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More NASA UFO's?

ufo nasa

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Poll: Are these UFO's? (51 member(s) have cast votes)

Do these videos contain images of UFO's?

  1. Yes (22 votes [43.14%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 43.14%

  2. No (29 votes [56.86%] - View)

    Percentage of vote: 56.86%

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#1171    quillius

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 09:58 AM

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 09:53 AM, said:

He (like you) can believe and claim all sorts of things, but without substantial evidence its worthless,... all we have here is a person saying something. Its up the the listener to believe him, or not.

Worthless.

Mitchell also says that a teenage remote healer who lives in Vancouver helped him heal kidney cancer from a distance. Do you believe that?


might not be scientific evidence but I wouldnt put it in the 'worthless' section.......


#1172    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 10:03 AM

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 09:53 AM, said:

He (like you) can believe and claim all sorts of things, but without substantial evidence its worthless,... all we have here is a person saying something. Its up the the listener to believe him, or not.

Worthless.

Mitchell also says that a teenage remote healer who lives in Vancouver helped him heal kidney cancer from a distance. Do you believe that?



I believe that Hazzard has missed the point--again--since Oberg was on here all day yesterday denying that Edgar Mitchell had ever said anything at all about the UFO cover up at NASA.

I proved him wrong, but he'll be on here soon enough saying that I didn't.  

I'm not going to answer him about this subject again, however, because I'm bored with it and it's truly a thankless task.


#1173    TheMacGuffin

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 10:07 AM

View Postquillius, on 19 November 2012 - 09:58 AM, said:

might not be scientific evidence but I wouldnt put it in the 'worthless' section.......

As I said, it's a thankless task for me since I can post a dozen things proving that Mitchell really did talk about people at NASA covering up aliens and UFOs, only to be told that what he said doesn't matter anyway what.

And this is after I dutifully answer request after request after request demanding that I PROVE Edgar Mitchell said such things.  He did say them, repeatedly, but now I'm just going to be told it doesn't matter any way.

Well, next time when Oberg and friends want to look something up they can do it themselves.  Why can't they? Did they break their fingers?  LOL

Edited by TheMacGuffin, 19 November 2012 - 10:11 AM.


#1174    Hazzard

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 10:49 AM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 10:03 AM, said:

I believe that Hazzard has missed the point--again--since Oberg was on here all day yesterday denying that Edgar Mitchell had ever said anything at all about the UFO cover up at NASA.


So, in other words (on me "missing the point") you dont believe in Dr. Michells claims,... all you did was prove to Jim that Ed claimed there was a cove-up by NASA?

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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#1175    1963

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 11:15 AM

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 09:53 AM, said:

He (like you) can believe and claim all sorts of things, but without substantial evidence its worthless,... all we have here is a person saying something. Its up the the listener to believe him, or not.

Worthless.


Mitchell also says that a teenage remote healer who lives in Vancouver helped him heal kidney cancer from a distance. Do you believe that?




You see MacGuffin,..this is an example of why it is a complete waste of time engaging into this kind of activity with certain 'uncompromising-sceptics' around these parts.
The task that was set for you was to provide examples of Dr. Mitchell actually stating his belief that NASA is withholding knowledge of the subject in question, as though they deemed it an important point! ... And you duly provided the [easily-accessible  material that they could have found themselves...if they had really wanted to!]...Only for the same old sentiment to come back...

"He (like you) can believe and claim all sorts of things, but without substantial evidence its worthless,... all we have here is a person saying something. Its up the the listener to believe him, or not.

Worthless."




Oh and as for the ..."Mitchell also says that a teenage remote healer who lives in Vancouver helped him heal kidney cancer from a distance. Do you believe that?"...jibe Hazzard,...what on earth has that got to do with NASA's alleged knowledge of UFO's...??...Nothing at all has it!...merely another one of your attempts to paint a proponent of the ETH as nothing more than a superstitious simpleton isn't it!...When once again you are just showing your ignorance of a very real scientifically proven and well documented aspect of human recovery, 'The Placebo Effect' !...you can look that one up yourself, because unlike MacGuffin...I have more important things to do than play to your unreasonable games.!


Cheers.

When you have eliminated the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.

#1176    Hazzard

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 11:20 AM

That train has already left the station, 63,... :innocent:  please try and keep up.

