23 replies to this topic

[Raptor Witness]

We hear it all the time at protests across the ME, but is it a prayer, is it a chant, a threat, and/or is it something else?

Perhaps it's all of the above, and then some ...

Apart from the obvious meaning, I wonder if there is something else, hidden within this message.

It's easy to take at face value, but does it mean death to all Americans, our way of life, our military, or just our political system?

If any of these are true, then I suspect we're going to need a lot more unmanned drones.

For those who missed the PBS special called "Rise of the Drones," I've attached it below. It's eye opening, and provides a very advanced mechanism for dealing death to those who want U.S. dead.

I suspect it all depends on the underlying meaning of "Death to America."

Will it become "Death to the Drones," instead?

Edited by Raptor Witness, 29 January 2013 - 07:07 AM.

[and then]

America hatred is on the rise for sure.  Easy scapegoat for all the world's troubles I guess.  Eventually the US will fall and if I'm around to see it I expect to take a certain satisfaction in how these America haters  react to their new "patrons".  Drones - the military in general - isn't an answer.  Truth is the whole world is going to hell on a greased skid and America is just at the forefront in visibility.  The people here are no worse than anywhere else.  Indeed, Americans are some of the most generous humans on the planet.  But there is no shortage of people who take what we give, then spit on us and call for our demise.  I think they are too stupid  or hate filled to understand that when the US goes - so goes their help in time of need.  Maybe the M.E. for example, can call on Saudi Arabia for help after the next natural or man made disaster.  Good luck with that....

[Frank Merton]

I don't think hatred for America is on the rise anywhere.  There are those who hate America because it stands in the way of their vision for the world (usually not a pleasant vision), but they are really few and far between, even in Muslim countries.

The vast majority don't like some of the things America does and American tourists often irritate, but all tourists often irritate and all countries in the end act in their own interests, so this is widely understood.

I can speak for Vietnam, and say that in spite of the American War (that's what it is called here), very few Vietnamese "hate" the States, and Americans (and of course their money) are more than welcome.

Because of my fluency in English I know maybe a dozen English-speaking ex-pats who have made a living here, the younger ones working as English teachers or in the computer programming businesses here, the older ones retired.  They do fine, and tend to get special treatment in places like stores and clinics.

Of course there is the danger the OP speaks of.  All it will take is one nuclear weapon set off in an American city and I dread to think of what will happen, and there are a few lunatics who actually think such a scenario is desirable.  I can only say that if such a thing came from a Muslim state, it would probably mean the annihilation of Islam everywhere -- even though level heads would dread such a thing.

[Yamato]

Raptor Witness, on 29 January 2013 - 07:05 AM, said:

We hear it all the time at protests across the ME, but is it a prayer, is it a chant, a threat, and/or is it something else?

Perhaps it's all of the above, and then some ...

Apart from the obvious meaning, I wonder if there is something else, hidden within this message.

It's easy to take at face value, but does it mean death to all Americans, our way of life, our military, or just our political system?

If any of these are true, then I suspect we're going to need a lot more unmanned drones.

For those who missed the PBS special called "Rise of the Drones," I've attached it below. It's eye opening, and provides a very advanced mechanism for dealing death to those who want U.S. dead.

I suspect it all depends on the underlying meaning of "Death to America."

Will it become "Death to the Drones," instead?

Why isn't it already Death to the Drones?  

An Iranian caught in traffic will yell:  "Death to traffic!"   It's a manner of speaking and we place so much emphasis on rhetoric that we ignore action.  Or the lack thereof.   Iran hasn't attacked anyone in hundreds of years.  I don't give a damn about who they arm when we're guiltier than anyone else on the planet as weapons proliferation goes.   Americans get into another major war every 20 years and we're worried about Iran?   I don't know what these paranoid politicians and citizens are smoking but they need to change their pipes.  

And what does that rhetoric have to do with this Nova video on drones exactly?  Sooner or later it's not going to just be an American thing.  All the other wealthy countries of the world are going to have drones.   China's going to stamp them out on plastic for pennies on the dollar and build 10x more than we'll ever have.   We're sloppily and carelessly surrendering our privacy to the State.   Every new intrusion is another judge on another bench telling us how we don't have a reasonable expectation of privacy anymore.

