Hoax of global warming

[receivingendofsirens]

5 Jun 06 — William Gray, professor emeritus, works in the atmospheric science

department of Colorado State University. He's mentored dozens of scientists.

And he's outraged.

Much of his government funding has dried up. He has had to put more than

$100,000 of his own money into keeping his research going. “If none of his

colleagues comes to his funeral,” he says, “that'll be evidence that he had the

courage to say what they were afraid to admit.”

Namely, that “global warming is a hoax.”

Gray has testified about this to the U.S. Senate. He has written magazine articles,

given speeches, done everything he could to get his message out.

"I've been in meteorology over 50 years,” says Gray. “I've worked damn hard,

and I've been around. My feeling is some of us older guys who've been around

have not been asked about this. It's sort of a baby-boomer, yuppie thing."

Gray believes in observations. Direct measurements. Numerical models can't be

trusted. Equation pushers with fancy computers aren't the equals of scientists who

fly into hurricanes.

“In just three, five, maybe eight years, says Gray, “the world will begin to cool

again.”

He is almost desperate to be heard. His time is short. He is 76 years old.

“Notice how, after rising steadily in the early 20th century, in 1940 the temperature

suddenly levels off. No— it goes down! For the next 35 years! If the planet is

getting steadily warmer because of Industrial Age greenhouse gases, why did it get

cooler when industries began belching out carbon dioxide at full tilt at the start of

World War II?

“Now look at the ice in Antarctica: Getting thicker in places!

“Sea-level rise? It's actually dropping around certain islands in the Pacific and

Indian oceans.

Gray has the honor of delivering the closing remarks at the National Hurricane

Conference in Orlando, Fla. He talks of global-warming foolishness, untrusty

numerical models, underappreciated ocean circulation, overly dramatized CO2

increases, the crazy complexity of the weather.

Unfortunately - and despicably - this article, which supposedly reports the

skeptics arguments, now veers off to the left, accusing Dr. Gray of being on

the "fringe," and dismissing him and M.I.T. professor Richard Lindzen as

being just simply part of the minority "Old Guard." The article conveniently

ignores the fact that 60 international climate-change experts recently signed

an open letter to Canada's Prime Minister disavowing the "fact" of global

warming. See Kyoto Pointless

Source

http://archives.seattletimes.nwsource.com/...arming+skeptics

Edited January 20, 2007 by receivingendofsirens

[adkchamp]

I say this is what happens we learn science...we begin to make up stuff.........i adepted to the change, have you?

[SilverCougar]

*yawns* There's such a fad right now... either it's "OMGS! GLOBAL WARMING IS REAL!!" or.. "OMGS!! GLOBAL WARMING IS FAKE!!" Then we get the "Libral crap media views!" vs the "Conservitive denial propaganda!!"

Personaly... I can't wait till the weather and the earth gets so out of wake that a good chuck of the human population is eliminated. So yeah... keep doing what we're doing! Pointless argueing while we head to our demise!

[drakonwick]

It's natural the planet goes through these stages all the time.

[SilverCougar]

Yes.. it is. No one's denying that. However.. the oh so lovely(read annoying) fight over this whole thing is wheither or not human pollutions of all sorts are causing the cycles to happen quicker and more violently.

Though what really burns me.. is if I say yes... it is partly because of human controbutions in the bad way... I'm labled a librial idiot who doesn't know a damned thing. If I dissagree... then I'm a conservitive ignorant fool.

Thus... I just don't give a damned anymore if humans hand a hand in it or not. damned either way.

[Cadetak]

I live in Cleveland and it is raining in January...i should be building snowmen!

[brave_new_world]

Thanks for the great post!~#! I have admit that I agree with morobumbleroot that it is a cycle.

[positron]

Thanks for the great post!~#! I have admit that I agree with morobumbleroot that it is a cycle.

Global Warming is a true fact !! I guess we will just have to wait and die!

[Four Winds]

I think this man is senile. Yes we are in a warming cycle, but is just plainly evident we are fully capable of effecting our planet on a global scale and we are contributing significantly to the current cycle of warming. Enough so, that in short order, we shall see weather changes that will force major changes in the distribution and lifestyles of the earths population.

[Mysterious Molecules]

A part of me is hoping that Global Warming is true and here to stop this crazy consumer type society we're building.