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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#1177    quillius

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 11:23 AM

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

So, in other words (on me "missing the point") you dont believe in Dr. Michells claims,... all you did was prove to Jim that Ed claimed there was a cove-up by NASA?

tut tut tut....Hazzard I never thought you would admit to Jim being proved wrong.....still I think McG should save this one :whistle:


#1178    quillius

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 11:24 AM

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 11:20 AM, said:

That train has already left the station, 63,... :innocent:  please try and keep up.


add the word 'Woo Woo' then what springs to mind......for me the word is 'sock puppet' and yet I do not know why :santa:


#1179    Karlis

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 11:26 AM

Quote

TheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 12:53 PM, said:

Oberg recently took up an entire thread here dumping on Gordon Coopper, basically calling him a crook, a liar and a crazy.

That's just his standard operating procedure in every single case with those who disagree with him, and should not be considered any more meaningful than that.



Quote

JimOberg, on 19 November 2012 - 12:57 PM, said:
I never called or even insinuated Cooper was a crook.

I never called or even insinuated Cooper was a liar.

I never called or even insinuated Cooper "crazy".

People who claim I do have no citations to support the vicious accusations, they just express confidence they 'know' what it was I REALLY was trying to say -- but actually didn't say.

Folks, in my opinion you seem to be arguing for the sake of arguing. Please don't waste time accusing each other of knowingly or unknowingly posting falsehoods. That is not the purpose of this thread, which started off about discerning UFOs in film clips.

Everybody -- please drop personal issues, and present facts that are relevant.
Karlis -- mod team member


#1180    quillius

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 11:29 AM

View PostKarlis, on 19 November 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

Folks, in my opinion you seem to be arguing for the sake of arguing. Please don't waste time accusing each other of knowingly or unknowingly posting falsehoods. That is not the purpose of this thread, which started off about discerning UFOs in film clips.

Everybody -- please drop personal issues, and present facts that are relevant.
Karlis -- mod team member

ok to follow on with the request from Karlis can we agree:

Mitchell accuses the Government of the cover up and also says some individuals within NASA were involved....

again I ask, Deal?


#1181    quillius

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 11:49 AM

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 11:20 AM, said:

That train has already left the station, 63,... :innocent:  please try and keep up.

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

Can you be a little more speciffic, quillius?

http://en.wikipedia....a:Sock_puppetry

certainly,  I point to the angelic emoticon used.....I trust we understand eachother.....and best we both follow Karlis' advice, so as not to derail

View PostHazzard, on 19 November 2012 - 11:45 AM, said:

Hey, I just call it as I see it. :)  Granted I havent been following their entire "debate" on this,...

:tu:


#1182    booNyzarC

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 02:41 PM

View PostTheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 08:50 AM, said:

If NASA isn't involved in a cover up, then why does Mitchell keep saying things like this in interviews?



"FORMER NASA astronaut and moonwalker Dr Edgar Mitchell - a veteran of the Apollo 14 mission - has stunningly claimed aliens do exist.
And he says extra-terrestrials have visited Earth on several occasions - but the alien contact has been repeatedly covered up by governments for six decades.

Dr Mitchell, 77, said during a radio interview that sources at the space agency who had had contact with aliens described the beings as 'little people who look strange to us."


Which people at the "space agency" have had contacts with the aliens?  LOL

http://www.dailytele...r-1111117003802

Those weren't Dr. Mitchell's words.  What you've provided here is known as a misquote.  He doesn't associate NASA or people who work for NASA as the ones who described "little people who look strange to us."  He also mentions photographs when he is asked what they look like.  He says "Well you've seen some of the pictures.  The pictures that I know of, some of them are these little people that look strange to us."  If these are photographs that are in the public record, how are they covered up?  Answer: they aren't covered up.

Were these photographs taken by NASA or people who work for NASA?  Answer: no.

So again, find Dr. Mitchell stating in his own words that NASA was involved in some kind of cover up.



View PostTheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 08:58 AM, said:

And here it is again: Edgar Mitchell Blows the Lid on NASA.  What more is there to say?



The honest thing to say is that Edgar Mitchell says nothing of the sort in this interview.  The closest he comes to saying something like that is when he is asked whether or not other people involved with the moon landings "know about this" and he responds saying "Some of the do."

How does that equate to a coverup?  How do we know exactly who he is talking about?



View PostTheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 09:01 AM, said:

No, I am not at all.  I have continually posted videos about Mitchell saying that people at NASA have had contact with aliens and so forth.

I don't know if it's humanly possible to do any more than I have done to establish this point, but I'm getting tired of repeating myself about how an "X" is an "X".

You could start by providing an exact quote from him which definitively states that he believes NASA has been involved in a coverup as you have claimed.  So far you haven't done so.



View PostTheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 09:14 AM, said:

In that interview, Mitchell was asked specifically whether people involved in the moon landings know about contacts with aliens, and he answered "some of them do".

Don't take my word for it, all you have to do is listen to what he says for himself.

