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New NASA photos?


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#61    DingoLingo

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 08:11 AM

View PostFenderJazzBass, on 24 January 2013 - 07:29 AM, said:

Good luck to all of you.

and to you as well :)


#62    psyche101

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 08:16 AM

View PostFenderJazzBass, on 24 January 2013 - 07:29 AM, said:

To be honest i'm sick of trying to convince skeptics. Its truely an excersice in futility. go to youtube and watch the interviews with Gordon Cooper. Besides that, do your own digging. I'm not one to be so precise and type out all the compelling evidence i've seen over the years.

Nobody is asking you to convince anyone, nor are you to be convinced. Information is what it is. The aspects of what is available are being discussed, and that is all. It is not personal, there is just more information out there than most of us realise, and a place like this tends to bring it all to the table fairly quickly. When you mentioned Coops, I mentioned Mitchell, for every plus there seems to be a negative. That be the conundrum we seek to unravel. I think most in here have no problem with personal belief, it is just when that belief is claimed as fact that people get into heavy discussion.

Things are what they are. - Me Reality can't be debunked. That's the beauty of it. - Capeo If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of giants. - Sir Isaac Newton Let me repeat the lesson learned from the Sturrock scientific review panel: Pack up your old data and forget it. Ufology needs new data, new cases, new rigorous and scientific methodologies if it hopes ever to get out of its pit. - Ed Stewart Youtube is the last refuge of the ignorant and is more often used for disinformation than genuine research.  There is a REASON for PEER REVIEW... - Chrlzs Nothing is inexplicable, just unexplained. - Dr Who

#63    ChrLzs

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 09:59 AM

View PostFenderJazzBass, on 24 January 2013 - 07:29 AM, said:

To be honest i'm sick of trying to convince skeptics. Its truely an excersice in futility.
Well, maybe you should consider *not* making claims you can't back up.  And if that was your best shot, to make a claim about lots of astronauts saying something and then being unwilling to provide even ONE example beyond a handwave to Youtube.. well, the futility may be justified.

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go to youtube and watch the interviews with Gordon Cooper.

No, this is a discussion forum, remember?  You made the claim, you bring it here.  In simple terms, I do not find Cooper's claim convincing, or even logical.

Quote

Besides that, do your own digging.

I have, in case you haven't noticed.  I don't post claims I can't back up, and I KNOW just how many astronauts have made credible claims and what they were about.

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I'm not one to be so precise and type out all the compelling evidence i've seen over the years.

No, of course not.  And that isn't because of the obvious reason - that the compelling evidence is not compelling at all, and is NOT indicative of alien origin.

Quote

You'll just have to see it to believe it.

Actually, the more observing I do, the more I realise how human senses are easily fooled..  Ok 'fooled' isn't quite the right word - it's actually remarkable how clever your brain is at interpreting sensory inputs - our minds work enormously hard to satisfy our database of experiences and desires.. and will massage the data to neatly fit any new experiences into that world-view.  That's why anecdotal evidence is so unreliable.  Mine. Yours. Pilots. Astronauts.  etc.

Quote

Untill you see it, you'll forever be surrounded by doubt and fear. best bury your head in the sand and pretend everything is ok.

DON'T pretend you know me, and don't put others down as lesser beings living in fear.  Take a look at my posts - see all the astrophotography I do, see my comments and personal images about our wonderful, beautiful heavens?  Have you noticed that I talk a lot about Apollo - I grew up watching the space program culminate in Apollo - lived every minute of it, grabbing every tidbit and investigating how it all came about - again, in AWE of that incredibly successful achievement - imo the pinnacle of human technological achievement.  I LOVE space and astronomy and I do not in any way fear the sky or the universe.

And if It's ok for you to judge me, let me say this, I'll lay a substantial bet that I spend much MUCH more of my life than you (and perhaps 80% of the posters here) outdoors at night looking up at the sky and all the things that are in it - and each time I become more in AWE of the universe, not afraid of it..  And I would LOVE for aliens to visit us.  I'm waiting...   (BTW, to be fair, one of the reasons I spend so much time out there is simply the wonderful climate where I live!)

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dont worry, i'll stand watch and let you know if i see anything funny.

That's rather patronising...

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Seriously tho its pointless for me to jump thru your hoops.

Your choice..

