65 replies to this topic

[Professor Buzzkill]

As the Pillars of Hercules were considered the end of the known earth, couldn't reference to "beyond the pillars of hercules" be read as "beyond our knowledge of geography" (i.e. it could have been anywhere or only conceptual)

[granpa]

granpa, on 04 December 2012 - 11:59 PM, said:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Evenor

When Cleito reached marriageable age, her parents died, but the god Poseidon slept with her and she became mother of five pairs of twin sons

http://religion.wiki...iki/Diné_Bahaneʼ

At the end of four days, First Woman gave birth to twins. They were neither male nor female, but Nádleeh, hermaphrodite. Four days later a second set of twins was born, one male and one female. After twenty days a total of five pairs of twins had been born, half of them male and half of them female

http://religion.wiki...iki/Diné_Bahaneʼ


Changing Woman and Naayéé' Neizghání and the younger twin, Naʼídígishí, who was also known as Tó Bájísh Chíní, Child of the Water, now heard a voice from the east chanting in reply: "With the Slayer of Monsters I come. From the house of the dark stone blades I come. From where the dark stone knives hang I come. Giver of the sacred hoops I come. I come, I come! The dreaded one." Changing Woman said, "It is the voice of your father. Dress yourselves quickly. And then she left the hogan.

Jóhonaa'éí, the Sun, entered and greeted the twins. To Naayéé' Neizghání he said, "My son, have you slain all the enemies of the people?" Naayéé' Neizghání replied, "Those who should die I have killed. I have been among the highest peaks, and I been through the deepest canyons. I have been to the edge of the waters, and I have been to the boundaries of the sky. And wherever I went I found no one who is not a friend to our people." "Then your work is done," said Jóhonaa'éí. "I will take the weapons I gave you back with me. Tell your mother that after four days I will return. I wish to speak with her on top of Ch'óol'į'í, the Giant Spruce Mountain." And he departed.
After four days, Asdzáá Nádleehé, Changing Woman, went to the summit of Ch'óol'į'í, the Giant Spruce Mountain, and sait on a rock near the spot where she had first felt the warmth of the sun deep within her body. Jóhonaa'éí, the Sun, came and sat beside her. He tried to embrace her, but she stopped him. "What do you mean by that?" she said. "I want you for my own," he replied. "Come to the west and make a home with me there." "I wish no such thing," she said. "I am lonely," said Jóhonaa'éí. "What good is all that I do if I must endure my days and nights all alone?" After a time a silence, Asdzáá Nádleehé spoke. "I am told you have a beautiful house in the east. I want such a house in the west. I want it built floating on the shimmering water, away from the shore, so that the Earth-Surface people will not bother me with their quarrels. I want white shell, and blue shell, and turquoise. I want haliotis. I want soapstone, agate, redstrone, and jet. Because I will live there alone while you are gone each day, I want animals to keep me company. Give me buffalo, and deer, and mountain sheep, jackrabbits, prairie dogs, and muskrats. Provide me with those things and I shall go with you to the west."

"What do you mean by making such demands of me?" said Jóhonaa'éí. "Why should I provide you with all of those things?" "I will tell you why," she said. "You are male and I am female. You are of the sky and I am of the earth. You are constant in your brightness, but I must change with the seasons. Remember that I willingly let you enter me and I gave birth to your sons,^[52] enduring pain to bring them into the world. As different as we are, we are of one spirit. As dissimilar as we are, you and I, we are of equal worth. As different as we are, there must be solidarity between us. There can be no harmony in the universe unless there is harmony between us. If there is to be harmony, my request must matter to you. There is to be no more coming from me to you than there is from you to me."^[53]

At first Jóhonaa'éí gave no reply. He carefully weighed all that she had said. Then slowly he placed his arm around her. She allowed him to do so. Then he promised her that all the things she wished for she would have. She would have a house in the west on the shimmering water. She would have gems, and animals. They would dwell together in harmony. When Changing Woman was ready to depart for her new home, the Mirage People and the Ground Mist People prepared to go with her. She said goodbye to First Man and First Woman and to her two sons. Then she and the Holy People passed through the mountains at Béésh łichíí' (Red Knife), and in the Ch'ínlí Valley they celebrated her betrothal to Jóhonaa'éí. Her hips widened, and her breasts grew large. The elk and buffalo multiplied, and some left her herd to form other herds and spread across the land. At last she and her party and animals came to the end of the land, and then to her floating house beyond the shore. Then Naayéé' Neizghání, Monster Slayer, and his brother Tó Bájísh Chíní, Water Born, traveled to Tó Aheedlí^[54], where the Pine River flows into the San Juan, and there they continue to live below the earth. A petroglyph was made on the canyon wall just above the water level to mark the place. ^[55] Then Jóhonaa'éí, the Sun, said that it was time for the first four Holy People to depart from the surface of the Fourth World. These four, who had come from the First World, were First Man, Áłtsé Hastiin, First Woman, Áłtsé Asdzą́ą́, Mąʼiitoʼí Áłchíní, Great Coyote, and the coyote Áłtsé Hashké, First Angry. They traveled east, beyond the house of the Sun, and took all their powers with them. As they began to travel, First Woman turned and said, "When I wish to do so, I will send back death from disease, and the sign will be the howl of the coyote." ^[56] Then the four Holy People who had come up from the Third World departed as well. They were Haashchʼéłtiʼí, Talking God, Tó Neinilí, Water Sprinkler, Hashchʼéoghan, House God, and Haashchʼééshzhiní, Black God, the god of fire. As they departed, Haashchʼéłtiʼi said, "If anyone sees us it will be a sign that an enemy is coming into the country. If he hears us call, that same person will be killed by an enemy before the day is over. And so saying they all returned to their homes and all their powers went with them.^[57]

Asdzáá Nádleehé, Changing Woman, began to live in her Floating White Bead House, beyond the shore in the west.

Edited by granpa, 05 December 2012 - 02:08 AM.

[Harte]

the L, on 04 December 2012 - 10:00 PM, said:

Carl said it when some scientist (forgot his name) proposed idea that Venus was ejected from Jupiter. Then many scientists  tried to suppressed it.

"Scientist?'

He was a psychiatrist named Immanual Velikovsky.  He published the book "Worlds in Collision."  It was certainly not supressed.  It was ridiculed, and absolutely rightly so - it still stands today as the stupidest book I've ever read, making Erik VonDaniken look like Isaac Newton.

Harte

[DieChecker]

Harte, on 05 December 2012 - 02:34 AM, said:

making Erik VonDaniken look like Isaac Newton.

And that..... is actually saying something!!!

[the L]

That is point. No matter how idea sound it cant be suppressed. And yes thats word Carl Sagan used. Go to 33:17

*snip*

Edited by Saru, 05 December 2012 - 11:00 AM.
Video removed for copyright reasons

[Balin]

Was Atlantis one of the seven wonders of the ancient world?

[Harte]

No.

Harte