Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 20, 2012 Author #51 Share Posted October 20, 2012 64 billions couldnt? What 64 billions? Ah, don't tell me: Villoldo? . Chance to made Ayahuasca there is 1:64 billion. To choose two plants from 80 000. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 20, 2012 Author #52 Share Posted October 20, 2012 I'll tell you what: these guys knew a goddamn lot about herbs and their effect, but they had a way of explaining these effects that is not ours. In one hectar in peru they found 314 different plants. While in whole Europe we have cca 250 spicies of plants. They knew exactly how to made potion from two plants from 80 000. It is extraordinary especially when we add that they cooked it for 12 hours. 64 billion combination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted October 20, 2012 #53 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Tell me about it. You are at least as screwed as i am now, eh? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 20, 2012 Author #54 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Tell me about it. You are at least as screwed as i am now, eh? I calculated that if they have 80 000 plants. And need two. and cooked 12 hours. They must cooked 8,7 million years to try all 64 billion combination. So method of trying is just redicule imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted October 20, 2012 #55 Share Posted October 20, 2012 (edited) No way. You need more booze to think like they did. Trial and error, a process that takes maybe a thousand years to find out what herb is good for you , what herb is not, and what herb will give you that needed 'spiritual' feeling. Heh, you must be a city-slicker. I have no doubts about that. I have met several of your country men that understood what I was talking about. I am glad I am the son of a farmer. And, btw, you calculated wrong. . Edited October 20, 2012 by Abramelin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 20, 2012 Author #56 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Whats then right calculation for 64 billions combination for 12 hours of cooking? Im urban child. I was raised in concrete jungle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
orangepeaceful79 Posted October 20, 2012 #57 Share Posted October 20, 2012 Jesus. L, I have LIVED with these guys. You talk books, I talk living there. And they thought I was some kind of weird 'gringo', little bit nuts and so kind of suitable for conveying their message/belief to. I'll tell you what: these guys knew a goddamn lot about herbs and their effect, but they had a way of explaining these effects that is not ours. . You mean real life experience trumps a bunch of crapola you can read on fringe websites? Whoa.... Thank you for sharing your FIRST HAND knowledge, Abramelin - your contributions further the debate in a way that nothing anybody read on the internet ever could. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 20, 2012 Author #58 Share Posted October 20, 2012 You mean real life experience trumps a bunch of crapola you can read on fringe websites? Whoa.... Thank you for sharing your FIRST HAND knowledge, Abramelin - your contributions further the debate in a way that nothing anybody read on the internet ever could. Laws of math are same here, Brasil,Peru and Andromeda. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted October 22, 2012 #59 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Thing is that Ayahuasca is mystery. We will never grasp it. We made colleges to train people to understand shamans yet we failed. Shamans will always beat Anthropologists. Now what does tell us? Who is smarter and wiser? To make that statement shows much ignorance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted October 22, 2012 #60 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I calculated that if they have 80 000 plants. And need two. and cooked 12 hours. They must cooked 8,7 million years to try all 64 billion combination. So method of trying is just redicule imo. Perhaps they just got lucky. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 22, 2012 Author #61 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Perhaps they just got lucky. With Aya, with Curare...Phh...they are lucky guys. Next time when someone went there I will aski him that they choose numbers for Lotto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted October 22, 2012 #62 Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) I calculated that if they have 80 000 plants. And need two. and cooked 12 hours. They must cooked 8,7 million years to try all 64 billion combination. So method of trying is just redicule imo. Trial and error yes. What's your explanation? That the vine whispered into their ears and said 'Cook me, eat me, and fly across the jungle'?? == It is possible to eat the vine leafs raw, btw, but the cooking releases the 'spiritual' bits (or its 'spirit' so to speak). Curare is poisonous, it can enter your blood stream through your skin. Simple scenario: thousands of years ago some people touched a nice colored little froggy, and died soon after. A clever person must have thought: hey, I can use the stuff from the frog's skin to make