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I already gave it my best. i'm not a genious, just a regular guy who saw and got a picture of something extraordinary and based upon my past experience have come to the conclusion that what i saw with my own eyes and got a picture of (note my avatar) is not of this world...

This is a genuine question - on the basis of your sighting/experience, WHY are you fearful?  I simply do not understand..  I mean, if even there are aliens with great powers beyond our ken, then is worrying about it going to stop them doing whatever it is you are concerned about?

Look, I'm not trying to drive you away - if you had an awesome experience that convinced you that aliens are here, that's fine.  But you can't expect not to be challenged if you claim that *several* astronauts made verifiable claims about *many* 'alien' craft - that's simply not correct...

And if you quote Gordon Cooper and regard his stories as flawless and unquestionable... well, I think you need to dig a whole lot deeper into the whole Cooper tale, and also simply realise that some people do go a little strange as they get older.. (or even before - just look at me...)  At this point I was going to discuss some of the problems with Gordon Cooper's ufo 'accounts', but that is probably for another thread (and may well have been beaten to death hereabouts already..)  So I'll leave it be.

Edited by Chrlzs, 24 January 2013 - 10:19 AM.

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#64    ChrLzs

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:13 AM

On reflection, seeing it was brought up here, I will add this about Gordon Cooper...

From his interview with OMNI magazine, March 1980.

Quote

...

OMNI: What about the repeated allegations that the astronauts saw many UFOs?

COOPER: It got so bad that there were deliberately falsified tapes of communications with the astronauts, where UFO material was simply edited in. To my knowledge, the only astronaut on any of the Mercury, Gemini, or Apollo missions who ever saw anything that might have been a UFO was Jim McDivitt, but he didn't get enough pictures to prove anything substantial. That's the only case, in spite of all the stories you hear.
...

Cooper then goes on to relate his earthly sighting of some strange craft, but then he states this:

Quote

I'm engaged in a lawsuit against people who used my name for a commercial venture, quoting me to the effect that I'm dedicated to forcing the government to tell the truth about UFOs. I never said that at all. If any UFO information is being suppressed, it's certainly not in the U.S. Air Force, because I was at a high enough level to know about it.

It's rather difficult to reconcile those comments against other quotes, and it directly contradicts any claim of astronauts seeing/claiming alien ufo's..  Which quote to believe?

The Cooper situation is a complex and convoluted one, with many more contradictions than those..  But Cooper is rolled out often by those who haven't actually looked deeply into what he said at differing times...

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#65    JimOberg

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 11:39 AM

View PostChrlzs, on 24 January 2013 - 10:13 AM, said:

The Cooper situation is a complex and convoluted one, with many more contradictions than those..  But Cooper is rolled out often by those who haven't actually looked deeply into what he said at differing times...

Precisely.

And it's worse.

The 'astronaut-worship' of which this is just the latest lamentable example has had disastrous personal consequences for many, many people -- most spectacularly in the loss of millions of dollars of investment funds in projects endorsed by Cooper, that turned out to be scams. The loss wasn't Cooper's fault, in that case, since anybody can make poor business decisions [although Cooper seemed a too-easy dupe for the con men who flattered his ego in order to gain his blessings]. The blame lies squarely on those investors and advisors who proclaimed that Cooper's special high status obviated any need for double-checking the proposed projects, that to actually seek more independent assessments was an insult to Cooper's reputation. Millions of dollars, literally, went down the drain as a direct consequence of that imprudence. But now we have people singing the same song again and boasting of their intellectual superiority in doing so.


#66    Hazzard

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 02:47 PM

View PostFenderJazzBass, on 24 January 2013 - 07:29 AM, said:

To be honest i'm sick of trying to convince skeptics. Its truely an excersice in futility.

Can you really blame people for being skeptical in this matter!?

The main reasons for believing  that some UFOs are ET spaceships is the questionable interpretations of visual experiences, the testimony of many people, the inability to distinguish science fiction from science, the willingness to trust incompetent men telling fantastic stories, or the ability to distrust all contrary sources as being part of an evil conspiracy to withhold the truth.

Attacking an opponents arguments or motives, instead of presenting positive evidence in defense of ones own view is common among defenders of the claim that UFOs are alien spacecraft. These facts are all too common in this field,... and it not likely to change anytime soon. In a way I kinda feel sorry for you. I have no idea what you saw, if anything at all. But getting upset about it seems like the wrong way to go. After all you are the one making an extraordinary claim, you should expect that people will have doubts and ask for extraordinary evidence.