Again, specifically who is he referring to?  How do we know that he isn't talking about someone else who is likewise convinced about alien visitation by the same set of evidence that has convinced him?  Knowing about something (which should read: believing something) and being involved in a coverup are not the same thing McG.  You'll have to do better if you intend to substantiate your claim.



View Postquillius, on 19 November 2012 - 09:21 AM, said:

Maybe a fair compromise at this point would be to say Mitchell says ' people within NASA are part of cover up but NASA as an organistion are not.

deal?

at what point to individuals 'count enough' to represent the organisation they work for?

If you can find where Mitchell says even that, it would be a worthy compromise.  However, I don't believe he has even said that.



View PostTheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 09:46 AM, said:

I wouldn't say that EVERYONE at NASA was involved in the UFO cover up, but clearly Mitchell said that some of them were.  As he pointed out, everything to do with ETs and UFOs is very highly compartmentalized and has been since 1950 at least.

Where has he said that anyone at NASA was involved in a coverup?  So far you've not provided it.



View Postquillius, on 19 November 2012 - 09:50 AM, said:

great I think there is some good middle ground here to reach an agreement....

So we all agree NASA as an organisation has no 'agenda' that is known by all employees, however it is understood that 'individuals' that work within NASA are part/have been part of a cover up....

anyone disagree with this?

I disagree with it.  If this is the case we should be able to find somewhere that Dr. Mitchell has indicated so.  Are you aware of any place where he has?



View PostTheMacGuffin, on 19 November 2012 - 10:07 AM, said:

As I said, it's a thankless task for me since I can post a dozen things proving that Mitchell really did talk about people at NASA covering up aliens and UFOs, only to be told that what he said doesn't matter anyway what.

And this is after I dutifully answer request after request after request demanding that I PROVE Edgar Mitchell said such things.  He did say them, repeatedly, but now I'm just going to be told it doesn't matter any way.

Well, next time when Oberg and friends want to look something up they can do it themselves.  Why can't they? Did they break their fingers?  LOL

You haven't proven your claim McG.  Nothing in what you've presented has Dr. Mitchell saying that NASA or people at NASA have been involved in any kind of coverup.

In addition, he has emphatically stated that NASA is definitively NOT involved with the coverup that he believes has taken place.  Again, I quote:

At about 3:40 in this video, Mitchell clarifies with "One more thing... it got messed up that this had to do with NASA.  It doesn't have anything to do with NASA."

And as quoted by psyche:

LB - Lisa Bonnice
EM - Edgar Mitchell.


LB: The interviews are quoted as saying that you say sources at NASA who had contact with aliens
EM: That is totally false.
LB: Then let’s clear that up.
EM: Yes, please do. That is not correct. Because I have talked with government people about it, and military people about it, that was a misquote.
LB: Good. I’m glad to clear that one up. Have you seen the reports? The articles that are going around?
EM: I’ve seen some of them. They’ve been floating into my computer all day long.
LB: Is there anything else in these articles that you would like to use as an opportunity to say “OK, they misquoted me”?
EM: I would have to look at them individually, but that’s one that, to my knowledge, has nothing to do with NASA.
LB: One of these quotes said that whoever did describe these beings said they resembled “little people who look strange to us.”
EM: Well, we’ve all seen the pictures of the so-called aliens – “little grays.” I have no first-hand evidence that that’s true, but I do accept the fact that those seem to be the prevalent story.
LB: That does seem to be what the majority of people who say they’ve seen them agree upon. Now another one, this one I can see makes so much sense that our technology is not nearly as sophisticated and if they had been hostile we would have been gone by now.
EM: Well, if they proved to be hostile, and wanted to do so, they probably could. But there’s utterly no evidence that they really are hostile.


LINK




Do you understand the distinction here?  Do you see the difference between an actual quote and a misquote?

We have Dr. Mitchell, in his own words, refuting what you've claimed McG.


#1183    JimOberg

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 02:45 PM

View Postquillius, on 19 November 2012 - 09:50 AM, said:

great I think there is some good middle ground here to reach an agreement....

So we all agree NASA as an organisation has no 'agenda' that is known by all employees, however it is understood that 'individuals' that work within NASA are part/have been part of a cover up....anyone disagree with this?  

Mitchell did NOT say that. He claimed [at 08:30 in the video] that 'some' people KNEW about alien visits [without saying who they were or what they did or didn't do with the knowledge]. That could easily be someone like John Schuessler, who was an energetic UFO investigator, or Al Pennington, a friend of mine, who worked Apollo missions in Mission Control, became a space shuttle Flight Director, and believed that UFOs were real [even while realizing that the stories about space sightings were baseless].