poisened darts !! . Edited October 22, 2012 by Abramelin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 22, 2012 Author #63 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Trial and error yes. What's your explanation? That the vine whispered into their ears and said 'Cook me, eat me, and fly across the jungle'?? Abe I dont know how. But they have different background then you and me. Different history, Different views and beliefs. They trust their intuitions. Their hallucinations. They live in differnt world the you and I. When one anthropologist was with Shaman in Amazon forest and while they walked saw snake. Shaman said to that anthropologist you see this plant...that is a cure for this snake venom. And westerner ask how do you know all that? And he didnt answer my granma, granpa, mom dad told me. He said: "Whats wrong with you? Doesnt you see similarites between plant and this snake. They are same. Also spirits confirmed it." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Big Bad Voodoo Posted October 22, 2012 Author #64 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Todays biologists have problems with spicies. What is spicies? We are all carbon based being, ...Amazon shamans speak how leaf of plant is same as our hand. Put leaf of plant in air to sun you will see similarites. When anthropologists James Narby was with Amazon Shamans they said that we are walking plants. They have different views. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted October 22, 2012 #65 Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) If you are interested in that stuff, read this: WIZARD OF THE UPPER AMAZON (1927) MANUEL CORDOVA-RIOS; F. BRUCE LAMB Wizard of the Upper Amazon is an extraordinary document of the life among a tribe of South American Indians at the beginning of the 20th century. For many readers, the most compelling sections of the book will be the descriptions of the use of Banisteriopsis caapi, the ayahuasca of the Amazon forests. This powerful hallucinogen has long been credited with the ability to transport human beings to realms of experience where telepathy and clairvoyance are commonplace. Manual Córdova, the narrator of these adventures is a well-known as a healer in Peru. The book is online here: http://archive.org/s...age/n8/mode/1up (Btw: I met one of Córdova's pupils in a market place in Iquitos, 1991. I was coughing like crazy for weeks on end, and he gave me some herbs to make tea from that cured me within an hour or so. It tasted like sh1t, though) . Edited October 22, 2012 by Abramelin 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted October 22, 2012 #66 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Abe I dont know how. But they have different background then you and me. Different history, Different views and beliefs. They trust their intuitions. Their hallucinations. They live in differnt world then you and I. When one anthropologist was with Shaman in Amazon forest and while they walked saw snake. Shaman said to that anthropologist you see this plant...that is a cure for this snake venom. And westerner ask how do you know all that? And he didnt answer my granma, granpa, mom dad told me. He said: "Whats wrong with you? Doesnt you see similarites between plant and this snake. They are same. Also spirits confirmed it." And I told you: I have lived in their world. Not for a long time, but still. And another thing: I was (and still am, but I closed it recently) the owner of a site that was about exactly all that, shamanism, spirituality, separate reality and that stuff. Anyway, they have a way of explaining phenomena that is different from ours. As long as it suits them in their daily life, why bother? And if it doesn't, you have no idea how fast they will show up in a nearby hospital or drugstore. They accept that we have different ways of healing people, like they have their own. If a method works, fine, if it doesn't, seek help. And that's what they do as the very practical people they generally are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abramelin Posted October 22, 2012 #67 Share Posted October 22, 2012 (edited) Something else (and to go back on topic,somewhat): you mentioned the 'songlines' of the Australian Aboriginals on post 31. I have read that book by Bruce Chatwin (and a couple of his other books), and these lines have no connection whatsoever with Nazca lines or the Russian ones. These songlines are not literally lines, but stories/myths that connect important and spiritual places in the beliefs and history of the Australian Aboriginals. You should read that book, Chatwin was a great author. . Edited October 22, 2012 by Abramelin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hermai Posted October 22, 2012 #68 Share Posted October 22, 2012 Wonder why they built this. Surely their time would of been better spent on survival. Interesting thanks for posting. I've always wondered this myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Myles Posted October 22, 2012 #69 Share Posted October 22, 2012 I've always wondered this myself. Having something to do is very important. No matter what it is. Humans were not as lazy as we are now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now