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Stephen Fry: "only humans are homophobic"

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#61    shaddow134

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 05:44 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 14 October 2012 - 02:53 AM, said:

How does one turn away from a being they do not believe exists.. What is there to turn away from exactly?



If you are in complete darkness..how would you find yourself?   lol Who said  anyone will be in darkness ?
Religion clouds everything and this world would be a better place without it,as far as i am concerned,homosexuality is as normal as being heterosexual and who cares what the church thinks as they are irrelevent in the 21st century and are bigoted and out of touch..

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#62    Left-Field

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:34 PM

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 14 October 2012 - 02:04 AM, said:

Homosexuality is not wrong. It's biological.

That is debatable.

As humans we have minds capable of determining right from wrong in ways no other species can.

You can state sex in general is biological, but as humans we know that that alone does not make it acceptable for us to cheat on our significant others.

Getting rid of bodily waste by urinating or bowel movements is biological, yet it does not mean it is proper for us as humans to do these things anywhere we please in the same manner animals do.

Many animals have sexual altercations with their family members, yet again, this is not right for us as humans to do the same.

There are many examples of this.

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 14 October 2012 - 02:04 AM, said:

Never said I was talking about you, buddy.

You should have been clearer with your remark. Whether you were referring directly to me or not, you certainly seemed to lump me in with the group you were commenting on.

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 14 October 2012 - 02:04 AM, said:

And I will continue to mock and turn away from your imaginary god every chance I get. And I'll love doing it, too.

That won't get you far. You should let go of your hate.


#63    Left-Field

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:40 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 14 October 2012 - 02:53 AM, said:

How does one turn away from a being they do not believe exists.. What is there to turn away from exactly?

Simply because a person does not believe in God does not mean He is not real. Being that He is real, you (in the general sense) are denying and turning away from Him by not recognizing his existance.

As for what you are turning away from, the answer to that is you are turning away from God's calling. At the moment I do not have the time to go into what all of that entails.

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 14 October 2012 - 02:53 AM, said:

If you are in complete darkness..how would you find yourself?   lol  Who said  anyone will be in darkness ?

Turn to God and He will lead you out of darkness.

God also tells of those who live in darnkness to answer your second question. The thing is, many of those who live in this darkness do not realize they are doing so. This is the result of turning away from God to begin with.


#64    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:41 PM

View PostLeft-Field, on 15 October 2012 - 06:34 PM, said:


That is debatable.

As humans we have minds capable of determining right from wrong in ways no other species can.

You can state sex in general is biological, but as humans we know that that alone does not make it acceptable for us to cheat on our significant others.

Getting rid of bodily waste by urinating or bowel movements is biological, yet it does not mean it is proper for us as humans to do these things anywhere we please in the same manner animals do.

Many animals have sexual altercations with their family members, yet again, this is not right for us as humans to do the same.

There are many examples of this.

Culture defines what is and is not acceptable. Biology is not debatable.
Homosexuality cannot be right or wrong anymore than heterosexuality is.

Quote

You should have been clearer with your remark. Whether you were referring directly to me or not, you certainly seemed to lump me in with the group you were commenting on.

If the shoe fits...

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That won't get you far. You should let go of your hate.

I don't have any hate to let go of. In fact, I see nothing hateful in what I said.

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#65    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 06:42 PM

View PostLeft-Field, on 15 October 2012 - 06:40 PM, said:


Simply because a person does not believe in God does not mean He is not real.


Simply because a person believes in god does not mean he is real.

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#66    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 07:39 PM

View PostLeft-Field, on 15 October 2012 - 06:40 PM, said:

Simply because a person does not believe in God does not mean He is not real.

If you do not believe in any god... then you will not think you have turned away from god.. in your mind, there is nothing there to turn away from.

Quote

As for what you are turning away from, the answer to that is you are turning away from God's calling.   

If I believed and followed  a god that was not the same as your god, and  I claimed it was your god.. You will not hold belief's in my god..in your mind, my god does not exist for you.. Does it mean you have turned away from my god too?  

Quote

Turn to God and He will lead you out of darkness.   

But ......I am not in darkness..  Well accept at night, that's a given  lol

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The thing is, many of those who live in this darkness do not realize they are doing so. This is the result of turning away from God to begin with.

Hang on... -  Those who do not hold belief's in the god you chose...live in darkness . but..because they turned away from a being they don't believe exists  ( which to them is nothing, and that means nothing to turn away from  ) .. they live in darkness anyway and they don't know it ?  ........... Can you explain how that makes any sense?

Edited by Beckys_Mom, 15 October 2012 - 07:42 PM.

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#67    Left-Field

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:11 PM

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 15 October 2012 - 06:41 PM, said:

Culture defines what is and is not acceptable. Biology is not debatable.

Culture is a product of peoples morals (among other things).

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 15 October 2012 - 06:41 PM, said:

Homosexuality cannot be right or wrong anymore than heterosexuality is.

That is not true.

There is a reason God made both man and woman. If not then we would have all been made the same sex.

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 15 October 2012 - 06:41 PM, said:

If the shoe fits...

Yes, if the shoe fits.

Like I said, you have no idea about my own sexuality, my own sexual desires, or any personal conflict I may have regarding the matter. You also have no idea as to who my friends are and how many of them are gay, bi, or transgenered.

I do not hate or even dislike people who fall under any of those categories based upon that alone. If I did I wouldn't be friends with some of the people I am friends with.