[IamsSon]

I think this man is senile. Yes we are in a warming cycle, but is just plainly evident we are fully capable of effecting our planet on a global scale and we are contributing significantly to the current cycle of warming. Enough so, that in short order, we shall see weather changes that will force major changes in the distribution and lifestyles of the earths population.

Apparently, not so obvious since there are meteorologists who don't see it, and there are many of us who are intelligent and logical who don't see it.

[SilverCougar]

List them please. Oh and thanks for calling me illogical and stupid, Iam's. I knew you were always such a nice guy. (Hi sarcasm)

Oh, and list any credible scientists. I'm curious. I see people saying "These scientists! (lists and links) Say that there's global warming!" And then there are people who say "These meteorologists and scientists (not listing a damned thing... infact this thread had the first link I've seen. Then again, I don't look at all the damned global warming threads that are popping up faster then the "OMGS!! THE ANTICHRIST AND NWO!!!" threads...) say there is no such thing as global warming!"

Meanwhile, people who know that global warming means winter and summer are getting more extream and odd... (50 degrees in the Adirondacks in Janurary when it should be below freezing, what? Along with it being 40 in Moscow when it should be -30, what? WAIT!! 10 inches of snow in Arizona when it should be alot warmer then that... Oh dear!") are left shaking our heads because apparently everything is normal. It's just a cycle... forget that it's stronger then any other cycles....

Want links? Well I can't link the Adirondack thing.. since ya'know... I'm not linking the contact info for my family. Moscow is an easy NPR link... bling And the Arizona one, again, I'm not linking contact info for friends out there. Quite sure there's a news article about it. I'd have to google it, and I know how people love discrediting the use of google...

[carini]

CO2 and temprature show a pretty linear relationship. And we are way past the co2 levels of any record in the past 800000 years.

[truethat]

I think the debate about global warming boils down to this idea that its "Supposed to be" a certain temperature. Right now its freezing in NYC last week it was 70 degrees. Its wacky weather alright but how do we know how the weather is supposed to be. In my opinion the earth is a self correcting system. I agree with George Carlin's take on things

Sorry in advance for the curses. It IS George Carlin after all.

We're so self-important. So self-important. Everybody's going to save something now. "Save the trees, save the bees, save the whales, save those snails." And the greatest arrogance of all: save the planet. What? Are these ****ing people kidding me? Save the planet, we don't even know how to take care of ourselves yet. We haven't learned how to care for one another, we're gonna save the ****ing planet?

I'm getting tired of that sh**. Tired of that sh**. I'm tired of ****ing Earth Day, I'm tired of these self-righteous environmentalists, these white, bourgeois liberals who think the only thing wrong with this country is there aren't enough bicycle paths. People trying to make the world save for their Volvos. Besides, environmentalists don't give a sh** about the planet. They don't care about the planet. Not in the abstract they don't. Not in the abstract they don't. You know what they're interested in? A clean place to live. Their own habitat. They're worried that some day in the future, they might be personally inconvenienced. Narrow, unenlightened self-interest doesn't impress me.

Besides, there is nothing wrong with the planet. Nothing wrong with the planet. The planet is fine. The PEOPLE are ****ed. Difference. Difference. The planet is fine. Compared to the people, the planet is doing great. Been here four and a half billion years. Did you ever think about the arithmetic? The planet has been here four and a half billion years. We've been here, what, a hundred thousand? Maybe two hundred thousand? And we've only been engaged in heavy industry for a little over two hundred years. Two hundred years versus four and a half billion. And we have the CONCEIT to think that somehow we're a threat? That somehow we're gonna put in jeopardy this beautiful little blue-green ball that's just a-floatin' around the sun?

The planet has been through a lot worse than us. Been through all kinds of things worse than us. Been through earthquakes, volcanoes, plate tectonics, continental drift, solar flares, sun spots, magnetic storms, the magnetic reversal of the poles...hundreds of thousands of years of bombardment by comets and asteroids and meteors, worlwide floods, tidal waves, worldwide fires, erosion, cosmic rays, recurring ice ages...And we think some plastic bags, and some aluminum cans are going to make a difference? The planet...the planet...the planet isn't going anywhere. WE ARE!