Just because a person 'knows' that UFOs are real does NOT make them a 'participant in a coverup. McG "knows", but does that make HIS employer a participant in a coverup? Silly notion.

Still, it's an intriguing interview, of unknown date/time/location.  

I found it eye-opening to see that Mitchell believes that to enforce the UFO coverup, the dark forces used to kill people.


at 7:40   I don't think they're knocking people off any more”

I also note that the original poster of the audio, Andy Bell Ashburton, is a fan of [drumroll...] Clark McClelland and his by-now-thoroughly-discredited ravinbgs.

http://hgn53k.blogsp...11_archive.html

An e-mail received today 31/07/2008 To important to leave out!
A past Space Shuttle ScO, admits ET's are Real. And this ScO has seen them, himself with another witness!
29 July 2008 Clark C. McClelland, former ScO, Space Shuttle Fleet, Kennedy Space Center, Florida, 1958 to 1992.


http://hgn53k.blogsp...11_archive.html

An e-mail received today 31/07/2008 To important to leave out!
A past Space Shuttle ScO, admits ET's are Real. And this ScO has seen them, himself with another witness!
29 July 2008 Clark C. McClelland, former ScO, Space Shuttle Fleet, Kennedy Space Center, Florida, 1958 to 1992.



http://hgn53k.blogsp...11_archive.html

An e-mail received today 31/07/2008 To important to leave out!
A past Space Shuttle ScO, admits ET's are Real. And this ScO has seen them, himself with another witness!
29 July 2008 Clark C. McClelland, former ScO, Space Shuttle Fleet, Kennedy Space Center, Florida, 1958 to 1992.



=======

Jim back: When Mitchell says 'some of them knew', he could even be referring to Clark McClelland. Wouldn't that be a hoot!



.

Edited by JimOberg, 19 November 2012 - 02:55 PM.


#1184    booNyzarC

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 02:54 PM

View Post1963, on 19 November 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

You see MacGuffin,..this is an example of why it is a complete waste of time engaging into this kind of activity with certain 'uncompromising-sceptics' around these parts.
The task that was set for you was to provide examples of Dr. Mitchell actually stating his belief that NASA is withholding knowledge of the subject in question, as though they deemed it an important point! ... And you duly provided the [easily-accessible  material that they could have found themselves...if they had really wanted to!]...Only for the same old sentiment to come back...

"He (like you) can believe and claim all sorts of things, but without substantial evidence its worthless,... all we have here is a person saying something. Its up the the listener to believe him, or not.

Worthless."




Oh and as for the ..."Mitchell also says that a teenage remote healer who lives in Vancouver helped him heal kidney cancer from a distance. Do you believe that?"...jibe Hazzard,...what on earth has that got to do with NASA's alleged knowledge of UFO's...??...Nothing at all has it!...merely another one of your attempts to paint a proponent of the ETH as nothing more than a superstitious simpleton isn't it!...When once again you are just showing your ignorance of a very real scientifically proven and well documented aspect of human recovery, 'The Placebo Effect' !...you can look that one up yourself, because unlike MacGuffin...I have more important things to do than play to your unreasonable games.!


Cheers.

Hiya 1963.

As you can hopefully see in my previous post, nobody has proven that Dr. Mitchell is of the opinion that NASA is withholding knowledge of the subject.  On the contrary, it appears to be proven that he does NOT hold this belief at all.

When you say, "easily-accessible  material that they could have found themselves...if they had really wanted to!" it makes me wonder if you think we weren't already aware of Dr. Mitchell's statements on the matter.  If that was the impression you were under, I'd like to set the record straight;  I'm more than aware of his statements, and it is clear that his statements do not support the claim that NASA or people working with NASA have been involved in any kind of coverup.

Cheers.


#1185    bee

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Posted 19 November 2012 - 03:37 PM

.


Are we getting into semantics over all this.....

http://science.howst...ks.com/nasa.htm


while NASA is described as an 'Independent civilian space agency'.....it's creation by Congress...it's funding...and general direction

is lead by the US Government.....?


it would technically be the Government who is doing the 'covering up'......but as a civilian branch of government NASA would naturally be

under instructions from Government about what it could and couldn't make public. What would be classified and what wouldn't...


Mitchell doesn't go out of his way to point the finger at NASA (who would be the ones paying his retirement pension?).....but he doesn't have to.....

by saying that the government is...and has been covering up ET visitation...NASA is naturally and obviously implicated...as a 'civilian' branch of government.

In other words....Covering up stuff in the  'National Interest'....would not be something NASA could do independent of Government...

The government would lead in matters of 'security' and NASA would follow...? And by following would be part of the cover up.


:wacko:




.

Edited by bee, 19 November 2012 - 03:40 PM.





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