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 15 October 2012 - 06:41 PM, said:

I don't have any hate to let go of. In fact, I see nothing hateful in what I said.

Ah, but there is most definitely hate behind some of the things you have stated. You may not see it, but that only indicates the very reason you can't let go of it to begin with.

One does not take such joy in mocking the beliefs of others - whether it concern God's existance or otherwise - without some level of hate and detest involved in doing so.


#68    Left-Field

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:12 PM

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 15 October 2012 - 06:42 PM, said:

Simply because a person believes in god does not mean he is real.

I already know this. I am not so sure that you realize your nonbelief in God, however, means He is not real.


#69    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:18 PM

View PostLeft-Field, on 15 October 2012 - 08:11 PM, said:


Culture is a product of peoples morals (among other things).

Morals come from culture, not the other way around.

Quote

That is not true.

There is a reason God made both man and woman. If not then we would have all been made the same sex.

Give me empirical proof that your god created anything. A book of jewish fairy tales doesn't count.

Quote

Yes, if the shoe fits.

Like I said, you have no idea about my own sexuality, my own sexual desires, or any personal conflict I may have regarding the matter. You also have no idea as to who my friends are and how many of them are gay, bi, or transgenered.

I do not hate or even dislike people who fall under any of those categories based upon that alone. If I did I wouldn't be friends with some of the people I am friends with.

I could honestly care less about you, your friends, or your/their orientation.

Quote

Ah, but there is most definitely hate behind some of the things you have stated. You may not see it, but that only indicates the very reason you can't let go of it to begin with.

One does not take such joy in mocking the beliefs of others - whether it concern God's existance or otherwise - without some level of hate and detest involved in doing so.

Oh, so you've managed to work up a full psychological profile of me based on a few statements and know now exactly how and why I feel the way I do about things, right?
Bravo.

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#70    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:19 PM

View PostLeft-Field, on 15 October 2012 - 08:11 PM, said:


That is not true.


Can you chose to make yourself fall in love with someone of the same sex ?   If you can.. can you tell me how easy it is ?

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#71    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:20 PM

View PostLeft-Field, on 15 October 2012 - 08:12 PM, said:


I already know this. I am not so sure that you realize your nonbelief in God, however, means He is not real.

It's just a circular argument with no resolution, suffice it to say that the burden of proof does not rest on me to prove the fantastical.

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#72    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:22 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 15 October 2012 - 08:19 PM, said:

Can you chose to make yourself fall in love with someone of the same sex ?   If you can.. can you tell me how easy it is ?

Be careful, I think you're going going to get lost in darkness! :lol: Better grab a flashlight.

"A cat has nine lives. For three he plays, for three he strays, and for the last three he stays."


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#73    Beckys_Mom

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:28 PM

View PostImaginarynumber1, on 15 October 2012 - 08:22 PM, said:

Be careful, I think you're going going to get lost in darkness! :lol: Better grab a flashlight.

If I get lost in the darkness.. it will get me out of work for a while   lol

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#74    Left-Field

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:28 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 15 October 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

If you do not believe in any god... then you will not think you have turned away from god.. in your mind, there is nothing there to turn away from.

Correct. If you don't believe in God than you won't think have turned away from Him. Not thinking you have done so, and not actually doing so are different things however.

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 15 October 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

If I believed and followed  a god that was not the same as your god, and  I claimed it was your god.. You will not hold belief's in my god..in your mind, my god does not exist for you.. Does it mean you have turned away from my god too?

Being as I know there is only one God I would not believe I have turned away from yours (unless we believe in the same God of course).

That said, you'd be well within reason to state I have turned away from your god (or gods) if you truly believe in them and do your best to live by their laws due to the level of belief you hold in him/her/them.

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 15 October 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

But ......I am not in darkness..  Well accept at night, that's a given  lol

Well, I am not sure of all your beliefs pertaining to God, but if I recall correctly you do believe in some type of god. And if I am correct in stating that (hope I am recalling correctly) I'm fairly certain you believe in a god that is just and one that expects people to behave in accordance to good morals and things of that nature.

In that sense I wouldn't say you are living in darkness. We'd have to have a far more intricate discussion about each of our beliefs however to go into more specific details about what living in darkness encompasses.

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 15 October 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

Hang on... -  Those who do not hold belief's in the god you chose...live in darkness . but..because they turned away from a being they don't believe exists  ( which to them is nothing, and that means nothing to turn away from  ) .. they live in darkness anyway and they don't know it ?  ........... Can you explain how that makes any sense?

I haven't chosen "my" god. God has chosen me. There is only one God, and as such no one gets to choose Him. They can only choose to turn towards Him or turn away from and/or deny Him.

When people turn away from, deny, or are merely unaware of His existance they are living in darkness. What level of darkness, and what "living in darkness" encompasses is something that I am not so sure can be all that well discussed through the internet as it takes somewhat of a more personal knowing of the person you are discussing the topic with in order to better understand each other.


#75    Imaginarynumber1

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Posted 15 October 2012 - 08:33 PM

View PostBeckys_Mom, on 15 October 2012 - 08:28 PM, said:

If I get lost in the darkness.. it will get me out of work for a while   lol

Heh. I can't come in today, I got lost in a godless darkness.


There's too much proselytizing going on in this thread for my liking....

"A cat has nine lives. For three he plays, for three he strays, and for the last three he stays."


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