NO guns were allowed and all those out there destroyed, trouble is the law makers are not going to take a risk of trying to pass that without making sure they are armed first.

#10    Setton

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:38 PM

View Postfreetoroam, on 24 May 2013 - 12:32 PM, said:

No one said it was not different from christians, start another thread if you want to discuss them. Please note the title of the OP! The Christians are not the topic of this thread so  what you are doing is twisting the topic and i can not see why you would want to do that? unless to create a rift between the Christians and muslims on here. I think its best you stick with the original OP because Christianity has nothing to do with this thread.

I am not the one creating rifts. I'll leave that to the intolerant fools who are impossible to please.

My point is that the only complaint people seem to have left is 'Well they say non-Muslims can't go to heaven'. That's no different to other religions and yet it's only this one they complain about. Because they've already made up their minds and every time moderate Muslims around the world prove them wrong, they have to scramble for a new excuse.

Thanks for your 'advice'. Here's some in return: Leave policing threads to those appointed to do so. Unless moderating is now up to anyone, in which case I would point out that the majority of my post was directly related to the OP. Unlike yours.

'Good' is not the same as 'nice'.
'No, murder is running your broadsword through someone because he worships a different God to you... Or is that evangelism? I get confused.'
When they discover the centre of the universe, a lot of people are going to be disappointed - They are not it.
I don't object to the concept of a deity but I'm baffled by the notion of one that takes attendance.

#11    freetoroam

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 12:57 PM

View PostSetton, on 24 May 2013 - 12:38 PM, said:

I am not the one creating rifts. I'll leave that to the intolerant fools who are impossible to please.

My point is that the only complaint people seem to have left is 'Well they say non-Muslims can't go to heaven'. That's no different to other religions and yet it's only this one they complain about. Because they've already made up their minds and every time moderate Muslims around the world prove them wrong, they have to scramble for a new excuse.

Thanks for your 'advice'. Here's some in return: Leave policing threads to those appointed to do so. Unless moderating is now up to anyone, in
which case I would point out that the majority of my post was directly related to the OP. Unlike yours.
What has any of this got to do with the OP? this thread is about the muslims praying for the holocaust, something you have not even mentioned!

Here is even more advise: stick to the topic of the thread!

In an ideal World a law would be passed were NO guns were allowed and all those out there destroyed, trouble is the law makers are not going to take a risk of trying to pass that without making sure they are armed first.

#12    Setton

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 01:05 PM

View Postfreetoroam, on 24 May 2013 - 12:57 PM, said:

What has any of this got to do with the OP? this thread is about the muslims praying for the holocaust, something you have not even mentioned!

Here is even more advise: stick to the topic of the thread!

Did you miss the massive speech in the Op about ending discrimination?

Exactly what all these anti-Muslims have been saying they never do. So they find a new excuse.

However, as you have yet to contribute anything even vaguely related to the OP, you're in no position to talk. On that note, we're done here until you get bored with your hypocrisy and talk about the topic at hand.

'Good' is not the same as 'nice'.
'No, murder is running your broadsword through someone because he worships a different God to you... Or is that evangelism? I get confused.'
When they discover the centre of the universe, a lot of people are going to be disappointed - They are not it.
I don't object to the concept of a deity but I'm baffled by the notion of one that takes attendance.

#13    meryt-tetisheri

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 01:08 PM

View PostMnemonix, on 24 May 2013 - 10:50 AM, said:

And they will be tortured in the grave, and then for all eternity in Hell.

Actually, not all kafirs are denied Heaven, there are exceptions, due to Allah's mercy.

Just some general knowledge...

Also, I think I heard that Muslims cannot be friends with non-Muslims.

So I don't really get why they are praying for them or what they can expect from their prayers.

P.S. A kaffir, doesn't necessarily mean "non-believer" it means something like "someone who rejects truth" or something like that. So if someone never knew about Islam, it doesn't mean he is a kaffir, if someone knows about Islam and rejects it, that makes him a kaffir. I may be wrong, though. I heard that from somewhere.

Thankfully, not all Muslims follow that. My best friend is an observant, practicing Muslim (wears veil, prays 5 times/day, went to Haj...etc.). She even went with us to attend Catholic Mass at our local church, had my husband explain it to her, but of course did not take communion. It was hilarious to watch the astonished looks on everyone's face! It is the extremist sheikhs who have started to attempt drive a wedge between Muslims and non Muslims, but it wasn't always like that. The danger is that their influence is increasing.

It is interesting to note that the event mentioned in the OP has not been publicized in the ME. In the case of the Saudi Imam, I guess it's a clear instance of differentiating between what is for local consumption and what is PR for foreign audience. SA is the main supporter of stringent Salafi Islam, the ones who advocate rejection of 'kafirs'.


#14    ealdwita

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 01:15 PM

View PostSetton, on 24 May 2013 - 12:20 PM, said:

How is that any different from most Christians?

Honestly, I sometimes wonder what it would take to make you lot happy. When Muslim extremists are in the news, you say moderate Muslims are also to blame because they never speak out. Then when they do, rather than be happy at the things they are condemning, you have to complain about the things they aren't.

Just puts a massive hole in your usual excuse and it really is starting to come across as tarring a whole religion with one brush.

You're running out of excuses.

I respectfully draw your attention to the first sentence of my post (#3).

Imam Magid has rightly condemned several 'isms' and a couple of 'phobias', and I applaude him for that, but nowhere can I see where he calls for an end to blowing people up and/or hacking them to death in the street because they refuse to bend the knee to his medieval god! That's what I expect to see 'moderate Muslims' speaking out against.

"Gæð a wyrd swa hio scel, ac gecnáwan þín gefá!": "Fate goes ever as she shall, but know thine enemy!".
I can teach you with a quip, if I've a mind; I can trick you into learning with a laugh; Oh, winnow all my folly and you'll find, A grain or two of truth among the chaff!
(The Yeoman of the Guard ~ Gilbert and Sullivan)

#15    Mnemonix

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Posted 24 May 2013 - 01:18 PM

View Postealdwita, on 24 May 2013 - 01:15 PM, said:

BTW, I notice the good Imam didn't call for an end to Jihad as well!

An imam won't call for an end to Jihad, it is an essential part of Islam.

I don't mean blowing people up, I mean fighting the evil in oneself.

That is the greatest Jihad there is.

Heard that from an imam.

Jihad means "to struggle" if I'm not mistaken.

Edited by Mnemonix, 24 May 2013 - 01:19 PM.





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