I would never suggest killing someone because of something they said.   Why are we so brain-dead when the idea of government doing it comes up?   Where does this double standard come from?   Because it's big, grey and from the government and here to help, it makes it all legitimate?   I don't think so.

[and then]

Yamato, on 29 January 2013 - 07:53 AM, said:

Why isn't it already Death to the Drones?  

An Iranian caught in traffic will yell:  "Death to traffic!"   It's a manner of speaking and we place so much emphasis on rhetoric that we ignore action.  Or the lack thereof.   Iran hasn't attacked anyone in hundreds of years.  I don't give a damn about who they arm when we're guiltier than anyone else on the planet as weapons proliferation goes.   Americans get into another major war every 20 years and we're worried about Iran?   I don't know what these paranoid politicians and citizens are smoking but they need to change their pipes.  

And what does that rhetoric have to do with this Nova video on drones exactly?  Sooner or later it's not going to just be an American thing.  All the other wealthy countries of the world are going to have drones.   China's going to stamp them out on plastic for pennies on the dollar and build 10x more than we'll ever have.   We're sloppily and carelessly surrendering our privacy to the State.   Every new intrusion is another judge on another bench telling us how we don't have a reasonable expectation of privacy anymore.

I would never suggest killing someone because of something they said.   Why are we so brain-dead when the idea of government doing it comes up?   Where does this double standard come from?   Because it's big, grey and from the government and here to help, it makes it all legitimate?   I don't think so.

Beirut in '83, 241 Marines.  Khobar Towers in Saudi Arabia, 19 dead.  Just a couple examples of things we KNOW they did.  Iran has been waging war outside it's borders non stop since 1980 or so.  To say otherwise is either foolish or pushing propaganda.

[AsteroidX]

I blame Honey Boo Boo for us being hated in the Muslim world. They dislike our culture and dont want it integrated into theres to a large degree thats where this started and oil.

Exhibit A: http://tlc.howstuffw...s-honey-boo-boo

If I had a choice Id keep Honey Boo Boo out of our culture as well. But oh well I digress. Its already here.

[Yamato]

and then, on 29 January 2013 - 09:30 AM, said:

Beirut in '83, 241 Marines.  Khobar Towers in Saudi Arabia, 19 dead.  Just a couple examples of things we KNOW they did.  Iran has been waging war outside it's borders non stop since 1980 or so.  To say otherwise is either foolish or pushing propaganda.

If waging war outside its borders was justification to go to war on someone, you'd invite the world to attack us for all the crap we've stuck our noses in.  Khobar Towers is Saudi Arabia, not us.  I'm tired of defending some dumb sheikh's oil well.  Let Saudi Arabia prosper under its own merit.  If they have some oil to sell, maybe we should buy some.  Other than that, screw the place.  

Beirut in '83 was Iran?   Isn't that wishful thinking!  You need to do homework.
http://en.wikipedia....arracks_bombing

[Frank Merton]

Since I don't know what Honey-Boo-Boo is (and I get the feeling I don't want to know), I guess this aspect of American culture hasn't reached Vietnam.

I gotta tell you the world is small and getting smaller (my I'm full of cliches today).  All countries are being invaded by the cultures of all other countries.  There is a lot of US culture visible in Vietnam, but there is also a lot of Chinese, Japanese, Korean, Thai, Indian, Australian, Middle Eastern, European, Australian, what have you culture here.

[Yamato]

If "the Muslims" do hate us for Honey Boo Boo, they have yet another legitimate reason to hate us.