Quote

Good luck to all of you.


And to you.

Edited by Hazzard, 24 January 2013 - 02:47 PM.

I still await the compelling Exhibit A.

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#67    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 07:23 PM

View PostTheSearcher, on 23 January 2013 - 11:07 PM, said:

Nuke_em, there is no need for name calling. "Sheepling" and "you are a good proof of ignorance" are uncalled for, just because I have a different opinion and point out something you happen not to agree with.

Besides the guy does say, he made the model out of styrofoam and some lamps, after having seen similar shapes and lights in pictures. He never actually saw a UFO himself. However he does admit that once his picture got out, the whole thing took a life of it's own and as an 18 year old, he didn't have the courage to tell the truth. His words.

Also, did I say that ALL the pics were fakes? No, I didn't, I just pointed out, that at least one is a proven hoax. So odds are, that others are as well. As to what the objects in question were, well your guess is as good as mine, they are called UFO for a reason after all.

Sorry about that word calling sometimes i burst out, not thinking about what i actualy wrote...

And yes you came to same conclusion that i have, it is a ufo .. so now that we cleared that it is a UFO we can only guess what could it be... and guessing never hurt anyone.. but i don't like people who try to prove that one picture is a hoax yet so many material exists on the same object.
Then you need to look at bigger picture.. it this case many other reports worldwide.
I am glad we got hoax thing cleared and that the sightings were real what were those i dont know.. and like i said many many times before military knows.. they are ones who watch the skies in a more strict measure.

And that leads to military knows more than we do.. peopel often say military knows as much as we do... wrong they know far more than we do, they are just playing fools with us.

Sorry again for those words!

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#68    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 07:28 PM

View PostDBunker, on 23 January 2013 - 11:53 PM, said:

It was a HOAX, live with it. Learn something from it. It might spare you from these types of embarrasing moments in the future..... allthough I somehow doubt it.

READ THIS AND THEN LOAD YOUR SCEPTICAL BS TO SOMEONE ELSE...

Link1, Link2, Link3,  Link4

So yeah it is a real good hoax maybe you did it?

What are you even doing in this forums lost?

Edited by Nuke_em, 24 January 2013 - 07:29 PM.

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#69    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 07:32 PM

View PostDBunker, on 24 January 2013 - 03:35 AM, said:

Government black ops exist, that a fact..... can you say the same about ET visitation?

I will report you to admin... missleading people, not reading the posts at all, flaming, trolling,... WE SAID WE DIDNT KNOW WHAT IT IS HAVE YOU EVEN RED WHAT THE TOPIC WAS ABOUT?!?!?!?!

No one said it was ET in orgin we were just talking about the proability of that triangle not being a hoax and evidence that supports that...

EDIT: TheSearcher you now see why i burst in that way..this guy has attitude problems... for first time i even talked to hazzard in proper way, we actualy both for that matter but then this guy comes along and goes on trolling spree..

Edited by Nuke_em, 24 January 2013 - 07:34 PM.

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#70    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 07:36 PM

View PostSwampgasBalloonBoy, on 24 January 2013 - 04:06 AM, said:

can you prove such fact please. Where are the documents? where are the men who can testify to it? where are the crafts without wings and no sound the seemed to skip across the sky? did the government come out and said "we have a secret research department that created all the "UFOs" that people reported to have seen. until then, is that really a fact?

So what it is then if not ufo or black budget project.? What are people reporting worldwide ?

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#71    SurgeTechnologies

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 07:39 PM

View Postpsyche101, on 24 January 2013 - 05:11 AM, said:

If you read the links Hazz left, that is not his story though.
I've red them so explain those links i put for DB there?

Edit: Believe what you want to believe i know there is suffiecent material that supports alot of sightings of that triangle and i'll now float away from this topic... and not even try to give you more opinions. Maybe 1 picture was a hoax but sightings werent so...

Edited by Nuke_em, 24 January 2013 - 07:44 PM.

" Technology has exceeded our humanity. "

#72    Paxus

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:05 PM

View PostChrlzs, on 24 January 2013 - 09:59 AM, said:

Well, maybe you should consider *not* making claims you can't back up.  And if that was your best shot, to make a claim about lots of astronauts saying something and then being unwilling to provide even ONE example beyond a handwave to Youtube.. well, the futility may be justified.