We're going away. Pack your sh**, folks. We're going away. And we won't leave much of a trace, either. Thank God for that. Maybe a little styrofoam. Maybe. A little styrofoam. The planet'll be here and we'll be long gone. Just another failed mutation. Just another closed-end biological mistake. An evolutionary cul-de-sac. The planet'll shake us off like a bad case of fleas. A surface nuisance.

You wanna know how the planet's doing? Ask those people at Pompeii, who are frozen into position from volcanic ash, how the planet's doing. You wanna know if the planet's all right, ask those people in Mexico City or Armenia or a hundred other places buried under thousands of tons of earthquake rubble, if they feel like a threat to the planet this week. Or how about those people in Kilowaia, Hawaii, who built their homes right next to an active volcano, and then wonder why they have lava in the living room.

The planet will be here for a long, long, LONG time after we're gone, and it will heal itself, it will cleanse itself, 'cause that's what it does. It's a self-correcting system. The air and the water will recover, the earth will be renewed, and if it's true that plastic is not degradable, well, the planet will simply incorporate plastic into a new pardigm: the earth plus plastic. The earth doesn't share our prejudice towards plastic. Plastic came out of the earth. The earth probably sees plastic as just another one of its children. Could be the only reason the earth allowed us to be spawned from it in the first place. It wanted plastic for itself. Didn't know how to make it. Needed us. Could be the answer to our age-old egocentric philosophical question, "Why are we here?" Plastic...*******.

So, the plastic is here, our job is done, we can be phased out now. And I think that's begun. Don't you think that's already started? I think, to be fair, the planet sees us as a mild threat. Something to be dealt with. And the planet can defend itself in an organized, collective way, the way a beehive or an ant colony can. A collective defense mechanism. The planet will think of something. What would you do if you were the planet? How would you defend yourself against this troublesome, pesky species? Let's see... Viruses. Viruses might be good. They seem vulnerable to viruses. And, uh...viruses are tricky, always mutating and forming new strains whenever a vaccine is developed. Perhaps, this first virus could be one that compromises the immune system of these creatures. Perhaps a human immunodeficiency virus, making them vulnerable to all sorts of other diseases and infections that might come along. And maybe it could be spread sexually, making them a little reluctant to engage in the act of reproduction.

Well, that's a poetic note. And it's a start. And I can dream, can't I? See I don't worry about the little things: bees, trees, whales, snails. I think we're part of a greater wisdom than we will ever understand. A higher order. Call it what you want. Know what I call it? The Big Electron. The Big Electron...whoooa. Whoooa. Whoooa. It doesn't punish, it doesn't reward, it doesn't judge at all. It just is. And so are we. For a little while.

[isis-999]

If you look thru history you'll see the Earth has cycle's, This is just another stage we are going thru right now......

[brave_new_world]

CO2 and temprature show a pretty linear relationship. And we are way past the co2 levels of any record in the past 800000 years.

How on earth can we say what the carbon dioxide levels or weather was like 800000 years ago?

Edited January 21, 2007 by brave_new_world

[brave_new_world]

List them please. Oh and thanks for calling me illogical and stupid, Iam's. I knew you were always such a nice guy. (Hi sarcasm)

Oh, and list any credible scientists. I'm curious. I see people saying "These scientists! (lists and links) Say that there's global warming!" And then there are people who say "These meteorologists and scientists (not listing a damned thing... infact this thread had the first link I've seen. Then again, I don't look at all the damned global warming threads that are popping up faster then the "OMGS!! THE ANTICHRIST AND NWO!!!" threads...) say there is no such thing as global warming!"

Meanwhile, people who know that global warming means winter and summer are getting more extream and odd... (50 degrees in the Adirondacks in Janurary when it should be below freezing, what? Along with it being 40 in Moscow when it should be -30, what? WAIT!! 10 inches of snow in Arizona when it should be alot warmer then that... Oh dear!") are left shaking our heads because apparently everything is normal. It's just a cycle... forget that it's stronger then any other cycles....

Want links? Well I can't link the Adirondack thing.. since ya'know... I'm not linking the contact info for my family. Moscow is an easy NPR link... bling And the Arizona one, again, I'm not linking contact info for friends out there. Quite sure there's a news article about it. I'd have to google it, and I know how people love discrediting the use of google...