[WhyDontYouBeliEveMe]

and then, on 29 January 2013 - 07:21 AM, said:

Indeed, Americans are some of the most generous humans on the planet.  But there is no shortage of people who take what we give, then spit on us and call for our demise.  I think they are too stupid  or hate filled to understand that when the US goes - so goes their help in time of need.  Maybe the M.E. for example, can call on Saudi Arabia for help after the next natural or man made disaster.  Good luck with that....

lol are you sure about that? vietnam war you bombed the entire country ! after that you took all the minerals and gold ! and now you give us back a little bit of that gold ! what else you expect us to do?
hello thankx . for your generosity  thankx for your help ? lol no we do indeed spit on you ! for taking away our families and friends ,infecting our soil. ( same goes for all the other countries that have lost their close ones ''USA influence'' )
but offcours after 30 or 50 years..  the children that are growing up and having a hard time surviving would trully believe the usa is indeed  generous by helping them !
but before you give them ! tell them what you took from their parents and country !  ironic !

and after, a few hundreds of years.. if the Usa or China has taken over the world .. and we all live in peace ! than i ll thank the Usa or China for uniting the world !
till then we ll hate the USA  and China ! and spit on them ! for the wars thats going on now !


the sacrifices that are now made ! is it worth it?  !  
for unification of the world ,
but thats for our grandchildren to judge ! i think it is .

Edited by WhyDontYouBeliEveMe, 29 January 2013 - 10:55 AM.

[AsteroidX]

Please hate the Government or dislike our culture if you dont like it.

Please seperate that from the average American person. Many of us live on this land and care for it properly like we are suppose to do for the care of our shared planet Earth.

[and then]

Yamato, on 29 January 2013 - 10:04 AM, said:

If waging war outside its borders was justification to go to war on someone, you'd invite the world to attack us for all the crap we've stuck our noses in.  Khobar Towers is Saudi Arabia, not us.  I'm tired of defending some dumb sheikh's oil well.  Let Saudi Arabia prosper under its own merit.  If they have some oil to sell, maybe we should buy some.  Other than that, screw the place.  

Beirut in '83 was Iran?   Isn't that wishful thinking!  You need to do homework.
http://en.wikipedia....arracks_bombing

Yam are you seriously contending that Hezballah isn't funded and run by Iran?  Really?  I don't care about you shifting the argument.  You said Iran hasn't attacked anyone outside it's borders for hundreds of years and that quite clearly is false.

[and then]

WhyDontYouBeliEveMe, on 29 January 2013 - 10:41 AM, said:

lol are you sure about that? vietnam war you bombed the entire country ! after that you took all the minerals and gold ! and now you give us back a little bit of that gold ! what else you expect us to do?
hello thankx . for your generosity  thankx for your help ? lol no we do indeed spit on you ! for taking away our families and friends ,infecting our soil. ( same goes for all the other countries that have lost their close ones ''USA influence'' )
but offcours after 30 or 50 years..  the children that are growing up and having a hard time surviving would trully believe the usa is indeed  generous by helping them !
but before you give them ! tell them what you took from their parents and country !  ironic !

and after, a few hundreds of years.. if the Usa or China has taken over the world .. and we all live in peace ! than i ll thank the Usa or China for uniting the world !
till then we ll hate the USA  and China ! and spit on them ! for the wars thats going on now !


the sacrifices that are now made ! is it worth it?  !  
for unification of the world ,
but thats for our grandchildren to judge ! i think it is .

This is a perfect example of what I was alluding to.  Mindless hatred.  Wrapped up in self justification and venom - useless waste of breath to even try discussing it.

[AsteroidX]

Chicken or the egg

[Yamato]

and then, on 29 January 2013 - 12:25 PM, said:

Yam are you seriously contending that Hezballah isn't funded and run by Iran?  Really?  I don't care about you shifting the argument.  You said Iran hasn't attacked anyone outside it's borders for hundreds of years and that quite clearly is false.

I'm not shifting the argument, I'm exposing your hypocritical claims..

Iran hasn't attacked anyone outside its borders in hundreds of years, yes that's what I said. And that's exactly what I meant.   If you're blaming Iran for the actions of Hezbollah, then don't be surprised when like-minded individuals to yourself, Osama bin Laden for example, blame the US for supporting the actions of Israel and other oppressive regimes.  

Even if you were right, Iran can't come to the aid of a political ally?   Iran can't arm anyone it wants to in the world?  You reserve these rights strictly for your own country?   A fat double standard with cheese yet again.