120 replies to this topic

[the L]

cormac mac airt, on 28 November 2012 - 09:05 PM, said:

No it doesn't. Go back and read the entire article I linked in Post #66 again.

cormac

I cant read it because I have to sign up. But if not language support term IE then we must stop to use term IE because that whats IE is all about.

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 November 2012 - 09:07 PM, said:

I cant read it because I have to sign up. But if not language support term IE then we must stop to use term IE because that whats IE is all about.

Try here:

http://www.sciencema...=ref&siteid=sci

Look for Full Text PDF and right click going to "save target as", saving it to your computer. Happy reading.

cormac

[the L]

Since you have knowledge about genetics. What do you say on this picture.

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 November 2012 - 09:58 PM, said:

Since you have knowledge about genetics. What do you say on this picture.

It's not as accurate or meaningful as this picture:

 Language expansion in time and space.jpg   120.5K   17 downloads

http://language.cs.auckland.ac.nz/

cormac

[the L]

I posted picture of Haplogroup R1a1a spread in euroasia. Its interesting isnt? In your picture I didnt notice that is R1a1a spread in euroasia. Is it?

Edited by the L, 28 November 2012 - 10:21 PM.

[the L]

Here is what wiki say about Kurgan hypothesis.The Kurgan model is the most widely accepted scenario of Indo-European origins.(Mallroy 1989 and Strazny 2000)




Look this chariot spread.

[the L]

Also if Anatolia hypothesis is true, how come that they spread so lately in fertile Mesopotamia and around? Why would one avoid it? If they are pecafull...If I was IE and live in Anatolia my first expansion would be Mesopotamia. It doesnt make sense. Too many holes.
Hobbes is against it.

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 November 2012 - 10:10 PM, said:

I posted picture of Haplogroup R1a1a spread in euroasia. Its interesting isnt? In your picture I didnt notice that is R1a1a spread in euroasia. Is it?

It's the spread of IE languages, which in your Wiki link was being used in connection with R1a1a to (incorrectly) validate the Kurgan Hypothesis. If you'll notice, my picture is a more refined version of your while showing the outward spread of IE. All of which eliminates the need for the Kurgan Hypothesis.

cormac

[the L]

M. Gimbutas (1991), "The discontinuity of the Varna, Karanovo, Vinča and Lengyel cultures in their main territories and the large scale population shifts to the north and northwest are indirect evidence of a catastrophe of such proportions that cannot be explained by possible climatic change, land exhaustion, or epidemics (for which there is no evidence in the second half of the 5th millennium B.C.). Direct evidence of the incursion of horse-riding warriors is found, not only in single burials of males under barrows, but in the emergence of a whole complex of Kurgan cultural traits."

cormac mac airt, on 28 November 2012 - 10:29 PM, said:

It's the spread of IE languages, which in your Wiki link was being used in connection with R1a1a to (incorrectly) validate the Kurgan Hypothesis. If you'll notice, my picture is a more refined version of your while showing the outward spread of IE. All of which eliminates the need for the Kurgan Hypothesis.

cormac

Then why not Mesopotamia first? (post 82)

[the L]

cormac do you think that Aryans were noble and peacefull?
Do you think that proto Indo Europeans were peacefull, noble savages?

[the L]

Also how do you explain same Gods in IE people? India and Slavic countries and  not in Anatolia. In north europe and India and not in Anatolia. Strange isnt?

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 November 2012 - 10:18 PM, said:

Here is what wiki say about Kurgan hypothesis.The Kurgan model is the most widely accepted scenario of Indo-European origins.(Mallroy 1989 and Strazny 2000)




Look this chariot spread.

The second picture is incorrect as the earliest Hittite mention of chariots dates earlier to the 17th/18th century BC, making it older than the claim on your picture. Also, the earliest evidence for chariots in China (Shang Dynasty) dates to the 12th century and not the 16th century as appears on the wiki picture.

cormac

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 November 2012 - 10:31 PM, said:

M. Gimbutas (1991), "The discontinuity of the Varna, Karanovo, Vinča and Lengyel cultures in their main territories and the large scale population shifts to the north and northwest are indirect evidence of a catastrophe of such proportions that cannot be explained by possible climatic change, land exhaustion, or epidemics (for which there is no evidence in the second half of the 5th millennium B.C.). Direct evidence of the incursion of horse-riding warriors is found, not only in single burials of males under barrows, but in the emergence of a whole complex of Kurgan cultural traits."



Then why not Mesopotamia first? (post 82)

It spread in two directions, east across the Fertile Crescent and west across Greece and the Balkan countries, at about the same time. With the exception of the Sumerian language the rest were Indo-European.

cormac

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 November 2012 - 10:40 PM, said:

Also how do you explain same Gods in IE people? India and Slavic countries and  not in Anatolia. In north europe and India and not in Anatolia. Strange isnt?

Similarities, which is quite often what's seen by people claiming 'same Gods' is not the same as an actual connection. A good example is the Greek peoples attempting to equate their deities with those of Egypt. In their case it was because Egypt carried the greater antiquity as a civilization and they wanted to associate themselves as being a part of that.

cormac

[cormac mac airt]

the L, on 28 November 2012 - 10:37 PM, said:

cormac do you think that Aryans were noble and peacefull?
Do you think that proto Indo Europeans were peacefull, noble savages?

I don't know about 'noble' but peaceful, perhaps. There's definitely no evidence of any sort of "invasion" meaning an incoming peoples forcing themselves, primarily through war, on more indigenous peoples.

cormac