[/size]
No, this is a discussion forum, remember?  You made the claim, you bring it here.  In simple terms, I do not find Cooper's claim convincing, or even logical.


I have, in case you haven't noticed.  I don't post claims I can't back up, and I KNOW just how many astronauts have made credible claims and what they were about.


No, of course not.  And that isn't because of the obvious reason - that the compelling evidence is not compelling at all, and is NOT indicative of alien origin.


Actually, the more observing I do, the more I realise how human senses are easily fooled..  Ok 'fooled' isn't quite the right word - it's actually remarkable how clever your brain is at interpreting sensory inputs - our minds work enormously hard to satisfy our database of experiences and desires.. and will massage the data to neatly fit any new experiences into that world-view.  That's why anecdotal evidence is so unreliable.  Mine. Yours. Pilots. Astronauts.  etc.


DON'T pretend you know me, and don't put others down as lesser beings living in fear.  Take a look at my posts - see all the astrophotography I do, see my comments and personal images about our wonderful, beautiful heavens?  Have you noticed that I talk a lot about Apollo - I grew up watching the space program culminate in Apollo - lived every minute of it, grabbing every tidbit and investigating how it all came about - again, in AWE of that incredibly successful achievement - imo the pinnacle of human technological achievement.  I LOVE space and astronomy and I do not in any way fear the sky or the universe.

And if It's ok for you to judge me, let me say this, I'll lay a substantial bet that I spend much MUCH more of my life than you (and perhaps 80% of the posters here) outdoors at night looking up at the sky and all the things that are in it - and each time I become more in AWE of the universe, not afraid of it..  And I would LOVE for aliens to visit us.  I'm waiting...   (BTW, to be fair, one of the reasons I spend so much time out there is simply the wonderful climate where I live!)


That's rather patronising...


Your choice..


This is a genuine question - on the basis of your sighting/experience, WHY are you fearful?  I simply do not understand..  I mean, if even there are aliens with great powers beyond our ken, then is worrying about it going to stop them doing whatever it is you are concerned about?

Look, I'm not trying to drive you away - if you had an awesome experience that convinced you that aliens are here, that's fine.  But you can't expect not to be challenged if you claim that *several* astronauts made verifiable claims about *many* 'alien' craft - that's simply not correct...

And if you quote Gordon Cooper and regard his stories as flawless and unquestionable... well, I think you need to dig a whole lot deeper into the whole Cooper tale, and also simply realise that some people do go a little strange as they get older.. (or even before - just look at me...)  At this point I was going to discuss some of the problems with Gordon Cooper's ufo 'accounts', but that is probably for another thread (and may well have been beaten to death hereabouts already..)  So I'll leave it be.

PERFECT responses to Fender!

It's like a caveman responding to something he doesn't understand.....

I don't understand his fear either....   o.O

Weird....


#73    DBunker

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:10 PM

View PostPaxus, on 24 January 2013 - 10:05 PM, said:

PERFECT responses to Fender!

It's like a caveman responding to something he doesn't understand.....

I don't understand his fear either....   o.O

Weird....


There are some strange people around here these days, that much is sure. :clap:

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#74    DBunker

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:12 PM

View PostNuke_em, on 24 January 2013 - 07:32 PM, said:

I will report you to admin... missleading people, not reading the posts at all, flaming, trolling,... WE SAID WE DIDNT KNOW WHAT IT IS HAVE YOU EVEN RED WHAT THE TOPIC WAS ABOUT?!?!?!?!

No one said it was ET in orgin we were just talking about the proability of that triangle not being a hoax and evidence that supports that...

EDIT: TheSearcher you now see why i burst in that way..this guy has attitude problems... for first time i even talked to hazzard in proper way, we actualy both for that matter but then this guy comes along and goes on trolling spree..

Im sorry, I have no idea what you are talking about anymore. Are you now saying that you dont believe that these black triangle has anything to do with ET?

Now that communications technology has made it possible to give global reach to the bizarre and archive it forever, it is essential for men and women of reason resolutely to counter the delusions of the fringe element. James S. Robbins

#75    FenderJazzBass

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Posted 24 January 2013 - 10:42 PM

View PostDBunker, on 24 January 2013 - 10:12 PM, said:

Im sorry, I have no idea what you are talking about anymore. Are you now saying that you dont believe that these black triangle has anything to do with ET?

You are a coward.

The world around us ? Things are not what they seem.




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