There are cycles that occur every twenty six thousand years according to the mayans. There could be cycles that happen so many millions of years who knows. But the earth and nature is in constant flux and change. Millions of years ago the Antartic used to RAINFORREST!@! Now it is all icecaps. Also The antartic is one and a half the size of Europe. That is a big continent to completely melt away. And in some parts the ice is getting thicker. So There is alot of conflicting information.

Let us not forget that in the seventies that Carl Sagan and other scientists had the world alarmed that the world was going to experience a nuclear winter.

People the weather is way too complex for the best of our technologies to predict any further than twelve hours from now let alone a hundred years.

Edited January 21, 2007 by brave_new_world

[when.i.am.queen.]

How on earth can we say what the carbon dioxide level or weather was like 800 000 years ago?

I think that I read somewhere that they tested the bubbles caught in the ice caps of Antartica.

I'll try to find a link....

Here we go. First sentence after Variations in the Past. Click Here

Edited January 21, 2007 by when.i.am.queen.

[carini]

How on earth can we say what the carbon dioxide levels or weather was like 800000 years ago?

Just follow iamqueens link. You can measure co2 levels based on ice core samples and by looking at isotope relationships of carbon 13 and carbon 14, there are other ways too.

They can do decent measurements up to 650 million year ago when co2 concentrations where much much higher then they are today, the difference is that we will hit 500ppm in the next 50 years which the planet will not be able to cope with rapidly.

65 million years ago co2 levels were at about 1000ppm and decreased to about 280 ppm before the industrial revolution started. But we are doubling the co2 in the atmosphere in the environment much faster then anything seen in recent history, i.e. the past 65 million years.

[adkchamp]

ok people....why are we in such panic! Who cares about global warming....this world is gonna end in about 50 years (water shortage;no more resources and etc).....so like my friend said, stop worrying and have fun. WE ARE LIVING THE END OF THE WORLD, how coool is that!!

[Cadetak]

ok people....why are we in such panic! Who cares about global warming....this world is gonna end in about 50 years (water shortage;no more resources and etc).....so like my friend said, stop worrying and have fun. WE ARE LIVING THE END OF THE WORLD, how coool is that!!

It would be cool...if anything you said was true. Water shortages? Seriously?

[brave_new_world]

Just follow iamqueens link. You can measure co2 levels based on ice core samples and by looking at isotope relationships of carbon 13 and carbon 14, there are other ways too.

They can do decent measurements up to 650 million year ago when co2 concentrations where much much higher then they are today, the difference is that we will hit 500ppm in the next 50 years which the planet will not be able to cope with rapidly.

65 million years ago co2 levels were at about 1000ppm and decreased to about 280 ppm before the industrial revolution started. But we are doubling the co2 in the atmosphere in the environment much faster then anything seen in recent history, i.e. the past 65 million years.

It is still educated guess work.

[when.i.am.queen.]

Who cares about global warming....

Well, quite obviously the people who are responding to this topic. Hoax or not, it has to mean something to them or they wouldn't have bothered replying.

this world is gonna end in about 50 years (water shortage;no more resources and etc)

So no giant comet? War with Aliens? Wiped out by a mystery virus?

Come on! If you are going to make claims like that, at least make them credible

.....so like my friend said, stop worrying and have fun. WE ARE LIVING THE END OF THE WORLD, how coool is that!!

Uhuh, well, if it was actually happening , the fact that you are celebrating the death of billions of people I find slightly disturbing.

Anything else you would like to add?

[when.i.am.queen.]

It is still educated guess work.

The exact numbers are, the trends are not. I think that it definitely implies that something is happening.

[Four Winds]

Tell the former inhabitants of Lohachara Island that there is no such thing as global warming. They just lost their island to rising see levels. It is sad that some of the people I have seen post intelligent comments on this board, are saying we have nothing to do with global warming and it is just a cycle. That freaks me out. Like I said already in this thread, we are in a natural warming period, but our human activites are increaseing the warming at an alarming rate. It is not egotistical to think we can have an impact on the planet. It is just a fact. Ever seen a photo of the earth at night? Did you know more earth is moved by humans every year then natural processes? Did you know the daming of rivers is effecting the spin of the planet?

We are impacting our planet on a global scale. We need to be careful because we are smart enough to do things on a global scale that we don't fully understand the consequences of. We only have the one planet, it is better to play it safe than sorry on this one!!!